NESRGB New Firmware Palette Updates:

[bobrocks95]

May as well toot FBX's horn and say that Frank Cifaldi, one of the leads on the Mega Man Legacy Collection, praised FBX's palettes when I was talking to him on Twitter (the link he posted is incorrectly copied from an earlier tweet he made- presumably he meant to link FBX's site?):
https://twitter.com/frankcifaldi/status ... 2594872320

He did go on to question your method just a little bit of course

[FBX]

May as well toot FBX's horn and say that Frank Cifaldi, one of the leads on the Mega Man Legacy Collection, praised FBX's palettes when I was talking to him on Twitter (the link he posted is incorrectly copied from an earlier tweet he made- presumably he meant to link FBX's site?):
https://twitter.com/frankcifaldi/status ... 2594872320

He did go on to question your method just a little bit of course

I wish I could talk to him and describe the problems I ran into and how I corrected them, but Twitter is just too short and I hate using it.

And believe me, I would have loved to hook the NES directly to the capture device, but that fact of the matter is modern capture devices only go down to YPbPr. As such, I had no choice but to use a Framemeister and then manually correct the green 'pull' that several entries were suffering from. It's actually quite remarkable how close the final version ended up looking compared to the "natural" default palette (other than the issue of the cyan colors being too balanced on the "natural" palette).

At any rate, Unsat-V5 has been working so well for my tastes that I've felt no need to make any further refinements. For LCD use, it satisfies my nostalgia weenie.

[Guspaz]

I wish I could talk to him and describe the problems I ran into and how I corrected them, but Twitter is just too short and I hate using it.

There are no character length restrictions on twitter DMs.

[FBX]

I wish I could talk to him and describe the problems I ran into and how I corrected them, but Twitter is just too short and I hate using it.

There are no character length restrictions on twitter DMs.

I can never tell on there. When I reply to someone, there's always this two-line limit. I just don't like Twitter and never have. I remember when it was first being promoted on CNN right before it came out, I thought the concept of it was pretty lame to be honest. Why would I want a character limit? Why not just use Facebook or a forum?

[Guspaz]

DMs are not the same as public replies.

Twitter launched roughly a decade ago. If you've not figured out twitter in the intervening years, I'm not sure there's much I can say that will convince you. Forums are not as direct or immediate as twitter, and Facebook is a mess. It's like saying, what's the point of e-mail, we've got telephones.

[mvsfan]

I have a Pexhdcap capture card It takes 240p RGB over the dvi connector with an vga adapter.

I have a custom Vga to female scart adapter i use with it.

[mvsfan]

I Finally built an nesrgb and flashed FBX playchoice unsaturated improved palette update to it.

Nice work, FBX. Looks great.

I notice though that the palettes are in a different order now on my switch.

[rayik]

Thank you FBX for the palettes and instructions.

Built a custom cable. Soldered bent header pins into nesrgb. Flashed playchoice - unsaturated - improved with no problems.

Thank you .

[FBX]

A couple months back, my friend Ste from HD Retrovision made me these nifty adapters that make updating the firmware a breeze:



No longer do I have to strip wires and jerry-rig the interface. With these adapters, I just plug the ribbon cable directly into the adapter and insert the adapter into the jtag holes. This may seem like an afterthought, but I am considering revisiting those pesky cyan colors on the Unsaturated palette. The first area in Metroid is a great testing ground for getting a look at how the cyan color is interacting in the palette. I may do some emulator test screenshots and post them for a vote on what looks typically best.

[leonk]

Interesting.

I'm not sure these adapters would work on a top loader or famicom AV with the component adapter installed. There's just not enough space between the pin header and the cart slot.

Personally, I solder a 6 pin female socket into every NESRGB. (1x6 strip). My USB blaster has a 6 pin male strip soldered in. Easy to plug/unplug and no space issues with component adapter.

Every NESRGB install I do now automatically gets this firmware. It should be stock!!!

[CkRtech]

Personally, I solder a 6 pin female socket into every NESRGB. (1x6 strip).

Nice. I am pretty lazy - I just hacked up the data cable from the programmer and soldered it to a pin header that I just drop and hold in the holes whenever I need to program it.

[mvsfan]

I have a cable that breaks out all the pins on the usb blaster connector into single connectors and i have tags on the wires tdo tck, etc.

makes it easy to change the layout if need be. the wires i dont use i tied together.

[copy]

This may seem like an afterthought, but I am considering revisiting those pesky cyan colors on the Unsaturated palette. The first area in Metroid is a great testing ground for getting a look at how the cyan color is interacting in the palette. I may do some emulator test screenshots and post them for a vote on what looks typically best.

Any idea when/if you might release your next version? I just cracked open my newly-received RGB NES to update the firmware, and I'm realizing I don't want to have to redo this again for a long while!

I'm also having a hard time deciding which version of the firmware to use. Do I want both Unsaturated-V5 and YUV-V3? Do I really need FCEUX? I can't make up my mind.

Anyway, thanks in general for your palettes and the great instructions on how to do the update.

[FBX]

This may seem like an afterthought, but I am considering revisiting those pesky cyan colors on the Unsaturated palette. The first area in Metroid is a great testing ground for getting a look at how the cyan color is interacting in the palette. I may do some emulator test screenshots and post them for a vote on what looks typically best.

Any idea when/if you might release your next version? I just cracked open my newly-received RGB NES to update the firmware, and I'm realizing I don't want to have to redo this again for a long while!

I'm also having a hard time deciding which version of the firmware to use. Do I want both Unsaturated-V5 and YUV-V3? Do I really need FCEUX? I can't make up my mind.

Anyway, thanks in general for your palettes and the great instructions on how to do the update.

It's on hold for the moment, but I plan on eventually doing some more tests on those cyan entries. When I analyzed the cyan entries from direct captures, there's a peculiar 'twist' in the direction of the hue. It goes from blue-weighted on the two darkest entries, then the 3rd entry shifts to a balance of blue & green, then the lightest color shifts to VERY slightly more green than blue. Of course I want to be absolutely certain about this before spending the money on paying Tim to code a new Firmware update, so there will be a lot of testing in the near future. I'd say expect an update in not more than a month.

Edit: Unless you particularly like FCEUX (which is called the "Improved" palette), I'd just stick with Unsat-V5 and YUV-V3. The latter replaces the YUV palette, which is called "Natural").

[copy]

Thanks FBX. I decided to go with PlayChoice/Unsaturated/FCEUX. I figured I didn't need YUV-V3 since by most accounts Unsaturated is more accurate, and I thought I'd retain the FCEUX option just in case (though I doubt I'll ever use it). So far Unsaturated matches my unmodded NES's composite output very well.

Oddly, Unsaturated is not the middle choice on my three-position switch; instead it's on the end. I'm not even sure which is which between the other two...

[FBX]

Went ahead and spent several hours tonight working new direct captures of those cyan colors. Seems the more recent Framemeister firmwares make it a lot easier to force YCbCr output, so I went with that and full range ( 0 - 255) color space. So below are side-by-sides of the difference. The left-hand images are all the current Unsaturated-V5 with its math-generated cyan colors. All the right-hand images are the same palette, only the cyan colors have been replaced with new direct captures, which feature that 'twist' in hue from darkest to lightest on the blue-green weights.








Personally, I have to admit the direct-captured cyans really do look a tad more faithful to what I'm seeing when I run the games live on my unmodded NES, especially on the clouds there of Mega Man 2. But I'll leave it to you guys for a vote on that. If you thinks it's worth it, I'll make a new release.

[leonk]

you're pulling at straws at this point.

[FBX]

you're pulling at straws at this point.

It's really the only thing left that nags me. If I pull the trigger and release version 6 with this update, I'm absolutely done with it.

[FBX]

Project finished!

Web site updated:

http://www.firebrandx.com/nespalette.html (hit refresh if still showing old content)


The palette ends up being in the middle position on my toggle switch, so be warned even though the code has it in the 3rd position, it will likely be in the middle position depending on how your switch is installed. You can tell when you're on the unsaturated palette as the other two (PC10 & FCEUX) are quite a bit more vivid/saturated.

BTW in case there are questions about the finality: This is the last version that will be released. The project is 100% done.

[xadox]

Thx for other update

In the previos V5 release there where 3 POF files with different pallete mix-ups.
Now there is only on V6 POF. Could you also provide the other mix-ups as v6?

[Guspaz]

The comparison on the website should really be to the original NESRGB palette, not the v5 palette.

[FBX]

The comparison on the website should really be to the original NESRGB palette, not the v5 palette.

The new comparison is for those wondering if it's worth upgrading to V6 since most have already flashed V5 to their boards. I'm happy with it myself.

Thx for other update

In the previos V5 release there where 3 POF files with different pallete mix-ups.
Now there is only on V6 POF. Could you also provide the other mix-ups as v6?

YUV palette support is discontinued. I never use it, and it seems silly to offer arrangements with it when Unsaturated is effectively meant to replace it. Basically you either prefer Unsaturated or you prefer YUV. In the latter's case, there's no point in upgrading.

[gojira54]

Updated... can't tell the difference tbh but thanks a lot for all the effort =]

[leonk]

the older firmware was pc10/yuv/unsaturated

which version was the one where you only replaced cyan? was it yuv?

[copy]

I flashed my board with v6 the other night. Very happy to have the final, perfected palette!

The comparison on the website should really be to the original NESRGB palette, not the v5 palette.

I strongly agree. Anyone coming to the page for the first time would benefit more from seeing comparisons to the stock "natural" palette.

[FBX]

I flashed my board with v6 the other night. Very happy to have the final, perfected palette!

The comparison on the website should really be to the original NESRGB palette, not the v5 palette.

I strongly agree. Anyone coming to the page for the first time would benefit more from seeing comparisons to the stock "natural" palette.

I'll update the site with some pics comparing original YUV palette then. I'll have it up by tonight.

[FBX]

Web site updated with 7 comparison pics:

http://www.firebrandx.com/nespalette.html (hit refresh if still showing old content)

These were the more glaring differences, while most games the difference really only seemed to be in brightness/contrast between the two palettes.

[copy]

Nice, that should definitely be helpful for newcomers.

I'm hoping to dig into a lot of NES games soon, and it'll be great knowing they all look like they should.

[Guspaz]

Looks good. I've got a USB blaster in the mail from China to try it out

[CkRtech]

One good comparison would probably be that neon green color in the Link sprite from LoZ. Seems like it was quite loud on NESRGB natural, but it has been awhile since I had it in the system. I think some of the green in SMB2 had the same issue.