Analogue Interactive's Analog NT - $500 NES/Famicom Console

[Lemony Vengeance]

Can you explain why you're including two controllers, the HDMI upscaler and HDMI cable?

Dude, you're NOT going to use it HDMI style?! come on.. we all know you are.

You wouldn't get those with the NESRGB solution.

No, because you would already have controllers (came with the $40 console ), and the RGB cable is factored into parts cost.

Still standing by my $140 to $240 cost breakdown for that.

I'm not going to convince you that there are much better ways to spend your money, and you're not going to convince me that I should drop between $600 and $700 for a frankensteined console.

ok. now I'm done.

[airs]

Yes, I think it's best for you to be done.

[robivy64]

I'm sure Chris doesn't just cherry-pick the "unsellable" and "undesirable" Famicoms from the bulk lot. I'm sure there are some nasty discolored Famicoms in the lot, as many as there are clean systems. Famicoms ARE cheap in Japan, and these were all purchased for one purpose.

After all, they can't all be THAT bad if the controllers are being removed and resold!

Like I said, it's my only issue with the Nt. The thing could be $99.95, dispense bacon on voice command, upscale to 4K, and have a controller wrapped in baby seal leather. I would feel the same way about it.

[airs]

Let me try and understand this, your issue is that the console shells get discarded? Why do you care about that?

[robivy64]

I don't like original consoles being destroyed. It's simple really.

I hope your comprehension skills can improve.

[airs]

No need for personal attacks. Seriously trying to understand your point of view.

Would it help if Christoph included the Famicom shell with each order instead of discarding it?

[Pasky]

Is he gonna charge $50 extra?

[d0s]

Would it help if Christoph included the Famicom shell with each order instead of discarding it?

You keep repeating that, he said his problem is that real Famicom systems get destroyed to make a pseudoluxury conversation piece/obnoxious status symbol. Including the shell of a machine that has already been destroyed does not change that. It has nothing to do with the shells.

[ApolloBoy]

Reminds me of this pic Broken posted on N-G.com:

[Ed Oscuro]

Not one of us is going to make an offer on ugly old Famicoms.

It's not going to be economical to ship all the donor systems or empty shells around, or even one (what would you do with it?). At some place they're being systematically harvested and then the shells trashed, as close to the warehouse where the old systems were kept as possible. Again, who's going to arrange to save them all? We already know that they're trying to save the controllers where possible. I'd like it if other parts were salvaged too, but how much work would you take on to get spare parts from here and there?

The future that makes a project like this uneconomical will be the future when original systems are so hard to find that anybody will pay money for even an ugly busted-up one, and rolling insane amounts of cash and trouble into refurbishing original systems is worthwhile. (But the bright side would be that making a kind of clone ASIC would be worthwhile - but hopefully bunnyboy can corner the market on that. Maybe AI can revisit that in the future.)

Time to put the skids on what I started by acknowledging the money constraints. As the man said, "business reasons."

[robivy64]

Again, who's going to arrange to save them all?

I try to restore what I can get my hands on! I've cleaned up and de-yellowed some nasty looking systems.

[Ed Oscuro]

And here we get to the part of the thread where Rob thinks that he's discovered a new problem for against Ed, when Ed raised this problem in the first pages of the thread.

Clearly those units didn't start out in an unsellable condition. Do we actually know what Analogue's systems looked like? After the very smart threadshitting by the Neo Geo crews, it's highly unlikely that Cristoph will continue to indulge our idle speculations (even if that's possible; the shells were almost certainly scrapped long ago) since it's brought him nothing but grief.

So Rob, just show me the shipping invoice where you went out of your way to ship a comparable load of broken Famicoms to the States, at a price that allowed you to turn a profit after all the work you put into them. We're not talking about somebody's pet system here, but the cheapest of the destroyed systems they could lay their hands on.

My own stance is pretty clear here...if there's anything that can be salvaged, it should be, and even then I was against stripping units on principle. But shipping is usually pretty prohibitive, especially at the volumes we're talking about here. If somebody dove into that pile, they probably could end up with a few good-condition units, but at the cost of a lot more time, work, and money than was required for their current project.

[evil_ash_xero]

I doubt many Famicoms are going to be gutted, because I doubt many of these systems are going to sell. They're too expensive, and there are cheaper options, that are just as good, and appeal more to the hardcore gamer(folks that like the original systems).

They should give the shells to somebody though.

[Ed Oscuro]

Indeed, they "should," but that requires somebody actually pay for them.

[Mero]

Dat price

[kamiboy]

Wow, people could buy two of these babies for a single one of their boxed Famicom Titlers!

[Zapf]

Reminds me of this pic Broken posted on N-G.com:

I too try to equate shitty famicoms rotting in a japanese warehouse getting repurposed to rape.

edit: I have no interest in purchasing one of these, but the effort lemony vengeance is putting into making these photoshops and the constant twitter posts, holy shit dude


holy shit

[Ed Oscuro]

Wow, people could buy two of these babies for a single one of their boxed Famicom Titlers!

$250 was the going rate for a Titler many years ago...or so I thought. If you know where I could find one at that price, let me know!

I too try to equate shitty famicoms rotting in a japanese warehouse getting repurposed to rape.

Also literally as bad as Hitler!

[Fudoh]

Ed, math ? Really ?

[Ed Oscuro]

Oh, just not reading carefully, heh $1000 for a titler strikes me as pretty crazy actually; didn't know the price had jumped that much.

[kamiboy]

That is the upper end for a Titler. I think I gave $400 for mine.

It is a fine system but it is so damn big. Once I get a proper RGB kit for my AV famicom that thing is going back in the box for good I imagine.

[RGB32E]

Kind of envious that Fudoh gets to test out AI's new scaler! I'd love to buy one if it provides anywhere near the quality of a XRGB!

I'm also wondering if the nt uses the NESRGB in kit form, or if it was integrated into the newly designed system PCB?

As far as noise regarding repurposing the "functionally worthless" original Famicom systems goes, I wonder if there's similar sentiment about case modding (e.g. painted systems)? I recall Tim mentioning that he had some plans for a replacement PCB for the back half of the original systems, but it doesn't seem to have materialized.

I'm still considering pre-ordering a nt, but would like to see the internals first, and have confidence that audio is clean, even with expansion audio in the mix.

[Chacranajxy]

As far as noise regarding repurposing the "functionally worthless" original Famicom systems goes, I wonder if there's similar sentiment about case modding (e.g. painted systems)?

I think it's just a case of a bunch of NG people being twats, as usual, and then a few people here wanting to be "cool" like them.

[theMot]

The bashing of this thing on ng.com was intense. Haters gonna hate!

I have no interest in Nes stuff but i dont think its such a bad deal if your into old stuff repurposed. Seems like a neat package.

[Fudoh]

For what it's worth, I like the product and find it's price to be very acceptable. For years and years RGB modded NES or Famicom were 400-450 EUR over here. And yes, if you're able to do a RGB mod yourself, you'll end up cheaper doing it on your own, but not everybody is. Also prices for mint AV Famicoms have exploded over the years. $200/200 EUR are typical these days.

But as RGB32E mentioned, it will of course eventually all come down to the picture and sound quality. And I certainly have my doubts about that external scaler. Nevertheless I'm looking forward to it.

[robivy64]

Where do you find people paying 200 Euros/$ for a Famicom AV?

Let me know so I can sell them mine.

[evil_ash_xero]

I too try to equate shitty famicoms rotting in a japanese warehouse getting repurposed to rape.

Also literally as bad as Hitler!

What about being raped by Hitler?!

[d0s]

I think it's still possible to be against what these dudes are doing without being a nutjob comparing it to rape and the holocaust. Destroying Famicoms sucks from a "boy I sure wish they wouldn't do that" standpoint but I think people wouldn't have as much of a problem if the parts were going towards something more sensibly designed and priced to appeal to people who actually play old games and care about stuff like RGB output. Their whole marketing strategy seems to be to go after people who don't know any better ($29 for a COMPOSITE cable?!?) and I think that's what gets people kinda emotional about this thing, the fact that the systems are being destroyed to make something for people who don't even know why it's actually good to have the real hardware, and to kiiinda overcharge a bit to maybe take advantage of that.

If you read the way they talk this thing up it's kind of obvious they're trying to sell it to people who have little to no idea what they're actually getting for their money, just that it seems to be a "luxury" item. It comes off as dishonest and I think they'd have a much better time of it if they put it in a less... affected case, knocked $200 off the price, and talked straight about what's in their product and what it does instead of the bizarre marketingspeak all over the website.

I've seen it compared to things like Monster cables and I think it's a lame product in the same way those are, if you understand the technology enough to know what's behind the smoke and mirrors, it's not just unimpressive but kind of annoying that some guy just tried to sell it to you not only with a straight face, but actually claiming it's something special.

EDIT: And please, before anybody makes this point, I know that it's their right to do whatever they want with the hardware they bought. I understand it doesn't make a dent in the availability of Famicom systems. I'm just trying to explain why the product gave me a gut "annoyed" feeling, not to start an argument about whether or not they "should" be doing anything. If you think this thing is awesome and have preordered one, more power to you! Personally, I think there are so many better ways to achieve the same result and from an aesthetic/design standpoint it comes off as forced, I want my Nintendo to look like a Nintendo and not a first year industrial design student's midterm project.

[darcagn]

Their whole marketing strategy seems to be to go after people who don't know any better ($29 for a COMPOSITE cable?!?) and I think that's what gets people kinda emotional about this thing, the fact that the systems are being destroyed to make something for people who don't even know why it's actually good to have the real hardware, and to kiiinda overcharge a bit to maybe take advantage of that.

I think you're right here. Let's all take a step back here--this NES/Famicom is fucking awesome. If someone came on this forum and told us they built this, we'd all be incredibly impressed.

But when it comes down to it, modding consoles has been a passion of mine for the past year and a half. I've usually only been interested in software, but this stuff has gotten me interested in hardware, and on a bigger level, circuit design. I've been following projects like low_budget's Super8 clone motherboards and controller ports, viletim's NESRGB video and audio upgrade kit, the Universal PPU, and Helder/BuffaloWing's 3D-printed Nintendo multiout sockets. There's a great community of people who are creating these things, and even though they charge for them, we can all agree that this is a sort of labor of love type of community.

But despite the fact that I have an NES that can do everything this one can and more, my friends (who, like most people, don't really know anything about this stuff) didn't look twice when I showed off my NESRGB-modded NES running on my Framemeister. Most people, even most gamers who played vintage consoles when they were young, haven't actually hooked up a console since they were a kid and don't realize the amount of effort it takes to make them look really good in a modern setup. So they weren't impressed by the NESRGB, yet they're all "dude, have you seen this Analog NT console?!" And really, to those of us in the community, there's literally nothing new about the Analog NT other than the Jony Ive shiny case. It feels like they're taking my hobby and selling it for a massive markup, profit, and even a little fame. None of the mods that the community came up with that compose this thing ever broke huge in the news like this thing has. And the fact that they have put very little detail into the tech specs only further reinforces that image. Why haven't we gotten images of the PCB yet?

I admit I sound like I am a hipster, upset with Analog Interactive for selling out or something. But I'm not really upset with them or anything, I can genuinely tell from Christoph's posts that this is something he's passionate about. I think he wants to make a truly amazing high end NES/Famicom product, and I think he has succeeded at that. Take away the price for a moment, who here really wouldn't want to own this console? If it's really a brand new revised motherboard, it could be a drastically more reliable NES/Famicom capable of doing pretty much anything a modded tricked out NES or Famicom can, in a beautiful case. Had I not put so much effort into my NES setup in the past year, I might be interested in such a product. It's fantastic. I just think the style of marketing and pricing is designed in a way appears insulting or at least abrasive to the community, because it caters to people who don't even know what they're looking at with flashy buzzwords like "HiFi". It reeks of Monster Cables. And in the end, we don't want our hobby being peddled by Monster Inc. We prefer to see our products sold by artisan hobbyist hacker types. I'm sure it will be a truly great product, but the marketing and execution just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

[ms06fz]

I've hesitated to bring the word "art" into this discussion because I think most people have a really distorted idea of what art is or should be... But to me that's basically what this is. They're making a thing some people will like for its aesthetic value as much as its technical qualities. They're making something you couldn't get before and, when they're done making them, probably never again. It's kind of silly from a practical perspective but there's nothing wrong with buying an expensive thing because you think it's pretty.
I can totally relate to those friends who saw a modded NES and were unimpressed. It was just a few years ago that I was one of those who hadn't played NES in years, and I just didn't know the NES signal quality had all these issues. So I expect I'd see similar reactions, when I get my NESRGB and mod my Fami, I think most of my friends just won't be familiar with the problems that prompt that kind of mod.