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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 12:54 am 


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Joined: 18 Sep 2010
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aaronmjr wrote:
Can you post pictures of what you;re talking about?


Sure, I’ll do that whenever I get around to taking a closer look at the monitor, which should be in the next week or so.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 2:36 pm 


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So finding information about video wall processors has been a journey and a half. I started digging into them back in 2016 with a phone call to an AV place whose sticker was on the side of one of my monitors. He gave me some names of some companies that made them, and from there I found what I could. After a few dead ends with software that is nowhere to be found to configure old devices, and experts on certain devices having retired years ago and not wanting to be bothered there was a lot of trial and error and reading of manuals. But here we are finally. Haha. Mariokart 64 where everyone gets their own monitor. This is via composite, but I have some s-video breakout cables in the mail and I'll take some new pics once I have them installed. This device DOES accept/output RGBHV, but unfortunately will only display 240p/480i via composite or y/c. Through all of my research I haven't found a device that accepts those resolutions via RGBS. I have some videos of fractals and other things running on this with my old setup (a Vector video wall processor) if anyone is interested.

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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 6:07 pm 


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That is insane Mariokart setup

On another note I wouldn't mind having an XM-29 Plus/XP-29 Plus. I've got a PVM-20L5 for trade, so if someone is interested hit me up.
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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 8:37 am 



Joined: 04 May 2014
Posts: 200
Location: germany
aaronmjr wrote:
So finding information about video wall processors has been a journey and a half. I started digging into them back in 2016 with a phone call to an AV place whose sticker was on the side of one of my monitors. He gave me some names of some companies that made them, and from there I found what I could. After a few dead ends with software that is nowhere to be found to configure old devices, and experts on certain devices having retired years ago and not wanting to be bothered there was a lot of trial and error and reading of manuals. But here we are finally. Haha. Mariokart 64 where everyone gets their own monitor. This is via composite, but I have some s-video breakout cables in the mail and I'll take some new pics once I have them installed. This device DOES accept/output RGBHV, but unfortunately will only display 240p/480i via composite or y/c. Through all of my research I haven't found a device that accepts those resolutions via RGBS. I have some videos of fractals and other things running on this with my old setup (a Vector video wall processor) if anyone is interested.

Image
Image
Image
Image


Nice setup but show us the M3 now :)


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 11:29 am 



Joined: 07 May 2020
Posts: 3
are there any resources to collect such a "from and to"?


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 4:29 pm 


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svensonson wrote:
Nice setup but show us the M3 now :)


Haha. I promise you'd be disappointed. I blew the engine years ago and have been working on it little by little, but it's nothing to look at.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2020 7:37 am 


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aaronmjr wrote:
Can you post pictures of what you're talking about?


That videowall setup is pretty cool. I remember they used to have something like this at Best Buy in the 90s, it was usually playing Super Mario 64. I always thought that was really cool. Stuff like that was partly what made me want to get a monitor like this in the first place. My N64 is RGB-modded; playing Super Mario 64 or Mario Kart 64 in RGB on the XV29 is pretty awesome.

Here's a picture of the residue I was talking about. This is before I cleaned it. I had to break off some of the plastic to access it.

Image


Here's what it looked like after I cleaned it with some alcohol.

Image

The alcohol cleaned away the residue pretty well, and all of the solder connections look pretty good now. Unfortunately, doing this didn't solve the issue, because it still came back. It occurred to me that the other areas might need to be cleaned too, but I'm now thinking not - because I have a new idea about what causes the issue. I already observed before that physically moving the monitor will sometimes make the problem go away, but considering that other things seem to influence it too, I wasn't sure what to make of this. Now, I've observed that moving the monitor can not only eliminate the issue, it can also make it appear when it's working normally. Now that I know this, based on things I've read about CRTs, this is a very likely sign that something inside the monitor is loose. I read something that suggested that things like the board on the deflection yoke and the power supply are good places to look for something like this. So I'm going to do some more tests to try to at least locate the source of the problem. If I can find the source, then I need to find a way to fix whatever's wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2020 12:47 pm 


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That just looks like solder flux residue to me. Definitely not the cause of your issue.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2020 1:32 pm 


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I did notice that after cleaning the residue, the image seemed noticeable brighter than usual. I’ve also noticed that fluctuations in brightness often happen before the problem appears. I just cleaned out a little piece of debris (I don’t know what it is) and now the image seems even brighter. I can’t say for sure if this is just a coincidence or not though; the brightness seems to vary a lot at seemingly random times. For now I’m going to do more testing to see if what I just did eliminated the issue.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 9:43 am 


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Well, I've tried some more things and it had no effect on the issue. I think I'm about ready to give up on this monitor; I've already wasted so much time on it, it doesn't seem worth it to continue. I'm not sure that even a professional would be able to fix it. The problem also seems to have gotten worse, to the point that it makes the monitor basically unusable. I would buy another one, but I haven't been able to find any more for sale. Does anyone (in the US) have an XM/XV/XP29/29 Plus for sale? I'm only interested in the 29" models. Barring that, I think I'm just going to go back to the dual 20" RGB monitor setup I was using before. I'll have to rearrange my setup a little, but it seems to me like this is the only logical option left at this point. I'm tired of not being able to play all of my games; if I set up the former 2 monitors, then I'll be able to play all of my systems again.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 1:36 pm 


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A professional can fix it. There's more to repairing electronics than cleaning off boards :wink: And all of these monitors are pushing 25 years old and will develop problems eventually. Better to have yours fixed than buy another one. Cheaper probably too. Where are you located?


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 3:20 pm 



Joined: 30 Jul 2017
Posts: 80
aaronmjr wrote:
cut
Image


I didn't think Mario cart would be this cool with 4 monitors!! Need to find myself 2 more NEC's! :roll: :D


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 3:19 am 


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aaronmjr wrote:
A professional can fix it. There's more to repairing electronics than cleaning off boards :wink: And all of these monitors are pushing 25 years old and will develop problems eventually. Better to have yours fixed than buy another one. Cheaper probably too. Where are you located?


That’s great, but there’s no one anywhere near me who can do this. I live in the southeastern US.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2020 8:41 pm 


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lalilulelo wrote:
aaronmjr wrote:
A professional can fix it. There's more to repairing electronics than cleaning off boards :wink: And all of these monitors are pushing 25 years old and will develop problems eventually. Better to have yours fixed than buy another one. Cheaper probably too. Where are you located?


That’s great, but there’s no one anywhere near me who can do this. I live in the southeastern US.


Are you sure? If you're on facebook, you should join "The CRT Collective" and ask if anyone has experience with repair shops in your area. They still exist.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2020 6:17 am 


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aaronmjr wrote:
Are you sure? If you're on facebook, you should join "The CRT Collective" and ask if anyone has experience with repair shops in your area. They still exist.


I'm pretty sure there's no one in the town I live currently who can repair the monitor. So I'd probably have to travel somewhere with it, which I really don't want to do. I'm thinking it wouldn't be a bad idea to have another monitor, even if I eventually get this one fixed. That way, I'd have a spare in case either of them have more problems later on. You have at least 4 of them, right?

Right now, I really just want a working monitor. I've done everything I can do with the monitor myself, and trying to get someone else to do it would be a huge pain in the ass. I want a monitor I can use now; I can worry about getting this one fixed later on.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2020 12:20 pm 


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lalilulelo wrote:
aaronmjr wrote:
Are you sure? If you're on facebook, you should join "The CRT Collective" and ask if anyone has experience with repair shops in your area. They still exist.


I'm pretty sure there's no one in the town I live currently who can repair the monitor. So I'd probably have to travel somewhere with it, which I really don't want to do. I'm thinking it wouldn't be a bad idea to have another monitor, even if I eventually get this one fixed. That way, I'd have a spare in case either of them have more problems later on. You have at least 4 of them, right?

Right now, I really just want a working monitor. I've done everything I can do with the monitor myself, and trying to get someone else to do it would be a huge pain in the ass. I want a monitor I can use now; I can worry about getting this one fixed later on.


I totally get that. I just can't imagine shopping for an XM these days with them costing $1000+. I got one of mine for free, and paid only $50 each for the others. For me, some travel time and money spent on repairs that would make the monitor last another 20 years would be worth looking into vs. buying another. :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:24 pm 



Joined: 09 Feb 2019
Posts: 3
My 29 still has an issue with any input other than vga. Looks like patterned horizontal sections are going back and forth on the image. No rolling. VGA input is crystal clear. Would love to get that other section of the manual.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:43 am 


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So, I'm still having issues with my XV29 Plus. I tried asking people about where to find a person to repair my monitor in the CRT Collective group, and I got zero responses. I was just using the monitor and the issue returned, so I decided to take some pictures of it. This game (Ikaruga) isn't exactly the best game to show the issue, it's just what I happened to be playing when the issue appeared. The areas of blue and the horizontal lines across the screen are part of the issue; the game doesn't normally look like this. The issue doesn't always look exactly like this, it varies somewhat. Any idea what's going on here?

Image

Image

Image

I also noticed that if the VGA cable isn't screwed in, jiggling the connector a little sometimes makes the problem go away. I don't know why that is, though I thought it could be related to a problem with the monitor's VGA connector.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 11:05 am 


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I remembered that I had an issue kind of similar to this with my other monitor (LaCie Electron 22 Blue IV) that turned out to be an issue with the connection to my Dreamcast. That made me think that maybe this issue has something to do with the monitor's VGA connectors. However, if that's the case, I don't know how to solve it. I've tried a number of different things and nothing seems to make any difference in the long run.

I've verified that the issue is indeed limited to the inputs. The on-screen menu always functions perfectly, so the tube must be fine. My best explanations currently are that it has something to do with the connectors, the video input circuits, or the power circuits - though I'm leaning more towards thinking it's related to the inputs.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 5:19 pm 



Joined: 14 Jul 2020
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lalilulelo wrote:
I remembered that I had an issue kind of similar to this with my other monitor (LaCie Electron 22 Blue IV) that turned out to be an issue with the connection to my Dreamcast. That made me think that maybe this issue has something to do with the monitor's VGA connectors. However, if that's the case, I don't know how to solve it. I've tried a number of different things and nothing seems to make any difference in the long run.

I've verified that the issue is indeed limited to the inputs. The on-screen menu always functions perfectly, so the tube must be fine. My best explanations currently are that it has something to do with the connectors, the video input circuits, or the power circuits - though I'm leaning more towards thinking it's related to the inputs.


There's a shop in Pennsylvania, Andalusia TV, that can probably fix your TV. I had 2 Megaview 29's that didn't work, both with input board problems, and they fixed both of them. Won't be cheap though, cost me over a grand total for both sets. I had to drop them off and wait 2-3 weeks for them to be fixed, so if you've got a long drive, you'll have to make it twice. I think there's a place or two in NYC that will fix these sets, but the number is becoming less and less every day.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 7:31 pm 



Joined: 14 Jul 2020
Posts: 9
I've got that flyback screaming noise that happens after my XM37 Plus warms up. Does that definitely mean the flyback is dying or can they live a long time doing that? The TV seems to work perfectly other than the noise. I'm scared of damaging it, so I usually turn it off as soon as the noise starts. Maybe 5-10 minutes of play (enough for me, I just keep running through the same Kaizo Mario level). Is it more damaging to whatever is going on if I keep using it through the noise? Where does one get a flyback replacement part for this? I'm ok with attempting it myself. I'm not an expert as I'm seeing many are here, but I don't mind learning and trying.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2020 3:56 am 



Joined: 29 Jul 2016
Posts: 9
this is probably not the flyback, but this or another vibrating transmitter.
gently clamp it with some wood or paper.
then the noise disappears..............

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ny2y7i9hl659f ... o.JPG?dl=0


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2020 4:41 am 



Joined: 14 Jul 2020
Posts: 9
Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2020 5:04 am 


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basketballer wrote:
There's a shop in Pennsylvania, Andalusia TV, that can probably fix your TV. I had 2 Megaview 29's that didn't work, both with input board problems, and they fixed both of them. Won't be cheap though, cost me over a grand total for both sets. I had to drop them off and wait 2-3 weeks for them to be fixed, so if you've got a long drive, you'll have to make it twice. I think there's a place or two in NYC that will fix these sets, but the number is becoming less and less every day.


PA is a pretty long drive for me. It'd be better if I could take it somewhere closer. It looks like there's probably no one where I live currently who can do it, but if I could find someone somewhere like Nashville, TN or Atlanta, GA, that might be feasible for me.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2020 7:22 am 


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So, I've done some work on the monitor, and there have been some interesting developments. First, I adjusted the controls on the flyback a bit, which noticeably improved the picture quality, but had no apparent effect on the issue. However, I now think I have a lead on what actually causes the issue. I found this little cable that appears to be connected directly to the ground pin of the power input connector on one end, and connected to a large metal plate on the other end - which appears to supply ground to both of the rear input boards. In this picture, you can see where the cable attaches to the metal plate with a screw in the red box:

Image

I observed that jiggling this cable and touching nothing else often will make the issue appear or disappear. I wanted to try unscrewing it and then screwing it in again, but I was unable to reach it with a screwdriver because it's such a tight space (tighter than it appears in the photo). I'm going to make another attempt to do that soon, but in the meantime I'm trying to understand what the problem is. It seems plausible that this cable could be related to the problem, since I already thought that the problem was related to the input boards and grounding. I've also seen similar issues with my PVM that turned out to be related to grounding. So it makes sense that something to do with this cable could explain the issue, but I'm not sure exactly what's wrong or how to fix it. It doesn't appear to be loose, but it's kind of hard to tell. I tried cleaning it a little, but obviously I can't clean the entire connection without unscrewing it; doing this didn't seem to have an effect. I can't rule out the possibility that this isn't actually the cause of the issue, but just another thing that affects the issue in some way. Still, it appears that this little cable is the sole source of ground for the entire back panel, so if the issue is related to grounding it makes sense that this would be the source. What do you think is going on here?

Another possibility is that there's some issue with the other end of this cable - that is, the part of the cable that connects to the 3-prong power adapter on the back panel. It occurred to me that if this is the issue, it might be possible to fix it by sourcing ground from somewhere else inside the monitor, like from the power supply - but I'm not sure what would happen if I did this.

I noticed that on the power supply, the solder points that are connected to the power input connector on the back panel had some residue of some kind. I cleaned off some of this with a knife, the little whitish/greenish bits you can see are just areas of the plastic that got scratched when I did this. Do you think this is something I should be concerned about? Here's a picture of what I'm talking about:

Image


Here are some of the pots I was talking about before, on the neckboard I guess? Any idea what these pots do, and should I try adjusting them? I'm guessing they're probably some kind of voltage adjustment.

Image

Any insight about any of the things I mentioned would be appreciated.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 4:24 pm 


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I saw someone say they were getting offers up to $2500 for their XM29... Jesus. Anyways, if someone wants my 4 monitors they can have them for $10k. I'm for real.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 4:47 pm 


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Location: Québec City
Can I have one of your 4 monitors for $800 though?
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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 6:22 pm 


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FinalBaton wrote:
Can I have one of your 4 monitors for $800 though?


It's a great offer, but one of my highest priority goals is getting a classic car that broke down back in 2005 back on the road, and it needs about $10k worth of work. If I can't get $10k I'd rather just keep my setup the way it is. For the record, I think $10k for 4 XM29s is insane, but hey the market does what the market does.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:31 am 



Joined: 30 Oct 2018
Posts: 120
Wow that is nuts. I wonder what a 37 would go for? You rarely see them for sale.


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 Post subject: Re: NEC XM/XP 29/37 Pro/Xtra Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 7:43 am 


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So, I tried tightening the screw connected to the ground a bit, and this didn't appear to eliminate the issue. However, it does seem like the appearance of the issue has changed a little, and it seems like that could be related to what I've done to the internals of the monitor. That, plus what I've observed about the cable, leads me to still think that the cable and the screw are somehow related to the issue. But I still don't know how to solve it. When I tried to tighten the screw, I didn't remove it completely - because I was worried it might fall down inside the monitor, and it could damage something and/or it might be hard to get it out. Now I'm thinking I should try removing it completely, so I can get a better look at the cable itself - it's possible that there could be a problem with the connection between the cable and the little ring that goes around the screw.

I was wondering about one thing: what would happen if I removed the grounding for the video input boards completely and then tried to use the monitor in that state? Could doing this damage the monitor? My idea is that this could possibly be a way to diagnose the issue, because I could see in realtime what happens when the ground is connected or disconnected. I don't want to do it if it could cause any damage, though. Again, any help or insight would be appreciated.

I wonder if these people who are spending $2,500 on an XM29 are aware that they might be in the same situation I'm in (or worse) within a week or two of buying their expensive monitor. You might even consider me lucky, since my monitor is still somewhat usable in its current state; these monitors are so old, they could easily just stop working entirely at any time, no matter what their current condition appears to be. How can you justify spending so much money on something when there's a real possibility that it could just die on you tomorrow?


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