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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 7:58 pm 


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Quote:
Hi all, anyone know how I can set the Corio2 up to output 480i?

There should be an "NTSC" profile on your Corio2 - that's 480i (yes, technically it's not NTSC when outputted over RGB or Component).


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 8:41 pm 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
Posts: 1082
Xer Xian wrote:
Quote:
Hi all, anyone know how I can set the Corio2 up to output 480i?

There should be an "NTSC" profile on your Corio2 - that's 480i (yes, technically it's not NTSC when outputted over RGB or Component).


When you program it with the Windows software you'll see that #1 resolution is NTSC, and #2 is PAL. Weird thing is that I can never get to those two resolutions on the unit itself - it starts with #3 (which I program as my "240P MASTER" resolution) and won't let you get to those. I could totally be missing something as I hate 480i and don't use it, but there has to be an easy way to get to that NTSC resolution....

Maybe you might have to write down those values (in the software as you're programming it) for the NTSC #1 resolution, then simply put those numbers into any resolution above #3 and it'll work (or maybe you just can't run 480i over RGB? ...that wouldn't make sense to me since 240p is kinda the same as 480i from a bandwidth perspective...).

Oh, and I know your C2-400 doesn't have these, but on my other units whenever you plug into the Composite or S-Video plugs on those, it seems to always be 480i even when it's on the 240p preset. I have a little C2-100? 150? which works this way and seems to output 480i (picked that model up by accident for cheap forgetting it wasn't 240p compatible).


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 9:08 pm 


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I can't help with that, I sort of recall having owned a Corio2 that wouldn't let me access those two profiles, but I didn't care much about it. IIRC they can be accessed on my C2-750 (sorry but it's not hooked up and I'd have to look for my 12v PSU).

And I don't think I've ever owned Corio2 scalers with YC and composite output myself - only a downconverter that wouldn't let me set custom profiles properly. But I can see them being limited to standard PAL or NTSC on those outputs - those were the only proper standards ever supported over YC and composite after all.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 11:07 pm 


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So a few pages back you guys were curious what Bloodstained: CotM looked like being output from a PC in native 400x240p without any external processors. I finally got some pictures, and probably the most important one is the save screen.

Each letter on the save screen has the exact same number of lines, and they're all equally bright. That's how you know you're scaling properly, each line rendered by the game is being display on the CRT 1:1.

I'm not sure if this is possible on a Corio, but here's what it would look like if it was:

Spoiler: show
Image
Image
Image


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2019 12:03 am 



Joined: 14 Aug 2017
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BazookaBen wrote:
So a few pages back you guys were curious what Bloodstained: CotM looked like being output from a PC in native 400x240p without any external processors. I finally got some pictures, and probably the most important one is the save screen.

Each letter on the save screen has the exact same number of lines, and they're all equally bright. That's how you know you're scaling properly, each line rendered by the game is being display on the CRT 1:1.

I'm not sure if this is possible on a Corio, but here's what it would look like if it was:

Spoiler: show
Image
Image
Image


So nice! Looks like a proper 8-bit game.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2019 1:07 am 



Joined: 07 Mar 2016
Posts: 108
BazookaBen wrote:
So a few pages back you guys were curious what Bloodstained: CotM looked like being output from a PC in native 400x240p without any external processors. I finally got some pictures, and probably the most important one is the save screen.

Each letter on the save screen has the exact same number of lines, and they're all equally bright. That's how you know you're scaling properly, each line rendered by the game is being display on the CRT 1:1.

I'm not sure if this is possible on a Corio, but here's what it would look like if it was:

Spoiler: show
Image
Image
Image

beautiful picture


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 3:14 am 



Joined: 17 Aug 2015
Posts: 37
Image


Last edited by Brando1975 on Tue May 14, 2019 10:12 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 4:20 am 


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:roll:
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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 4:17 pm 



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:roll:


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 9:18 pm 


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The Corio machine is old? What the f*ck is the Emotia? (Edit: I see you edited and changed your issues cells. Although, I could be forgiven, because you moved a legitimate issue with the Emotia over to the Corio side when you switched them.)

Can I adjust the frame rate output on the Emotia? That's kind of a big deal. Is there any kind of frame lock feature at all? No. Nothing. Lots of sweet sweet tearing, though. :)

Also, why shitpost that here? Why not start a fresh thread?
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Last edited by orange808 on Tue May 14, 2019 10:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 9:26 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1691
orange808 wrote:
Also, why shitpost that here? Why not start a fresh thread?

Agreed. This is a thread for instruction and assistance configuring Corio2s to be downscalers, not a discussion to compare them with other devices.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 10:09 pm 


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The Corio2 has both sampling and output adjustment. You can adjust the sampling or the processing.

You'll get the same kind of horizontal sampling issues with any scaler. FBX has spent hours helping people adjust their OSSC and Framemeister units to fix the issues you are seeing.

The Emotia doesn't offer the same robust adjustment that the Corio offers me. So, the Emotia automatically returns an optimized sampled image in every situation?

I just don't believe that.
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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 10:56 pm 


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RetroRGB shares this photo of the Emotia blowing it on the checkerboard test pattern.

https://cdn.retrorgb.com/images/240pCompare03.jpg

That's not okay. It looks bad.

The Corio2 can be dialed in to handle the checkerboard properly.
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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 11:25 pm 



Joined: 17 Aug 2015
Posts: 37
I can only talk about how the corio2 behaves in my setup, I think it's very good but the emotia runs better in general, it is my personal opinion. I'm not interested in how the device performs in the tests, or the other endless possibilities it has.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 11:38 pm 


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Brando1975 wrote:
I can only talk about how the corio2 behaves in my setup, I think it's very good but the emotia runs better in general, it is my personal opinion. I'm not interested in how the device performs in the tests, or the other endless possibilities it has.


So, you shitposted a half-assed and inaccurate review in a thread about configuring the device. :)
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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 12:30 am 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
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I think it's fine that Brando1975 posted his experiences with the two - gives others a perspective on what else is out there. I think a hurdle might be how he's using a Mac (want to say 2014 Mini?) which won't do 480p through the system menu (tried on my 2013 Mac Pro as well, and it seems like they took that option out around that time), so he can only output 480p with the help of a 3rd party app (don't know if that causes any issues with the Corio2 or what).

I will add that in another topic I did see how Brando's tried 3x Emotia's over the last couple years, and he said that ALL have given him "weird problems" (perhaps due to their age?), so that's kinda something important that shouldn't be left out in a comparison of the two IMO. The Emotia's are getting up there in age now, when many of these Corio2's are from 2006-2010ish – I've had units with up to 87k hours on them which still perform just like the brand new ones to my eyes (for full disclosure I did have a fault code on my 2200's, probably new-user error back then, but it's been over a full year later and those same ones are still in my rack chugging along perfectly).


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 12:54 pm 


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If one is experiencing video artifacts from their Corio2 (such as shown on this video), that's not a fault of the Corio2, but only a sign that some more tweaking is needed in order to reach a good result.

A properly configured Corio2 should give a pretty much flawless 240p result (see here - and this is from a YUV source). I've never owned an Emotia, but I don't think there's much room for improvement in terms of PQ.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2019 4:39 am 



Joined: 13 Mar 2011
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Location: Toronto, Canada
What about using a Corio2 for something like an X68000?

The computer outputs 31k video using RGBHV. But some games switch to 15k and then back to 31k when you exit back to DOS (HumanOS). Is this something this device can support? on the fly resolution changes and 240p input?


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 2:12 am 



Joined: 07 Mar 2016
Posts: 108
i busted out the Corio to try mimicking Game boy player for Gamecube:
i was playing Fusion on the gamecube using the mk-ii

ImageImage

and was curious how AMR2 will look on the 20m4u

ImageImage
ImageImage

it's downscaled from a 1080p screen that is using the fullscreen 4:3 option on AM2R display settings downscaled to 240p through the corio.

there's a native 320 x 240 setting in AMR2 display settings, i wish i could figure out how to get it on my PVM native as i don't have the right tools.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:10 pm 


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Hi,

I picked up a Corio C2-2655 Scaler earlier this week (cheap-ish) but I am having real trouble getting anything useful out of it using the same profiles (and cables) that I use on my 2355 (which works perfectly)

I have XBOX 360 VGA in and then 240p out on the DVI-U Port via a DVI to RGBHV cable to a Std Def PVM. I'm using a DVI to RGBHV BNC Cable, with Sync coming over the H cable. The 2355 allows me to set RGBS on the DVI out, but the 2655 seems to only allow RGBHV or RGsB or YUV.

I don't think I am getting sync properly, as I get a horizintally duplicated (I think) 240p image that rapidly scrolls.

I'm going to get a DVI-A to DSUB-15 tomorrow to run this into an Extron RGB interface and see if that will take RGsB before I get it into the PVM.

Any another suggestions, or do you think I am on the right track?

Cheers,
JSM.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:36 pm 


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I don't know if anybody tried a 2655 in particular before, but at least the majority (if not all) of C2 units labeled with "scan converter" don't work for 240p output.

The 2655 certainly does support 480i output and this should be an available factory preset by default, so to check your cabling in general, I would try that and see what happens.

A horizontally duplicated image suggest that you're getting a 31khz output despite having set the unit to 15khz.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2019 4:34 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
I don't know if anybody tried a 2655 in particular before, but at least the majority (if not all) of C2 units labeled with "scan converter" don't work for 240p output.

The 2655 certainly does support 480i output and this should be an available factory preset by default, so to check your cabling in general, I would try that and see what happens.

A horizontally duplicated image suggest that you're getting a 31khz output despite having set the unit to 15khz.


Thanks for the reply :) Doh! Didn't notice the scan converter badge instead of the scaler badge (the 2755 and 2855 are both badged as scalers). I bought it because I noticed no one had tried the 2655 previously and it was £115 so not too much of a gamble to find out. Worst thing that happens is that others know not to buy them!

Edit: I found a VCS700 and that gets Sync perfectly from the 2655 using RGsB and RGBHV and confirms it is at 15.780khz.

I'll give it a go with the RGB interface tomorrow when the new cables arrive. I've also raised a ticket (unit is still under support) to find out if it support RGBS over the DVI port like the 2355 does.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:13 pm 


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Hi,

OK, so it looks like the 2655 only supports Separate HV Sync and RGsB on the DVI out unlike the 2355 which also supports RGBS. Putting it through a 203rxi and then into the PVM gets sync and gives a sharp picture, but:

Aspect ratio is off and everything is rather zoomed in, as pic below (sorry about the tate and white balance):
https://imgur.com/tOHvx0Q

I am using these settings on the 2655 (same as I used on the 2355A):
https://imgur.com/kBIaI0X

Xbox 360 is set to 640x480 out on an official VGA cable. The Extron has all dip switches set to off. The 2655 has the latest firmware on it.
An interlaced NTSC 525i image displays OK but it about 10% too zoomed in: https://imgur.com/qafLBXh

Anyone have any idea what I need to look at changing, or am I on a wild goose chase? Any insight really appreciated!

cheers,

JSM


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:36 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1691
JigsawMan wrote:
An interlaced NTSC 525i image displays OK but it about 10% too zoomed in: https://imgur.com/qafLBXh

Are there any overscan settings you can toggle?


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:56 pm 


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nmalinoski wrote:
JigsawMan wrote:
An interlaced NTSC 525i image displays OK but it about 10% too zoomed in: https://imgur.com/qafLBXh

Are there any overscan settings you can toggle?


Thanks! I just went looking through all of the menus and I (mostly) figured it out. There is no overscan option but there is a Sizing Mode (set to "percent") and it only lets you increase in 10% increments upwards (no decrease).

So in SETUP. LAYERS. PRIMARY. Set SIZING MODE to PIXEL and then leave all other settings unchanged. Here is the result (DDP DFK on 360):
https://imgur.com/xC0SEcF
The pic from my phone absolutely doesn't do it justice, it looks great!

There is a slight bit of overscan (is that the right term?), maybe 5%? It's annoying but not a show stopper (certainly better than using 480i). I can't even remember if my 2355 does it or not.

Thanks for fudoh's and nmalinoski's input :) I'll write up properly how I got it all to work next week as it took some faffing around. If anyone has any ideas on how to fix the zoom using the CorioTools that would be great!

JSM.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:26 am 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
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Edited my original post, confirmed the C2-2350A as working a few minutes ago.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 4:20 pm 


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May be worth noting that the 2655, 2755 and 2855 do not support RGBS output. I had confirmation from TVOne Support today that there is a mistake in the user manual.

So, if you are getting one of these then you will need a Extron RGB Interface to take the RGBHV into RGBS. The 2655 definitely works with that, but I haven't found a cheap enough 2855 to purchase yet.

The 2755 doesn't (according to the Tech Specs) support low resolutions, so I would be hesitant to even try that one.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 11:21 pm 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
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JigsawMan wrote:
May be worth noting that the 2655, 2755 and 2855 do not support RGBS output. I had confirmation from TVOne Support today that there is a mistake in the user manual.

So, if you are getting one of these then you will need a Extron RGB Interface to take the RGBHV into RGBS. The 2655 definitely works with that, but I haven't found a cheap enough 2855 to purchase yet.

The 2755 doesn't (according to the Tech Specs) support low resolutions, so I would be hesitant to even try that one.


Thanks! Just marked 2655 as working but no RGBS output. Put above caveats on 2755 and 2855.


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:37 am 



Joined: 11 Sep 2019
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I recently acquired a Corio C2-1350, which is not currently listed in the OP (the closest number being C2-1250). I have managed to program it with the custom resolutions after taking ages to find a USB-Serial cable that actually works. At first I couldn't get the CorioSuite to accept any of the XML files as it would complain about the model number being mismatched. But then I got a bit lazy and glanced over all three XML files for the C2-400, C2-750 and C2-2200 and noticed that the *only* difference was the model number and firmware version at the top. Changing this to match my model number and firmware version allowed the CorioSuite to accept the file and load the resolutions, and write them successfully! However I have yet to get it hooked up to a RGB monitor to test if 240p indeed works, although these output options are indeed selectable in the OSD (although the screen goes blank as soon as I do of course as I'm currently using a CCTV monitor via the S-Video connector, so I cannot set a 240P output as a default yet!). I am in the process of putting my RGB-capable PVM back together and will test when I'm done. If I am successful, I will post back again. Would you be open to adding the C2-1350 to the list of supported models if this is the case?
EDIT: I just had an idea to partially test this. I have an old VGA to S-Video converter box lying around. So I hooked it up to the PC-HD output on the Corio and through the flickering was able to select through the resolutions, albeit through a scruffy-flickering picture (but at least it wasn't blank!). This isn't a full test of course but it does at least allow me to select a 240P output resolution and save it as the default before I hook it up to my PVM when it's working again...


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 Post subject: Re: TUTORIAL for TVOne Corio2 240p Downscalers
PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 8:41 pm 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
Posts: 1082
samspin wrote:
However I have yet to get it hooked up to a RGB monitor to test if 240p indeed works, although these output options are indeed selectable in the OSD (although the screen goes blank as soon as I do of course as I'm currently using a CCTV monitor via the S-Video connector, so I cannot set a 240P output as a default yet!). I am in the process of putting my RGB-capable PVM back together and will test when I'm done. If I am successful, I will post back again. Would you be open to adding the C2-1350 to the list of supported models if this is the case?
EDIT: I just had an idea to partially test this. I have an old VGA to S-Video converter box lying around. So I hooked it up to the PC-HD output on the Corio and through the flickering was able to select through the resolutions, albeit through a scruffy-flickering picture (but at least it wasn't blank!). This isn't a full test of course but it does at least allow me to select a 240P output resolution and save it as the default before I hook it up to my PVM when it's working again...


Yup, just let us know how you fair out once you give it a proper test on your PVM then I can add it to the list.

Something to note (forget if this is in the original tutorial), but I believe some people have noted that the 240p resolutions ONLY work on the RGB/YPbPr/RGBHV/VGA outputs, and not via S-Video or Composite if your model has those (or maybe it changes it to 480i instead? I forget honestly).


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