Csync RGB cables for Pal consoles without syncstripper?

[RetroBVM]

Lord Voutar mentioned in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLBQxuljiAU at 2:02:50, that it is possible to get cysnc from Pal consoles (PAL Snes, Gamecube, Saturn) without the need of a sync stripper in the cable - basicly csync by an internal mod outputted on the multiouts or alike .

How should the RGB SCART cables be wired to get Csync from the PAL console to the Extron or CRT? (Most cables for sale are wired for other sync or a sync stripper build in)

[Kez]

Could be wrong here but I feel like Voultar went off on a bit of a tangent. The PC Engine does have a csync signal that can be tapped very easily from the expansion port, but it needs to be buffered to get to proper levels.

There is no cable that can grab csync from a multi-out that does not have csync, which is why they use sync strippers when csync is required. If you do an internal mod to get csync on the multi out, the way you wire your cable would depend on the output of the mod. If the csync is on spec then you would simply have a wire with no components on the sync line.

[Syntax]

When you internal mod a PAL console to output Csync you usually replace the 12v pin on the multi out with csync.

That way you can use the csync cables.

[RetroBVM]

When you internal mod a PAL console to output Csync you usually replace the 12v pin on the multi out with csync.

That way you can use the csync cables.

Thanks for the info Syntax, this might be it. So this is the same for all PAL consoles (Snes, Gamecube and Saturn)?

[RetroBVM]

Could be wrong here but I feel like Voultar went off on a bit of a tangent. The PC Engine does have a csync signal that can be tapped very easily from the expansion port, but it needs to be buffered to get to proper levels.

There is no cable that can grab csync from a multi-out that does not have csync, which is why they use sync strippers when csync is required. If you do an internal mod to get csync on the multi out, the way you wire your cable would depend on the output of the mod. If the csync is on spec then you would simply have a wire with no components on the sync line.

I think your right.

[nmalinoski]

When you internal mod a PAL console to output Csync you usually replace the 12v pin on the multi out with csync.

That way you can use the csync cables.

That's frightening; make sure you never use your straight CSync cable on a regular console.

[Syntax]

12v directly into a tvs jungle chip does all sorts of nasties.

[RetroBVM]

I know, read it all on retrorgb.com

[dseleski]

Lord Voutar mentioned in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLBQxuljiAU at 2:02:50, that it is possible to get cysnc from Pal consoles (PAL Snes, Gamecube, Saturn) without the need of a sync stripper in the cable - basicly csync by an internal mod outputted on the multiouts or alike .

How should the RGB SCART cables be wired to get Csync from the PAL console to the Extron or CRT? (Most cables for sale are wired for other sync or a sync stripper build in)

I think what he’s saying (I watched it several times, and it kinda goes all over the place because yes, this stuff isn’t scripted) is you can either mod your console or in the case of consoles that don’t have csync, if your setup doesn’t need it you shouldn’t be using csync and sync strippers.

I’ve had this info in place on my site for some time. I think it’s starting to stick as far as PlayStation cables go. Most people purchase luma versions.

There’s this idea in place, it does exist and it’s prevalent- but pretty outdated now that you can get coax cables - that csync will give you the best picture, when in fact you don’t need it as long as the signal is properly shielded.

And that’s what we believe. If you’re using an OSSC or Framemeister or straight into most PVMs - you don’t *need* csync, you just need coax cables. Sync strippers are not cheap circuits, plus they require extra work to put in the cable. So if you don’t need them, my advice has always been - just use sync on luma or composite video.

If you do need them? For the few consoles you need them for, they can be used if you don’t want to mod your console. But if you are using Scart, honestly I’d use them in an adaptor in the final chain. Or send the signal through a gscart or other switchbox that has the sync stripper built in. Which is ok. While it won’t improve the signal going through the cable any, this shouldn’t matter if you’re using coax. The only scenario where you’re going to get signal coupling from a coax cable is when your other equipment is bad. Some of the bandridge switchboxes for example, run the sync line too close to rgb on the pcb.

So, assuming you have good equipment:

Putting multiple sync strippers into Scart cables is a little redundant imo. That’s why we offer both options, to keep costs down for people. But if people are purchasing csync cables with sync strippers it always makes me wonder: are they buying this because they need it? Or are they buying it because they are stuck on this idea that csync is best? In fact it’s worse than just using luma in the case of PlayStation.

[Harrumph]

Many excellent points in that post dseleski, hope this is something that will start to stick with people going forward.

[theclaw]

The wise user learns to accept when it 'feels right'. Chasing quality get increasingly costly for less and less gain. Going batty testing every amalgamation of cable, console revision, switchbox, TV, etc, is neither fun or rewarding.

If you don't see a distinct visual problem on the TV screen, it's more often than not fine.

[RetroBVM]

Im clear on the SNES (PAL) (internal mod to get csync). What about GAMECUBE (PAL) and SATURN (PAL), are there internal mods to get csync on the multi out?