Gaming on 77" Oled

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Fudoh
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Fudoh »

It's a cheap trick but frame interpolation, as horrible as it looks, is a good way of demonstrating the extra detail you can see by doubling the frame rate. It's approximately equivalent to doubling the resolution.
you're actually roughly tripling the motion resolution.
Once you get above a certain pixel density, increasing the resolution further stops having the same impact for me but going from 60hz to 120hz still makes all the difference in the world.
cool, but what do you do on your 60Hz consoles if you don't want to deal with 100ms of extra lag due to the TV's motion interpolation?
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by orange808 »

I briefly had a Samsung LCD with game mode interpolation. Total latency was about 20ms.

It wasn't great, but the feature is new, so there's room for improvement. Probably best suited for new games, not pixel art.

It would be nice to see them improve the feature and roll it our with a future OLED product.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

Xyga wrote:Yeah was afraid so, it's almost unevitable.

20 years into flat panels and - besides the plasma parenthesis - nothing's changed yet.
You are a retrogamer ?
Then basic lag and response should still be your #1 concerns along with compatibility with your retro sources.
Forget about gimmicks and myths, always watch for all the display's elementary specs and performance, like you're getting a simple PC monitor.

And that's what makes LG OLEDs the best choice right now bar the burn in worries.
I just wish they made a smaller and cheaper 9 series *sigh*
I still believe everything 480p and below and sprite based belongs on a crt monitor. Everything 720p and above is best on an HD flat screen. Playing old sprite based games on an HD flat screen is a compromise, even on my OLEDs. Street Fighter 2 will never look better to me than it does on my arcade monitors or my Ikegami 20". And Time Crisis is most enjoyable with a real light gun.

For people that only have room for one monitor for everything from 240p to 4k, LG's OLEDs are pretty good value right now. But, if I only had my 4k OLED, I'd have to invest in decent low lag external upscaler for 240p games.

I think a lot of the burn in experiences with LG OLEDs are user error. They don't realize that, with models like the C8, you need to update the firmware and run the pixel refresher as soon as it arrives. Mine had dark spots and noise all over the place when I first turned it on. After the refresher, the image is perfect. A lot of those "day one burn in" pics are actually easily fixed software issues.

I've only ever seen actual burn-in on monitors in 24-7 pro environments like arcades and Airports.

BTW, why would you want a smaller OLED? Large screens are awesome! Sega Rally HD remix on the PS3 is pure magic on the 77". I'd have gone bigger if they made it.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Xyga »

I have a dedicated room for tech n' shit which is rather small and already packed with tons of gaming stuff and displays, no way a really large panel would fit now, plus I would be sitting too close.
43" would be the maximum, and cheaper than the bigger ones of course. :P
Maybe someday, or it'll be micro-led.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

Fudoh wrote:
It's a cheap trick but frame interpolation, as horrible as it looks, is a good way of demonstrating the extra detail you can see by doubling the frame rate. It's approximately equivalent to doubling the resolution.
you're actually roughly tripling the motion resolution.
Once you get above a certain pixel density, increasing the resolution further stops having the same impact for me but going from 60hz to 120hz still makes all the difference in the world.
cool, but what do you do on your 60Hz consoles if you don't want to deal with 100ms of extra lag due to the TV's motion interpolation?
I'm not saying I like to use frame interpolation for gaming (or anything else). I'm just saying it can be used to demonstrate how much difference increasing the frame rate makes. I.e. As a catalyst to make companies produce native high frame rate content instead of trying to bring an 8k 60hz standard to life.

The TV makers primary concern is giving people a reason to buy new TVs instead of waiting for the old one to die. It would be better for everyone if they made native high frame rate content instead of pretending that people will see extra detail by switching to 4k or 8k.

Unfortunately, it seems most likely that TV broadcasts will remain at 60hz and the next console generation will be focused on delivering 4k 60hz instead of 4k (or even 1080p) 120hz.

It leaves the average user to wonder why that extra 4k detail disappears once they turn off the unsightly soap opera effect.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

Xyga wrote:I have a dedicated room for tech n' shit which is rather small and already packed with tons of gaming stuff and displays, no way a really large panel would fit now, plus I would be sitting too close.
43" would be the maximum, and cheaper than the bigger ones of course. :P
Maybe someday, or it'll be micro-led.

I suspect you'll be out of luck on smaller sizes with micro led too. The consumer trend on TV sizes is only going up. Samsung's first micro led set, "The Wall" is 140".

As far as TV tech goes, I think micro led is the least likely to appear in small sizes and the least likely to be suitable for users who sit close to the screen. There is a reason why they have only made a 140" one currently. I read that they were working on 98" and 75" models though.

Anyway, the difference in foot print of a 43" 16:9 set and a 55" is negligible. I don't know how small your game room is but I assume the sides of the 43" aren't pressing against the wall? If you sit any more than 4 or 5 ft from the screen, 55" is not too big for gaming. I only sit 7ft from my 77" and I had a 110" projector screen in that room before..,
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by bobrocks95 »

Classicgamer wrote:
Fudoh wrote:
It's a cheap trick but frame interpolation, as horrible as it looks, is a good way of demonstrating the extra detail you can see by doubling the frame rate. It's approximately equivalent to doubling the resolution.
you're actually roughly tripling the motion resolution.
Once you get above a certain pixel density, increasing the resolution further stops having the same impact for me but going from 60hz to 120hz still makes all the difference in the world.
cool, but what do you do on your 60Hz consoles if you don't want to deal with 100ms of extra lag due to the TV's motion interpolation?
I'm not saying I like to use frame interpolation for gaming (or anything else). I'm just saying it can be used to demonstrate how much difference increasing the frame rate makes. I.e. As a catalyst to make companies produce native high frame rate content instead of trying to bring an 8k 60hz standard to life.

The TV makers primary concern is giving people a reason to buy new TVs instead of waiting for the old one to die. It would be better for everyone if they made native high frame rate content instead of pretending that people will see extra detail by switching to 4k or 8k.

Unfortunately, it seems most likely that TV broadcasts will remain at 60hz and the next console generation will be focused on delivering 4k 60hz instead of 4k (or even 1080p) 120hz.

It leaves the average user to wonder why that extra 4k detail disappears once they turn off the unsightly soap opera effect.
I'm very excited to use HDMI 2.1 to drive 120Hz PC games to a big 120Hz TV once AMD or Nvidia finally add a 2.1 output.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by vol.2 »

Fudoh wrote:
It's a cheap trick but frame interpolation, as horrible as it looks, is a good way of demonstrating the extra detail you can see by doubling the frame rate. It's approximately equivalent to doubling the resolution.
you're actually roughly tripling the motion resolution.
Once you get above a certain pixel density, increasing the resolution further stops having the same impact for me but going from 60hz to 120hz still makes all the difference in the world.
cool, but what do you do on your 60Hz consoles if you don't want to deal with 100ms of extra lag due to the TV's motion interpolation?
I thought that the black frame insertion could be done with negligible added lag and results in a significant reduction in motion blur. Those new OLEDs like the one the OP are supposed to have it. Would that work?
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Fudoh
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Fudoh »

yes, you can do that, but I don't know if that's what Classicgamer was refering to.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Hoagtech »

Classicgamer wrote:
Xyga wrote:I have a dedicated room for tech n' shit which is rather small and already packed with tons of gaming stuff and displays, no way a really large panel would fit now, plus I would be sitting too close.
43" would be the maximum, and cheaper than the bigger ones of course. :P
Maybe someday, or it'll be micro-led.

I suspect you'll be out of luck on smaller sizes with micro led too. The consumer trend on TV sizes is only going up. Samsung's first micro led set, "The Wall" is 140".

As far as TV tech goes, I think micro led is the least likely to appear in small sizes and the least likely to be suitable for users who sit close to the screen. There is a reason why they have only made a 140" one currently. I read that they were working on 98" and 75" models though.

Anyway, the difference in foot print of a 43" 16:9 set and a 55" is negligible. I don't know how small your game room is but I assume the sides of the 43" aren't pressing against the wall? If you sit any more than 4 or 5 ft from the screen, 55" is not too big for gaming. I only sit 7ft from my 77" and I had a 110" projector screen in that room before..,

That’s true but pc monitors are also getting bigger. 32” is the new 27”.

Granted viewing distance is an issue but brightness seems to be increasing. “Nits” seems to be the hot new industry bullshit term.

If he waits another couple years he may get his dream monitor for his game room.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Lawfer »

Hoagtech wrote:
Classicgamer wrote:
Xyga wrote:I have a dedicated room for tech n' shit which is rather small and already packed with tons of gaming stuff and displays, no way a really large panel would fit now, plus I would be sitting too close.
43" would be the maximum, and cheaper than the bigger ones of course. :P
Maybe someday, or it'll be micro-led.

I suspect you'll be out of luck on smaller sizes with micro led too. The consumer trend on TV sizes is only going up. Samsung's first micro led set, "The Wall" is 140".

As far as TV tech goes, I think micro led is the least likely to appear in small sizes and the least likely to be suitable for users who sit close to the screen. There is a reason why they have only made a 140" one currently. I read that they were working on 98" and 75" models though.

Anyway, the difference in foot print of a 43" 16:9 set and a 55" is negligible. I don't know how small your game room is but I assume the sides of the 43" aren't pressing against the wall? If you sit any more than 4 or 5 ft from the screen, 55" is not too big for gaming. I only sit 7ft from my 77" and I had a 110" projector screen in that room before..,

That’s true but pc monitors are also getting bigger. 32” is the new 27”.

Granted viewing distance is an issue but brightness seems to be increasing. “Nits” seems to be the hot new industry bullshit term.

If he waits another couple years he may get his dream monitor for his game room.
Funny you mention that, because Asus just released 2 Mini LED Monitors both in 27" and 32" and Asus really seem to want to underline their "Nits".

ASUS ProArt PA27UCX 1000 Nits

ASUS ProArt PA32UCX https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/ ... cx_4k.html 1200 Nits
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Guspaz »

120Hz support is critical even for 60Hz-and-below content when you start talking about variable refresh rate displays... and LG's 2019 OLED TVs support both 120Hz input and variable refresh rate (AKA "FreeSync").

The reason is for low-framerate compensation. In order to support refresh rates lower than the panel's minimum native refresh rate, you need the variable refresh range to have at least a 2:1 ratio so that you can do low-framerate compensation. Otherwise, you get motion judder.

Imagine that you say "I don't need higher than 60Hz" and you have a display with a 40-60Hz VRR range (which, alongside 48-75, is actually a common VRR range). If your framerate drops below 40FPS, your variable refresh rate implementation falls apart. If you are at 40FPS, each frame is 25ms. But at 39FPS, you either double every frame, reducing you to 30FPS, or you double some percentage of frames, randomly flipping between 25ms and 41.7ms per frame. Terrible motion judder!

However, imagine that your display supports a VRR range of 48-120Hz. If you drop below 48 FPS, you simply double every frame and draw at 96Hz. 47FPS becomes 94Hz. And so on. Until you hit 24FPS, now you quadruple each frame, so 23FPS becomes 92Hz.

This is transparent to the user, as far as they are concerned, their display now shows a variable refresh range of 1FPS to 120FPS with even frame pacing (well, as even as the render times allow).

All that said, I have no idea what the minimum refresh rate on LG's 2019 OLEDs is. I don't know if they have at least a 2:1 range.

None of this is relevant for retro gaming, but it's relevant for modern game consoles (both versions of the XB1 currently sold, the S and X, support FreeSync) and PC games, even if you can't get framerates much above 60FPS.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

.[/quote]

Funny you mention that, because Asus just released 2 Mini LED Monitors both in 27" and 32" and Asus really seem to want to underline their "Nits".

ASUS ProArt PA27UCX 1000 Nits

ASUS ProArt PA32UCX https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/ ... cx_4k.html 1200 Nits[/quote]


Micro led is a completely different tech to the led backlit displays sold now. The current "led" is just an LCD with led backlighting. Micro-led is a higher res version of the led digital signage used in outdoor advertising. I.e. Each pixel is independently lit and can be turned full on or full off like OLED pixels.

The challenge with this tech has been making the bulbs small enough to not be visible when viewed up close. It's going to be a long time until they'll be able to make a 4k panel in smaller sizes... Samsung 140" "the Wall" was made up of bunch of lower res 55" panels.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

Fudoh wrote:yes, you can do that, but I don't know if that's what Classicgamer was refering to.

I wasn't. I was talking about the benefits of increasing the native frame rate as a (superior) alternative to increasing the resolution. I.e. To produce a more detailed image. Ultimately, it's about how much info is displayed each second. Increasing the res, upping the bit rate or increasing the frame rate are all methods of increasing the amount of info we see on screen in that second.

Black frame insertion is done for other and somewhat unrelated reasons. It's mainly supposed to reduce the blur effect found on flat panels. Personally, I don't find it necessary for gaming on Oleds and Plasma tv's. Even with LCD displays, I usually only notice the problem in movies.

I'm sure some people might say different but BFI does nothing to increase the amount of detail I perceive and it sometimes makes the image look darker, which most people perceive as worse.

As a general point, I don't like adding unnatural (I.e. Not native) effects that alter the appearance of movies or games. The only time where fast paste action is improved with processing effects is sporting events imo. For everything else, I am already sufficiently amazed and delighted by how good everything looks naturally on my Oled displays.

I'll take advantage of it's 120hz capability only when native 120fps content is available.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by fernan1234 »

What BFI is meant to do is help clean up the retention of the previous frame from our dumb human eyes, effectively making us perceive as if motion is smoother. It takes advantage of the way our eyes work.

BFI is not meant to improve image quality, but only to improve motion resolution without introducing artifacts like other methods such as frame interpolation. It does effectively the same that the scan of a CRT does, except it does it worse. The scan on a CRT sweeps through the screen from top to bottom, and the electron guns are also very bright, so our eyes see beautiful smooth motion (better than on any other display tech) with adequate brightness. BFI is a primitive method of doing the same, with a full black frame every other frame, resulting in inferior results compared to CRT while also reducing the brightness that our eyes see (not of the content, which stays the same). It's a compromise.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

You can't separate image quality and motion resolution. They are all ultimately about making us perceive a better viewing experience. Nobody judges image quality on a TV with static imagery or says "the image is great.... as long as nothing moves".

The difference between a high end TV and cheap crappy one comes down to the differences in the amount of detail we can see with the same content. If the image loses detail while in motion, we perceive it as inferior to one that doesn't. It's one of the reasons why the image on LCD displays looks worse than Plasma, Oled and CRT. I.e. They lose more detail in fast moving scenes.

The other reason for lcds looking worse is contrast. It's a simple fact that TV's display imagery with light and that detail is achieved with contrast between dark and light. Superior contrast is the primary reason why Oled displays produce greater detail.

On BFI, I know what it's is meant to do, it just doesn't do it for me. It solves a problem I don't perceive and causes one that I do (I.e. a darker looking image).

If I can't have a native higher refresh rate, I'd rather have a quality natural 60hz. The image on an Oled display doesn't need any extra effects for me.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by fernan1234 »

If you don't notice "persistence blur" (and note that this is different from "motion blur", which affects LCD but not OLED), then you may just be too used to flat panels in general. Going from CRT to OLED (or any other flat panel), persistence blur is incredibly obvious. It's only noticeable in very fast moving objects in video games (most action retro games, camera panning in modern games, etc.) and sports, some action scenes in movies. In other content it may not be a problem at all.

BFI only partially compensates for persistence blur, and it has the brightness drawback. The rolling scan used in older pro BVMs and PVMs does a much better job on both counts, but it doesn't look like we'll see it on consumer sets. Even the newer pro monitors may not even have it anymore. Does anyone know if the BVM X300 and the current model have the rolling scan?
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

For anyone with issues with a new LG Oled, remember to update the firmware and run the pixel refresher as soon as it arrives. It changes everything. Mine looked noticeably better after.

I don't get why LG aren't doing this at the factory as it seems to be a huge source of issues for them. People are mistaking fixable uniformity issues with day one burn-in. It seems dump to spoil people's first impressions needlessly as the will clearly shout about issues on a $4000+ TV.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

fernan1234 wrote:If you don't notice "persistence blur" (and note that this is different from "motion blur", which affects LCD but not OLED), then you may just be too used to flat panels in general. Going from CRT to OLED (or any other flat panel), persistence blur is incredibly obvious. It's only noticeable in very fast moving objects in video games (most action retro games, camera panning in modern games, etc.) and sports, some action scenes in movies. In other content it may not be a problem at all.

BFI only partially compensates for persistence blur, and it has the brightness drawback. The rolling scan used in older pro BVMs and PVMs does a much better job on both counts, but it doesn't look like we'll see it on consumer sets. Even the newer pro monitors may not even have it anymore. Does anyone know if the BVM X300 and the current model have the rolling scan?
I do most of my gaming on my CRT monitors and my first flat panel was a Plasma before getting LCDs and now Oleds. I'm familiar with the strengths and weaknesses of each tech. Overall, I perceive the best results with OLED for HD content after taking everything into account.

The issues around loss of detail during motion on flat panels is just not noticeable to me in video games unless I specifically try to cause it. It's only ever bothered me on action movies played on LCD displays. Movies like the Matrix and Bourne movies have snappy left and right camera work which is most problematic. You rarely see that type of snappy movement in games though. They specifically have to add motion blur effects to 3d graphics to make them look realistic in motion.

If I was particularly sensitive to the issue, I'd go back to using a Plasma. They draw frames differently to lcd and Oled and are more like CRT in this respect. I would choose using a Plasma over BFI if this was my primary concern. Not just any plasma though.

The only plasma's that could compete with Oled are the Pioneer Elite Kuro line and one or two of the top Panasonic models. There are plenty of people who still rate them above all others (including Oled) but I'm not among them. To me, Oled produces the best image overall naturally (for HD content).

The most bothersome visual issue I have with modern games is trying to see what's going on during night missions. They make you play in the dark with smoke effects and whatnot. I often can't see anything and only know that baddies are attacking me when the joypad starts to vibrate. This issue is largely solved now thanks to Oled's incredible contrast.

Given that loss of detail during dark scenes is the issue I am most sensitive to, BFI is the last thing I'd want.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by vol.2 »

Do any of these monitors incorporate strobing alla ULMB type solution? If so, is it any good?
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Fudoh »

Do any of these monitors incorporate strobing alla ULMB type solution?
technically ON AN OLED panel, strobing is the same as BFI, since there's no additional backlight and switching an OLED pixel to black is essentially the same as turning it off.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by orange808 »

As long as we're on the subject, LED panels have multiple backlight zones and good ones try to emulate a rolling scan.

They don't simply insert ham-fisted clumsy complete black frames.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by fernan1234 »

orange808 wrote:As long as we're on the subject, LED panels have multiple backlight zones and good ones try to emulate a rolling scan.

They don't simply insert ham-fisted clumsy complete black frames.
Do you know of any specific models that actually have this and perform well?

None of the ones I know of seem to have adjustable flicker rates, or have a 60hz flicker which we would need for 60fps games, only a few now defunct monitors had it.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by orange808 »

fernan1234 wrote:
orange808 wrote:As long as we're on the subject, LED panels have multiple backlight zones and good ones try to emulate a rolling scan.

They don't simply insert ham-fisted clumsy complete black frames.
Do you know of any specific models that actually have this and perform well?

None of the ones I know of seem to have adjustable flicker rates, or have a 60hz flicker which we would need for 60fps games, only a few now defunct monitors had it.
The BenQ xl2720 is still for sale. It's adjustable, with inherent color and viewing angle caveats.

I liked Vizio's strobing/BFI when I had one, but I don't know what their current models are doing.

It's always a trade off. If there was a perfect display, lots of people on here would have it.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Fudoh »

LTT just posted a video with a new Asus monitor that offers strobing alongside variable refresh rate. Not the worst video although they don't differentiate between BFI and strobing. Definitely interesting monitor though for PC users.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by orange808 »

Fudoh wrote:LTT just posted a video with a new Asus monitor that offers strobing alongside variable refresh rate. Not the worst video although they don't differentiate between BFI and strobing. Definitely interesting monitor though for PC users.
Yes. That one has been highly anticipated over at blurbusters since spring.

Still waiting on reviews. That's my next potential purchase.

------;;

The Viewsonic LS700-4K is the other interesting one, but that one is a projector. It's been delayed multiple times; I assume the pixel shifting is creating issues. Could be a good inexpensive really big screen option.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Xyga »

Classicgamer wrote:I suspect you'll be out of luck on smaller sizes with micro led too. The consumer trend on TV sizes is only going up. Samsung's first micro led set, "The Wall" is 140".

As far as TV tech goes, I think micro led is the least likely to appear in small sizes and the least likely to be suitable for users who sit close to the screen. There is a reason why they have only made a 140" one currently. I read that they were working on 98" and 75" models though.
No, they present large screens because it's popular for the electronics shows, but MicroLED has been demonstrated in small modulable panels (to form custom-sized/shaped larger ones if desired)

MicroLED is precisely the tech that should make smaller sizes possible, while it's a huge hassle with OLED apparently b/c they need a costly dedicated production line for each size, and no way to make modulable designs of course.

Anyway MicroLED is nowhere near to become affordable mainstream tech, we'll see what happens in a decade or so.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Flashman »

Xyga wrote:
Classicgamer wrote:I suspect you'll be out of luck on smaller sizes with micro led too. The consumer trend on TV sizes is only going up. Samsung's first micro led set, "The Wall" is 140".

As far as TV tech goes, I think micro led is the least likely to appear in small sizes and the least likely to be suitable for users who sit close to the screen. There is a reason why they have only made a 140" one currently. I read that they were working on 98" and 75" models though.
No, they present large screens because it's popular for the electronics shows, but MicroLED has been demonstrated in small modulable panels (to form custom-sized/shaped larger ones if desired)

MicroLED is precisely the tech that should make smaller sizes possible, while it's a huge hassle with OLED apparently b/c they need a costly dedicated production line for each size, and no way to make modulable designs of course.

Anyway MicroLED is nowhere near to become affordable mainstream tech, we'll see what happens in a decade or so.
Yeah I must say I got a 55' LG for my gaming earlier this year, it's got a great game mode and I don't notice any lag at all, I would have preferred a smaller size though, and there didn't seem to be too much available with the specs I was looking for. Since getting it, I do notice I have sore / bloodshot eyes sometimes after a long session - there's a limit to how far away I can sit due to wired controllers and space in the room. I have a bottle of eye drops on standby which sorts my eyes out, but obviously its a little worrying what long term effects it could be having.
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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Freezerburn26 »

I am loving my 65" c9 it looks amazing and supports every input I throw at it so far.

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Re: Gaming on 77" Oled

Post by Classicgamer »

Xyga wrote:
Classicgamer wrote:I suspect you'll be out of luck on smaller sizes with micro led too. The consumer trend on TV sizes is only going up. Samsung's first micro led set, "The Wall" is 140".

As far as TV tech goes, I think micro led is the least likely to appear in small sizes and the least likely to be suitable for users who sit close to the screen. There is a reason why they have only made a 140" one currently. I read that they were working on 98" and 75" models though.
No, they present large screens because it's popular for the electronics shows, but MicroLED has been demonstrated in small modulable panels (to form custom-sized/shaped larger ones if desired)

MicroLED is precisely the tech that should make smaller sizes possible, while it's a huge hassle with OLED apparently b/c they need a costly dedicated production line for each size, and no way to make modulable designs of course.

Anyway MicroLED is nowhere near to become affordable mainstream tech, we'll see what happens in a decade or so.
The small modular panels are low res which is why it takes so many to make a single large 4k one.
You can't take one of those 42" modules and use it as a 4k TV.

As far as I know, nobody has made a small 4k micro led yet. The first time that tech has been seen was the Samsung wall. But, if you know of a smaller 4k micro-led panel, please post a link.
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