My server rack is shocking me! Any electricians here?

[Dochartaigh]

I made a topic about this a while ago, but the problem has crept back up so I wanted to see if there's anything else I can do.

I have a ~7' tall server rack filled with consoles, a 32x32 Extron Crosspoint switcher, tons of different (mostly Extron and TVOne) converters, transcoders, scalers, etc. I get a low level (assume DC) shock if I'm not wearing shoes and touch the metal rack. The metal server rack is on casters/wheels if that matters, with nylon wheels or whatnot.

My house is from 1958, with all original wiring, but a new 200 amp service and fuse box – not a single electrical problem otherwise (and I commonly run like 10x Sony PVM's at once + all this stuff from the same outlet/circuit and have never blown a fuse...central air, 240v electrical stove and dryer, power tools out the wazoo for the renovation work, etc. - everything has been 100% perfect). Every outlet in the entire house has been replaced with the newer 3-prong type (original was 2 prong). BUT, I don't believe any outlet in the entire house is properly grounded - besides being grounded to the outlet electrical boxes themselves - I have confirmed this by using one of those led-light-up electrical outlet testers where I read the code from the 3x LED lights and they say nothing has a ground (I think my kitchen, maybe the bathroom, is the exception for some reason, maybe because they have GFI outlets?).

In my last topic somebody suggested I had an earth leak (which if I understand correctly means not all of the voltage is being grounded leaving some stray voltage???) I did the test for an "earth leak" with my multimeter (from a YouTube video) and it's within a couple volts if my memory serves so that shouldn't be it.

The server rack has 2x industrial/server style CyberPower power strips powering everything on it. The main one is 20amp and uses the special outlet where one prong is turned 90º (I installed this brand new outlet, and it's grounded via a wire to the electrical box which is nailed to a stud). The other power strip is regular 15amp with a regular plug. The 'Ground' light on the main power strip never lights up - just the Power and Surge lights are lit - even though I grounded to the box like I was told you should do in this scenario). I believe my brother ran another 20 amp outlet from the bathroom circuit (which is the room next door, separate fuse breaker and all), and I think (not positive) I've tried this outlet as well so it's not just this individual circuit which does this. I would run an extension cord to the kitchen, where I know those outlets come up as grounded with my tester, but the problem is they don't make 20amp extension cords with that special outlet (with one blade sideways) --unless I build one myself from romex-- so I can't test this.

Is there anything I can try? I've literally pulled a plug at a time (and there's literally ~30 devices total plugged-in) to see if it was any 1 device causing this problem and for the life of me I can't narrow it down - it's like as long as something is plugged in, the server rack itself is energized and carrying a slight current. My house is on a cement slab so it's not like I can drill down through 20"+ of cement and pound in a ground stake and ground the server rack itself or anything (which, fuck, if that's the extent I have to do I'll consider it...).

I have an AC/DC multimeter (like cheap $30 type from Home Depot) so if there's any tests I can run please tell me how (which mode on the multimeter, where to put the + - probes, etc.). Honestly, everything works fine, nothing has burned out or heated up weirdly, I get no weird interference on my BVM's (which can be pretty touchy about power - as are consoles), I'm just tired of getting that little low level shock - it's annoying as hell and I think I'm going to short out something and have a house fire because of it...

[NoAffinity]

You said the rack is "grounded" to the panel, but is the panel confirmed to be grounded? Nailed to a wood (non-conductive) stud doesn't qualify as grounded. You said you tested all outlets, and only the one in the kitchen is confirmed to be grounded. Does that include outlets fed by this panel in question (those outlets are testing as not grounded)? If you've tested outlets fed from this panel that you are attempting to ground the rack to, and there's no ground on those outlets, it could point to the panel also not be grounded. Not completely conclusive, but if you know a ground wire is run from the panel to those outlets and they don't show as being grounded, that's two data points indicating the panel isn't properly grounded (getting shocked, and no ground at outlets which are also assumed to be grounded by this panel).

If you have the ability to take the cover off the panel, you can try to determine if the panel is grounded. The ground wire is typically green. There will often be a bar with white wires, and a single green wire. That green wire will (should) go to another bar with a green wire, and that green wire will disappear into the wall with the other wires (black and white, usually). If you get that far, you can go to whatever is feeding this panel, find the ground there, and continue following it until hopefully you find that it is actually connected to earth somehow. Not sure what was common in the '50's in your area, but a lot of homes have a ufer ground, which on older homes is typically a piece of rebar sticking out of the concrete slab, and the ground will be bonded (connected by a clamp, typically) to it. If you're lucky, there is an access compartment, and its usually in close proximity to the main service panel. Often it's just buried in the wall tho. But, even at the panel that the rack is connected too, if you find that green wire, you can test continuity between it and the panel enclosure. The enclosure should also be grounded. Do that same test at every panel back to the main service panel, and again, hopefully you can find how those green wires are actually connected to earth.

It is unlikely such a small amount of current will trip any breakers, or even the surge protectors, or overload any extension cords. You are probably also not pulling 20A from the rack, so a 15A extension cord to the kitchen confirmed grounded outlet should be fine. Worse case scenario, the extension cord will heat up under full load. If you want to be safe, only turn on half of the racked components at a time, or just feel the cord to make sure it's not getting too warm. Worse worse case scenario, everything except the cord is rated for 20A, you really are pulling almost 20A, the cord heats up too quickly and insulation on the cord melts. Extension cords are fairly inexpensive, make sure it is not in direct contact with anything conductive, on its path to the kitchen. Again, this result is very unlikely.

If there is something confirmed to be grounded in close proximity to the panel which the rack is connected to, you can test continuity between the panel and that confirmed grounded location. If you have continuity, then test between the rack and the panel.

Failing all of this, and not being able to assume the rack and the panel are actually grounded, and you have no grounded location anywhere near the rack, can you drive an anchor bolt into the concrete? Anchor bolt into concrete, #10 insulated wire solidly connected to the anchor bolt, and making direct contact with rack metal (scrape paint if you have to, use a star washer, etc.). It's not code compliant, but should create an effective ground path. You may have some unintended results once that current has somewhere to go. But, you won't be getting shocked any more.

Of course, a visual inspection of all of your wires at the rack might produce the culprit. Any wires feeding your equipment that are frayed, have exposed copper, etc. I'm assuming you've already done this tho. I was getting shocked by a Neo 25 candy cab, when I first bought it. Found one of the coin switch wires dangling with a frayed end, and making intermittent contact with the painted metal shell of the cab, and despite all that, would randomly give me a pretty good wake-up call until I found and fixed it.

[brokenhalo]

Couple of things

If the ground light on your surge protector isn't lit, your outlet isn't grounded. Switching a 2 prong receptacle to a 3 prong receptacle without running a ground line to an actual ground is illegal and potentially very dangerous. Your 1958 wiring is just a hot and a neutral. Nothing was grounded because they didnt know any better back then. Running a small piece of wire from the 3 prong receptacle to the metal receptacle box doesn't do anything as the box isn't grounded. The people that did this are idiots.

Running a line off of the 20amp bathroom circuit is also illegal. That line is supposed to be dedicated for the bathroom.

Easiest way around this is to take the outlets that you need grounded and replace them with gfci receptacles. The newer "smartlock" gfcis have some wizardry inside that will allow them to use the neutral as a "ground" in a fault situation. Gfcis are a little pricy, so just swap out all the receptacles that you are going to plug electronics/surge protectors into. The rest of the ungrounded 3 prong receptacles should be changed back to 2 prong receptacles. If the house is ever sold, the inspector will make you do it.

If your panel was upgraded to 200amps, i'd hope that they would have grounded it properly. There should be a bare copper wire, a little thinner than a pencil, that runs from yout panel box to a ground rod. In most cases, the ground rod is on the exterior of the house, it's an 8' long rod that is pounded into the ground, there will only be a couple of inches sticking up out of the ground. The bare copper wire will be clamped to this.

Was any of this work inspected?

[Dochartaigh]

Thank you both for the extensive replies - I REALLY appreciate it.

The circuit panel was professionally installed, permit and everything, and does have rebar pounded into the earth with a clamp and wire running to the panel.

I used my Sperry outlet tester in the entire house and all outlets came back as “open ground” except the ones in the addition to the house (guessing here, but think from the early 80’s) which come back as “correct” (i.e. grounded I assume). The bathroom, with a GFI outlet (don’t know if it’s GFCI or not), is still run from that old wiring and comes back as open ground - as do the other 2x outlets in the kitchen (only the one, on the new addition side of the wall is “correct”.

Rack is totally free from any visible broken wires - everything is new (old stock) Extron BNC cables, and fresh NEMA 5-15P (computer 3-prong type) power cords for pretty much everything except the old consoles (which most are two prong, original OEM). Weirdly, if I plug the tested into the Belkin 12-outlet power strip (plugged into the same outlet as the server rack, that comes back as “correct” and I assume grounded…which makes no sense to me…but that doesn’t take 20 amp sideways-blade plugs like the server rack uses so can’t plug in there either).

For the outlets, my uncle (who was an electrician ~30 years ago) put in all new 3-prong outlets. I assume that since the wire running to these is original and isn’t grounded, that’s why they all come up as “open ground”. The inspectors passed my house (and my like 3x buddies houses from this same 18,000+ house development - all of which have 3-prong outlets but eveyrthing else original) so I think that’s normal for my county or whatever. And at the least those new outlets let me plug in modern 3 prong plugs instead of using those gray 3-to-2 prong adapters so this is fine by me). I think you only need new proper wiring if you do an addition or a major remodel or something like that (don’t really know to be honest).

I looked up 50’ 20 amp extension cords, and they’re like $90, so I don’t know if that’s something I want to spend money on just to see if using a grounded outlet will fix this problem, and wouldn’t want an extension cord running all the way through my house anyway… It looks like I can however buy a $8 20 amp to 15 amp adapter, then run a cord from the kitchen’s grounded outlet to the server rack and see if that prevents me from getting shocked then go from there. Again, this level of shock is VERY slight - like I sometimes have to lick my wrist and touch it to a bare part of the rack (like a screw holding something in) to even feel it - and need to be bare foot as well.

So are you both pretty positive that using a grounded outlet will fix this? I’ll pickup that adapter and run a regular extension cord and if it works I will see about getting a propetly grounded outlet there. This room backs up to the addition, and we ran all new romex there for the washer (120v) and dryer (240v) - and for the rest of that room as well so that’s where I can tie in for a properly grounded outlet I think (I will let my buddy who wired all this new stuff handle that - I can install an outlet, and switch out a breaker but that’s the extent of my electrical expertise).

Thanks again.

[NoAffinity]

In terms of inspections, current codes, etc, typically if you aren't directly touching something you won't be required to upgrade it. So, the new 200A panel was probably properly grounded, but the permit and inspection didn't technically include anything beyond that panel to be brought up to code. So, like brokenhalo was saying, those 3 prong plugs are operating as 2 prong plugs, but you have the "convenience" of being able to plug a 3 prong plug into them without the benefit of the 3rd prong (ground).

Your rack is becoming energized somehow. Providing a proper ground path (i.e. not you in bare feet ) will give that current a means to get to ground. This is the same reason all those electrical panels should have a green wire connected to the metal enclosure - should the enclosure somehow become energized, the current goes to earth instead of to the next poor soul to come into contact with it. It is an equipment ground. But, as brokenhalo also mentioned, the panels (other than the new 200A) are probably not grounded. Heck, some European countries don't believe in ground anything, or running wire in conduit. That's a whole other discussion, but there's arguments on both sides of the table supporting which is safer - grounded or ungrounded. You can probably see why we believe in grounded here in the US.

[Dochartaigh]

So if the outlets in the addition are coming back as "correct" with my tester, which should mean grounded, then that confirms the fuse box itself is grounded, right? I ordered one of those $8 20-to-15 amp dongles and will test if I get shocked any more when I run a regular extension cord to that, then if it works I'll have the outlet re-wired to the back addition's wiring which is brand new (and that wall is still open to the studs so that's convenient as well - been fixing up this house for 7 years now lol). Does this sound like a good plan?

[brokenhalo]

For the outlets, my uncle (who was an electrician ~30 years ago) put in all new 3-prong outlets. I assume that since the wire running to these is original and isn’t grounded, that’s why they all come up as “open ground”. The inspectors passed my house (and my like 3x buddies houses from this same 18,000+ house development - all of which have 3-prong outlets but eveyrthing else original) so I think that’s normal for my county or whatever. And at the least those new outlets let me plug in modern 3 prong plugs instead of using those gray 3-to-2 prong adapters so this is fine by me). I think you only need new proper wiring if you do an addition or a major remodel or something like that (don’t really know to be honest).

It's "convenient" until something bad happens. Everything metal gets grounded so that if a hot wire comes loose, gets rubbed through, etc., and touches something metal, the path to ground will cause your circuit breaker to trip. Without a ground, whatever the voltage can get to simply becomes energized. Luckily in your case we are talking extremely low voltages off of circuitry. I had a customer who had something very similar to what you have, 3 prong receptacles with no ground, but it was her washer machine that was the culprit. When she leaned her body across the washer machine and hit the on switch, the washer machine body became energized at 120v. It knocked her poor little butt across the room, and just kept running like nothing happened. She had to turn the circuit breaker off to stop the washer. If that outlet was properly grounded, it would have tripped the breaker instantly when she hit the on button.

So please, ask your uncle to help you fix the mess that he created. Swap them back to 2 prongs, the outlets you need grounded should be replaced with GFCis.

The outlets in your addition that you are reading as correct will have grounds run to them. If you were able to run a new circuit for the washer, is it possible to run a new circuit for your gaming stuff? You shouldn't be tapping off of the washer circuit, as that's a dedicated appliance circuit. It's against code to pull off of that, and with the amount of stuff you seem to be running, you'll probably be tripping the breaker running the washer and your gaming stuff (washers a big draw). I'd recommend a 20 amp breaker, 12-2 romex, and a 20amp duplex receptacle. This would clear up all your problems.

[Dochartaigh]

So please, ask your uncle to help you fix the mess that he created. Swap them back to 2 prongs, the outlets you need grounded should be replaced with GFCis.

Thank you for the advice but that simply isn't practical. If I change them back to 2-prong, whenever I needed to plug in something which uses a 3-prong plug, I'm just going to use one of those 3-prong to 2-prong adapters which is the same thing as if I plugged it into a non-grounded 3-prong outlet directly. I'm also not able to get the entire house re-wired so no other option really exists unfortunately.

If you think it's a bad idea to run the game rooms outlet off the same circuit as the washer (I know in that room there was the original wiring, a new 120v line, and a new 240 volt line I think), would I be able to pull the ground ONLY from the new wire we ran to the wash room, and use it for the 20 amp outlet I'm running everything from in the game room? (just looking for the best option here - and don't know how all this works 100%).

[nmalinoski]

If I change them back to 2-prong, whenever I needed to plug in something which uses a 3-prong plug, I'm just going to use one of those 3-prong to 2-prong adapters which is the same thing as if I plugged it into a non-grounded 3-prong outlet directly.

Why would you continue to use grounded devices on ungrounded outlets when you know it's a fire and safety hazard?

I think you have the option of using a 3-prong GCFI outlet in an ungrounded circuit (supposedly can use neutral as ground), but you'll want to verify that with an electrician and maybe have them do the install.

[Dochartaigh]

Why would you continue to use grounded devices on ungrounded outlets when you know it's a fire and safety hazard?ll.

According to what I've read any house built prior to the mid 60's or so (when the code was changed) won't have grounded outlets unless the entire house was re-wired since then (which Google says costs about $8,000-$15,000). That's literally tens upon tens of millions of houses just in the United States alone (with a crapload more people living in those houses). I've never lived (or rented) in a house newer than that time period in fact - it's perfectly normal (my house still has asbestos siding and floors too, FYI - just like millions of others).

If this house is ever totally renovated the wiring will be updated (like we updated it in the laundry room, and the previous owners did in the addition) - until then I'm doing what probably a hundred million people do - live with ungrounded plugs without giving it a second glance (yet I'm posting asking for advice on the best way to go about doing this in regards to my retro video gaming setup - which may be a new line run, going into another existing line, or a GFCI which might just be a bandaid and not help me with the low level current the rack has since I'm understanding it correctly it'll only ground when it shorts out, so I'll still be getting that super low level shock on the server rack --- regardless, before doing anything major will have my electrician chime in).

[Syntax]

You can always go get an earth stake, hammer it into the ground, attatch it to your server rack and see if it fixes the issue.
Stuff redoing the whole house for 1 thing.

Just don't try make toast in the bath hey.

[NoAffinity]

Well, the easiest way, although possibly not easy, would be to pull a insulated #12 or larger from the new 200a ground bus bar, and connect it to the rack or connect it to the nearest 3 prong outlet and properly ground that outlet then plug in the rack there. Or pull some romex with a ground, establish a new 20a circuit in the 200a panel (assuming you have room for another breaker) and install a new single outlet which is properly grounded, in close proximity to the rack.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[nmalinoski]

According to what I've read any house built prior to the mid 60's or so (when the code was changed) won't have grounded outlets unless the entire house was re-wired since then (which Google says costs about $8,000-$15,000).

That's not entirely true; I've lived in a couple houses built in the 1920s that ended up with mixed wiring; one had a handful of these neat triple 2-prong outlets scattered about (I hadn't seen any triple outlets like those before); and, in the other, there were a bunch of two-prong outlets in the kitchen, in one room on the first floor, and in the basement, but everything else was 3-prong grounded.

That's literally tens upon tens of millions of houses just in the United States alone (with a crapload more people living in those houses). I've never lived (or rented) in a house newer than that time period in fact - it's perfectly normal (my house still has asbestos siding and floors too, FYI - just like millions of others).

Thank you for the advice but that simply isn't practical. If I change them back to 2-prong, whenever I needed to plug in something which uses a 3-prong plug, I'm just going to use one of those 3-prong to 2-prong adapters which is the same thing as if I plugged it into a non-grounded 3-prong outlet directly.

Correct. It's not uncommon for millions of houses in the US to have ungrounded outlets; what is uncommon, however, is 3-prong, non-GCFI outlets being installed with no ground, because that's a code violation and a fire hazard.

I am not an electrician (IANAE?), but NEC 250.130(C) only allows for replacement of non-grounding outlets with grounding outlets if a grounding conductor is installed, and 406.4(D)(2) only allows for replacement of non-grounding outlets with another non-grounding outlet or a GFCI outlet specifically labeled as having no equipment ground.

Assuming the junction boxes are not grounded (based on the description of the age of your house), those 3-prong outlets should never have been installed in the first place (and if they are, why weren't they connected?), and you should not use those 3-prong adapters until you've verified that the junction box you're using them on is actually grounded.

So yes, please talk to your electrician to address your house's wiring and options for 3-prong devices/appliances before something actually does happen. No one needs to lose anything, especially their gaming collection (retro or otherwise), because of something stupid like this.

[Dochartaigh]

Stuff redoing the whole house for 1 thing.

Serial. That's not even in the realm of being realistic to rewire the entire house - I'm just trying to make this one single outlet – the only one which has given me even a single problem in 7+ years of living there, into the proper type since I have all this expensive stuff plugged into it (and eliminating the static-shock type tingle when barefoot would be great

Well, the easiest way, although possibly not easy, would be to pull a insulated #12 or larger from the new 200a ground bus bar, and connect it to the rack or connect it to the nearest 3 prong outlet and properly ground that outlet then plug in the rack there.

The new wiring to the laundry room does have a ground wire - that's literally on the opposite side of the gaming room, with the drywall still open. When we finish putting in outlets in the laundry room (which are properly grounded with new romex wire and new fuse and everything), can I steal a ground from one of those outlets and run it to the non-grounded 20 amp plug in the gameroom? I have a call into my cousin's cousin, a certified electrician to go over options as well - but he works like 80 hours a week and sucks to get a hold of.

I am not an electrician (IANAE?), but NEC 250.130(C) only allows for replacement of non-grounding outlets with grounding outlets if a grounding conductor is installed, and 406.4(D)(2) only allows for replacement of non-grounding outlets with another non-grounding outlet or a GFCI outlet specifically labeled as having no equipment ground.

I'm not an electrician either, just know my buddy just bought his house, was inspected (and passed) twice by certified people to get his mortgage, and when I tested all his downstairs 3 prong outlets they came back exactly the same (ungrounded) as mine, except for his kitchen. I'm honestly not worrying about it. Like I said, I would just be using the 3-prong to 2-prong adapters if it didn't have those 3-prong outlets like I have now....so you tell me what difference there is in doing that - there is none in all practicality. I could care less about code when I'm using the outlets the same way as millions of other people do (do you really think people will run an extension cord to a grounded outlet if they need to plug something with 3 prongs in? Or run a new wire through the walls to get a ground to plug that 3-prong device in? No. They use a friggin 3-to-2 prong adapter just like everybody else...so zero difference if my outlets happen to be 3-prong to bypass that adapter. If I have to spend $0.98/each + 10 minutes to switch back in 2-prong outlets when I sell the house (in like ~20 years), whatever - not a problem. Just trying to come up with the best solution for this SINGLE outlet right now (not get into discussions about my entire houses wiring and electrical code....come on now! that's simply too much!).

[NoAffinity]

The new wiring to the laundry room does have a ground wire - that's literally on the opposite side of the gaming room, with the drywall still open. When we finish putting in outlets in the laundry room (which are properly grounded with new romex wire and new fuse and everything), can I steal a ground from one of those outlets and run it to the non-grounded 20 amp plug in the gameroom? I have a call into my cousin's cousin, a certified electrician to go over options as well - but he works like 80 hours a week and sucks to get a hold of.

Yes, just pull a ground wire to the outlet that you want to add grounding to. There's a ground point on the receptacle (will be continuous with the 3rd prong hole), connect the ground there. If the outlet box is metal, connect it to the box as well. If box is plastic, no need to ground it.

[Dochartaigh]

Yes, just pull a ground wire to the outlet that you want to add grounding to. There's a ground point on the receptacle (will be continuous with the 3rd prong hole), connect the ground there. If the outlet box is metal, connect it to the box as well. If box is plastic, no need to ground it.

Great! Thanks for the info - I will definitely do that.

[NJRoadfan]

Disclaimer: Not an electrician, but have dealt with old houses and questionable wiring practices.

In most cases, people got away with replacing a 2-prong outlet with a 3-prong grounded outlet and grounding to the metal box, but only if armored ("BX") cable was used to run the wiring to begin with. Even then it has to have a thin metal tracer wire in it (most don't). It should be noted that this practice has since been banned by the NEC, mostly because if the armored cable gets damaged, it becomes a serious safety hazard when something shorts to "ground".

Another source of electrical leakage current is a possible floating neutral, a very serious safety hazard as appliances start using random grounds as a return path instead of the neutral line back to the panel and service in the street. Somewhat related, some lazy re-modelers will "bootleg ground" 3 prong outlets by connecting the ground lug to the neutral..... DO NOT DO THIS (those cheapo outlet testers won't even detect this as a problem). Your house already has several safety hazards (ungrounded outlets, etc), call a real electrician and get it fixed. Its money well spent and chances are there are other dodgy problems in the house that you don't even know about.