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 Post subject: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:21 pm 



Joined: 16 Nov 2013
Posts: 325
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Taken from citrus3000psi twitter:
Quote:
Might as well leak this info out. @chriz2600 and I decided to hold off on the PS2 and release a PS1 variant first. Prototypes will be purchased soon. This will be a no cut mod w/HDMI in place of the serial port.

Spoiler: show
Image


Last edited by juji82 on Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:00 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1572
Glad to see this is finally coming along! It's probably a safe assumption that there won't be an alternative install method that allows the serial port to remain intact. :/

(Also, please put the large image in a spoiler tag.)


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:33 pm 



Joined: 07 Jan 2017
Posts: 122
Man, now all the fat PS1's with I/O ports will disappear :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:40 pm 



Joined: 14 Aug 2017
Posts: 708
tongshadow wrote:
Man, now all the fat PS1's with I/O ports will disappear :mrgreen:


I think that's a different port, which coincidentally the PSIO utilizes so thankfully there's no conflict there. The serial port was used for hooking up two consoles and maybe other stuff.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 12:37 am 


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Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 1154
Location: Southern California
:( Another PS1 device that doesn't support the PSOne model.

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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 12:37 am 



Joined: 01 Mar 2018
Posts: 342
But... why?


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 1:24 am 



Joined: 07 Jan 2017
Posts: 122
fernan1234 wrote:
tongshadow wrote:
Man, now all the fat PS1's with I/O ports will disappear :mrgreen:


I think that's a different port, which coincidentally the PSIO utilizes so thankfully there's no conflict there. The serial port was used for hooking up two consoles and maybe other stuff.

Oh yes, Im aware of the Parallel I/O port, which was used for Gameshark mostly. The serial I/O was the one that was never removed right?


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 1:31 am 



Joined: 14 Aug 2017
Posts: 708
opt2not wrote:
:( Another PS1 device that doesn't support the PSOne model.

Image


Sound is noticeably inferior on these so they should be avoided in general, but ironically an HDMI board may have fixed that if the problem lies in the DAC.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 2:51 am 



Joined: 16 Nov 2013
Posts: 325
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Looks like there are plans to save the serial port.
Quote:
With so many requests about the serial port, @chriz2600 thinks it’s possible to use the esp32 for wireless connectivity. To either other ps1 hdmi consoles or a separate hardware adapter.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 5:09 am 


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fernan1234 wrote:
Sound is noticeably inferior on these so they should be avoided in general, but ironically an HDMI board may have fixed that if the problem lies in the DAC.


Really? That’s the first I’ve heard about this.

I love my PSOne, it’s a great size and has a great aesthetic. The LCD attachment is fantastic too. I can’t give up on these units, they’re just too awesome.
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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 5:36 am 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1572
juji82 wrote:
Looks like there are plans to save the serial port.
Quote:
With so many requests about the serial port, @chriz2600 thinks it’s possible to use the esp32 for wireless connectivity. To either other ps1 hdmi consoles or a separate hardware adapter.

Neat! I wonder how that would be configured, whether it's ad hoc or can connect to a WLAN (and download firmware updates, a la DCHDMI). Frankly, I'd like to see a wired variant; 2.4GHz is crowded where I am.

Also, I hope the peering is dead-simple to use; should be able to broadcast after connecting to a [W]LAN, list all the other broadcasting and unpaired PS1HDMIs, and automatically pair if it only finds one device after a few seconds.

On top of that, if it does connect to a [W]LAN, and latency isn't a problem, it might also be possible to set up a tunnel and play over the internet.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 6:41 am 


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I'm happy to see this happen, although I'm not sure I understand the logic of creating a no cut mod that instead of sacrificing a bit of the plastic shell, removes one of the dedicated functions of the console. Personally I think it's less destructive to just cut a hole.
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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 5:45 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1572
Arthrimus wrote:
I'm happy to see this happen, although I'm not sure I understand the logic of creating a no cut mod that instead of sacrificing a bit of the plastic shell, removes one of the dedicated functions of the console. Personally I think it's less destructive to just cut a hole.

It really depends on who you ask. I think there are a lot of people who don't have link cables (like me), or they only have one console, or they have zero interest in using the serial port for anything; for those people, it doesn't make a tangible difference that the serial port gets removed.

For those that do want both an HDMI mod and keep the serial port, or for those that only want or need the HDMI mod in one of their consoles (not both), or for those that have PSones, I think they should make available an alternate installation method.

In defense of their proposal of using wireless (and I'm still hoping for a wired option) for serial networking, if the antenna is strong enough and latency is low enough to allow two consoles with his mod installed to connect via WiFi, then you're no longer limited to the length of the serial cable, and, as I mentioned in an earlier post, it might be possible to link over the internet.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 6:14 pm 


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Joined: 25 Dec 2013
Posts: 625
Location: Indiana
750x and later (including PSONE) do not have digital audio available. Installation is not the reason for not including the PSONE, its the audio.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:06 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2010
Posts: 477
juji82 wrote:
Taken from citrus3000psi twitter:
Quote:
Might as well leak this info out. @chriz2600 and I decided to hold off on the PS2 and release a PS1 variant first.


Spoiler: show
Image


But on a serious note: I think I will stick with PS2 for PS1+PS2 games, but what would be the ideal PS1 model for using the PS1HDMI and PSIO? SCPH-1001 or SCPH-5501


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:26 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1572
Seraphic wrote:
juji82 wrote:
Taken from citrus3000psi twitter:
Quote:
Might as well leak this info out. @chriz2600 and I decided to hold off on the PS2 and release a PS1 variant first.


Spoiler: show
Image


But on a serious note: I think I will stick with PS2 for PS1+PS2 games, but what would be the ideal PS1 model for using the PS1HDMI and PSIO? SCPH-1001 or SCPH-5501

My personal opinion is that SCPH-550x is ideal. It's old enough that it still has the parallel port and the ideal sound chip, but new enough that it has the rotated CD assembly (so it doesn't suffer a slow heat death due to proximity to the PSU). On the other hand, if you're not going to use the CD drive at all, and you're not going to use analogue audio, any model that has a parallel port should work.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:41 pm 



Joined: 05 Mar 2017
Posts: 377
Location: Woodinville, WA
I searched Twitter and couldn't find anything about the scaling options. Will it support 720p or 960p scaling?

I still haven't found a great way to scale 480p digital, so it would be great if this mod didn't have that limitation.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:54 pm 


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Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 1154
Location: Southern California
citrus3000psi wrote:
750x and later (including PSONE) do not have digital audio available. Installation is not the reason for not including the PSONE, its the audio.

Well that's unfortunate.

I'm not an audiophile, so I don't notice any difference with the digital vs analog audio output. So to me, not having digital audio doesn't really matter. But surely someone could come out with an HDMI device that converts the analog audio to digital to feed an HDMI standard.

I'll just stick to using my OSSC for PSOne.
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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:57 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1572
strygo wrote:
I searched Twitter and couldn't find anything about the scaling options. Will it support 720p or 960p scaling?

I still haven't found a great way to scale 480p digital, so it would be great if this mod didn't have that limitation.

I haven't seen anything regarding scaling, but, if citrus3000psi is doing it, I would think it would be on-par with the capability of the Dreamcast (480p, 960p, 960p windowboxed to 1080p).

That said, the PS1 is an older system that's limited to 15kHz modes; so I would expect at least 4x 240p/480i to 960p (2x for 288p/576i) and 960p windowboxed to 1080p, and we might see a 3x240/1.5x480 scale to 720p (which I think would be better for 4K displays, although a 1.5x deinterlaced 480i would still look kind of crappy).

opt2not wrote:
citrus3000psi wrote:
750x and later (including PSONE) do not have digital audio available. Installation is not the reason for not including the PSONE, its the audio.

Well that's unfortunate.

I'm not an audiophile, so I don't notice any difference with the digital vs analog audio output. So to me, not having digital audio doesn't really matter. But surely someone could come out with an HDMI device that converts the analog audio to digital to feed an HDMI standard.

It should be feasible to build a version of the HDMI board (or a unified board that can accommodate both use cases) for those later models that would digitize the analogue audio.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 3:26 am 



Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 1162
One great benefit of this internal solution is that the device will have the original pixel clock available.
It'll always look as good as a perfectly optimized OSSC, in all possible modes :)


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 12:09 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2010
Posts: 477
nmalinoski wrote:
My personal opinion is that SCPH-550x is ideal. It's old enough that it still has the parallel port and the ideal sound chip, but new enough that it has the rotated CD assembly (so it doesn't suffer a slow heat death due to proximity to the PSU). On the other hand, if you're not going to use the CD drive at all, and you're not going to use analogue audio, any model that has a parallel port should work.


The PlayStation I had when I was a kid was a SCPH-9001 so that's no good.
Maybe I will try to find a cheap SCPH-5501 just in case I ever want to mod it. :D


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 7:10 pm 


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Joined: 25 Dec 2013
Posts: 625
Location: Indiana
nmalinoski wrote:
It should be feasible to build a version of the HDMI board (or a unified board that can accommodate both use cases) for those later models that would digitize the analogue audio.


Its possible but is it worth it? I don't think so. PS1's are dirt cheap. Why spend so much effort for making separating revisions for specific consoles. Just buy a 500x-700x and call it day. Managing multiple revisions etc doesn't make sense on a console that costs 30USD.

As for the serial port, there might be a work around with piping the protocol over wireless but no guarantees. When these consoles were designed, engineers did not think to leave a free spot for and an hdmi connector. I didn't sit and think, "Ok what is the most inconvenient spot for people" Then go that route. Its a give and take situation. I could put the HDMI out the side and have you chop the metal case all up. This would keep the port serial intact.

Again PS1's are dirt cheap, if you want to use the serial port then you can always use a different console.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 8:08 pm 


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Joined: 02 Apr 2018
Posts: 72
Location: Arkansas
citrus3000psi wrote:
nmalinoski wrote:
It should be feasible to build a version of the HDMI board (or a unified board that can accommodate both use cases) for those later models that would digitize the analogue audio.


Its possible but is it worth it? I don't think so. PS1's are dirt cheap. Why spend so much effort for making separating revisions for specific consoles. Just buy a 500x-700x and call it day. Managing multiple revisions etc doesn't make sense on a console that costs 30USD.

As for the serial port, there might be a work around with piping the protocol over wireless but no guarantees. When these consoles were designed, engineers did not think to leave a free spot for and an hdmi connector. I didn't sit and think, "Ok what is the most inconvenient spot for people" Then go that route. Its a give and take situation. I could put the HDMI out the side and have you chop the metal case all up. This would keep the port serial intact.

Again PS1's are dirt cheap, if you want to use the serial port then you can always use a different console.


What's stopping you from squeezing a mini HDMI port between the serial port and rear center screw post? I know this would require some metal cutting but it would at least keep the full functionality of the console intact.
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plus c'est la même chose,
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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 9:28 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1572
citrus3000psi wrote:
nmalinoski wrote:
It should be feasible to build a version of the HDMI board (or a unified board that can accommodate both use cases) for those later models that would digitize the analogue audio.


Its possible but is it worth it? I don't think so. PS1's are dirt cheap. Why spend so much effort for making separating revisions for specific consoles. Just buy a 500x-700x and call it day. Managing multiple revisions etc doesn't make sense on a console that costs 30USD.

As for the serial port, there might be a work around with piping the protocol over wireless but no guarantees. When these consoles were designed, engineers did not think to leave a free spot for and an hdmi connector. I didn't sit and think, "Ok what is the most inconvenient spot for people" Then go that route. Its a give and take situation. I could put the HDMI out the side and have you chop the metal case all up. This would keep the port serial intact.

Again PS1's are dirt cheap, if you want to use the serial port then you can always use a different console.

You have a point; I've not been up to speed on the current prices of secondhand PlayStations, and it is fairly easy to get a compatible model. I was thinking that the addition of an ADC for compatibility with the other consoles (and the increase in cost that would come with it) would vastly increase the potential userbase; but an extra $30 on top of what's probably going to be another $150 mod kit likely won't make a difference.

Arthrimus wrote:
What's stopping you from squeezing a mini HDMI port between the serial port and rear center screw post? I know this would require some metal cutting but it would at least keep the full functionality of the console intact.

There really isn't a whole lot of room right there. Mine (SCPH-5501) has about an inch between the case and the mainboard's heat shield (covers half the ICs; I'm certain I'll have to remove it, at least temporarily, to install the QSB).

On the bright side, if the HDMI port could be routed to that location, it could be anchored using the two closest screws (one from the serial port and one from the AV Multi-out) with one or two 3D-printed parts; the section of the EM shield that would need to come off should come off relatively easily (just like with the DCHDMI); and we'd only need a small notch in the top shell. If it could be done, it'd be less work than the DCHDMI, and no desoldering would be needed.

There seems to be plenty of room underneath the mainboard, but the HDMI port would need to go directly under the serial port or directly under the AV Multi-out, and there's no clearance to wrap a flex cable around to the bottom.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:32 pm 


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Joined: 25 Dec 2013
Posts: 625
Location: Indiana
It might be possible to put a mini HDMI next to the serial port.

-The serial port was originally targeted so Late PU8 and the PU16 boards could work.
-Where Mini HDMI the filing would cause around around 2mm open gap below the connector due to where the cases meet.
-Its also dead simple to desolder the serial port. I've done it with braid (I have pump but wanted to see how feasible this was for a user) and its very simple.

The board will not fit under the mainboard. The ESP32 has to sit on top of the PCB, it cannot be flush like the DCHDMI. Maybe it could but would be super labor intensive and likely have a lot of errors. Fab solders the ESP2866 on the DCHDMI by hand. I'm trying to avoid that type of labor. The flex cables also can be very short with the board on the top and won't need series resistors on the flex. Flex assembly is very much a pain.


The plan is to send the serial data over ESP32. Meaning:

Two HDMI consoles can link.
One HDMI console with one link box (separate ESP32 with soldered on serial port) can still link to a non HDMI console.
Dev users will no longer need a cable as they can use something like socat to connect. (But could still use the link box if they chose too)


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:10 pm 


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Posts: 238
I feel like it would be better to keep the serial port if possible (I'm just not a fan of removing original features unless absolutely necessary)

Isn't the PU-16 revision rare and limited to Asian markets? and the later model PU-8 revisions (The -21 and later sub-revisions I assume?) are also kind of uncommon and IIRC are usually mixed in with different model numbers:-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStati ... _of_models
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Cate ... therboards
In which case I would be tempted to only 'officially' support the PU-18 (SCPH-55XX) and PU-20 (SCPH-70XX) revisions, and keep the serial port.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 2:49 am 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1572
I know this is reasonably off-topic, but, when you get around to the PS2 version, I hope there's a more eloquent method of getting digital audio out of the console than tapping S/PDIF output, because there are apparently a handful of games that don't support optical audio, PaRappa the Rapper 2 being one of them.


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 Post subject: Re: PS1HDMI
PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 2:21 pm 


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and Fantavision, which I still enjoy playing from time to time!
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