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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 1:02 pm 


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I heard back from the customer and he informs me that he doesn't get any noise with the Joyzz wireless controller, so we're thinking there's a fundamental design flaw in the 8bitdo dongle. I need to get a Joyzz and test this out myself. If it's a case where the Joyzz really is noise-free, it might be a no-brainer to go with that controller.
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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 1:40 pm 


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FBX wrote:
I heard back from the customer and he informs me that he doesn't get any noise with the Joyzz wireless controller, so we're thinking there's a fundamental design flaw in the 8bitdo dongle. I need to get a Joyzz and test this out myself. If it's a case where the Joyzz really is noise-free, it might be a no-brainer to go with that controller.

Is it known what technology Joyzz is based on, 2.4Gz RF or BT?


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 10:28 pm 


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Bit of a tangent, but i have a SFC30 8BitDo 2.4Ghz pad is there any easy way to connect this to PC wirelessly as it seems its intended for the SNES/NES Mini consoles or the Switch?


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:20 pm 



Joined: 08 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
Email 8bitdo and ask for the beta V2 firmware. There's two files, one for the controller and one for the receiver. You need to unscrew and decase the receiver to access the USB plug. Fixed all my issues.


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:32 pm 



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 731
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Okay, maybe we can make this a combined thread with the new Retro-Bit Sega pads. Anyone in on those yet? the USB Genesis ones have been available on eBay for about a week.

I'll be grabbing one of the Saturn Cool Pad versions - too tempting to wait, and not badly priced at all - but it's looking like another week to wait for those.


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:45 pm 


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I'll definitely give the retro bit pads a shot since they are officially licensed from SEGA.

I'm really torn between the Mega Drive and Saturn pads though.


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2019 4:33 am 



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
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they should be cheap enough relatively soon not to have to choose :D

Seriously, there's already an eBay seller with the Genesis pad at $18.25, free ship.

Dealbreaker for me, sadly, is that they added shoulder buttons to the USB version of the Genesis pad. I can see the rationale, but with the unique shape of that controller, the new buttons fall exactly where I wrap my fingers around the casing. I can see constant unintended button presses with that thing. Combine that with the cool factor of the transparent Saturn pad and it's an easy choice for me.

I'll report in when I get one. I've got the classic SLS USB pads as well, so I can definitely judge the quality.


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2019 5:45 am 



Joined: 04 May 2018
Posts: 14
Anyone have one of these that they can test with the new Saturn pad?

https://www.focusattack.com/brook-super ... 1-adapter/


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2019 8:25 pm 



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
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If you're talking about the USB pads, I don't think you're in luck. Those converters take PS3/4 wired controllers that happen to have USB plugs, not any generic USB controller.

If you're talking about the Bt m30 though, it does also mention Bluetooth support..


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 2:05 pm 



Joined: 25 Jul 2008
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Location: Leeds
Elixir wrote:
bigbadboaz wrote:
@ Elixir: are you hands-on familiar with the PS2 Sat pads or trying to choose between two options you haven't been able to try?

Very very familiar, I've been using PS2 Saturn pads since at least 2005. I was wondering how this stacks up against them.


Never had the ps2 variants... but, presuming the price is similar in your region, I really can't see you not picking these up for everyday/backup use. Buttons are better than saturn. Pad is excellent, although yet to really test this with fighters. It does feel cleaner/firmer than my saturn (old) pads, not sure how that might effect 'rolling' over the directions, rather than 'jabbing' at the directions, but would presume this would actually be a preferable difference for most shmup/platform players.

Breaks my shit the shoulder buttons are appear to be mapped to mouse 1 + 2, hence not (re)mappable in many emulators.

Last thing I tried: Didn't seem to work bt wise with a usb <-> megadrive adapter + md dongle. Not yet looked into why. Hoping might be the above interference issue that FBX found - was hoping this might maybe grant a route around the shoulder buttons not being mapp-able... but no idea if the adapter will even recognise the shoulders :)

Otherwise, considering the price, pretty much what you want as a saturn/megadrive person.


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:39 pm 



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gray117 wrote:
Breaks my shit the shoulder buttons are appear to be mapped to mouse 1 + 2, hence not (re)mappable in many emulators.


I don't know what these guys' problem is re: sensible mapping. There was already an uproar about the D-pad mapping as analog on the Switch, and now this?

They are very good about firmware updating so I'm not slagging too hard, but the complete lack of logical thought is at odds with how well they design the controllers themselves. even harder to understand is that they keep making the same mistake: this has to be the third controller getting an instant firmware fix for obvious, foreseeable issues.


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2019 11:54 am 


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https://www.retrorgb.com/krikzz-joyzz-vs-8bitdo-m30-2-4g-vs-8bitdo-m30-bluetooth-input-latency-lag-testing.html


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 5:18 am 



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
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Wow, that's a horrific result from the Bt m30. Would really like to see a corresponding test with it on a native Bluetooth device - it's impossible to know what role their proprietary receiver is playing here.

Guess I'm gonna have to wait for a head-to-head test with the Bluetooth Retro-Bit pads now - hard to feel like the m30 is a safe bet with that early result.


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:51 am 


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Quote:
Wow, that's a horrific result from the Bt m30.

didn't every RF vs. BT controller test over the past decade show that BT has about one additional frame of lag of compared to RF?


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:34 am 


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Fudoh wrote:
Quote:
Wow, that's a horrific result from the Bt m30.

didn't every RF vs. BT controller test over the past decade show that BT has about one additional frame of lag of compared to RF?

yes

@bigbadboaz if you care about lag, don't use bluetooth. simple as that, regardless of who makes the product


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 3:20 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
Quote:
Wow, that's a horrific result from the Bt m30.

didn't every RF vs. BT controller test over the past decade show that BT has about one additional frame of lag of compared to RF?


Regarding this is there a way to get 8BitDo's 2.4Ghz SNES pads to connect to a PC wirelessly??


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 5:04 pm 


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no, they only pair with their included receiver dongle (and wired via USB cable).


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 5:42 pm 


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A Sony DS4 can be connected to a PC using DS4Windows over bluetooth with a 1ms polling rate.

Use the touchpad as a mouse input and your favorite mouse polling test program. It works as advertised.

So, bluetooth isn't inherently bad. In fact, it works great. If bluetooth is slow, that's a developer problem and the manufacturer of your controller didn't try.

That's just the truth. Sorry if it sounds nasty. It's just the hard facts.

The "bluetooth is inherently too slow" thing is a flimsy cheap lie/excuse for poor engineering.
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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 6:03 pm 


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I picked up one of these (2.4G) as a second controller. I definitely prefer the Joyzz, which I have had for a few months. I am not sure why 8bitdo deviated so far from the shape of the original 6 button MD controller, obviously it's subjective but it feels a lot less ergonomic to me.

Still the d-pad and buttons feel great, it all feels very responsive and it connects immediately without any issues.


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:09 pm 



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 731
Location: Los Angeles, CA
maxtherabbit wrote:
@bigbadboaz if you care about lag, don't use bluetooth. simple as that, regardless of who makes the product


orange808 wrote:

The "bluetooth is inherently too slow" thing is a flimsy cheap lie/excuse for poor engineering.


Yeah, as I had mentioned back on the first page, 8bitdo made the claim back around the release of the SN30 that they had updated their Bt technology to be "lag-free". It's in light of this that the test report above is so disappointing.

Bad enough it still sucks, but egregious in the face of the claims they had made (unprompted, BTW.. why even do that!?).

So.. i'd love to see the upcoming Retro-Bit do better, but not optimistic. I'd guess there's a good chance they're sourcing their wireless chips from the same place. Can't be too many economical options off the shelf..


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 12:35 am 


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orange808 wrote:
A Sony DS4 can be connected to a PC using DS4Windows over bluetooth with a 1ms polling rate.

Use the touchpad as a mouse input and your favorite mouse polling test program. It works as advertised.

So, bluetooth isn't inherently bad. In fact, it works great. If bluetooth is slow, that's a developer problem and the manufacturer of your controller didn't try.

That's just the truth. Sorry if it sounds nasty. It's just the hard facts.

The "bluetooth is inherently too slow" thing is a flimsy cheap lie/excuse for poor engineering.

I'm willing to believe that - I personally have zero knowledge of the Bluetooth protocol or its intrinsic capabilities

that being said, when literally every single aftermarket device ALWAYS tests at a frame or more of lag, I'm going to stick with the practical answer of "Bluetooth sucks ass"


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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 4:36 am 


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maxtherabbit wrote:
orange808 wrote:
A Sony DS4 can be connected to a PC using DS4Windows over bluetooth with a 1ms polling rate.

Use the touchpad as a mouse input and your favorite mouse polling test program. It works as advertised.

So, bluetooth isn't inherently bad. In fact, it works great. If bluetooth is slow, that's a developer problem and the manufacturer of your controller didn't try.

That's just the truth. Sorry if it sounds nasty. It's just the hard facts.

The "bluetooth is inherently too slow" thing is a flimsy cheap lie/excuse for poor engineering.

I'm willing to believe that - I personally have zero knowledge of the Bluetooth protocol or its intrinsic capabilities

that being said, when literally every single aftermarket device ALWAYS tests at a frame or more of lag, I'm going to stick with the practical answer of "Bluetooth sucks ass"


That's a good point. :)

I've run into some people on Steam that report issues with BT and DS4, but it's awfully hard to pin down edge cases with PC's running Windows. There's so many possibilities; also, 2.4GHz wifi and bluetooth have infamous collision issues.

I have taken steps to make sure that's collision isn't a problem, but I have the luxury of a large game/bar room on the lower floor--and plenty of experience with networking. A person living in an attached house or dense building could easily be surrounded with noise from neighboring routers.

If you're doing it right, a gaming PC tower should be hard wired or on 5GHz band, anyway. So, the PC shouldn't interfering with the controller.

Works very well on my rig, but other people's milage may vary.
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 Post subject: Re: Has no one snagged the 8bitdo m30 yet??
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:05 am 



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 731
Location: Los Angeles, CA
So you all may be aware the Genesis Mini version of this controller was added to the family recently. It comes with a USB dongle rather than a Genesis one, much like the Retro-Bit 2.4 Sega controllers do. This dongle has firmware which is easily updated through direct connection to a PC.

With all the hacking going on lately - classic consoles and all - it occurred to me that this type of thing should be hackable too, right? All the great new 8bitdo and Retro-Bit controllers have been Switch compatible, but never PS or Xbox. With such easily-programmable dongles, couldn't someone just write in whichever drivers are necessary for these other consoles to recognize the pads as well?

Looking for input from anyone actually knowledgeable on how these things are done and what is required. It seems like an obvious hack people would want to do, but I have yet to see any news or discussion.


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