MiSTer FPGA board

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fernan1234
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by fernan1234 »

evil_ash_xero wrote:
fernan1234 wrote:Analogue RGB is known to be pristine. YPbPr is known to be wonky but many people do make it work without problems. Wait for that VGA to Component converter or you may also want to try an HDMI to Component DAC using the MiSTer's direct video setting.
So SCART works better? I could try that, but I'm not sure what I have to change in the settings. I have a VGA to SCART cable.
RGB works better. SCART is one way you can use to deliver RGB, but if you're using SCART gear you need to attenuate the sync on the SCART cable you use as the MiSTer's analogue output is TTL rather than 75ohm video level sync that SCART equipment uses. You want to double check that your VGA to SCART cable has the needed attenuation.

A very common way people use RGB from the MiSTer IO board is using a VGA to BNC cable that they just connect straight into professional RGB monitors, or to BNC or D-Sub/VGA switch boxes.

To use RGB you don't need to change any setting, the IO board outputs RGB by default. To use direct video (for HDMI to VGA or Component DACs) you just change the corresponding setting in the ini file.
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by evil_ash_xero »

That cleared it up almost completely. Thanks!
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by evil_ash_xero »

In TATE mode, the screen is wider than the TV (I'm using a 20 inch TV to experiment with this). Do most people just roll with this, or do they go into the service
menu and shrink the entire picture? Also, any reason that some games won't flip? It's kind of a paint to pick the TV up and move it about to play some games.
That being said, it's really nice to play Batrider without a ton of lag.

Also, a bit of update on the interference. It's really odd. It's gone from all the "Consoles", except Neo Geo. And it's in the Arcade games. It's like a wave that goes from left to right.
That's on my Trinitrons. On my 20 inch Toshiba, there is none of that. Really odd. I don't think I'll figure that one out. It's not unplayable with the interference (it's faint), but
I thought I'd mention it.

Also, a bit of a side note... the "Original Colors" on the PC Engine kind of suck. I appreciate the toned down nature, but they are SO desaturated. I can crank my colors to the max,
and they still look washed out. Strangely, they look pretty saturated on my Pocket. But it's screen is very vibrant, so maybe it's giving the illusion... who knows? :lol:
fernan1234
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by fernan1234 »

evil_ash_xero wrote:Also, a bit of a side note... the "Original Colors" on the PC Engine kind of suck. I appreciate the toned down nature, but they are SO desaturated. I can crank my colors to the max,
and they still look washed out. Strangely, they look pretty saturated on my Pocket. But it's screen is very vibrant, so maybe it's giving the illusion... who knows?

This is just your brain being used to years of garish colors on your RGB modded PC Engines don't listen to it :P
But really give it some time and you'll probably get used to it and you'll soon appreciate what they do for the library, it really is to its benefit. I have no experience with the Pocket's core and if it uses the original palette, but yeah it could be that the screen is more saturated like you're used to. You can also try boosting the contrast a bit on your CRTs. Otherwise you can always switch back and forth between original and raw colors anyway, some games may benefit more than others.
SavagePencil
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by SavagePencil »

evil_ash_xero wrote:In TATE mode, the screen is wider than the TV (I'm using a 20 inch TV to experiment with this). Do most people just roll with this, or do they go into the service
menu and shrink the entire picture?
No idea what you're talking about here; I don't have this issue with any vertical games on my PVM. Can you take a picture?
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by evil_ash_xero »

SavagePencil wrote:
evil_ash_xero wrote:In TATE mode, the screen is wider than the TV (I'm using a 20 inch TV to experiment with this). Do most people just roll with this, or do they go into the service
menu and shrink the entire picture?
No idea what you're talking about here; I don't have this issue with any vertical games on my PVM. Can you take a picture?
Yes, I can. I'll post it a bit later.

Update:

Image
Bassa-Bassa
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Bassa-Bassa »

Overscan for being 240p instead of 224p, which is usually what a consumer Trinitron expects. Service mode to solve it, yeap.
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by evil_ash_xero »

That's what I figured.

Unfortunately, looking thru some things... I cannot change the H Size on a 20 inch Toshiba. So... well, I could always turn one of my 27 Trinitrons on it's side. :lol:
There's always something, I swear...
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Bassa-Bassa »

It's actually the V size what would solve your issue, unless there's something we're missing. 320x240 like the game pictured should never show major horizontal overscan issues unless the TV is really old and tiny.

Is there a list anywhere of vertical games supporting picture flip on Mister, by the way? Or something to know beforehand which side a game flips on? Is it something the Mister devs do care about to add if the game originally lacks the feature?
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by evil_ash_xero »

Yes, V Size would solve the issue, but I don't want to mess up the aspect ratio. I was hoping to shrink the whole thing, so nothing would be distorted.
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Bassa-Bassa »

That's not how you deal with CRTs. You're assuming that currently you've got a perfect 4:3 for 320x240 (in spite of getting all that vertical overscan), and it's 99% sure that's not the case. Your only concern with CRTs in this regard should be that, for full-screen graphics, you don't get any borders and get close to zero overscan (which normally will get you 4:3, but that's the side effect) - that's how games were designed for CRTs. Due to the nature of the technology, you'll always get more horizontal overscan with games of a wider resolution which will force you to shrink the display horizontally - they're intended to do so. The same with the vertical size. Despite TVs not letting you modify geometry easily for silly reasons, you're actually using them as monitors when displaying videogames.
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by evil_ash_xero »

Yeah, that does work. I was comparing the image to it on an panel, and everything was fat. So, it was just too wide.

That being said, only some games are like this. The Raizing games (not Dimahoo) are too wide, as well as most CAVE games, but a lot of other games fit just fine. Any horizontal games
fit fine too. So, I have to adjust the screen to what I'm playing. Which is annoying. At least it's really easy to get into Toshiba's service menus.
ZellSF
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by ZellSF »

MiSTer might be getting a Nintendo 64 core:
https://twitter.com/AzumFpg/status/1646452662676619264
There are some caveats.
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Bassa-Bassa »

Hopefully it does mean his PS1 core is flawless now.
ZellSF
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by ZellSF »

I doubt it's flawless, I can't think of any remaining bugs, but flawless is a high bar. There's some flaws listed on the Github issues page:
https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/PSX_MiSTer/issues
That said, it's not a for profit endeavour like Analogue, old products that do not sell any longer aren't necessarily abandoned.
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Bassa-Bassa »

Yeah, but check Neogeo for instance. It's like if they're not called Jotego they lose motivation once they reach a landmark and it's farewell. So kind of like Mame once again.
ZellSF
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by ZellSF »

It's definitely a possibility. I also feel like I should have pointed out that while the core developers aren't for profit enterprises, they do have monetization (most of them have Patreons) that means they might want to go more for big new things than smaller fixes to existing ones.

Personally if it gets me a Nintendo 64 core I wouldn't mind the PSX core being abandoned in its current state. Even if it isn't 100% it's pretty damn good.
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evil_ash_xero
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by evil_ash_xero »

I was playing some of my games with the PSX core, and Capcom Generation 2 (I think that's the one... with Arthur). When I would get killed in one of the games (I think Ghouls N Ghosts) there would be a high
pitched noise that wouldn't go away until the screen faded. So, that's definitely a bug. And that was quite recently.

As far as cores, I'm waiting for that guy to finish the new Irem core, as I'm excited to get Ninja Baseball Batman, Gun Force II, and R-Type Leo on the tube. Pretty excited about that core.

Question for those in the know. I have set custom buttons to have strong shot and rapid fire in games like R-Type and whatnot. However, I have to lift my thumb off of the rapid fire, and then go to the strong shot, otherwise it
won't work.
This hasn't been a problem, but when Leo is released, I go between the homing and rapid shot all the time, so I wonder if there is a way around this? Maybe I need to set the rapid fire timings differently?

Too bad most shmups don't have the CAVE core settings with full auto-fire.
jd213
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by jd213 »

I also use 1 button for turbo and 1 button for non-turbo in some games, pretty sure I've noticed that problem in R-Type as well. Not sure if there's a way around it, though. Maybe try asking on the MiSter forum or Discord.
cfx
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by cfx »

I can't help but be amused by the reality of the comments here compared to the hyperbole I see elsewhere about how, unlike emulation, MISTer is a perfect recreation of hardware because of the magic of FPGA. I knew that was utter nonsense and you here are proof of that.
fernan1234
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by fernan1234 »

cfx wrote:I can't help but be amused by the reality of the comments here compared to the hyperbole I see elsewhere about how, unlike emulation, MISTer is a perfect recreation of hardware because of the magic of FPGA. I knew that was utter nonsense and you here are proof of that.
In a way this is also hyperbole but in the other direction. Not all cores are made equal, and truth is somewhere in the middle.
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by evil_ash_xero »

cfx wrote:I can't help but be amused by the reality of the comments here compared to the hyperbole I see elsewhere about how, unlike emulation, MISTer is a perfect recreation of hardware because of the magic of FPGA. I knew that was utter nonsense and you here are proof of that.

It's not as bad as some of it sounds. It's just confusing, to a degree. Especially with some aspects of the arcade cores.
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orange808
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by orange808 »

It's all emulation. This all goes back to Analogue's marketing shit. The beauty of FPGA is independence from draconian operating systems and the ability to emulate close to the metal. There's fewer potential sources of excessive latency and devs have more control over the video output with modern MiSTer cores.

I say modern MiSTer, because low latency, accurate refresh rates, and good scaling weren't always in the MiSTer roadmap. In fact, there was a time that suggesting them would be met with angry and nasty ranting. Originally, it was supposed to be a Raspberry Pi alternative with similar performance. I don't know if the old forum is still around. Maybe the evidence is gone. I guess I'll put on my fucking laughing shoes.
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bobrocks95
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by bobrocks95 »

Maybe someday someone will be able to suggest using original media and not be laughed out of the room either...
PS1 Disc-Based Game ID BIOS patch for MemCard Pro and SD2PSX automatic VMC switching.
cfx
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by cfx »

bobrocks95 wrote:Maybe someday someone will be able to suggest using original media and not be laughed out of the room either...
Doubt it. They're all pirates, no matter how much they claim it's all about preservation. Edit: Not passing judgement on anyone using this here, but the attitude of developers as described in the quote get my derision.

Recently I stumbled onto the fact there's an English translation patch for Galaxy Fraulein Yuna on PC-Engine CD. I thought that was cool and that I might try to rip and patch my original game and write that back to CD since the PC-Engine doesn't use copy protection. There are fairly detailed instructions on how to patch the game, and they are all about how to patch various formats you may find when downloading the game from whererever. There isn't a single sentence about how to do it to an original game, only a sentence that says something to the effect if you want to do anything other than what they tell you how to do you're own your own.

I'm not a hacker so I gave up on the idea. And it's the same thing I was referring to above; none of these emulators work in a way where you just play the game and don't have to be concerned about any quirks as to whether that is behavior of the original or some problem. It's fine if you like tinkering and aren't bothered by that stuff, but the big reason I like consoles instead of computers is "insert game, press button, play game" and no matter what the MISTer or emulation evangelists say, it's not that straightforward or simple.

I was a programmer in an earlier life so I know how some things work, but I don't want to deal with that anymore. That was a job, an often very frustrating one, and about as far removed from "fun" as I can imagine.

Sorry, I shoudn't even be in this topic. :oops:
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Bassa-Bassa »

Devs (Mister, Mame) are highly skilled people who like a good challenge, usually with interest in preservationism. They aren't telling you to pirate anything as there're means to rip/dump your own media. Another subject altogether, but I don't think fan translators do either, they just have to work with what most people will use as they can't test every particular rip. None of those are the people to blame, in case there's anything to blame about actually.
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by ldeveraux »

cfx wrote:
bobrocks95 wrote:Maybe someday someone will be able to suggest using original media and not be laughed out of the room either...
Doubt it. They're all pirates, no matter how much they claim it's all about preservation. Edit: Not passing judgement on anyone using this here, but the attitude of developers as described in the quote get my derision.

Recently I stumbled onto the fact there's an English translation patch for Galaxy Fraulein Yuna on PC-Engine CD. I thought that was cool and that I might try to rip and patch my original game and write that back to CD since the PC-Engine doesn't use copy protection. There are fairly detailed instructions on how to patch the game, and they are all about how to patch various formats you may find when downloading the game from whererever. There isn't a single sentence about how to do it to an original game, only a sentence that says something to the effect if you want to do anything other than what they tell you how to do you're own your own.

I'm not a hacker so I gave up on the idea. And it's the same thing I was referring to above; none of these emulators work in a way where you just play the game and don't have to be concerned about any quirks as to whether that is behavior of the original or some problem. It's fine if you like tinkering and aren't bothered by that stuff, but the big reason I like consoles instead of computers is "insert game, press button, play game" and no matter what the MISTer or emulation evangelists say, it's not that straightforward or simple.

I was a programmer in an earlier life so I know how some things work, but I don't want to deal with that anymore. That was a job, an often very frustrating one, and about as far removed from "fun" as I can imagine.

Sorry, I shoudn't even be in this topic. :oops:
I wanted to disagree with you based on your previous comment, but sadly I think this hits the nail on the head.
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Bassa-Bassa »

They can't be perfectly simple and straightforward because they're all unofficial and unfinished projects. There's always been an issue of quantity over quality, but at least now you can patronize them and try to be heard.
Last edited by Bassa-Bassa on Sat Apr 15, 2023 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Udderdude
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Udderdude »

FWIW I have seen translation patches that do the exact opposite. They tell you what software they used to rip their original copy of the game, and if you don't do it that way, you're on your own.
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Re: MiSTer FPGA board

Post by Konsolkongen »

bobrocks95 wrote:Maybe someday someone will be able to suggest using original media and not be laughed out of the room either...
This. I don’t understand why the ARM side of the chip could not handle an optical USB drive. It already handles the iso files in some cores IIRC. Is there really that much of a difference?
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