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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 8:21 pm 



Joined: 02 Sep 2014
Posts: 11
SavagePencil wrote:
Does the pinout of the connector deal with joystick inputs at all? Could a pin be getting shorted when you're connecting?


not sure, that is why I am surprised that it behaves that way. For what its worth, the system is functioning fine when I detached the SSDS3 unit.
I have the original PSU as well. I guess I can track down an aftermarket PSU.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2018 9:30 pm 


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total shot in the dark: didn't the SGX have a PCE/SGX switch toggle on the system? Can't really remember what it's for, but wasn't this intended to solve some compatibility issues ? Did you try both positions ?


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Sat May 19, 2018 4:41 am 



Joined: 02 Sep 2014
Posts: 11
Fudoh wrote:
total shot in the dark: didn't the SGX have a PCE/SGX switch toggle on the system? Can't really remember what it's for, but wasn't this intended to solve some compatibility issues ? Did you try both positions ?


I did, no difference.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2018 2:50 pm 



Joined: 24 Dec 2017
Posts: 18
replacement Program for V1 boards is up:

https://forums.terraonion.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=78


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 9:11 am 



Joined: 23 Oct 2014
Posts: 14
Anyone get to test the latest (beta) firmware on these units?
Details were on their forum...


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 11:00 am 


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Got in my SSDS3 and it has worked beautifully on my Super Grafx. I'm in the process of filling a 200GB microSD card with the game library in order to do testing and OSSC profiles. I've also ordered the usual RGB bypass gear as I only intend to use the SSDS3's output for sound. I'll post how everything goes after that. For now, here's a screengrab I did of preliminary work on Rondo of Blood through the SSDS3:

Image
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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 11:32 am 


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@FBX: what's your impression on the RGB output quality taken directly from the unit ?


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 12:34 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
@FBX: what's your impression on the RGB output quality taken directly from the unit ?


Well I need to do the cap replacement to fix jail bars, as obviously that's contributing to noise in the RGB ouput, but I've found the noise gets much worse on the wider resolution games. Also I'm sort of 'winging it' by using an HD Retrovision cable that wasn't designed for the Super Grafx, which might even be amplifying background noise as a result. With that said, you can get a pretty good idea of how bad it gets on Daimakaimura with this stock output screenshot I did:

Spoiler: show
Image
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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 12:41 pm 


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Id settle for anything close to those images.

The diagonal interference in my white PCE SSDS3 combo is unbearable to look at in the SSDS3 menu even.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 1:27 pm 



Joined: 18 Jul 2014
Posts: 11
Ooooff. Bob just laid into Terraonion and the SSD System 3 ..... (15.09)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=529JITQMTHY


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 2:00 pm 



Joined: 11 Nov 2013
Posts: 113
Rogue_element wrote:
Ooooff. Bob just laid into Terraonion and the SSD System 3 ..... (15.09)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=529JITQMTHY


This doesn’t advance the conversation or get us closer to a functional board.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 2:09 pm 



Joined: 25 Jun 2016
Posts: 246
SavagePencil wrote:
Rogue_element wrote:
Ooooff. Bob just laid into Terraonion and the SSD System 3 ..... (15.09)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=529JITQMTHY


This doesn’t advance the conversation or get us closer to a functional board.


Neosd has stated they won't be doing a third revision so calling them out on their bs can only help get us closer to a functional final board because if their heads are so far up their asses they think their current behavior is ok hopefully the public calling them out will wake them up. "Quality can't be measured" human stupidity is the only thing that can't be measured and it gets proven time and time again.

At this point I'd rather just wait a few years and pray Kevtris gets around to a turbo cd instead of giving this company any kind of support. The only thing that would change my mind is if they made a heartfelt apology for the way they have acted and actually released a finished board (IF they do it at all it probably wont be until after Voultar tells them how to do it properly).


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 3:30 pm 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
Posts: 569
SavagePencil wrote:
This doesn’t advance the conversation or get us closer to a functional board.


Just wanted to ask in a friendly way if you even watched that section of the video all the way through? Bob pointed out specifically how TerraOnion has said (multiple times in fact) that they're NOT willing to make another revised version of their product. They have ZERO interest in fixing the RGB output on it (the newer, 'fixed-but-not-fixed' V2 I'm talking about). I.e. it will never be fixed. Will never be fully functional to the standards we expect of ALL products like this (especially ~$300 USD ones). He even goes into how Voultar said that it's just not feasible (even for more advanced modders) to fix the problems with it (he was talking about the V1 SSDS3's video, but all they did different in the V2 was to separate the ground planes I believe, so the same still basically holds true....audio is a separate problem btw which may, or may not, be fixed through firmware).

He also goes into detail about how TerraOnion has treated people in the past (or, through their choice of mediums, let other people treat their customers if I'm to be more precise - which is still on their shoulders) - all of what he said is 110% correct if you've been following this. So like Wolf_ just said, I also don't see any other possible way to get them to change their behavior besides pressure from the public based on how they've acted isn't right.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 3:39 pm 



Joined: 11 Nov 2013
Posts: 113
I did watch the video. I felt Bob made good points. I am someone who has been actively pointing out issues with the audio. I have the beta firmware and it still does not address the SD access buzz or the low-level hum that doesn't exist on a vanilla system.

By posting a link to the video here and then resurrecting that they treated people like shit just stirs up the drama further. The mods here already removed a ton of drama-related flame wars and we're just going over it over and over again.

EDIT: Put another way, what is it you hope to achieve by continuing to bitch about them?


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 5:47 pm 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
Posts: 569
SavagePencil wrote:
I did watch the video. I felt Bob made good points. I am someone who has been actively pointing out issues with the audio. I have the beta firmware and it still does not address the SD access buzz or the low-level hum that doesn't exist on a vanilla system.

By posting a link to the video here and then resurrecting that they treated people like shit just stirs up the drama further. The mods here already removed a ton of drama-related flame wars and we're just going over it over and over again.

EDIT: Put another way, what is it you hope to achieve by continuing to bitch about them?


I want what everybody wants: a solution to the problem.

Posts about the problems (as long as they're civil) should also not be removed in this topic. We don't want that to turn into banning people with dissenting opinions like some other forum... I see those posts as having value and can serve two purposes: to let people considering this product know there's still some issues with the newest version (AND that some of those issues the developer doesn't care about and has explicitly said they will NOT fix 'til hell freezes over), and also to voice our opinion (which the developer may or may not care about) that some of their customers are still having problems, are still not happy about it, and are still looking to them for a resolution to these problems with their product (no matter how realistic or non-realistic that expectation is, it's still a valid opinion).

Also "continuing to bitch" isn't exactly accurate as I don't think I've ever said a single negative word before (honestly, more-so because I didn't want to get banned from NeoGeo forums which is where I was following this product). Closest I ever got to negative was to tell the T.O. team (on their forum when it first opened) that they should really stop telling people it's the cables or their PCE system causing the audio noise when it's clearly their product itself.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 5:57 pm 



Joined: 11 Nov 2013
Posts: 113
That's fair. That's different than "oh shit Bob laid the SMACK DOWN on Terra Onion!" that prompted my initial response.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 6:37 pm 



Joined: 18 Jul 2014
Posts: 11
SavagePencil wrote:
That's fair. That's different than "oh shit Bob laid the SMACK DOWN on Terra Onion!" that prompted my initial response.


Did I actually say that ? - no . Try not to misquote me. I was merely posting, in a thread about the SSD System 3, something about the SSD System 3. I have one, and I'm more than happy with it, despite its "issues". I was under the impression that the SHMUPS forums are actually forums, where people can 'discuss' the topic on hand, without someone getting their panties in a twist at the slightest thing. This wasnt a drive by shitpost, i was just highlighting what Bob had said - some may agree with him, some may not. Don't shoot the messenger.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 9:50 pm 



Joined: 11 Nov 2013
Posts: 113
Rogue_element wrote:
SavagePencil wrote:
That's fair. That's different than "oh shit Bob laid the SMACK DOWN on Terra Onion!" that prompted my initial response.


Did I actually say that ? - no . Try not to misquote me. I was merely posting, in a thread about the SSD System 3, something about the SSD System 3. I have one, and I'm more than happy with it, despite its "issues". I was under the impression that the SHMUPS forums are actually forums, where people can 'discuss' the topic on hand, without someone getting their panties in a twist at the slightest thing. This wasnt a drive by shitpost, i was just highlighting what Bob had said - some may agree with him, some may not. Don't shoot the messenger.


"Ooooff. Bob just laid into Terraonion and the SSD System 3 ..... (15.09)"

OK. I'm done here.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 2:18 am 


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Posts: 434
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If it wasn't for people "bitching about the issues" and Bob's video then I personally wouldn't have known and probably would have bought one. Now I don't want to support the company.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 3:05 am 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
Posts: 569
DoomsDave wrote:
If it wasn't for people "bitching about the issues" and Bob's video then I personally wouldn't have known and probably would have bought one. Now I don't want to support the company.


I bought one because they were good enough to admit that their initial V1 had RGB output problems, and on their own accord they ate that (probably pretty giant) cost and revised their board and promised to exchange the V1 to a V2 free of charge. So that was VERY nice of them to do, and made me think the company really did care about their customers...it's just that since then they're been a bit, how do I say? lacking? in their ability to admit their product still has issues.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 5:15 pm 


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DoomsDave wrote:
If it wasn't for people "bitching about the issues" and Bob's video then I personally wouldn't have known and probably would have bought one. Now I don't want to support the company.


I bought one because there's nothing else on the market that comes close. I've just finished pulling the ENTIRE ISO and HuCard set for both Japan and US and put them in the SSDS3 on my Super Grafx. Boom! Entire NEC library in one self-contained system. Once I get the RGB bypass parts in the mail, I'll be happy because quite honestly the sound isn't that bad at least on my end.
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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 5:26 pm 



Joined: 11 Nov 2013
Posts: 113
The big issue for me is still the sound. It was brought up on the official forums, and there *may* be a way forward:

For non-original (white) PCEs, which lack the bus pins, it's possible to get audio routed back to the system itself. This would require a software change in the SSDS3 to mix the stereo to mono (which happens inside a stock device anyway). Then it would require a hardware change to open up a bridge back to the mono pin. Then the audio and video would come out of the console's A/V port.

Whether this would reduce the constant hum or the SD access interference is still up in the air.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 8:37 pm 


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I'm just not getting any disturbing hum on my end. There's a 'little' bit of noise in silent parts, but the stereo CD music sounds fantastic. /shrug.
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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 8:50 pm 



Joined: 11 Nov 2013
Posts: 113
I feel like I have the attention to detail around audio that you have for your video scaler profiles.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 9:48 pm 


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I was planning on buying one too but the audio issues are not good. I can't stand audio interference.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 1:28 am 


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Guys as far as hum goes I can guarantee you the SSDS3 does not introduce more noise than a stock setup.
It does have loud SD card read noise which I'm sure can be fixed with a small hardware mod.

I had bad hum so i got stuck into my pce last night and found my awesome seperate 3.5mm stereo jack I was using had a loose ground.

In fact after ensuring all connections were perfect I noticed the sound to be really nice and loud compared to the stock volume.

I'm now in the process of fitting an internal mod but finding some annoying issues.

*Using any of the grounds on the expansion causes jailbars.
*Using ground from certain parts of the board causes sync dropout.
*Ground near the RF block causes massive interference.
*Best place to ground seems to be the switch corner of the board or the controller sheild.
*Board placement can cause jailbars.

I've done the full recap and added a 4.7ohm cap to each rail but still getting slight jailbars on the dark greens and greys. Adding more capacitance to the rails changes nothing.

I'm waiting on some 2 way headers to arrive so I can properly isolate the SSDS3 and have a play at removing that diagonal noise. I know unbuffered composite BEFORE the SSDS3 shows none of this noise but RGB all have it present.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 12:50 pm 


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Okay did some new testing today with the headphones and this time I could definitely hear a sort of 60-cycle 'buzz' in the CD audio from the SSDS3.

Aside from that, I did the cap fix for jail bars and noted a definite improvement. Take a look at the whites in the before and after pics:


Spoiler: show
Image


Spoiler: show
Image


The whites are now clean, though I'm still waiting on the DIN-8 socket to arrive in the mail so I can do Voultar's RGB bypass board mod.

Also I finished downloading the full set of US and Japanese ISOs and HuCards, and it ended up being a little over 200GB, so you will need a 256GB microSD card if you want the entire collection self-contained.
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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 4:07 pm 


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They should change the acronym to DIY3.
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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:07 pm 



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Posts: 10
I got mine (v2) earlier last month, tested it for about an hour and put it away in the closet. But note that I'm not selling it. This thing has a role to play some day but it's not to replace a good CD-ROM2 setup. It was an unnecessary purchase for me, but not entirely useless. I approach my review from the perspective of this simple question: Would I be better off if I replace my real optical drive with this ODE?

I'm definitely going to just keep playing on my briefcase, which just looks and sounds better, although the SSDS3 looks great and sounds fine.

In terms of the visual problems people have reported, I think it's possible to see none with the "right" setup. I saw no noise whatsoever (even that diagonal noise that so many people seem to get) using both an RGB modded IFU-30 and an RGB modded white PCE. Trust me, I looked for it. It may be because I only tested on a CRT (BVM). The visual noise may be a problem on flat panels + certain upscalers and cables. That said, my modded consoles still output a noticeably sharper and more vibrant image. The SSDS3 looks darker and a little washed out in comparison, but in itself still looks pretty good. Using a retro-access c-sync shielded cable may have helped (I don't see the need for coax if the cable is not long).

Now the sound is the bigger deal breaker for me, and not because of the buzz, which I did not really notice--rather, it did not buzz noticeably more than the actual console when reading discs. A good shielded cable may help here too. I'm also using an a-9010 onkyo amplifier, which should help me pick out audio noise problems. I did not test with headphones though, only floor loudspeakers. The sound is pretty good, but in a direct comparison with the sound from a real CD-ROM2 unit I can definitely tell something is different. Better or worse? Probably depends on taste, as usual when it comes to audio, but to me the fact that it's different is a problem psychologically, since I know it's a deviation from what it's "supposed" to sound like on a real optical drive.

The difference may be due to the clipping that people found, and the proposed solution is to adjust the CD audio level on the new firmware. This is not a good solution at all though. First, what will be the "right" CD audio level? Will you be able to find a sweet spot and never touch it again for any game, or will you need to fiddle with it for different games? I hate to deal with this kind of situation and the second-guessing that it leads to (a big reason why I'd never replace a real Famicom with an NT mini, or play Famicom expansion audio games on a flash cart). Plus, who knows if it will be possible to also adjust the CD audio level in a way that is balanced with non-CD audio like sound effects.

Now, why keep this SSDS3 around then? For me, if you have the money to spare, it's a convenient tool to back up game saves in combination with a Ten no Koe card. That's about it. You can do the same thing with that Japanese HDMI 720p "UpperGrafx" optical drive emulator (yes, the SSDS3 is not the only one), but that thing manages to be even harder to buy and more expensive, and has its own flaws too from what I can gather.

Another reason is to actually use it to play games in the future when I decide to actually sell off my CD collection. The shorter load times will be nice, though PCE CD loading is really fast IMO if your unit and discs are in good shape. Assuming no better ODE is available by then. If so will probably be able to sell it and get some money back for it.


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 Post subject: Re: Super SD System 3
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:59 pm 



Joined: 13 Jan 2018
Posts: 52
Sounds about right. It's annoying that we have to accept a lesser experience with such an expensive product.

Just how busy are they over there? Their store page still links to the old forums. At this point they should just update the page with a warning their ODE isn't faithful to the original hardware. It feels like we are no closer to a solution or even an indication on if it can be fixed.

If true replication isn't the priority I may as well be playing the games on an emulator. I have mixed feelings on the value of this thing. I enjoy having easy access to the entire library but it sits mostly unused as I wait for an audio fix. I at least don't notice the video problems on my setup.


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