Fudoh's ode to old display technology

[Ed Oscuro]

It line doubles 240p to 480p (640x480, specifically). The PGM-200R2U's resolution is "640x480 dots max" so I doubt that 768p is resolved very well.

Did you have the unit with the cube frame ("handles" on the back) or the more TV/computer monitor looking one? The first is the PGM-200R1, for which the module is optional. The second is the PGM-200R2U, which is the exact unit that was sold a week or so back.

I'm pretty sure i had the R2. The one that was bought by a member from here recently definitely did not come with the scanconverter integrated, because the actual optional module has way more inputs available.
Mine had the frame. Pretty sure the one posted here doesn't because the frame is most likely optional and was sold separately.

It sounds like you have the R1, because the 1999 catalog fully describes both units and pictures both (with the frame around the R1 only). The R2 was meant for kiosks and to be built into custom cabinetry, so its housing is more streamlined.

Are PVMs starting from ca. 1995 (modern Trinitron logo) with OSD calibration settings considered as having a fully digital chassis, or do they have additional pots inside (for convergence perhaps)? I guess that was the first generation to feature a digital chassis, when did that arrive in the consumer market?

This page gives a kind of general answer to the question.

That said, I think probably the answer to your question is this: There is *coarse* and *fine* adjustment of things like convergence. My PVM 20L5 has only a couple knobs alongside the CRT neck (don't actually know what they're for; I'm not that far along into things). However, it still has (as does my c. 2006 TV - as do probably all CRTs) the glued-together rings which are used at the factory (and by technicians) to alter convergence. Other people know a lot more about these things, but my thought is that you can probably do the most about convergence with these rings - next up would be using specially placed magnets (or changing the placements of the magnets placed directly against the back side of the CRT) - and finally there's small tweaks from the OSD.

[Tempest_2084]

Ok interesting new problem. I'm using the 240P suite on my SNES to adjust the screen geometry and discovered that the grid test produced this result:



As you can see the squares seem to get shorter as they go down the lower half of the screen. What would cause something like this and what can I adjust to fix it? Would it be vertical linearity or something like that?

EDIT: Yes it looks like V Lin did the trick. My next question is: What's causing those 'bumps' on the left side of the grid? You can see it 'indent' every square and it then 'bumps out' on the other side of the grid. Is that just some sort of funky interference?

[Xan]

This page gives a kind of general answer to the question.

That said, I think probably the answer to your question is this: There is *coarse* and *fine* adjustment of things like convergence. My PVM 20L5 has only a couple knobs alongside the CRT neck (don't actually know what they're for; I'm not that far along into things). However, it still has (as does my c. 2006 TV - as do probably all CRTs) the glued-together rings which are used at the factory (and by technicians) to alter convergence. Other people know a lot more about these things, but my thought is that you can probably do the most about convergence with these rings - next up would be using specially placed magnets (or changing the placements of the magnets placed directly against the back side of the CRT) - and finally there's small tweaks from the OSD.

Speaking of L-series PVMs, I always wondered why they didn't go with a flat screen setup there as that was the standard by then... it can't be that those flat screens aren't suitable for professional demands, as the FW900 got one, and that was about a year before the L-series was released. Does your L5 allow convergence adjustment from the OSD? That feature only seems to be commonplace on FD Trinitron screens, so I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't.

Could well be that the L-series is (one of) the last CRT series from Sony with curved screens... even my KV-14LT1E, which is an entry level TV from 2000, is a FD Trinitron. The hidden service menu on it is fairly extensive.

I've also always been curious when that switch to the latest Trinitron logo happened, and found this ad for an XBR set. 1993 is a bit earlier than I would have thought... the mid-late 90s models I was using back then did have OSDs too, so maybe that rebranding was done to accompany and indicate that change towards digital chassis. At least I don't know of any Trinitrons with the older logo that already had an OSD, and PVMs certainly didn't.

Edit: FWIW, Wikipedia claims that the new logo was introduced in 1992.

[Tempest_2084]

Looks like the bottom (and the top to an extent) of the picture actually IS bowed, it's not my imagination. I'll be damned if I can find the adjust for it though, I've tried just about every dial I can find on the inside.

EDIT: looks like it's V. PIN is what I'm looking for, but I'll be damned if I can find anything like that inside. It MUST have it though, that's a standard adjust.

EDIT 2: Does anyone know where the V.SIZE adjust is on a 1943MD? Also, is there anything I can do to make the image sharper other than the aperture adjust on the front? Is there something inside I can adjust?

[22point8]

Looks like the bottom (and the top to an extent) of the picture actually IS bowed, it's not my imagination. I'll be damned if I can find the adjust for it though, I've tried just about every dial I can find on the inside.

EDIT: looks like it's V. PIN is what I'm looking for, but I'll be damned if I can find anything like that inside. It MUST have it though, that's a standard adjust.

EDIT 2: Does anyone know where the V.SIZE adjust is on a 1943MD? Also, is there anything I can do to make the image sharper other than the aperture adjust on the front? Is there something inside I can adjust?

Try this service manual for the 2044QM https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_p3a0 ... sp=sharing

[Tempest_2084]

Thanks I'll try that.

I'm kind of torn. The 1910 has 'richer' colors and a sharper picture, but the geometry is a mess. The 1943MD has almost perfect geometry (just need to adjust the vert height), but the image isn't as sharp and colors are a bit washed out (might be because the brightness and contrast are cranked up). The 1943 also has a underscan button which is useful for systems like the Neo Geo which has way to big of an image.

[Artemio]

Here is the service manual for the 1944Q, might help you out https://www.dropbox.com/s/dqf9bst6yuhpl ... 4Q_SVM.pdf

[Tempest_2084]

That did help! Thank you. Now I know what all those adjustments actually do (the two that control the underscan H and V had me stumped before). A few things I can't figure out though:

1. The screen is tilted a little (not bad, but it's there). Is there any way to fix this short of moving the whole CRT yoke? I don't want to touch that thing if I can help it (especially not in something this large).

2. Is there any way to increase the sharpness other than the aperture control on the front? It's good, but not quite as good as the 1910.

3. The color on the 1943 isn't as 'warm' as the 1910 (flesh tones are more white than orange for example). What's the best way to fix this? I see there's a bunch of controls for color and temperature on a board inside the unit, but those are hard to get to and there are more than a few adjusts there so I only want to go for the ones that might be of use.

[cfx]

.

[nyder]

For #2, do you have the typical focus pot on the flyback transformer?

Is this focus pot on the flyback for all PVM's?

I'm guessing its not a setting in the OSD lol

Nyd

[Tempest_2084]

For #2, do you have the typical focus pot on the flyback transformer?

Yes I do and I did mess with it, but I think it's where it's supposed to be. If I move the dial at all the RGB colors become separated. I'm not 100% sure what this controls exactly, I would have thought the color convergence would have been a different control.

[nyder]

For #2, do you have the typical focus pot on the flyback transformer?

Yes I do and I did mess with it, but I think it's where it's supposed to be. If I move the dial at all the RGB colors become separated. I'm not 100% sure what this controls exactly, I would have thought the color convergence would have been a different control.

When I adjusted the focus pot on my 2530 I had the 240p suite up with the test patern cross hatch/grid with the squares with the dot in the center, adjust the pot until the dot is at its smallest.

Nyd

[Tempest_2084]

When you adjusted the focus did the colors separate? Or is there something wrong with my focus?

[nyder]

When you adjusted the focus did the colors separate? Or is there something wrong with my focus?

I just remember the dots getting tighter/smaller as I turned the screwdriver, then gettin a bit blurry so I went back till the dot was the smallest/tightest.

Don't remember anything with colours changing.

[Tempest_2084]

Thanks to everyone's help, I've almost got this thing perfect, one issue remains.

After fixing the tilt by carefully rotating the deflection yoke a hair (I barely had to move it) I noticed that the right side of the monitor wasn't even with the left. By this I mean that when I'm running horizontal lines across the screen they bow inward a bit top and bottom by the time they get to the right side (kind of squeezed or pinched in on the right side). It's not the end of the world, but is there an adjust that addresses this? I don't think there is, but I thought I'd check

[niall]

Try adjusting vertical height/size until there's a small amount of overscan (a line or two no longer visible - in the middle of each edge of the tube, not the corners like you have it now), then do the same with horizontal. Then adjust pincushion, bowing etc. with a test pattern grid until the grid itself is square from your primary viewing position, then do a final horizontal/vertical size/position adjustment to get the overscan to where you prefer it.

I thought about adjusting the height to get rid of that gap. But if you look at the bezel if I increased the height any more I'd start to lose the image in the corners. If I 'fill out the screen' the corners would be behind the bezel.

Overscan is normal and expected for analog video on CRTs - don't try to emulate perfect geometry with no overscan like you see on today's digital displays.

[Tempest_2084]

Overscan is normal and expected for analog video on CRTs - don't try to emulate perfect geometry with no overscan like you see on today's digital displays.

Yeah I've kind of learned to accept that. The screen 'pinching' as it goes left to right is kind of weird though, but I'm guessing fixing that is going to be well beyond my skills since there doesn't seem to be an adjust for it.

[Xan]

I have this one PVM-1453MD where the whole image seems to be slanted to the left. It's a real shame because the tube is otherwise in great shape.

http://imgur.com/Wyi5mDY,MjEUK8e (settings as-is)
http://imgur.com/Wyi5mDY,MjEUK8e#1 (underscan with some vertical offset, note the angle of the colored bars at the top)

Any chances of getting rid of this? The geometry settings in the OSD don't really seem to cut it. Can something like this happen during shipping?

And I know the convergence is off too, but that's certainly the smaller issue here...

[Ed Oscuro]

Tried the trapezoidal correction?

[Xan]

V ANGLE? Yeah I tried all of the NOR settings... couldn't eliminate it.

[Tempest_2084]

BTW here's a picture of what I'm talking about. Just looking at the top I'd say that the monitor is just crooked, but if you notice it does the same thing at the bottom too (although not as bad).

[Tempest_2084]

Someone suggested that this can be fixed by adjusting some clamps or magnets on the yoke. Anyone got more detail on this?

[Ed Oscuro]

Possibly fixed magnets on the back of the envelope, too.

[Tempest_2084]

Possibly fixed magnets on the back of the envelope, too.

I sealed it all back up yesterday. I don't feel comfortable messing with the magnets, you can REALLY screw things up that way unless you know exactly what you're doing (and I do not).

[cfx]

.

[Tempest_2084]

I know pictures don't show what you really see sometimes, but I don't think that looks bad at all.

It's actually not bad and you really don't notice it when playing games. I just figured I'd ask if there was an easy fix to it.

I really wish my PVM had an on screen menu, having to open it up any time you want to adjust something sucks.

[Xan]

I did a few pics of the insides of my BVM-1454D. Would have expected some date on the tube but unfortunately no...

http://imgur.com/a/1MKUf

[niall]

I know pictures don't show what you really see sometimes, but I don't think that looks bad at all.

It's actually not bad and you really don't notice it when playing games. I just figured I'd ask if there was an easy fix to it.

Give it a bit of overscan and you'll probably never notice it again.

[Ed Oscuro]

Possibly fixed magnets on the back of the envelope, too.

I sealed it all back up yesterday. I don't feel comfortable messing with the magnets, you can REALLY screw things up that way unless you know exactly what you're doing (and I do not).

I mean with the magnet strips on the back of the tube, where the aquadag is painted. Dunno - maybe it's possible to mess up the aquadag a bit, but you can always buy some and paint it back on there.

Just throwing out ideas here - obviously I agree you don't want to do this unless you actually know what you're doing. I'd run it past a more TV repair-centric forum.

[mchay]

thought a picture of my recent acquisitions would entertain someone in this thread. Looking forward to this weekend where I hopefully will get some time to test these monitors