best way to play PS2 games on a modern TV?

[MidOrFeed2015]

maybe someone can chime in their thoughts or experiences.

currently I am using an early model PS3 with hardware compatibility and cfw (to read imports/translations).

the reason for the ps3 is because it can force 480p on every ps2 game, but not natural 480p of course.

i have played drakengard from start to finish and i didn't experience any issues.

Anyone else using a PS3 primarily for PS2 games? Or are you using PS2 in 480i (and 480p where it is supported?)

I like to play this stuff at its best. I like what I am doing now but if there are better paths then I would love to hear them.

I am using an OSSC as well but I usually use upsample 480p line2x. not sure yet if 1080i or 720p is better decision as I have not tested those outputs yet.

And without OSSC, the games look like complete mud so direct or passthrough is no good.

last question: is forcing 480p on 480i games an unnatural thing to do?

[Fudoh]

last question: is forcing 480p on 480i games an unnatural thing to do?

on the PS3 Playstation 2 titles are still rendered in 480i and only deinterlaced to 480p afterwards, so by switching between 480i and 480p output you basically switch between the PS3's deinterlacing engine and your TV's deinterlacing engine.

The PS3 wasn't terrible, but the result's still quite blurry. Modern TVs can do a better job (but not all of them).

The Framemeister is the best external 480i deinterlacer, because it offers the sharpest results (without much movement, it's extremely close to native 480p). The OSSC's 480i deinterlacing capabilities are simple at best and not suited for every game out there.

[Necronopticous]

The Framemeister is the best external 480i deinterlacer, because it offers the sharpest results (without much movement, it's extremely close to native 480p).

I'm currently playing PS2 games on my PVM-20L5, and the interlacing jitter can be pretty annoying if I'm sitting close to the screen. Would the Framemeister help in this situation, or are you speaking strictly for HDTV output?

[Fudoh]

before LCDs and Plasmas were a thing linedoublers and scalers were commonly used on CRTs (or CRT projectors) to reduce interlacing artefacts. My first video game processor was a XRGB-2 and I used it on a 29" VGA CRT.

Depending on what types of games you primarily want to play, there are myriads of linedoublers to choose from. If you only output in 480p you hardly make use of the Framemeister's full potential.

[Revolver Ocelot]

Until my fat ps3 spoiled I used it for ps2 games as well and I was happy with the result. But that was long ago before I got seriously interested in Video Quality. So maybe with my Standards of 2018 I wouldn't be that happy with the results. It is hard to tell now. Has been ages since I have seen Ps2 games on the ps3.


For playing Ps2 games today on my UHD TV I plug my ps2 directly to the via via component. And the result is good enough for me.

I am also the owner of a Framemeister but never used the ps2 with it, because I am not owning a RGB scart cable or a d terminal Adapter for the FM.

So I might not use the best Option but is a good Option. At least for me.

the best Option might be hooking the ps2 up with a Framemeister over RGB Scart or Component?


PS: Do you guys think it would be worth it using the ps2 over the FM with component? or would the result only slightly better than connecting the ps2 directly to the TV via component?

I am tempted to try it, but I heard rumors that the component Output of the Framemeister is not the best...

[Fudoh]

Do you guys think it would be worth it using the ps2 over the FM with component? or would the result only slightly better than connecting the ps2 directly to the TV via component?

hard to judge without knowing your TV. But since you already have a FM, it would be a shame if you didn't try it. Component input on the FM is fine. What you probably read is that the FM's processing of 480p sources sucks. So it's a bit annoying using just one PS2, since once you run a PS2 game with native 480p support you get better results bypassing the FM.

[Revolver Ocelot]

Do you guys think it would be worth it using the ps2 over the FM with component? or would the result only slightly better than connecting the ps2 directly to the TV via component?

hard to judge without knowing your TV. But since you already have a FM, it would be a shame if you didn't try it. Component input on the FM is fine. What you probably read is that the FM's processing of 480p sources sucks. So it's a bit annoying using just one PS2, since once you run a PS2 game with native 480p support you get better results bypassing the FM.

My TV is a .40 panasonic ex 604. Not sure how well the TV is known in the Gamer circles. I agree it is worth a try. But unfortunately using component over the Framemeister is a bit bothersome. I need to buy a component d terminal adapter to do so. That adapter is not that expensive so it would be no problem.

But my use for it is limited. Besides the Ps2 I only just owe one console with a potential Component output is the Gamecube. But I got a hdmi modded Gamecube recently, so there is no point anymore to think about getting the super expensive component cables for the cube. So the only component capable console left is the good old Playstation 2.

I am tempted to try the ps2 with the FM but on the other hand I am not sure if it is worth it because I am rather happy with the direct connection to the TV.

I think I will try it nontheless would be shame if I do not use the FM in all possible ways to get out the best picture.

[Kez]

Well the main benefit of the FM is 480i, which you can simply run from PS2 via SCART.

[fandangos]

last question: is forcing 480p on 480i games an unnatural thing to do?

on the PS3 Playstation 2 titles are still rendered in 480i and only deinterlaced to 480p afterwards, so by switching between 480i and 480p output you basically switch between the PS3's deinterlacing engine and your TV's deinterlacing engine.

The PS3 wasn't terrible, but the result's still quite blurry. Modern TVs can do a better job (but not all of them).

The Framemeister is the best external 480i deinterlacer, because it offers the sharpest results (without much movement, it's extremely close to native 480p). The OSSC's 480i deinterlacing capabilities are simple at best and not suited for every game out there.

As to my understanding the CECHA and CECHB were the best option to play PS2 on modern TVs. Since we are talking about real hardware and not emulation there's no compromises here.
Also, with the PS3 you go digital all the way to the TV, avoiding conversions which results in PQ loss.

A CECHA/B would give the same result if we had a HDMI board for the PS2.

And besides the PQ debate:
You can use a DualShock 3, which is debatable better than the PS2 controller and it's wireless - which is great for couch gaming on a 65 inches TV.
You can use CFW and add your library of games to the internal HD in a much simpler way compared to OPL.

The only downside is that those early model PS3 will eventually develop YLOD.

[MidOrFeed2015]

Do you guys think it would be worth it using the ps2 over the FM with component? or would the result only slightly better than connecting the ps2 directly to the TV via component?

hard to judge without knowing your TV. But since you already have a FM, it would be a shame if you didn't try it. Component input on the FM is fine. What you probably read is that the FM's processing of 480p sources sucks. So it's a bit annoying using just one PS2, since once you run a PS2 game with native 480p support you get better results bypassing the FM.

My TV is a .40 panasonic ex 604. Not sure how well the TV is known in the Gamer circles. I agree it is worth a try. But unfortunately using component over the Framemeister is a bit bothersome. I need to buy a component d terminal adapter to do so. That adapter is not that expensive so it would be no problem.

But my use for it is limited. Besides the Ps2 I only just owe one console with a potential Component output is the Gamecube. But I got a hdmi modded Gamecube recently, so there is no point anymore to think about getting the super expensive component cables for the cube. So the only component capable console left is the good old Playstation 2.

I am tempted to try the ps2 with the FM but on the other hand I am not sure if it is worth it because I am rather happy with the direct connection to the TV.

I think I will try it nontheless would be shame if I do not use the FM in all possible ways to get out the best picture.

how about buying a SCART to use with your FM? most PS2 games run natively at 480i. thats also why I made this thread i dont know if I should use 480i or 480p (forced through ps3).

[Revolver Ocelot]

@ MidOrFeed2015

Yes that would be indeed an option for me. Most Games are just in 480i, what is the domain of the Framemeister. RGB scart cables are not expensive, so there are no cons considering this option.


How well forced 480p over the ps3 would look, depends on the scaling abalities of the ps3 and the TV I guess..

I am not sure but maybe the problem is adressed in the my life in gaming ps2 video on youtube.

If you haven't seen it yet check it out. Maybe the video can give you some new ideas.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brMW6KFue-I


@Kez Thx for advice about Scart. I will take it und order the rgb cable from retro gaming cables uk soon.

[maxtherabbit]

I run my ps2 into a component matrix, one output goes straight to the TV for PS2 games and the other goes into the OSSC for ps1 games

between native support and GSM, I don't have that many games that still require 480i, but when they do my TVs deinterlacer is pretty good

you could do something similar with one output for FM one direct to TV, if your TVs deinterlacer is not good

[airco]

Surprised it took so long for GS Mode Selector to come up, it can force 480p on 480i-only PS2 games if you have a FreeMCBoot-modded memory card. Sure, it crashes whenever you run into an FMV - my playthrough of Drakengard had to be in 480i - but there's a setting that forces the PS2 to skip FMVs, so it's great for stuff like fighting or rhythm games where those don't matter.

Otherwise, I just use an OSSC with 480i and try to sit far enough away from the screen that I don't notice the bob deinterlacing.

[MidOrFeed2015]

Surprised it took so long for GS Mode Selector to come up, it can force 480p on 480i-only PS2 games if you have a FreeMCBoot-modded memory card. Sure, it crashes whenever you run into an FMV - my playthrough of Drakengard had to be in 480i - but there's a setting that forces the PS2 to skip FMVs, so it's great for stuff like fighting or rhythm games where those don't matter.

Otherwise, I just use an OSSC with 480i and try to sit far enough away from the screen that I don't notice the bob deinterlacing.

i tried to see FirebrandX but he does not have an ossc prof for PS2 or PS3. can you suggest good 480i settings so I can try this? thanks in advance!

and if you know, is there a difference between GS mode Select 480p forcing vs PS3's 480p forcing?

other than GS mode select sometimes causing games to crash

[Fudoh]

is there a difference between GS mode Select 480p forcing vs PS3's 480p forcing?

GS forces games into being rendered at 480p. PS3 renders at 480i internally and then runs the signal through an additional deinterlacer.

[bobrocks95]

I found GSM's compatibility really lacking when I used to use it. Lots of early games use what the GSM community calls Field Rendering and when forced to 480p will actually just take one 480i frame and duplicate the missing picture area, essentially halving the vertical resolution. Even games that appear to look fine, like Kingdom Hearts, will actually crop parts of the screen because of them using a low-res backbuffer for rendering. Basically give a try, but you'll probably need to have a backup 480i solution in place.

[ZellSF]

I think figuring out how to force proper 480p using homebrew is essential to get the best PS2 experience on modern TVs. Obviously there's lots of games it won't work for, but there's also lots of games it will work for.

You can use a DualShock 3, which is debatable better than the PS2 controller and it's wireless - which is great for couch gaming on a 65 inches TV.
You can use CFW and add your library of games to the internal HD in a much simpler way compared to OPL.

OPL supports DualShock3 (and 4) controllers. I'm going to guess games that require ingame hooks to be unloaded won't work though. Not that I would recommend bothering...

Transferring games to my PS2 is really convenient to me, so easy to remove the HDD and connect it to a PC via a USB adapter. For transferring iso images I don't see how a PS3 could be any more convenient. For installing games from discs maybe the PS3 could have an advantage.

[maxtherabbit]

man yall still removing your hard drive to transfer games? oof

try this: http://ichiba.geocities.jp/ysai187/PS2/ ... taller.htm

[maxtherabbit]

I found GSM's compatibility really lacking when I used to use it. Lots of early games use what the GSM community calls Field Rendering and when forced to 480p will actually just take one 480i frame and duplicate the missing picture area, essentially halving the vertical resolution. Even games that appear to look fine, like Kingdom Hearts, will actually crop parts of the screen because of them using a low-res backbuffer for rendering. Basically give a try, but you'll probably need to have a backup 480i solution in place.

yeah GSM is just a tool in the box, a viable 480i solution is still necessary

[Wolf_]

I'm not entirely sure how good the ps3 is for ps2 games. I know it natively renders them in 480i so it is the same as a ps2 visually in 480i mode and the ps3 480p scaler is not the best, but does it render the picture digitally natively or does it convert it, and if it converts it how much lag does it add and does it use ypbpr as the source or does it convert from a composite signal? Also does it use all digital for the audio signal or is that also converted? I know some ps2 games don't play audio properly over spdif so that would be interesting to test.

Based on what I know for certain I would say just using a fat ps2 with spdif for audio and a hd retrovision cable into an ossc into a <1 frame of lag tv is by far the best ps2 experience I've ever had.

[ZellSF]

man yall still removing your hard drive to transfer games? oof

try this: http://ichiba.geocities.jp/ysai187/PS2/ ... taller.htm

When transferring DVD images then I would much rather have USB speeds than 100mbps ethernet speeds (best case PS3 scenario) or much lower (PS2 ethernet, PS2/PS3 disc drives).

[maxtherabbit]

man yall still removing your hard drive to transfer games? oof

try this: http://ichiba.geocities.jp/ysai187/PS2/ ... taller.htm

When transferring DVD images then I would much rather have USB speeds than 100mbps ethernet speeds (best case PS3 scenario) or much lower (PS2 ethernet, PS2/PS3 disc drives).

I'd much rather push a button and walk away than have to R/I the network adapter all the time, but to each his own

[nmalinoski]

man yall still removing your hard drive to transfer games? oof

try this: http://ichiba.geocities.jp/ysai187/PS2/ ... taller.htm

When transferring DVD images then I would much rather have USB speeds than 100mbps ethernet speeds (best case PS3 scenario) or much lower (PS2 ethernet, PS2/PS3 disc drives).

I'd much rather push a button and walk away than have to R/I the network adapter all the time, but to each his own

Each method has its benefits. If I'm going to be away at work or something, I might use the network to load my games; but if I need to get a bunch of specific games on the hard disk in short order, it's way faster for me to pull the disk and put it in one of my spare PCs (In lieu of me buying a ~$20 SATA->USB dock). Just use what you prefer or need depending on your situation.

[Pikkon]

man yall still removing your hard drive to transfer games? oof

try this: http://ichiba.geocities.jp/ysai187/PS2/ ... taller.htm

What I use is a ethernet wifi adapter and stream games from my pc to my ps2.