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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:34 am 


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Joined: 25 May 2014
Posts: 463
strygo wrote:
If anyone has the latest firmware (1.25), I would very much appreciate it!

I think the release notes would also be interesting, since I don't like blindly installing updates without knowing what they are supposed to change.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:17 pm 



Joined: 05 Mar 2017
Posts: 337
Location: Woodinville, WA
Unseen: Yes, definitely. It may also be the case that an older firmware could be better for our needs, so I'd love any details folks might have about the different versions. I experienced some compatibility issues, so if a newer (or older) firmware helped, it would be great to know this.

I received a 301 HD as well as an HD HD and I've had a chance to test both of them a bit. The 301 HD is running firmware 1.17 and the HD HD is running 1.00. Like others in this thread, my Vizio 4K LCD isn't particularly compatible with the OSSC, so my primary motivation has been to improve that compatibility. My secondary motivation was to see if it would help with 480p scaling outside the OSSC (because the Vizio isn't particularly great at it). Overall, the units are a positive addition, but they are not without some caveats. I'm hoping some of the problems I've experienced are things I can address.

On the whole, I've actually had a better experience with the HD HD than the 301 HD, but the HD HD is lacking a few important features and isn't without its own compatibility issues. Starting with the strengths of the HD HD:

- Better handling of 4x and 5x OSSC signals. I see consistent sync drops on the 301 HD for a number of systems, including the Genesis (Sonic 2), Jaguar (Tempest 2K intro), and PlayStation 1 (Street Fighter Alpha intro). The same configuration works fine on the HD HD. If there is anything I can do to rectify this, I'd love to know.
- Smoother transitions. I frequently would see scrambled screen content when the 301 HD transitions and tries to sync. It's minor, but the HD HD doesn't do this.
- Controls: I happen to prefer the buttons over the knobs, but that's a personal preference.

Some of the strengths of the 301 HD (which others have mentioned in this thread):

- Size / position controls. It's unfortunate that these controls are lacking in the HD HD. Being able to scale the 960p signal inside the 1080p frame is a great feature.
- Frame lock (AFL). This feature was removed from the HD HD, although in my testing, I couldn't notice a difference. Enabling or disabling it didn't help with my aforementioned sync issues.

Both units excel in a number of ways. I'm most impressed by the following:

- 480p->OSSC 2x->960p scaling. My Vizio hasn't supported this mode, so experiencing this has been a real treat. F-Zero GX scaled to 960p with thin scan lines looks stunning and very similar to what I observe on a 20L5. Without scanlines looks quite similar to an HS420. This is now my preferred way to display 480p analog content on this display.
- 240p->OSSC 4x->960p scaling. I've lived with 3x until now and this is a nice upgrade. Especially with the size controls of the 301 HD.
- 720p->1080p scaling. In conjunction with my display's 1080p->4K scaling, I've found both devices improve the picture for me by scaling 720p to 1080p. The SNES Classic, AVS and PlayStation 3 (for example) are a bit crisper going this route than leaving the scaling entirely to the display. More testing is needed on other systems, but so far, I'm happy with what I see.

The negatives I've found of both include:

- 480p digital scaling. I have an original GCHD and I've been dissatisfied with my display's 480p scaling. I was hoping that these devices would help, but I'm seeing a softness in scaling the 480p to 1080p that I don't like. In the case of the GC, going the analog route through the OSSC produces better results for me.
- Xbox compatibility. I see sync drops when running in 480p passthrough or 480p->OSSC 2x. Anyone have ideas on what might be the cause?
- NES/SNES compatibility: As others have stated, the jitter issues are real. It's nice that you have some options (dejitter mods or SuperNt/Nt Mini/AVS), but this is annoying if you don't immediately have a workaround.

That's it for now. It would be great if I can rectify some of the issues, either via firmware changes or adjusting settings somewhere. Any pointers would be greatly appreciated.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:47 pm 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
Posts: 846
strygo wrote:
- Xbox compatibility. I see sync drops when running in 480p passthrough or 480p->OSSC 2x. Anyone have ideas on what might be the cause?


Same for me - doesn't happen too often but my OG Xbox hooked up via RGBS or YPbPr cable drops out for me with this combo as well. Haven't dug into it to see if there's a fix quite yet.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:43 am 



Joined: 05 Mar 2017
Posts: 337
Location: Woodinville, WA
Unseen passed along a link to the 1.25 firmware. It's been a big improvement. It completely eliminated the problems I was seeing with the OSSC 4x/5x modes and also improved the behavior I am seeing with Xbox. If you're running a firmware lower than that and experiencing issues, I recommend giving it a try. Message me if you need a link to it.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:40 am 



Joined: 30 Mar 2019
Posts: 5
strygo wrote:
Unseen passed along a link to the 1.25 firmware. It's been a big improvement. It completely eliminated the problems I was seeing with the OSSC 4x/5x modes and also improved the behavior I am seeing with Xbox. If you're running a firmware lower than that and experiencing issues, I recommend giving it a try. Message me if you need a link to it.


Hi Strygo, do you still have that 1.25 firmware? I recently got my hands on one of these Extron 301s, and it has version 1.17. I registered just for this, but can't send private messages as a new forum member


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 10:31 pm 



Joined: 08 Apr 2019
Posts: 1
strygo wrote:
Unseen passed along a link to the 1.25 firmware. It's been a big improvement. It completely eliminated the problems I was seeing with the OSSC 4x/5x modes and also improved the behavior I am seeing with Xbox. If you're running a firmware lower than that and experiencing issues, I recommend giving it a try. Message me if you need a link to it.



Long time lurker, finally got around to registering for this. Recently got a hold of an Extron HD 301 running 1.14 firmware. I would like to upgrade to the 1.25 firmware if somebody has it available, please.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 3:37 pm 



Joined: 05 Mar 2017
Posts: 337
Location: Woodinville, WA
Sent. Sorry for the delay. Anyone else, please feel free to message me.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 3:16 am 


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Joined: 15 Jul 2009
Posts: 192
Location: Canada
Fudoh wrote:
Deinterlacing is better on the HD3000, scaling is close (with a slight advantage for the Extron), but the Extron is way easier to use and cheaper to buy.


Fudoh, I know from prior conversations you prefer a softer look than I do. When you say Extron has the advantage scaling, are you referring to it being sharper? I really enjoyed the HD3000 sharp look when I had it...think of picking one of these up.

I can get one cheaper on eBay if it doesn't include the power supply. I have an old 12V 2A extron power supply with what appears to be the same connector, except mine is orange whereas I think the 301 is green? They wouldn't swap the position of positive and negative between products that use the same connector, would they?


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 4:23 am 



Joined: 19 Mar 2017
Posts: 80
strygo wrote:
Some of the strengths of the 301 HD (which others have mentioned in this thread):

- Size / position controls. It's unfortunate that these controls are lacking in the HD HD. Being able to scale the 960p signal inside the 1080p frame is a great feature.


I wish knew this before I bought my HD HD. So just to be clear you get a perfect 1:1 scale in a 1080p frame with the 301 HD with overscan underscan adjustments? I’m going to grab either this or the Crestron (according to the manual he Crestron has a 1:1 mode as well). Anyone know of any other solutions with a 1:1 mode and image size settings?


Last edited by strayan on Thu May 02, 2019 4:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 3:18 pm 


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Joined: 06 Feb 2005
Posts: 780
Location: Italy
strayan wrote:
Anyone know of any other solutions with a 1:1 mode?

TvONE Corio2 scalers such as the 1T-C2-750. In comparison to the Extron DSC, they have:
+ a smoothing option
+ 240p output
- a bit more lag
- no frame lock
- a cryptic user interface


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 3:42 pm 


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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 11634
Location: Germany
Quote:
Can you get a perfect 1:1 scale in a 1080p frame with the 301 HD?

yes, by simply setting the active image size to what's listed under the input specs.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 5:13 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2017
Posts: 80
Fudoh wrote:
Quote:
Can you get a perfect 1:1 scale in a 1080p frame with the 301 HD?

yes, by simply setting the active image size to what's listed under the input specs.


Cool, I’m just reading through/comparing the manuals again. So it appears the HD HD just lacks the Advanced > Overscan menu setting and a few other options in this sub menu.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 5:20 pm 


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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 11634
Location: Germany
No, the HD-HD is actually lacking the complete "Picture Controls" submenu and that's where you set image size within a fixed output size.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2019 7:15 pm 


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Joined: 01 Dec 2006
Posts: 1869
Unseen wrote:
strygo wrote:
If anyone has the latest firmware (1.25), I would very much appreciate it!

I think the release notes would also be interesting, since I don't like blindly installing updates without knowing what they are supposed to change.


I only ever used my unit with 1.25 and never had any issues whatsoever, for WiiDual have been getting great results with OSSC + DSC 301 HD in most games, especially widescreen games like Metroid Other M and Trauma Center: New Blood, Captain Rainbow looks great too with it (not sure if this one is a widescreen game or not).

I also used it with PS3 and PS TV to upscale 720p to 1080p, works wonderful.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2019 1:11 pm 



Joined: 19 May 2019
Posts: 1
Lawfer wrote:
PS2 480p with component cables 480p->960p->1080p looks a TON better though:

Image


Which PS2 game is this?


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2019 7:54 pm 


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Joined: 20 Jul 2017
Posts: 434
Looks like Haunting Ground.


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2019 8:43 pm 


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Joined: 01 Dec 2006
Posts: 1869
Kez wrote:
Looks like Haunting Ground.


Yep it is (or DEMENTO in Japan).


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 Post subject: Re: Extron DSC 301 HD (RGB>HDMI+scaling)-Best settings for 4
PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 6:57 pm 


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Joined: 01 Dec 2006
Posts: 1869
Oh I just noticed that there's a new firmware for the Extron DSC 301 HD, version 1.26, does anyone has it or knows what it does compared to 1.25 (you need to login to be able to read the release notes)?


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