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 Post subject: Re: Emulation Shader recommendations
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:45 pm 



Joined: 05 Oct 2017
Posts: 113
http://imgur.com/a/SsSrJYd

Here we have crt-royale-kurozumi vs a crt monitor at 240p@120hz

And mame is just fine. Here is metal slug 2 on the fba core with crt-royale-kurozumi
http://imgur.com/a/oClVJf7


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 Post subject: Re: Emulation Shader recommendations
PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:05 pm 



Joined: 27 Sep 2018
Posts: 137
Patrickbot wrote:
Actually, I'm not sure 400 cd/m2 will cut it. My display (an ASUS VG248QE) reaches around 400 cd/m2 with the brightness and contrast maxed out, and it's still not bright enough to compensate for scanlines AND the RGB mask. IMO it's not enough to just have scanlines, you also need to emulate the phosphor structure/lower resolution (TVL) of a CRT, or else the image appears too sharp/smooth. The RGB mask (aperture grille) causes a HUGE amount of brightness to be lost, such that an HDR-capable display becomes necessary if you want an "accurate" RGB mask in addition to scanlines.

The latest LG OLEDs can do 900+ cd/m² peaks and ~600 cd/m² nominal on real-world video when fed a HDR signal, so considering how few pixels end up getting lit up at once after shadow mask emulation, those OLEDs should, in theory, now get bright enough. You have to make sure the source is properly tagging HDR, but the latest builds of Windows 10 will indeed do this.


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 Post subject: Re: Emulation Shader recommendations
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 4:16 pm 



Joined: 13 Aug 2018
Posts: 11
SNK-NEO-GEO wrote:
@Fernan1234 - on the LG OLED TV and Retroarch.. how do I tell if the game is being run at 4K. I Flowed your instructions but I don't think that I am running the game in Mame at 4K. It looks like 720p b cause the game does not look sharp.. also is the supposed to run at 4K with HDR? Or just 4K? Thank for the feedback.

Vulkan changed on video and made the changed to 3 on the shader files.


Be sure to set your Windows Display Scaling to 100%. If set to anything higher, Retroarch will be affected and you will be running a lower resolution. I learned this the hard way.


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 Post subject: Re: Emulation Shader recommendations
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:21 pm 


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Joined: 22 Jun 2011
Posts: 1314
Location: Bedfordshire, England.
DatMonkey wrote:
SNK-NEO-GEO wrote:
@Fernan1234 - on the LG OLED TV and Retroarch.. how do I tell if the game is being run at 4K. I Flowed your instructions but I don't think that I am running the game in Mame at 4K. It looks like 720p b cause the game does not look sharp.. also is the supposed to run at 4K with HDR? Or just 4K? Thank for the feedback.

Vulkan changed on video and made the changed to 3 on the shader files.


Be sure to set your Windows Display Scaling to 100%. If set to anything higher, Retroarch will be affected and you will be running a lower resolution. I learned this the hard way.


What do you mean stuff like 'Dynamic Super Resolution' settings for Nvidia cards?


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 Post subject: Re: Emulation Shader recommendations
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:13 pm 



Joined: 01 Sep 2018
Posts: 18
energizerfellow‌ wrote:
Patrickbot wrote:
Actually, I'm not sure 400 cd/m2 will cut it. My display (an ASUS VG248QE) reaches around 400 cd/m2 with the brightness and contrast maxed out, and it's still not bright enough to compensate for scanlines AND the RGB mask. IMO it's not enough to just have scanlines, you also need to emulate the phosphor structure/lower resolution (TVL) of a CRT, or else the image appears too sharp/smooth. The RGB mask (aperture grille) causes a HUGE amount of brightness to be lost, such that an HDR-capable display becomes necessary if you want an "accurate" RGB mask in addition to scanlines.

The latest LG OLEDs can do 900+ cd/m² peaks and ~600 cd/m² nominal on real-world video when fed a HDR signal, so considering how few pixels end up getting lit up at once after shadow mask emulation, those OLEDs should, in theory, now get bright enough. You have to make sure the source is properly tagging HDR, but the latest builds of Windows 10 will indeed do this.


Yep, this is what I've been waiting for! :D With HDR, we don't have to fake anything or rely on any visual gimmicks (such as fake bloom, glow, altering the colors, etc) to have an adequately bright image while emulating a CRT.

It occurs to me that 900 cd/m2+ would also make "glow" and "halation" effects pointless/redundant, since with 900 cd/m2 you can get each individual emulated "phosphor" to be as bright as the real thing on a CRT, so it will have *real* glow and halation when observed in person. IMO the fake stuff just doesn't cut it and winds up blurring the image too much at 1080p. At 1080p, most CRT shaders make for an image that is blurrier than what you would get on a 20" TV from the 90s (when calibrated and displaying an RGB signal).

At 4k resolution we can replicate the subpixel effects on a CRT, including the glow, while maintaining acceptable sharpness / TVL, but it becomes redundant to do so because most 4k displays also have HDR, which means we don't have to fake anything. With HDR and 4k (and higher) resolutions, just the scanlines and RGB mask should be enough for CRT emulation.


Last edited by Patrickbot on Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Emulation Shader recommendations
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:23 pm 



Joined: 01 Sep 2018
Posts: 18
karmeck wrote:
http://imgur.com/a/SsSrJYd

Here we have crt-royale-kurozumi vs a crt monitor at 240p@120hz

And mame is just fine. Here is metal slug 2 on the fba core with crt-royale-kurozumi
http://imgur.com/a/oClVJf7


actually, those shots illustrate a point I've been making, in that the CRT is both sharper and way less "bloomy" than the LCD with CRT Royale. That CRT actually looks closer to an LCD using nearest neighbor scaling with no shader effects except for scanlines.


Last edited by Patrickbot on Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Emulation Shader recommendations
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:55 pm 



Joined: 18 May 2011
Posts: 5
Hello,

Do you know any shaders for games with native 480p resolution?
Thank you.


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