XRGB-3

The place for all discussion on gaming hardware
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akumajo
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Post by akumajo »

alright, well my sony lcd is good enough for 480p, i was just testing and now i know ;p

what would you recommand to upscale 480p inputs to lcd ? (720p is enough)
DVDO Edge seems perfect but too much expensive for me.
there is also Mega-Cool VGA Box - XCM 1080P but i cant find enough feedback[/quote]
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

The XCM HDMI Box is supposed to be crap, but let's see until some more user reviews come in...

Which Sony LCD are you using ? I find the XRGB3 in B1 (480p VGA out) to the Sony and letting the Sony do the upscaling pretty good.

For scaling purposes you can use pretty much any scaler, maybe an iScan HD+ ?

Tobias
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akumajo
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Post by akumajo »

i'm using sony KDL-32D3000
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Inkvisitor
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Post by Inkvisitor »

Can you check somewhere if the XRGB gets 240i input instead of 480i? All I see on display is "525i", even when setting Ibara to tate.

Should it not be possible to pass through 240p directly or does the XRGB always scale that up to 480p?
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

There is no 240i.
525i = 480i.
It's not possible to passthrough 240p, since it's 15khz.
Ibara PS2, unless patched, is always 480i, no matter if Yoko or Tate.
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Inkvisitor
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Post by Inkvisitor »

Thanks for clearing that up Fudoh :)

My Ibara DVD is indeed patched according to thread "Deinterlaced Mushi PS2 (and Ibara)" and I'm not sure if it outputs 240p or not. I made a new ISO and compared it with the old in HxD so I can verify that it was successfully patched.

"Deinterlaced Mushi PS2 (and Ibara)": http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.ph ... highlight=
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

Nothing easier that than. Full scanline emulation will only work with 240p input, so you'll immediately see the difference between 240p and 480i input once you turn on the Scanline emulation in B1 mode.

As a sidenote: Mushihimesama and Ibara look quite nice on the XRGB2/3 in their original unpatched version. They look indeed even better than on any other direct TV or upscaling machine. As if Cave had XRGB units running in their office when making those versions for Taito....
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akumajo
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Post by akumajo »

any update for english firmware?
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akumajo
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Post by akumajo »

new update available (2008年10月28日)

http://www.micomsoft.co.jp/xrgb-3_download.htm

any translator?
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

support for the new 3000 PSP version. The new version now has interlaced component output instead of progressive only, so the zoom function for full screen PSP playback is now available for both interlaced and progressive input.
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akumajo
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Post by akumajo »

oh well, not much, at least i cant see any good change for me :o

still nice to see updates released

if i understand well, psp 3000 users will be able to play with scanline (thx to expanded video-out feature ?)

"Further expanding PSP's entertainment capabilities, the video-out
port(*3) is also expanded to output gameplay in interlace format, which
will allow new PSP users to enjoy games on non-progressive TVs by using
separately sold cables. With the current "slim and light" PSP, games can be displayed on progressive TVs only."
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

if i understand well, psp 3000 users will be able to play with scanline (thx to expanded video-out feature ?)
no, the signal is just interlaced (480i). This makes the picture blurry overall and causes even interlacing artefacts on the internal LCD screen. It's a mess...
jpnn80nc
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Post by jpnn80nc »

As I could not find the scanline option in the menu, and as it's not mentionned in the translation on 1st page of this thread, could someone tell me exactly where to enable scanline and set their level ? And will it work with 480P input?
Btw I already upgraded the firwmare, and B1 mode sets XRGB output to 480P.
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Post by Fudoh »

As I could not find the scanline option in the menu, and as it's not mentionned in the translation on 1st page of this thread, could someone tell me exactly where to enable scanline and set their level ?
open the menu. Very last point (where you set the A/D level), you'll see two options there (one _H and one _V). One is for classic horizontal scanlines, one is for weird vertical intereference pattern.... I like settings between 150 and 175 for the horizontal scanlines.
And will it work with 480P input?
no.

I recently found out why 480p looked to ugly on my setup: you have to disable the low-pass-filter (LPF) on 480p sources. But make sure to re-enable it for 240p sources.
jpnn80nc
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Post by jpnn80nc »

Thanks for your answer, now I could finally find it.

btw what does A/D stand for ?
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

no idea what it stands for* but you have to pull up a dark single colored screen in any game (dark blue for example) and then adjust A/D to the level where you see as little background noise as possible. It's 179 for 240p and 203 for 480p on my setup, but it might differ on yours.

*well, actually it's analog/digital conversion of course, but I have no idea how that's related to what adjusting the A/D level does...
jpnn80nc
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Post by jpnn80nc »

Concerning the vertical scanlines, I think they can be handy with a monitor that can rotate 90°, and a vertical shooter game than can rotate his display mode too.

btw scanline mode also requires vga output and is not compatible with dvi right ?
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

Concerning the vertical scanlines, I think they can be handy with a monitor that can rotate 90°, and a vertical shooter game than can rotate his display mode too.
not really, with a tated monitor and a game running in Tate as well you need the standard horizontal scanline setting. And have a look at those vertical ones. These are 1cm stripes and nothing like scanlines...
btw scanline mode also requires vga output and is not compatible with dvi right ?
yes.
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akumajo
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new update

Post by akumajo »

version 2008年12月5日
http://www.micomsoft.co.jp/xrgb3_update_setup_v2_07.exe

hope it will fix my problems...
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Elixir
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Post by Elixir »

Hey guys, I just recently scored an XRGB2+ and I need to know a few things in preparation for its arrival soon.

Firstly, I plan on using it in conjunction with an AV7000 supergun via a Japanese 21pin RGB cable, along with a D-Terminal PS2 cable for when I want to play PS2 games. I assume these can be connected at the same time without any issues, and will run without any issues either? I have a 17" CRT COMPAQ monitor that I intend to use, so I guess now I finally have a reason to have more than a single monitor on my desk.
I haven't actively browsed/used this forum in many years and it's no longer an accurate representation of me.

I have retired from genre-specific content creation after 13 years, but I'll always love this little genre in my own personal way.
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

You should be fine. Make sure the Scart input is set to RGB, not YUV and the PS2's output is set to YPbPr. Otherwise you get no picture. And maybe start with a game (PCB) with a refreshrate near 59.94Hz. You might eventually run into troubles using PCBs which are way off.
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

added an illustrated XRGB-3 beginner's guide to my page. It should explain the basic settings pretty well and provide new XRGB buyers a good start.

http://retrogaming.hazard-city.de/
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akumajo
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Post by akumajo »

version 2.10 is out

i have no idea about changes/fixes

http://www.micomsoft.co.jp/xrgb-3.htm

http://www.micomsoft.co.jp/xrgb3_update_setup_v2_10.exe
http://www.micomsoft.co.jp/XRGB-3_V2_10.pdf

edit:
- new resolutions are available: low res (320x240) and some widescreen resolutions (1360x768 etc)
- a new feature is available: dot by dot
- in b1 mode, default values for VL_H and VL_V are 32
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Konsolkongen
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Post by Konsolkongen »

Are any of you experiencing stuttering when playing 240p games in B0 mode? The most noticeable game i can think of is Sonic The Hedgehog 1 in JAP or on the Sonic Jam compilation. The EU and US version doesn't have moving clouds, so its very hard to see in them. The clouds are moving from right to left and sometimes there are stuttering/lagging/hiccups. Its also noticeable on games like Dynamite Headdy or any other game where parts of the background is moving on its own.

It happens on both Saturn and MegaDrive and on RGBs and S-Video. This doesn't seem to happen when upscaling the Dreamcasts VGA signal.
Changing the V Lock setting to On sounds like that would do the trick but instead i get nothing than a black screen with sound. These hiccups aren't as bad as they sound, and is nearly impossible to see when you are playing an actual game. Still i would like to see them go away...

Can someone explain what these options does:

5.7 - NTSC Manual dot lock
7.8 - Horizontal sync polarity
7.9 - Vertical sync polarity

A few days after i got the XRGB-3 i decided to modify the RGBs input so it could take EU scart cables without an adaptor. I took some pictures and could make a quick how to, would anyone be interested in this?
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Konsolkongen
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Post by Konsolkongen »

akumajo wrote:version 2.10 is out
- new resolutions are available: low res (320x240) and some widescreen resolutions (1360x768 etc)
- a new feature is available: dot by dot
- in b1 mode, default values for VL_H and VL_V are 32
1920x1080p nice!! I will have to try this later tonight.
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akumajo
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Post by akumajo »

hum, i dont remember that you could use 640x480 in b0 mode
and the quality is very good, scanline users give it a try
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Konsolkongen
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Post by Konsolkongen »

It never had 640x480 in B0 mode. The quality is very bad in this resolution. Everything looks blurry and unsharp. Changing the sharpness to 7 helps (funny as 7 always looked like 0 to me) but setting it higher will result in strange pink colors appearing in the all white parts of the game (letters and so on). Even though it now runs in a lower resolution i still get stuttering in Sonic Jam on the Saturn.

I can see how 640x480 would be great for some, but on my display this looks much worse. Maybe things will be corrected in the next firmware.
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Konsolkongen
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Post by Konsolkongen »

CRAP! Doesn't look like 1920x1080 works... And now i can't seem to get a picture at all using DVI on my tv :(

EDIT:
DVI works on my tv again. Had to change to 1280x1024 in VGA and then switch to DVI. For some reason the XRGB skipped that resolution when i used the Mode button...?

Strange that 1080p doesn't work on either VGA or DVI (HDMI), maybe in a future update? Another strange thing is that the XRGB has no problem outputting 640x480 through VGA when using B1 mode. But 640x480 in B0 mode through VGA doesn't work, it does work with DVI though... Those might just be problems with my tv.

The Dot by Dot option seems very nice. As far as i can see it keeps the correct aspect ratio, this should result in smoother scrolling when upscaling. But i haven't really had time to test it yet.
Last edited by Konsolkongen on Sat Jan 31, 2009 8:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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akumajo
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Post by akumajo »

maybe you need to reset your xrgb3
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Fudoh
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Post by Fudoh »

I'll try the new update later on today or tomorrow.
5.7 - NTSC Manual dot lock
that's the horizontal input mapping. Don't bother.
7.8 - Horizontal sync polarity
7.9 - Vertical sync polarity
polarity of the sync signals on the VGA output. Don't bother if you don't have problems with the VGA connection on your TV set.
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