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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 4:19 pm 


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More features? What the fuck mike I thought this was plug and play I hate features

/s


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 4:46 pm 



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Awesome updates! I'm curious about the new 80% scanline setting which seems to be replacing the old 90% one (which felt perfect to me).


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 5:05 pm 


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maxtherabbit wrote:
More features? What the fuck mike I thought this was plug and play I hate features

/s


:mrgreen: Its like having too much money. Mo money mo problems! :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:06 pm 


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fernan1234 wrote:
Awesome updates! I'm curious about the new 80% scanline setting which seems to be replacing the old 90% one (which felt perfect to me).

That's funny because I'm excited about the 25% scanline option since 50% and 90% seemed way too dark to me.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:13 pm 



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Tempest_2084 wrote:
That's funny because I'm excited about the 25% scanline option since 50% and 90% seemed way too dark to me.


Haha, maybe Mike can just give us 5% increments :mrgreen: . 90% was the most sharp-CRT-like (while 100% integer was most emulator-filter-like), but yes also quite dark, though that can be compensated for with gamma, contrast, and/or brightness adjustments.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:29 pm 


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I believe this is why the 90% option was removed. It was too similar to full scanlines IMO, and in many cases, even darker than full. Ill bet 80% will be just the right distance / balance from 100% to make it worth having it vs a 90% that was very close to the same. Dont knock it till you've tried it! :)


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:37 pm 



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Josh128 wrote:
I believe this is why the 90% option was removed. It was too similar to full scanlines IMO, and in many cases, even darker than full. Ill bet 80% will be just the right distance / balance from 100% to make it worth having it vs a 90% that was very close to the same. Dont knock it till you've tried it! :)


IMO 90% polyphase and 100% integer were similar in darkness but quite different in appearance besides that. Like I said earlier, 100% integer was straight venetian blinds black lines, whereas the polyphase lines tapered off and varied in thickness, looking much more like real scanlines on a CRT.

Not knocking the new option, just curious about the change.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:51 pm 


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So last night, I finally decided to use my Saturn with the 5x. I hadn't tried it since getting my unit. I have a MODE installed and whenever I use the MODE's in game reset to go back to the menu, I lose picture. The only way I can get it back is by blindly scroll through the 5X's resolutions or turn off the 5X and reboot it. My 5X only does this with the Saturn. It does this no matter what resolution I'm using. The funny thing is, not only does the Saturn picture disappear, but even the 5X disappears like my TV isn't recognizing it anymore. I can't even see the 5X menu and thus just have to click the resolution button or reboot the unit. I just updated to the newest firmware and had not tried my Saturn on the old firmware. Very odd to me that even the 5X menu disappears like my TV isn't recognizing it even though none of my other consoles do this, just the Saturn. I thought maybe the MODE in game reset was doing something goofy, but hadn't remembered seeing if anyone had talked about this or not.

I'm not sure if this has been a known issue in that's already been talked about in the dozens and dozens of pages. I just wanted to check before I messaged or asked Mike.


Last edited by TooBeaucoup on Mon Jun 07, 2021 7:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 7:06 pm 



Joined: 27 Sep 2018
Posts: 195
Color correction for NTSC-J's P22 at D93 to modern D65 and black level switching between IRE 0.0 and 7.5?


Last edited by energizerfellow‌ on Sun Jun 20, 2021 3:36 pm, edited 6 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:14 pm 


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TooBeaucoup wrote:
So last night, I finally decided to use my Saturn with the 5x. I hadn't tried it since getting my unit. I have a MODE installed and whenever I use the MODE's in game reset to go back to the menu, I lose picture. The only way I can get it back is by blindly scroll through the 5X's resolutions or turn off the 5X and reboot it. My 5X only does this with the Saturn. It does this no matter what resolution I'm using. The funny thing is, not only does the Saturn picture disappear, but even the 5X disappears like my TV isn't recognizing it anymore. I can't even see the 5X menu and thus just have to click the resolution button or reboot the unit. I just updated to the newest firmware and had not tried my Saturn on the old firmware. Very odd to me that even the 5X menu disappears like my TV isn't recognizing it even though none of my other consoles do this, just the Saturn. I thought maybe the MODE in game reset was doing something goofy, but hadn't remembered seeing if anyone had talked about this or not.

I'm not sure if this has been a known issue in that's already been talked about in the dozens and dozens of pages. I just wanted to check before I messaged or asked Mike.


Does this happen even with triple buffering enabled?


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:49 pm 


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Kez wrote:
TooBeaucoup wrote:
So last night, I finally decided to use my Saturn with the 5x. I hadn't tried it since getting my unit. I have a MODE installed and whenever I use the MODE's in game reset to go back to the menu, I lose picture. The only way I can get it back is by blindly scroll through the 5X's resolutions or turn off the 5X and reboot it. My 5X only does this with the Saturn. It does this no matter what resolution I'm using. The funny thing is, not only does the Saturn picture disappear, but even the 5X disappears like my TV isn't recognizing it anymore. I can't even see the 5X menu and thus just have to click the resolution button or reboot the unit. I just updated to the newest firmware and had not tried my Saturn on the old firmware. Very odd to me that even the 5X menu disappears like my TV isn't recognizing it even though none of my other consoles do this, just the Saturn. I thought maybe the MODE in game reset was doing something goofy, but hadn't remembered seeing if anyone had talked about this or not.

I'm not sure if this has been a known issue in that's already been talked about in the dozens and dozens of pages. I just wanted to check before I messaged or asked Mike.


Does this happen even with triple buffering enabled?


Ah! You're right. I just tried triple buffering and it's fine now. Odd that all my other consoles work fine when using in game resets with frame lock, but not the Saturn. :(


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 3:27 am 


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There's a reason why triple buffer is the default setting. It's the most compatible mode: there are things that will work buffered but not locked, but there is nothing that will work locked but not buffered.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 6:14 am 


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Guspaz wrote:
There's a reason why triple buffer is the default setting. It's the most compatible mode: there are things that will work buffered but not locked, but there is nothing that will work locked but not buffered.


Yeah, I get that. Just weird that my Saturn will work in frame lock just fine from a fresh system boot in every resolution mode and doesn't muck up until an in game MODE reset. I just thought it was odd. I enjoy frame lock since technically speaking the lag is lower, but it's obviously not a deal breaker. I just have to get up off my fat azz and reboot the console by hand if I really want frame lock for a Saturn game.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 7:26 am 



Joined: 08 Jun 2021
Posts: 3
Hi
I wished to know if RetroAccess/Retrogaming Cables Dreamcast SCART cable with selector between 15KhZ/31 KhZ is compatible with GSCARTSW and RETROTINK 5X or can damage them if i connect.
Thanks for the answers.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 9:34 am 


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It is quite strange that it would be completely knocked out from just resetting though, I assume it is briefly putting out a weird signal that the 5x or maybe the TV can't handle. If you're in framelock you could always toggle triple buffering on the tink before doing a reset I guess! I wonder if anyone else with a MODE can replicate this behaviour, or you are able to reproduce it on a different display?


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 10:32 am 



Joined: 08 Jun 2021
Posts: 3
Hi all

Someone could please tell me if the RetroGamingCable/RetroaAccess Dreamcast RGB SCART cable with selector between 15KhZ/31KhZ is okay with GSCARTSW and RETROTINK 5X?

Thanks in advance.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 11:11 am 


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Guspaz wrote:
There's a reason why triple buffer is the default setting. It's the most compatible mode: there are things that will work buffered but not locked, but there is nothing that will work locked but not buffered.

Do most people keep TB and switch to FL as needed or the other way around? I have mine on FL normally, but I really need to try a timing sensitive game like one of the Punch Outs and see if TB makes a difference or not. Then again my reflexes aren't what they used to be so maybe I can't blame the TB mode anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 11:24 am 


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Kez wrote:
It is quite strange that it would be completely knocked out from just resetting though, I assume it is briefly putting out a weird signal that the 5x or maybe the TV can't handle. If you're in framelock you could always toggle triple buffering on the tink before doing a reset I guess! I wonder if anyone else with a MODE can replicate this behaviour, or you are able to reproduce it on a different display?


Your suggestion of trying a second TV was a good one. It hadn't even occurred to me for some reason, so after a ton of messing around here is what I figured out. And this is going to be a fun one for Mike to look into if he ever decides he has the time or care. LOL!

SOOOOOO......

It seems both of my TVs only lose picture in frame lock on certain games. Not every game is affected. But, what's even weirder is from my testing, it seems dependent on the LPF.

If anyone has a MODE and wants to test this, feel free. I'd be curious as to your results, but it did this on both of my TVs. A game I can confirm loses picture using the MODE in game reset button combination is the U.S. version of Darius Gaiden.

If you have your 5X set to frame lock and the LPF to medium or strong, the game (In this case Darius Gaiden) will not lose picture when using the MODE in game reset. However, if the 5X is set to frame lock and the LPF is set to light or off, you will lose picture and have to cycle resolutions or toggle blindly back to triple buffer.

I also did these same tests on Batman Forever and the in game reset did not cause a picture loss in frame lock no matter what the LPF was set to. But, I tried this about two dozen times with Darius Gaiden and every time, it loses picture when the LPF was set to light or off, but never when it was set to medium or strong.

There were other games that lost picture as well, but Darius Gaiden was the first game I realized was doing it so I used this title for all the testing. Not sure how an LPF works or what it does to the signal, but my two TVs do not like it being off or on light when using frame lock on the Saturn for certain games. So damn weird! LOL! Not really an issue, though. I just leave it at medium and the in game reset has been functioning fine.

I'm sure not all TVs do this but both of mine did. I have a 65" LG 4K TV, non OLED and a little 20" Insignia piece of crap.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:40 pm 


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Just updated to the new FW yesterday and I must say, having the additional scanline options is a very nice addition. I find the 80% scanlines basically identical to the previous 90%. It seems now that there is sufficient difference between each mode to cover all bases.

Was Tinkering with it yesterday after the FW update and I must say that on my QHD monitor, I believe that for 240p RGB sources, the 1080p UNDER mode +50% polyphase scanlines is mind bogglingly beautiful. Anyone on the fence about this device should pull the trigger ASAP, IMO. Mike has accomplished something special here.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 6:44 pm 


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Anyone try the GC Gameboy player yet? How does that look with the new modes?


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 11:05 am 


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Looks like Mike is precisely working on this
https://twitter.com/retrotink2/status/1 ... 2886469635
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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:07 pm 


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parodius wrote:
Looks like Mike is precisely working on this
https://twitter.com/retrotink2/status/1 ... 2886469635

Cool!


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:15 pm 


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Of note: Mike's 360p captures are from a PAL cube with the RGB scart cables. No gcvideo required.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:35 pm 


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Guspaz wrote:
Of note: Mike's 360p captures are from a PAL cube with the RGB scart cables. No gcvideo required.


I use mine through official component cables. I wonder how good it will look?


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:44 am 


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Just as good.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:00 pm 


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I'm having some weird results with the new firmware and my GBI. If I use the GBI with the OSSC file to automatically set the output to 360p (as Mike suggested) it sets the screen to 16:9 and everything looks really pixelated. If I use the regular GBI file it's set to 4:3 and everything looks a heck of a lot better. In the 360p 16:9 mode text gets blurry and hard to read (the copyright text at the start of games is almost illegible). Are GBA games supposed to be 16:9 through the 5X Pro, or is my TV doing something weird like it does with the 480p mode? If there's an option on my TV to override the aspect ratio I can't find it.

Here are some pictures I took to show what I'm talking about. They're not the greatest, but hopefully you'll see what I mean. The 360p 16:9 mode looks much worse in person.

360p/16:9
http://atariprotos.com/temp/360p_1.jpg
http://atariprotos.com/temp/360p_2.jpg

240p/4:3
http://atariprotos.com/temp/gbi_1.jpg
http://atariprotos.com/temp/gbi_2.jpg


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:39 pm 


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The GBA isn't 4:3. The screen is 240x160, a 3:2 aspect ratio (and it uses square pixels). It's partly between widescreen and non-wide. See here:

Image

The aspect ratio in your 360p images seems right. The aspect ratio in your 240p images is very squashed.

It also sounds like you're having sampling issues, though. I'm not sure what to say about that, from Mike's firmware notes it seems super finicky since it works on a PAL cube over RGB SCART but not HDRV cables that transcode from analog RGB... But that said, I can't see any issues at all in the 360p photos you posted, that looks like per-pixel sampling to me?


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:55 pm 


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Nobody mentioned the new firmware Mike put out yesterday, I had to read between the lines. :mrgreen:

Quote:
June 15th, 2021

Version 1.28
Download Here

Added 360p support for the GBI. Possible output resolutions:

1080p (FILL): 6x integer scale with optimal sampling/autophase

1080p (OVER): 6.75 interpolated scaling to use the full vertical height of the display

1200p: 7x integer scale with optimal timing/autophase

1440p: 8x integer scale with optimal sampling/autophase

Grumpy disclaimer time! It's up to you to get GBI and 360p output from your Gamecube setup! We cannot provide support for the use of 3rd party equipment and there are simply too many variations for us to be able to keep up with.


We can confirm that a PAL GCN with a *NTSC SNES* RGB SCART cable works as well as the official OEM component cables and the Insurrection Industries Carby with an external HDMI -> YPbPr converter box. The RGB approach seems to have some image quality issues, though, so we'd recommend a solution that uses the GC's digital AV port.


Unfortunately the Carby Component Cable does not work. The HD Retrovision on a PAL GCN also does not work. We do not know if a modded GCN works, but are told that it should.



This is awesome, but as I raced to the page I was also hoping he sneaked the 1080i / 540p output in there. I'll just have to keep fingers crossed for inclusion the future. :)


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:58 pm 


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I thought the 240p ones looked squished, but the pixelation was so much better.

Here are three more pictures that I didn't scale so they're huge. In the first one you can the weird artifacts around the Konami logo and same with the text on the file select screen. The third one is of the game in action and honestly it doesn't look bad, but I wonder if it's correct. It's so hard to tell because GBA games really shouldn't be blown up to 40" :)

http://atariprotos.com/temp/konami.jpg
http://atariprotos.com/temp/360p_3.jpg
http://atariprotos.com/temp/360p_4.jpg

If it is some sort of sampling issue, I can't fix it on my end. I tried all the modes and it's all the same.


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 Post subject: Re: RetroTINK 5x-Pro
PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:05 pm 



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I think the 360p looks correct. Iirc, that’s how the Konami logo is actually drawn.


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