Looking for help with Ikegami TM20-80R!

[hyrulebr]

Hi Guys!

I bought two monitors from an auction dealer (computer and broadcasting equipment) and unfortunatelly both have problems!

But "one problem at a time" and now I need help with an Ikegami TM20-80R. It have two issues:

1) When you turn it on the screen is greenish and takes at least 5 minutes to be better;
2) There is a purple-like blending/ghost in some text and graphics. That problem also seems to get better with time but even after a full hour I still can see the ghosts.


0 minutes. Very greenish!


5 minutes. Purple blending/ghosts

Please see more pictures in better quality at imgur:

https://imgur.com/a/sImTEUP

I added a Sony monitor picture for comparison.

At 5 to 8 minutes of warm up the screen looks good but ghosts still haunting me!

Last picture is about 30 minutes and the ghosts are weak but I still can see it in moviment (against light backgrounds).

Any tips or advice to try to solve these problems? I think to solve the first one I will need to do a recap but which board? Do I have to recap all the boards? Anyone have the service manual for this monitor?

I apreciate any help!

Mauricio

[SamIAm]

A condition that improves with warm-up is a classic symptom of electrolytic capacitors going bad. If your TM20-80R is like my HTM-2050R2s, there will be a video processing board (the one you connect RGB and sync to) and an RGB amp board (the one that connects to the neckboard of the tube). You'll probably want to recap both of them. I'd start with the RGB amp, since it's easier and has bigger caps that are more likely to go bad.

If you take out your video processor board, I'd love to see a pic of it. I'm about to do some heavy-duty recalibration on a couple of mine. The HTMs convert RGB to YUV and back again, which might (or might not) be relevant to your case.

[hyrulebr]

A condition that improves with warm-up is a classic symptom of electrolytic capacitors going bad. If your TM20-80R is like my HTM-2050R2s, there will be a video processing board (the one you connect RGB and sync to) and an RGB amp board (the one that connects to the neckboard of the tube). You'll probably want to recap both of them. I'd start with the RGB amp, since it's easier and has bigger caps that are more likely to go bad.

If you take out your video processor board, I'd love to see a pic of it. I'm about to do some heavy-duty recalibration on a couple of mine. The HTMs convert RGB to YUV and back again, which might (or might not) be relevant to your case.

Hi

I opened it and take some pictures.




Complete pics at:
https://imgur.com/a/H79Pxtv

You nailed it!
RGB input or RGB out (amp) is/are the culprint because both problems only happens with RGB. See the pictures below (first composite and second RGB).






Thank you for your help!

Do you know I have to recap everything, even these little silver and black caps?

I'm a noob but following the cables, the RGB input board have a direct connection to the RGB out board (amp) and then to the neck board. But the other expansion boards goes to the deflection board (I'm assuming it's a deflection board) and then to the neck (but no in the neck board, more in the middle, after the rings, etc). So "deflection" is something like converting composite to RGB?

I also got a HTM1990R that needs repair and I will also post this headache in a few days. I hope you can help me in this too!

[jamon1567]

Just wanted to chime in here because I had basically the same experience with my TM20-80RH, minus the greenish tint. On RGB it looked like someone ran a brush across the blues (and it was clearly noticeable if you isolated the blue gun), but after warming up for some time it largely went away. However, using YPbPr, the problem did not exist, nor did it happen over composite either. I came to the same conclusion as SamIAm (as did a couple other guys I spoke with), so I sent both of these boards out to Savonpat to recap, although he just replaced whatever he found to be bad. However, when I got them back, I now had NO blue. I talked to Pat and sent them back out to him to have another look, and he again replaced a few more, but I still have the same issue with NO blue. I would also add that this isn't isolated to RGB. Even if I pull up the monitor test patterns, there is no blue.

I'm not sure what to think at this point, and I hope to take it to another guy I know here soon, but it's very disappointing because I like this monitor a great deal. If anyone has any other ideas I'd be all ears. I can't see how the issue isn't something that Pat would have done with the cap replacement, but who knows.

[coderkind]

The HTMs convert RGB to YUV and back again, which might (or might not) be relevant to your case.

Very interesting! How did you find that out? I'm looking to potentially get a HTM-1990-R recapped, but haven't tried the component-only input suggestion (only RGB so far), for which I'm experiencing the green screen warm-up issue (corrects itself after several minutes, but can drift back into green at later points).

[coderkind]

Just wanted to chime in here because I had basically the same experience with my TM20-80RH, minus the greenish tint. On RGB it looked like someone ran a brush across the blues (and it was clearly noticeable if you isolated the blue gun), but after warming up for some time it largely went away. However, using YPbPr, the problem did not exist, nor did it happen over composite either. I came to the same conclusion as SamIAm (as did a couple other guys I spoke with), so I sent both of these boards out to Savonpat to recap, although he just replaced whatever he found to be bad. However, when I got them back, I now had NO blue. I talked to Pat and sent them back out to him to have another look, and he again replaced a few more, but I still have the same issue with NO blue. I would also add that this isn't isolated to RGB. Even if I pull up the monitor test patterns, there is no blue.

I'm not sure what to think at this point, and I hope to take it to another guy I know here soon, but it's very disappointing because I like this monitor a great deal. If anyone has any other ideas I'd be all ears. I can't see how the issue isn't something that Pat would have done with the cap replacement, but who knows.

Damn; sending Ikegami boards to Pat was one route I was considering. Does he mainly specialise in Sony then, or known to recap other brands to the same success?

[SamIAm]

The HTMs convert RGB to YUV and back again, which might (or might not) be relevant to your case.

Very interesting! How did you find that out? I'm looking to potentially get a HTM-1990-R recapped, but haven't tried the component-only input suggestion (only RGB so far), for which I'm experiencing the green screen warm-up issue (corrects itself after several minutes, but can drift back into green at later points).

It's explained in the HTM-2050R service manual, and clearly visible in the schematics. There is a single YUV (YPbPr) bus that every input board puts its signals onto, and these get converted back to RGB on the video processor board. HTM monitors have mostly interchangeable boards, so I'd expect every unit to share this design. Technically, however, it wouldn't be impossible for one to use straight RGB from the RGB inputs, and I know that the 19xx models use a different core decoder chip than the xx50s.

I don't think a service manual for your monitor is available. If you want, try emailing a US branch of Ikegami. When a Japanese branch refused my requests for a service manual, another fellow actually got one through a US representative.

[coderkind]

The HTMs convert RGB to YUV and back again, which might (or might not) be relevant to your case.

Very interesting! How did you find that out? I'm looking to potentially get a HTM-1990-R recapped, but haven't tried the component-only input suggestion (only RGB so far), for which I'm experiencing the green screen warm-up issue (corrects itself after several minutes, but can drift back into green at later points).

It's explained in the HTM-2050R service manual, and clearly visible in the schematics. There is a single YUV (YPbPr) bus that every input board puts its signals onto, and these get converted back to RGB on the video processor board. HTM monitors have mostly interchangeable boards, so I'd expect every unit to share this design. Technically, however, it wouldn't be impossible for one to use straight RGB from the RGB inputs, and I know that the 19xx models use a different core decoder chip than the xx50s.

I don't think a service manual for your monitor is available. If you want, try emailing a US branch of Ikegami. When a Japanese branch refused my requests for a service manual, another fellow actually got one through a US representative.

Thanks for the info!

[jamon1567]

Just wanted to chime in here because I had basically the same experience with my TM20-80RH, minus the greenish tint. On RGB it looked like someone ran a brush across the blues (and it was clearly noticeable if you isolated the blue gun), but after warming up for some time it largely went away. However, using YPbPr, the problem did not exist, nor did it happen over composite either. I came to the same conclusion as SamIAm (as did a couple other guys I spoke with), so I sent both of these boards out to Savonpat to recap, although he just replaced whatever he found to be bad. However, when I got them back, I now had NO blue. I talked to Pat and sent them back out to him to have another look, and he again replaced a few more, but I still have the same issue with NO blue. I would also add that this isn't isolated to RGB. Even if I pull up the monitor test patterns, there is no blue.

I'm not sure what to think at this point, and I hope to take it to another guy I know here soon, but it's very disappointing because I like this monitor a great deal. If anyone has any other ideas I'd be all ears. I can't see how the issue isn't something that Pat would have done with the cap replacement, but who knows.

Damn; sending Ikegami boards to Pat was one route I was considering. Does he mainly specialise in Sony then, or known to recap other brands to the same success?

Yes, he specializes in Sony stuff. I still don't know what the issue is with my board since I don't have the knowledge to troubleshoot it myself and I've not been able to get it out to someone that can yet. I will be soon actually, so maybe I'll have some news here in the near future, but replacing caps shouldn't be something that is specific to Sony or Ikegami. I'll be very curious to see what comes of this other guy looking at mine.

[coderkind]

Yes, he specializes in Sony stuff. I still don't know what the issue is with my board since I don't have the knowledge to troubleshoot it myself and I've not been able to get it out to someone that can yet. I will be soon actually, so maybe I'll have some news here in the near future, but replacing caps shouldn't be something that is specific to Sony or Ikegami. I'll be very curious to see what comes of this other guy looking at mine.

Yep; update the thread as/when if you could. Many thanks.

I actually did a fan mod on my HTM-1990R and I haven't experienced the green screen issue since. Crossing my fingers I've accidentally fixed it