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 Post subject: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:06 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
This is the last chance (probably) to pick up a new CRT arcade monitor. Happ has just two left so anyone that was planning to wait should probably rethink... unless they want to pay crazy $1,000+ eBay prices.

https://na.suzohapp.com/products/accessories/49-2715-00

These are the 29" (27" visible) flat CRT tri-sync (CGA, EGA and VGA) and as far as I know, Happ has the last new ones in America (ever).


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:14 pm 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
Nice. I considered doing that years ago but instead I ended up buying brand new in box consumer crt's for around or under 100 usd a piece so I find the price on these monitors to be pretty steep, but nice for folks building cabinets or restoring existing ones.

Do you still use yours on the loose or did you build a case for it finally?


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:09 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
Taiyaki wrote:
Nice. I considered doing that years ago but instead I ended up buying brand new in box consumer crt's for around or under 100 usd a piece so I find the price on these monitors to be pretty steep, but nice for folks building cabinets or restoring existing ones.

Do you still use yours on the loose or did you build a case for it finally?


I still use my Billabs 25" loose on my desk. My 29" Makvision is mid project. There is a walk-in store room in my basement. I'm trying to build the monitor into the wall so the back can still be accessed from the walk in store room but it will just look like a large 4:3 flatscreen on (or in) the wall from the front.

There was a point where CRT monitors were plentiful and could be bought for low prices but these days, I'm not sure there are any cheaper new monitors than these. The only others I have seen are eBay sellers offering the same Makvision for $1000.

The freight costs from Happ are very reasonable vs eBay too.

If you know if somewhere that is still offering brand new 29" arcade monitors for $100, spill the beans. I'm sure a few people here would be interested....


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:29 pm 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
Classicgamer wrote:
If you know if somewhere that is still offering brand new 29" arcade monitors for $100, spill the beans. I'm sure a few people here would be interested....

I've never bought an arcade monitor, but even about three years ago or so it was still possible to find new in box consumer crt's from unsold stock if you were willing to drive out or your way to find them. Now a days though I agree it's probably near impossible with the tremendous increase in gamers going after these.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:00 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
Yup, I miss the days before gamers caught on. I snagged some awesome bargains by current standards.

I got a free Ikegami Tm20-90rh because the plastic power-on button got cracked in shipping. I picked up an NEC XM2950 off Craigslist a few years ago for $30 with less than 10 hours on it.

I gave myself a pat on the back for selling my $30 XM29 for $600 until I saw people selling them for $2000. Now I feel dirty and ashamed when I think about it.

I like these Makvisions for a mame project because they work easily with pc vga cards and allow you to play every arcade game ever made for a CRT at native res. You can play SF2 at 15khz, play Daytona at 24khz and then play Time Crisis at 31khz.

You can also use regular cga Jamma PCBs without needing a resistor array. And...more importantly, they have remote boards for image size and position pots. You can adjust every game to fit the screen in seconds without service menus or compromise.

The image quality is not as good as my Ikegami or my Billabs but it is still a very nice arcade-like image. Games look how I remember them from when I was a kid. Time Crisis 3 on the PS2 looks espiecially good on it.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:29 am 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
Yeah the NEC's sell for crazy amounts now a days. So do the BVM's. Don't worry I made the same error. I sold my better BVM for around 50 dollars some years ago, and it had something like 20k hours, which by BVM standards is really low too.

That being said I'm still not a huge fan of pro monitors, or any monitor that doesn't look like crt's as I remember them, which is basically to say traditional shadow mask and aperture grille tubes with standard tvl.

That's really neat to be able to run all arcade games in native resolution. I just can't do that on any consumer tv, they never seem to have enough picture to reach anything over 240p, and even 240p just barely gets in, most often with a few lines being cut off by the cutoff intervals. As you point out though different tv's/monitors have different strengths, in my experience none of them can be perfect for every single task really.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2019 4:23 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
All screens, even CRT's that switch res, have a sweet spot where they look best. The XM29 looks like a great all-rounder on paper as it can display 240p and (720p) hd sources but that HD pitch has a cost. I never liked it as a 240p monitor.

These tri-sync arcade monitors don't have a fine pitch. They are optimized for 480 line images. That includes 240p as 240 lines active with 240 lines blank are required. So, everything from the dawn of gaming up to the PS2 looks optimal.

The first thing I do with a new CRT is check how my test games look. Certain games like Double Dragon, SF2 CE and Turtles in Time only look right to me on a monitor with a suitably corse pitch.

I start to get unhappy when I see jagged edges that don't belong there. Mame makes the issue worse because the image from a PC is dull compared to the original PCBs. So there is less bloom.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:18 am 



Joined: 17 Mar 2018
Posts: 46
Classicgamer wrote:
allow you to play every arcade game ever made for a CRT at native res. You can play SF2 at 15khz, play Daytona at 24khz and then play Time Crisis at 31khz.



Just watched a video of it in action and I'm confused. Why doesn't it show any scanlines in LowRes mode? Is the signal being processed in any way?


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 9:49 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
SuperSpongo wrote:
Classicgamer wrote:
allow you to play every arcade game ever made for a CRT at native res. You can play SF2 at 15khz, play Daytona at 24khz and then play Time Crisis at 31khz.



Just watched a video of it in action and I'm confused. Why doesn't it show any scanlines in LowRes mode? Is the signal being processed in any way?


No, they have no processing capability of any sort. That is what arcade monitors look like. Always did.

You should not be able to see visible gaps between scanlines unless you look very close.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:22 pm 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
In my recollection in arcades you can see scanlines in games, but it might depend on the resolution used as well. Something like Neo Geo and CPS games I definitely recall them being visible up close, but with something that had higher resolutions like Mortal Kombat maybe they were not as visible. At any rate arcade monitors (and consumer tv's too) definitely never had those thicker scanlines found on pro monitors. Maybe SuperSpongo is used to the look on those.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 11:00 pm 


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Posts: 688
What's the quality of these crt's compared to the stock Blast City CRT's?


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 12:10 am 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
Pasky wrote:
What's the quality of these crt's compared to the stock Blast City CRT's?


They are ok. Not the best by any means but you can definitely get a nice image out of them. It's on par which most other 29" CRTs I have seen. The word I would use for the image is "authentic". If you want something to make mame look like the arcades you remember, they are worth a look.

If you are looking for technical excellence, a smaller pro monitor might be a better fit. My Ikegami is in a different league but I think many would prefer the arcade monitor.

My Billabs 25" tri-sync has a noticeably sharper and brighter image but it's smaller and not quite as flat. Larger screens have more geometry issues and these bother some more than others.

It's all academic as it's not like people have a choice anymore. These are among the last of the new CRT arcade monitors ever and therefore worth buying.

They also have the advantage of being tri-sync which is massively useful for emulators. Aside from being able to play all games at native res, you can run vertical games at native res without turning the screen (in 24khz).


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 12:21 am 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
This is a close-up of the "scanlines":

Image

Image

As you can see, they are there when you look close.

But when you move 2 or 3 feet back, as you naturally would with a 29" CRT, you get a more natural arcade-like image:

Image

Classics look authentic.... which makes me happy:

Image

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 12:42 am 


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Joined: 21 Oct 2013
Posts: 688
Do they fit rigth in a blast city? I think I remember reading about these, something about the blast city bezel has to be modified? I'm pretty interested in having a new crt to last me, the convergence on my current blast's crt has me worried.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 6:21 am 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
That's a good looking crt there. The overall image is very impressive. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 5:23 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
Pasky wrote:
Do they fit rigth in a blast city? I think I remember reading about these, something about the blast city bezel has to be modified? I'm pretty interested in having a new crt to last me, the convergence on my current blast's crt has me worried.


If the monitor in the cab is 29" then there is no reason why this 29" would not fit. Happ sells bezels for them seperately so you would probably have to use the Makvision bezel unless the existing monitor is a 29" flat crt. Note, when I say 29", the visible screen size is 27".

Compared to my other CRT monitors, these are fairly shallow. They extend back around half the distance of my 20" Ikegami or my 27" Sony Trinitron. They certainly don't weigh any less though. I struggle to lift it from the floor to my desk without help.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 5:46 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
Taiyaki wrote:
That's a good looking crt there. The overall image is very impressive. :)


It's nice enough. You get a nice image through RGB on most CRT monitors as long as the pitch is right for the source. Typically the later (or higher end) CRTs had a finer pitch and low bloom which is what causes those jagged edges and overly prominent gaps between scanlines that some find upsetting. These have a pitch that is closer to a typical mid 90's consumer crt tv which gives it a nice image on all 3 modes.

I love that you can play all your old Namco games in the correct 480p and all the classic Sega model 2 and 3 in the correct 384p.

Image

There aren't many EGA games but there are enough classics to make it worth considering:

Image

Image

And.... being able to actually read text in Windows in 480p is very helpful...

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:10 am 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
Yeah those look fantastic. I wasn't a big fan of the FV310 specifically because of the lack of blooming. It might also be because I was going away from pro monitors and at that point I just wanted something fully authentic to how I remembered crt's. Blooming is definitely an essential part of that.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:23 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
Taiyaki wrote:
Yeah those look fantastic. I wasn't a big fan of the FV310 specifically because of the lack of blooming. It might also be because I was going away from pro monitors and at that point I just wanted something fully authentic to how I remembered crt's. Blooming is definitely an essential part of that.


I like to use both, depending on my mood. I really like my Ikegami for use with my Supergun. Arcade boards are considerably brighter than playing the same game in mame and that can make the image look quite different.

That extra brightness causes a good deal more bloom. The Ikegami allows you to display that super bright image without any sacrifice in detail. You can see facial expressions and other effects that are lost on some lesser displays.

Still, nothing like playing Time Crisis 3 or Ridge Racer on a nice big 29" screen. Sometimes size adds more to the experience than good geometry. And.... it's always good to keep a few spare CRTs given what's happening to the supply.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:15 pm 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
I tend to stick to mid size (21 is my preference but 24/25 still works), 27 inch and up is just too heavy for my back and geometry/ convergence and even focus always seem to be so much worse on those larger sets in my experience (disposing of problem sets is also so much trouble), but that might just be cause they get more wear being used in larger households with more people. I can imagine for Time Crisis that 29 inch must be really amazing though.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 11:20 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
Taiyaki wrote:
I tend to stick to mid size (21 is my preference but 24/25 still works), 27 inch and up is just too heavy for my back and geometry/ convergence and even focus always seem to be so much worse on those larger sets in my experience (disposing of problem sets is also so much trouble), but that might just be cause they get more wear being used in larger households with more people. I can imagine for Time Crisis that 29 inch must be really amazing though.


My main every day monitor is the 25" arcade monitor (24.8"). It's a good all round size but I would certainly have no problem using my 29" when / if the 25" breaks. I am not someone who is particularly bothered by minor geometry issues that can only be seen with a test pattern.

As long as ny issues are not noticeable in-game, I am happy. You are right though. The larger you go, the more issues you have to live with.

I am just happy I have a selection. Where possible, I like to play on the same size monitor as the original cab. Time Crisis does not look right on my 20" and Pac Man looks wrong on the 29".


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:17 am 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1291
What, exactly, is required to get video and power into these? I assume they have screw terminals for RGBS/HV input, but do they have something like IEC 320 sockets for standard PC power cables, or do they need power via screw terminal as well?

Do they need 5V TTL sync, or would they be fine with the 75Ohm stuff that comes out of, say, SCART? And only clean sync, not any composite or luma, correct?


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:53 am 



Joined: 17 Mar 2018
Posts: 46
Thanks for the Close-Up Shots, they were really helpful. Interesting monitors indeed!


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:07 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
nmalinoski wrote:
What, exactly, is required to get video and power into these? I assume they have screw terminals for RGBS/HV input, but do they have something like IEC 320 sockets for standard PC power cables, or do they need power via screw terminal as well?

Do they need 5V TTL sync, or would they be fine with the 75Ohm stuff that comes out of, say, SCART? And only clean sync, not any composite or luma, correct?


They use a standard db15 (vga) male connector for rgb. They come with an adapter to connect cga arcade rgb molex connectors to the db15 port.

As these are tri-sync, they have a switch on the remote board to go between 75ohm and 1kohm to stop the image being too bright with Jamma PCBs or too dim with mame output. CGA and EGA PCBs use 1kohm and every other source uses 75ohm.

You can make your own power cable fairly easily. It's just your standard live, neutral, ground wires or, Happ sells ready made power cables. They use a (fairly) standard Wells Gardner molex.

Nothing else is needed to start using them. They don't need isolation transformers or signal boosters like older cga only arcade monitors.

You just connect a PC with Groovy mame and CRT EMU installed and off you go. Ultimarc sells vga cables for tri-sync monitors for the PS2 (and PS1). A Dreamcast can connect directly with a vga box. For older rgb consoles, you'd want a scart to BNC or scart to vga cable with a built in sync-strike. The monitors work with rgbhv and RGBS only.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:48 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1291
Classicgamer wrote:
They use a standard db15 (vga) male connector for rgb. They come with an adapter to connect cga arcade rgb molex connectors to the db15 port.

As these are tri-sync, they have a switch on the remote board to go between 75ohm and 1kohm to stop the image being too bright with Jamma PCBs or too dim with mame output. CGA and EGA PCBs use 1kohm and every other source uses 75ohm.

You can make your own power cable fairly easily. It's just your standard live, neutral, ground wires or, Happ sells ready made power cables. They use a (fairly) standard Wells Gardner molex.

Nothing else is needed to start using them. They don't need isolation transformers or signal boosters like older cga only arcade monitors.

You just connect a PC with Groovy mame and CRT EMU installed and off you go. Ultimarc sells vga cables for tri-sync monitors for the PS2 (and PS1). A Dreamcast can connect directly with a vga box. For older rgb consoles, you'd want a scart to BNC or scart to vga cable with a built in sync-strike. The monitors work with rgbhv and RGBS only.

Thank you; very useful info.

Is there any benefit to buying one of these CRTs from SuzoHapp over, say, Betson, which has them listed for about $140 cheaper?


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:19 am 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
nmalinoski wrote:
Is there any benefit to buying one of these CRTs from SuzoHapp over, say, Betson, which has them listed for about $140 cheaper?

Good find. I guess there's some a bit more stock than just two left then.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:48 am 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1291
Taiyaki wrote:
nmalinoski wrote:
Is there any benefit to buying one of these CRTs from SuzoHapp over, say, Betson, which has them listed for about $140 cheaper?

Good find. I guess there's some a bit more stock than just two left then.

Seems that way. A CSR from Suzo Happ told me today that they're currently out of stock, and that there's a 6-week lead time.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:29 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
nmalinoski wrote:
Classicgamer wrote:
They use a standard db15 (vga) male connector for rgb. They come with an adapter to connect cga arcade rgb molex connectors to the db15 port.

As these are tri-sync, they have a switch on the remote board to go between 75ohm and 1kohm to stop the image being too bright with Jamma PCBs or too dim with mame output. CGA and EGA PCBs use 1kohm and every other source uses 75ohm.

You can make your own power cable fairly easily. It's just your standard live, neutral, ground wires or, Happ sells ready made power cables. They use a (fairly) standard Wells Gardner molex.

Nothing else is needed to start using them. They don't need isolation transformers or signal boosters like older cga only arcade monitors.

You just connect a PC with Groovy mame and CRT EMU installed and off you go. Ultimarc sells vga cables for tri-sync monitors for the PS2 (and PS1). A Dreamcast can connect directly with a vga box. For older rgb consoles, you'd want a scart to BNC or scart to vga cable with a built in sync-strike. The monitors work with rgbhv and RGBS only.

Thank you; very useful info.

Is there any benefit to buying one of these CRTs from SuzoHapp over, say, Betson, which has them listed for about $140 cheaper?


I'm not sure. They were on sale at Happ when I bought mine. Check if they actually have stock and how much shipping would be. Happ were very reasonable on shipping for such a large heavy item. Some eBay sellers charge over $300 to freight these things. I got it for around $80.

But, if Betson has stock for a lower price shipped, I don't know of any reason why you shouldn't buy from them instead. Happ and Betson are the two largest and most reputable arcade suppliers in America.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 6:32 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
nmalinoski wrote:
Taiyaki wrote:
nmalinoski wrote:
Is there any benefit to buying one of these CRTs from SuzoHapp over, say, Betson, which has them listed for about $140 cheaper?

Good find. I guess there's some a bit more stock than just two left then.

Seems that way. A CSR from Suzo Happ told me today that they're currently out of stock, and that there's a 6-week lead time.


That's interesting. Maybe there is more stock in China coming over (which would explain the 6 weeks).

Obviously the supply will run out soon as they aren't being made anymore but hopefully we will have a while longer.

It is worth telling as many people as possible. Prices have sky-rocketed on eBay for larger CRTs because too many people seem to be under the impression that they are hard to find. I seen people pay over $2000 for 20 year-old XM29's..

Spreading the word on these new ones can only have a positive effect for buyers of crt monitors generally.


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 Post subject: Re: Happ down to last two new CRT monitors (maybe ever)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:18 pm 



Joined: 04 Apr 2014
Posts: 626
The XM29 is really hard to find, but in general large consumer crt's are so easy to find on craigslist, even now. I think most owners can't get rid of them in fact. In my area you can always find an abundance of 32 inch tv's (and even still lots of 27). It's the mid size tv's (20~24) that are harder to come by now. Whenever a 20/21 inch Sony pops up it sells in hours not days. Even on ebay some people have paid a couple hundred dollars for 20 inch Sony tv's sight unseen that looked pretty used which seems a bit unreasonable.


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