Extron RGB-118 with Pandora's Box & arcade monitor

[maxchila]

Picked up a Pandora's box for my arcade cab but the image can't be centered with the monitor's adjustments (similar issue seen in this post: viewtopic.php?t=58796)

I decided to pick up an RGB-118 off eBay to help with the issue, but I'm having trouble getting it to work correctly.

Basically I'm taking the RGBS out of the PB, into the Extron (sync just to horizontal pin on DB9), then into the monitor. I get a picture but the colors are funky (greens are yellows, darker picture overall). I noticed with I disconnect the incoming sync on the Extron's DB9 colors look correct on the monitor, but of course sync is out of whack. I also noticed that every time I disconnect and reconnect incoming sync on the Extron I hear what sounds like a relay activating, and when ever that relay activates the color issue appears. Nothing in the manual mentions the sound or mode.

My guess is the signal coming from the PB is too strong for the Extron, and it's causing it to go into this funky state so it doesn't get overloaded. Does anyone have a recommendation? Should I installed resistors on all RGBS inputs on the Extron, and if so what value should I be shooting for?

[orange808]

Open the case and check the status of the dipswitches inside.

Manual here:
https://www.extron.com/download/files/u ... es-man.pdf

I'm not familiar with the output of the Pandora's Box, but you also may need to mind the bandwidth limitations of the 118 as well.

[Gara]

Sorry, I know nothing about this issue. I'm not thread crapping. I am genuinely curious what makes theses units so attractive to so many buyers

Do you mind explaining what appealed to you on one of these boxes? I see then talked about all the time but usually with a very blah response. Something cheap for the kids.

Is it just the plug and play aspect that appealed to you? You're ahead of the pack even knowing what extron is. Why go this route over a groovymame or some such. Or even a pi. A tower from a yard sale or flea market makes a great (if ugly) mame machine.is building your own seen as such a daunting task or is it more to do with the increased cost?

I hope you find a solution. It's a weird device but it does have a lot of good games.

[maxchila]

Open the case and check the status of the dipswitches inside.

Manual here:
https://www.extron.com/download/files/u ... es-man.pdf

I'm not familiar with the output of the Pandora's Box, but you also may need to mind the bandwidth limitations of the 118 as well.

The Pandora's Box is a JAMMA version, using the video output on the JAMMA connector into the Extron. The Pandora's box is similar to this one: https://www.highscoresaves.com/999-in-1 ... a-pcb.html

I've experimented with the DIP switches but didn't help with the issue, here's what they're currently set at:

SW3 - Normal
SW4 - Normal
SW5 - Normal

I'm currently connecting the PCB to the Extron via the analog connection input shown in the manual, I didn't think the digital input option applied. Sync is hooked up to pin 9 (horizontal). Tried attaching the vertical sync pin but didn't have a positive effect.

What bandwidth limitations are there on the Extron unit?

Thanks for your help!

[maxchila]

Sorry, I know nothing about this issue. I'm not thread crapping. I am genuinely curious what makes theses units so attractive to so many buyers

Do you mind explaining what appealed to you on one of these boxes? I see then talked about all the time but usually with a very blah response. Something cheap for the kids.

Is it just the plug and play aspect that appealed to you? You're ahead of the pack even knowing what extron is. Why go this route over a groovymame or some such. Or even a pi. A tower from a yard sale or flea market makes a great (if ugly) mame machine.is building your own seen as such a daunting task or is it more to do with the increased cost?

I hope you find a solution. It's a weird device but it does have a lot of good games.

In this case I'm not too interested in the Pandora's Box at all! I have a cabinet that a guy at work really wanted, but wasn't into the idea of being a PCB collector like myself. So he wanted the cab with a Pandora's Box. He agreed to purchase the cab once the PB unit was up and running in it. I thought it would be a piece of cake getting it working

From my point of view the plug-n-play aspect seems the most appealing (especially for a cab), and they're cheap & simple (in theory), but overall I'm not a fan. If I want to emulate a game I'll do it on my computer. A cab is not for emulation in my book.

[Syntax]

You can always cut the yolk wires and add an inline resistor to delay/move the picture.
Can get more horizontal out of turning the h coil too.

[maxchila]

You can always cut the yolk wires and add an inline resistor to delay/move the picture.
Can get more horizontal out of turning the h coil too.

I experimented with the horizontal coil, the one that's on the board doesn't have a ferrite core on it that's adjustable (missing completely ). I removed the ferrite core from a WG board I have and placed it in the coil to see what kind of affect it had and all I got was the image becoming smaller, not moving farther across the screen like I need.

For the yolk wires, is there a specific one I should be targeting?

Thank you!

[Syntax]

https://youtu.be/MmiBhLUkKEM

The whole video is a good lesson but what you want is towards the end.

[orange808]

The dipswitches look right.

Does the 118 work with other sources? By now, most RGB 118 and 118+ probably have a lot of hours on them. It could be a bad unit.

There's also the possibility that the Pandora's Box isn't outputting a properly attenuated signal.

------

Also...

The Pandora's Box you linked claims to output 800x600 over JAMMA at 60.02Hz?

Is that really true?

What kind of video output signals are you seeing? Does it really convert everything to SVGA@60.02Hz?

Will your monitor even accept the signal the Pandora's Box outputs? I assume it does, but I'm curious.

As for bandwidth, the 118 tops out at 120MHz. Newer Extron RGB boxes do twice that, but 120MHz is plenty for retro gear. SVGA needs about 58MHz, so that wouldn't an issue. 720p or 1080p wouldn't work, though.

Edit: I looked at the manual and I see that it has an option for 15Hz output. I'm still curious. What does it output?

[maxchila]

https://youtu.be/MmiBhLUkKEM

The whole video is a good lesson but what you want is towards the end.

Awesome video - I saw the part you were talking about. What I have a hard time trying to find info on is moving the entire picture (horizontal position) vs. adjusting the width of the picture (which is what adjusting the width coil will give me).

[Syntax]

It's been awhile but doesnt he add a low value resistor to a yolk wire to change position?

[maxchila]

The dipswitches look right.

Does the 118 work with other sources? By now, most RGB 118 and 118+ probably have a lot of hours on them. It could be a bad unit.

There's also the possibility that the Pandora's Box isn't outputting a properly attenuated signal.

------

Also...

The Pandora's Box you linked claims to output 800x600 over JAMMA at 60.02Hz?

Is that really true?

What kind of video output signals are you seeing? Does it really convert everything to SVGA@60.02Hz?

Will your monitor even accept the signal the Pandora's Box outputs? I assume it does, but I'm curious.

As for bandwidth, the 118 tops out at 120MHz. Newer Extron RGB boxes do twice that, but 120MHz is plenty for retro gear. SVGA needs about 58MHz, so that wouldn't an issue. 720p or 1080p wouldn't work, though.

Edit: I looked at the manual and I see that it has an option for 15Hz output. I'm still curious. What does it output?

I haven't tested it with another source, should I try another PCB (I have it in my head that the Extron doesn't like JAMMA as a video source)? Sounds like I shouldn't assume the Extron is operating correctly, what would be another simple source I can throw at it?

The PB outputs 800x600 via it's VGA connector, via the JAMMA connector it's outputs CGA, 15Hz output (seeing that on the LCD of the 118 also when hooked up to the PB)

The monitor in the cab is an old-ball model: ALGOL CR-M-19VH

More info on the monitor can be found here: https://forums.arcade-museum.com/showth ... p?t=224185

The PB outputs great to the monitor when connected directly to it other than the horizontal position issue (HPOS pot is turned all the way up on the monitor). When the Extron is in the mix I can adjust the horizontal position perfectly using the adjustment knob on the Extron, but the colors are funky of course .

[maxchila]

It's been awhile but doesnt he add a low value resistor to a yolk wire to change position?

He talks about adding a resistor to the yellow wire, which according to him adjusts the height of the monitor. The monitor normally was vertical, so this might actually help?

[Syntax]

I hope so, Sorry I could not give any more advice on the matter.

[maxchila]

I hope so, Sorry I could not give any more advice on the matter.

I'll try it and report back.