OG Xbox 1.4 vs 1.6 picture quality

[TrantaLocked_]

I've seen this and it doesn't go into detail on component differences, and why people say 1.6 component is bad.

Curious, where are you seeing this?

I don't think anyone is claiming component on 1.6 is bad, just that using RGB Scart on a 1.6 produces a much better image than RGB scart on a pre-1.6 Xbox.

Also, one thing I have noticed with 480p mode in Halo: CE (via component Monster cables, 1.3 softmodded) is that the image is considerably darker. I always figured this to be a case of me forcing 480p in a game that I always thought did not natively support it, but apparently Mark (Try) from MLiG is having the same issue, and I'm not sure what could be the cause.

For reference, this is on a 20L5, properly calibrated. 480i is just fine. You can reproduce the same results on an LCD.

I figure this either has to do with cable quality (though Monster cables are pretty solid) or the encoder, but I really can't say.

I've seen it said on multiple forums, usually people just passing on what they think is some kind of common knowledge when it really isn't. I think it's one or a combination of: 1) On 1.6 component, 480p colors look better than 480i, 2) People using bad component cables that may be more problematic on a 1.6, and 3) Power supply model. The most common is probably #1.

The Pound HD Link had an issue with the 1.4 and certain power supplies that caused noise. They said plugging in the USB power to the HD Link helped in most but not all cases.

For Halo I think it's the game not having a correct black level profile for progressive.

[Axelay]

Hey people some great information in this thread.
I have a soft modded xbox which I am using with an official xbox scart cable. Picture is pretty sharp on a crt .

Would I be able to get a better picture with a more expensive cable from retro gaming cables or a sync on composite or c sync cable or is there no point?


Is there anyone that uses a monster or ixos component cable and has the xbox connected to a 4k or newer led tv.

Are the results sharp?

Or are they best used on a older hd tv.

[RocketBelt]

I used my 1.6 with the official scart on a crt for years and would recommend sticking with it.
When the crt broke down i got some no-name component cables off amazon for £8 for use with my flat panel in progressive mode. The results were the worst i've ever seen, from any console, with any cable. Massive blurring and ghosting. I literally binned the cable.
I bought a quality used component cable off ebay and the results are very nice. No complaints in 480p or 720p. I think i have both a monster and an ixos cable now for some reason, both are thick green cables, both equally nice it would seem.
I did notice that 480i mode in component on the flat panel looks quite bad, worse than I'd expect, then again it only flashes up for a few seconds before booting into the dash so i haven't investigated it thoroughly. I have no way of telling what component interlaced on a 1.6 looks like on a crt.

[PixelPhoenix]

Hey people some great information in this thread.
I have a soft modded xbox which I am using with an official xbox scart cable. Picture is pretty sharp on a crt .

Would I be able to get a better picture with a more expensive cable from retro gaming cables or a sync on composite or c sync cable or is there no point?


Is there anyone that uses a monster or ixos component cable and has the xbox connected to a 4k or newer led tv.

Are the results sharp?

Or are they best used on a older hd tv.

I don't think Scart would be wise in general unless you never plan to play above 480i. Just make sure what you've got is properly shielded, and for the most part you'll be fine.

The consensus seems to be:

-Use component if you're on a 1.0-1.5 Xbox
-Use scart if you're on a 1.6 Xbox (no evidence to support component failing to produce identical or similar image quality compared to scart).

Though admittedly, there seems to be a distinctive lack of knowledge for cable quality when comparing component and scart. I see a lot of claims without proof to support these claims - just people echoing what someone else said or saw somewhere.

Component makes sense as the console is capable of resolutions higher than 480i, but on a 1.6 picture quality isn't as clean, based on what OP claims.

Maybe it's time I pick up a 1.6 and start compiling this information into a video with comparisons. My other Xbox has a Focus encoder, and my sealed one is a 1.6, but I'm not opening that.

MLiG would do a much, much better job of that than I would, though.

I've seen it said on multiple forums

Any sources for those? That's what I was getting at. If your end goal is 480p (possibly line doubled to 960p) on an HDTV, then you need component. If color for you isn't as sharp, then I suppose you could create a game mode profile for the Xbox and calibrate it.

[strygo]

In a related vein, I began looking into getting VGA out of the original Xbox and the information is scattered across forum posts and broken links on the Wayback Machine. It seems promising, but it's hard to determine what the optimal solution is in 2020. I can share the links I've dug up in case anyone might benefit from this.

[Axelay]

Appreciate all the information. Thank you

[strygo]

If you HV sync mod the xbox, run some custom VGA firmware to remove sync from green you get a crispy RGB picture.

Which firmware do you recommend to remove sync on green? What cable do you end up using in this configuration?

[Syntax]

The VGA no Sync on Green bios is a bit of a pain to get running.

It only works on the Conexant encoders, although when you search you'll find an attempt at the Focus encoder. Dont bother with Focus, ive tried it wont work.

To make a No SOG bios you must first patch the bios with frostys VGA patch, then you have to Hex edit the bios. Each time the bios is edited via EVtools you must repatch it with a separate patcher also ( not frostys just a fix)

I have made a pack, feel free to use/share do whatever with it. I have included some pictures to show where H and V sync are grabbed from, and how to buffer them correctly.
There should be a readme in there that ive added some info to which makes things a bit easier to understand I hope.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1J3GRF- ... sp=sharing

I am also making an AV plug with VGA out, buffered H V sync, and both combined into correct csync.

[strygo]

The VGA no Sync on Green bios is a bit of a pain to get running.

It only works on the Conexant encoders, although when you search you'll find an attempt at the Focus encoder. Dont bother with Focus, ive tried it wont work.

To make a No SOG bios you must first patch the bios with frostys VGA patch, then you have to Hex edit the bios. Each time the bios is edited via EVtools you must repatch it with a separate patcher also ( not frostys just a fix)

I have made a pack, feel free to use/share do whatever with it. I have included some pictures to show where H and V sync are grabbed from, and how to buffer them correctly.
There should be a readme in there that ive added some info to which makes things a bit easier to understand I hope.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1J3GRF- ... sp=sharing

I am also making an AV plug with VGA out, buffered H V sync, and both combined into correct csync.

Thanks for sharing. I will definitely give this a try. Are the pics you reference in the pack or somewhere else? (I can't find them.)

That AV plug is very nice - if you're making them for others, I'm interested in one.

[tongshadow]

My 1.6 Xbox has noticeable ringing in 480p, but it looks great in 480i on component. I can attest the ringing is the Xbox's fault because I dont see it at all playing on my 360@480p.

[PixelPhoenix]

For Halo I think it's the game not having a correct black level profile for progressive.

Seems this is the case for Mechassault as well. Maybe it's time I look at a few other games. I do have a 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, and 1.6b. I could do testing with those using YPbPr/RGB and verify results.

I've since moved away from Monster cables and now use the HDAV Pack paired with HDRetrovision male-to-male cables.

[djc5166]

...
I am also making an AV plug with VGA out, buffered H V sync, and both combined into correct csync.
...

Holy crap, did you ever make this?

I found all the bits and pieces of info out there, but I kind of gave up making this HV sync buffer myself, this would be amazing if it was just plug and play (with the right bios), although I think you would still have to route the HV sync to the connector?

[Syntax]

I made a plug and play version but it was not safe without installing another board internally.
The GPU H V lines can spike on hot plugging and I killed an Xbox in the process.

The better route is the QSB under the AV port, or a combo of both.

I might get back to it one day but for now while there are HDMI mods floating around I dont see the point or much interest.

[jiml]

The VGA no Sync on Green bios is a bit of a pain to get running.
...

About the SoG. The xbox outputs the sync signal not only on Green, but on Red and Blue line too.At least mine does(conexant).
It's also mentioned here , but i just realized it, while trying to find why the picture from my xbox is compressed horizontally at 480p.
If you connect the red or blue signal of the xbox to the green input of your (SoG)monitor, the monitor will sync and display the picture.
Also this: channel 1 is green and channel 2 is red. Sync signal is present on both channels.


Also what mode are you using with the modded no-SOG bios? 1+3 or 2+3?

[Syntax]

Did you hex edit correctly?
Sync on all channels was one of the earlier hex edits.

Should have 0 sync on all 3 lines with a conexant.
The mode I use is the component mode. (Xbox thinks its outputting component but its hacked RGB instead)
The rgb one isn't correct for this hacked bios. (Will lose video on certain screens)

Try using the bios I made as a test.