OSSC (DIY video digitizer & scandoubler)

[cfx]

.

[BuckoA51]

^ Exactly this, could not have said it any better ^

[rtw]

Anyone use this with RBG's HAS supergun yet?

Not yet, finding parts for my cable

Remember this warning from the wiki (thanks RGB!)

Code: Select all

This input supports RGB video in RGBS and RGsB (sync on green) formats. Composite video, luma or c-sync can be used as sync source with RGBS mode. External sync splitters / boosters are generally not required or recommended as there is built-in sync filter & separator in the ADC frontend. The sync input has 75ohm termination, so TTL-level c-sync should not be connected directly there in order to avoid unnecessarily stressing source console and/or scanconverter. A 470ohm series resistor on the console side of the cable generally is a good solution when using cables which are wired for TTL-level c-sync output of a console. Video inputs also have standard 75ohm termination, so arcade boards may need extra resistors on the cable when connected directly without using a SuperGUN. 

[RGB]

Another advice - if you use the LM1881 as the sync cleaner/separator in your cables or consoles, you also need the 470ohm resistor, because the LM1881 CSync output is TTL.

[ZellSF]

You're a bit too RGB obsessed marqs, component connectors should be put in RBG order.

[Das Muel]

Presumably Paypal are still dawdling on the receiving limit, Marqs? I'm considering strapping my cash to a homing pigeon and flying it over to Finland.

[ZellSF]

Got to test it with my own TV. All the consoles I tested worked fine on it: NESRGB (rgb csync or c-video sync), SNES (rgb csync or c-video sync), N64 (rgb csync or c-video sync), Dreamcast (VGA), Playstation 2 (component and rgb, 480i and 480p), Xbox (component 480p). Everything just works perfectly as it should.

Sadly it reminded me about how bad my Panasonic plasma's 480p handling is (I've already seen this on the PS2, so not the OSSC's fault), but with a HDMI splitter I can use the OSSC for low latency games and chain it with the XRGB-mini for when I need more image quality. Which was my original plan anyway, and it works quite nicely.

Doing that revealed something interesting. With the OSSC, my TV has a new DVI menu option that allows me to set color range. The XRGB-mini does not have that, despite being in DVI mode. XRGB-mini doesn't send proper DVI flags? Bit off-topic, but since I asked about limited/full range earlier turns out you were right marqs. I just didn't realize because both my XRGB-mini and PC were failing to send the right flags.

I've also tried my 1CHIP SNES on some displays just to see if it would fail on anything. Two Panasonic plasmas, one Pioneer Kuro, one Samsung monitor, one Eizo monitor and one HP monitor. Worked on all of them. Linetriple mode worked on everything but the Panasonic plasmas. One had excessive tearing the other did not work at all.

Wish I could test with more consoles, but my PSX is dead and my Genesis is lost in the mail. Fun weekend.

Oh and I still really really want 480i passthrough.

[fafangus]

Once units are on the way to me I'll contact the first batch of folks on the mailing list.

Be sure to whitelist newsletter@videogameperfection.com

I'm not seeing any errors with the SMTP server, all but 2 of the newsletters it sent were delivered, so if the e-mails are not getting through it is likely to be something your side I'm afraid.

Frustrating that nobody has come up with a better system than e-mail after all this time...

I already recieve your newsletter (enjoy readin it), it was just to know if I have miss something - that I fill the form in november for a complete one, and no - maybe my fault - news since - so I've suscribe to your newsletter...

Do a batch of complete kit have already been sent ?

Anyway Marqs and Bucko keep up the good job

[BuckoA51]

Sadly it reminded me about how bad my Panasonic plasma's 480p handling is

Panasonic panels are a strange bunch. Our Plasma does 480p quite nicely. My friends LCD handles 480p from the Wii really nicely, but 480p from the OSSC looked awful. Luckily line triple mode worked and so we used that for a night of Megadrive gaming, err I mean intensive testing and evaluation.

Oh and I still really really want 480i passthrough.

Should happen in a firmware update.

I've also tried my 1CHIP SNES on some displays just to see if it would fail on anything.

I wonder if 1 Chips are more compatible than multi-chips. I'll see if I can find a 1-chip to test.

I already recieve your newsletter (enjoy readin it), it was just to know if I have miss something - that I fill the form in november for a complete one, and no - maybe my fault - news since - so I've suscribe to your newsletter...

If you haven't had word from Marqs now you're likely in the second batch which I'll be dealing with as soon as I can get stock.

[werk91]

So for my Sega MGII which has a Csync wired Scart cable I would either need to solder a 470ohm series resistor (in console or cable?) or just buy a composite video + sync Scart cable ?

[BuckoA51]

I've got loads of stuff not wired correctly to spec using clean sync (thanks XRGB3) and it's all been fine on the newest firmware, but I'm not sure what this talk of "stressing" components means, we'll have to wait for Marqs or someone with more electrical knowledge to clarify.

[marqs]

Presumably Paypal are still dawdling on the receiving limit, Marqs? I'm considering strapping my cash to a homing pigeon and flying it over to Finland.

Yeah, it has been quite hard to communicate with their customer service that works like in Soviet Union - 1 out of 3 messages getting answered, each time by a different person and not always with the most helpful answers. Even stricter limits are in place for withdrawal, and linking a bank account fails due to an error that nobody can explain, so it's quite annoying for me too.

Doing that revealed something interesting. With the OSSC, my TV has a new DVI menu option that allows me to set color range. The XRGB-mini does not have that, despite being in DVI mode. XRGB-mini doesn't send proper DVI flags? Bit off-topic, but since I asked about limited/full range earlier turns out you were right marqs. I just didn't realize because both my XRGB-mini and PC were failing to send the right flags.

I noticed the same thing with my own plasma, so maybe DVI mode is not setup correctly. More annoying was the fact that Mini indicated limited range in the Infoframe even though it was outputting full-range until a fw update around a year ago allowed switching to limited range output (but still no way to properly use full-range with Panasonics).

So for my Sega MGII which has a Csync wired Scart cable I would either need to solder a 470ohm series resistor (in console or cable?) or just buy a composite video + sync Scart cable ?

MD2 I assume? MD1 at least has quite weak c-sync signal (directly from VDP), so it's better to either use composite as sync or take video-level c-sync from CXA1145 (connection diagram is found on the datasheet).

[Thomago]

Speaking about 480i passthrough... what about 2:2 Pulldown deinterlacing for 480i/30fps games? Would this be possible with the OSSC's lag-free design?

[Unseen]

Speaking about 480i passthrough... what about 2:2 Pulldown deinterlacing for 480i/30fps games? Would this be possible with the OSSC's lag-free design?

Any deinterlacing method that needs to store more than two or three lines at a time isn't possible, there isn't enough RAM to hold all that image data.

[werk91]

@marqs, yes I meant MD2 sorry

[ZellSF]

Doing that revealed something interesting. With the OSSC, my TV has a new DVI menu option that allows me to set color range. The XRGB-mini does not have that, despite being in DVI mode. XRGB-mini doesn't send proper DVI flags? Bit off-topic, but since I asked about limited/full range earlier turns out you were right marqs. I just didn't realize because both my XRGB-mini and PC were failing to send the right flags.

I noticed the same thing with my own plasma, so maybe DVI mode is not setup correctly. More annoying was the fact that Mini indicated limited range in the Infoframe even though it was outputting full-range until a fw update around a year ago allowed switching to limited range output (but still no way to properly use full-range with Panasonics).

Maybe your Panasonic is like mine. When I set DVI range, it applies to all HDMI inputs, even non-DVI ones. Of course if you no longer have a DVI source you can't change it back.

[Xyga]

The wait is killing me. And I have to leave for ten days soon. Argh.

[ZellSF]

Oh and marqs, you did read my comment about component video connector order right? You really should fix that in a future revision, can get annoying with tightly packed cables.

[marqs]

The wait is killing me. And I have to leave for ten days soon. Argh.

Majority of completed orders have been now shipped, and remaining ones will be by Friday. Hopefully rest of the first batch orders (pending Paypal payments and those who haven't responded) can be delivered next week.

Oh and marqs, you did read my comment about component video connector order right? You really should fix that in a future revision, can get annoying with tightly packed cables.

Ah, I thought you were just joking. 3xRCA right-angle connectors with RGB/GBR color coding have actually become quite hard to source, so availability may dictate what will be used in future revisions.

[Guspaz]

You're a bit too RGB obsessed marqs, component connectors should be put in RBG order.

Component connectors should be ordered GBR, rather than RBG, although that's just upside down, really. Green (luma, the Y in YPbPr) always comes first.

I do agree that it's not ideal as it is now: if you have heavy gauge component cables, twisting them out of sequence to get them connected by RGB may be difficult and make the connectors prone to pulling themselves off. I'm surprised it's easier to find them in RGB order since I can't recall that ever having been used (since RGB-the-signal tends not to use RCA). And yet Digikey has 9 different RGB RCA connectors and not a single GBR/RBG...

[RocketBelt]

If you have component cables that are difficult to connect out of order due to the gauge, you could use a short triple rca cable plugged into the ossc, paired with a triple rca female socket coupler. If you cross over the short cable as necessary then you have the socket coupler connectors presented in the correct order. It also acts as a 'port saver' reducing wear and tear on the actual unit.

[marqs]

If you have component cables that are difficult to connect out of order due to the gauge, you could use a short triple rca cable plugged into the ossc, paired with a triple rca female socket coupler. If you cross over the short cable as necessary then you have the socket coupler connectors presented in the correct order. It also acts as a 'port saver' reducing wear and tear on the actual unit.

Yes, and component to scart adapter is another option, although that may wear scart socket if a heavy cable is used.

[BuckoA51]

Mailed you today Marqs did you get it okay?

[SGGG2]

If you have component cables that are difficult to connect out of order due to the gauge, you could use a short triple rca cable plugged into the ossc, paired with a triple rca female socket coupler. If you cross over the short cable as necessary then you have the socket coupler connectors presented in the correct order. It also acts as a 'port saver' reducing wear and tear on the actual unit.

+1

Had to resort to this due to how tight the Monster component cables are for PS2 and Xbox Original. It works well.

[Ed Oscuro]

On the heels (hrm...I wrote "hells," that might be more appropriate) of my posts elsewhere, I have a question:

Assuming a normalized size, but a large screen, how does the OSSC output appear compared to a CRT hooked up via RGB? This question might appear mad but consider the advantage of fixed-pixel panels with respect to defining pixel edges. Sure, LCDs and the like lose some advantage to scaling, and CRTs gain some back due to being able to put pixel edges as necessary.

[toto99303]

marqs, I was just about to order a DIY kit and you got the form closed... How can I order a kit? If you're missing parts I'm willing to buy a board with the essential parts, the rest I can find locally.

[Xyga]

Well Ed you had the DISPL before! just think about the same kind only with even sharper/better quality and many adjustable things.

Plus in cases linetriple works it's probably looking very '720p Mini'-like...

PS: understand "none looking close to a CRT in any case", but that's not exactly the purpose of those doublers/salers with 'scanlines' anyway.

[marqs]

marqs, I was just about to order a DIY kit and you got the form closed... How can I order a kit? If you're missing parts I'm willing to buy a board with the essential parts, the rest I can find locally.

I had to close DIY-kit form due to following reasons:

• * There's now more reservations than I can personally handle in a reasonable time, and new ones were coming in fast. For the last 2 weeks I barely have been able to process DIY kit orders at all, as majority of my free time has gone into finalizing and shipping the pre-assembled boards.
  * E-mailing people about their reservations is very hit and miss due to filters. I probably should have selected PMs as the communication channel instead of unreliable e-mail, but that would have been inconvenient both for customers (not everybody are registered here) and me (management nightmare)
  * I'm not sure if I want to continue receiving payments via Paypal after the treatment while setting up the business account. Even though I haven't had issues with my personal account in its 10-year usage history, I'm not sure what limits/blocks could be suddenly imposed when receiving several DIY kit payments in a short time.
  * Postage prices in Finland are really expensive. For US buyers, the shipping alone is around 20% of the total kit price which is a big shame.

Thereby, I think it'd be best that future kits would be sold by online store(s) which offer related console modding stuff. Also, the new kit would probably only include the essential parts (PCB, case, IR remote, special connectors, pre-flashed fw chip etc.) - everyone can buy the required basic parts from Mouser/Digikey, so it would save a lot of time (no component sorting) and wouldn't even raise the cost that much. I'm currently in discussions with a few potential stores, so I'll keep you updated when something gets decided. Meanwhile, I still have components for around 30 kits (minus PCBs, which are currently on order) so I'm still going to sell & ship those personally (everyone who made their reservation by around mid-March are in that group).

[BuckoA51]

Sounds like a good idea to me (of course I would say that eh? ) but seriously, now I have suppliers for the remotes and power supplies too, DIY customers can buy those if they want them the same way customers for the pre-assembled boards can.

[Ed Oscuro]

Well Ed you had the DISPL before! just think about the same kind only with even sharper/better quality and many adjustable things.

Plus in cases linetriple works it's probably looking very '720p Mini'-like...

PS: understand "none looking close to a CRT in any case", but that's not exactly the purpose of those doublers/salers with 'scanlines' anyway.

I never was able to actually use the DISPL; the only scalers I've used were the XRGB-2 and 2+ ones.

I guess I'll just have to look around for some photos to compare with and answer my own question.