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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 4:18 am 



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I've got the Framemeister along with various LCDs, plasmas and CRTs. All I can say is that when I'm using a good modern display along with the Framemeister, I personally don't notice any differences in terms of lag in comparison to a CRT no matter what I play. Maybe if I would be skilled enough to beat Mike Tyson in Punch-Out I could tell them apart but I'd say that if I wasn't aware of the fact that the Framemeister adds latency I wouldn't notice it. Just my two cents. Your experience with the Mini may be completely different and that's all right.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:42 am 


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I used Artemio's 240p test suit to check total lag on my LCD + Framemeister setup. It ended up being a lot better than I expected at 26ms. I have every sort of processing function turned off on my display, so that helped quite a bit I imagine. At any rate, I really don't notice it just casually playing games.


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Are you wearing Mario Kart pajamas in that video? LOL!
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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 6:19 pm 


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FBX wrote:
I used Artemio's 240p test suit to check total lag on my LCD + Framemeister setup. It ended up being a lot better than I expected at 26ms. I have every sort of processing function turned off on my display, so that helped quite a bit I imagine. At any rate, I really don't notice it just casually playing games.


Voultar wrote:


Are you wearing Mario Kart pajamas in that video? LOL!



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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 6:24 pm 



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Voultar wrote:
FBX wrote:
I used Artemio's 240p test suit to check total lag on my LCD + Framemeister setup. It ended up being a lot better than I expected at 26ms. I have every sort of processing function turned off on my display, so that helped quite a bit I imagine. At any rate, I really don't notice it just casually playing games.


Voultar wrote:


Are you wearing Mario Kart pajamas in that video? LOL!



Damn straight.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2015 3:31 am 


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I suppose I've got no room to be talkin' with having a Firebrand tattoo from Demon's Crest on my shoulder. We've all got our boat-floaters :-P

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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2015 8:01 am 


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nissling wrote:
I've got the Framemeister along with various LCDs, plasmas and CRTs. All I can say is that when I'm using a good modern display along with the Framemeister, I personally don't notice any differences in terms of lag in comparison to a CRT no matter what I play. Maybe if I would be skilled enough to beat Mike Tyson in Punch-Out I could tell them apart but I'd say that if I wasn't aware of the fact that the Framemeister adds latency I wouldn't notice it. Just my two cents. Your experience with the Mini may be completely different and that's all right.


Really for most games it's not an issue, just some of the really hard ones (like Mega Man 1 for example). Also, I like to do casual speedruns of certain games (Super Mario Bros. 1 and 3) and you need precision timing combined with perfect muscle memory to get through certain obstacles without stopping at all. I can speedrun through SMB on the XRGB-mini without too much of an issue, but if I switch over to the CRT, all of my timings are thrown off, and vice versa. So these days I pretty much keep all of my NES playing strictly to the CRT, so that it doesn't mess me up. Later generations of games are much more forgiving than the NES era, so I rarely play anything other than NES on the CRT.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2015 12:16 pm 


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Kevin's post from the nesdev thread:

Well, Jason (gametech) came over tonight and we did a bunch of everdrive testing. Turns out his everdrive works fine on my HDMI modified toploader. We ran SMB3, Zelda, Double Dragon, Faxanadu, SMB, SMB2, and a bunch of other games and all of them seem to work fine. Overall I tested NROM, UNROM, MMC1, and MMC3 games.

The only minor issue I had was reset. sometimes I had to mash reset a few times before the menu would come back up. Once (out of 15-20 games run) I had to cycle the power.

This confirms what I said earlier about the ED working back in november. It seemed to work then and still seems to work now.

Turns out his ED is one of the very first made, and as such it has really old firmware on it. Rev 3 firmware.


I also have a "modern" ED that uses the latest firmware. This ED does NOT work on the Hidef nes. The menu sometimes comes up and the graphics are always corrupt- looks like uninitialized VRAM. You can tell the menu is there, but you can't start a game, it just resets. Sometimes it's showing an error screen I think, but you can't read it. I did not get this version to run a game.

So I took the rev 3 firmware off Jason's ED and put it on the "modern" ED, and guess what it worked just as well as his ED did! So whatever change happened between rev 3 and 4 of the ED firmware seems to be the reason. I put the latest version of firmware on Jason's ED and it failed in the same way the "modern" ED failed.

These are good data points on tracking down the problem I think.

I was thinking of making a video showing this happening.

Regarding the HDMI connector fit, I test fitted my toploader with the cable I have here and it worked OK so I thought it was going to be fine. The connector is recessed as far as it is so I could use the same board on the NES and the nt both. I tested so I thought it was OK, but turns out it isn't. Various cables seem to have different "tongue" lengths. I modified one by cutting some of the plastic off with an xacto knife and it only took me about a minute to do this. I was surprised how easy it was actually.

This board would work fine on a front loader I think. the plastic is much thinner on the back so the fit should not be an issue there.

On the next run I will move the connector out on a little PCB "flag" to fix this issue.

Like any other brand new high complexity product, there's going to be some things to fix. There's literally hundreds or even thousands of little things that could go wrong, so it's not unlikely one or two of these things will slip through. I tried to do extremely thorough testing here. This included 20 sets of CPU/PPU's, 4 different NES main boards (front loaders and top loaders), 12 or 13 Hidef NES proto boards I hand stuffed and reflowed, and 10 different monitors. There is also the HDMI Analyzer that I paid quite a lot of money for just specifically so I could debug the HDMI link on this project. Overall I am in fairly deep on this project financially so I hope it will eventually pay off, and that I will make a bit more than minimum wage for the hours I put in and the cash I spent for tools and prototypes. Overall 5 or 6 people were helping me test/debug it (it wasn't just 2 people as someone claimed).

Not a whine or anything, just stating what the facts are. Hope this clears up some of the loose ends people have about the project. I hope to be able to supply as many boards as the modding community can use. There's not going to be any limit. So long as people buy them I will sell them, barring any parts availability issues.
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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2015 3:41 pm 



Joined: 17 May 2013
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Location: Pennsylvania, USA
game-tech.us wrote:
Kevin's post from the nesdev thread:

Well, Jason (gametech) came over tonight and we did a bunch of everdrive testing. Turns out his everdrive works fine on my HDMI modified toploader. We ran SMB3, Zelda, Double Dragon, Faxanadu, SMB, SMB2, and a bunch of other games and all of them seem to work fine. Overall I tested NROM, UNROM, MMC1, and MMC3 games.

The only minor issue I had was reset. sometimes I had to mash reset a few times before the menu would come back up. Once (out of 15-20 games run) I had to cycle the power.

This confirms what I said earlier about the ED working back in november. It seemed to work then and still seems to work now.

Turns out his ED is one of the very first made, and as such it has really old firmware on it. Rev 3 firmware.


I also have a "modern" ED that uses the latest firmware. This ED does NOT work on the Hidef nes. The menu sometimes comes up and the graphics are always corrupt- looks like uninitialized VRAM. You can tell the menu is there, but you can't start a game, it just resets. Sometimes it's showing an error screen I think, but you can't read it. I did not get this version to run a game.

So I took the rev 3 firmware off Jason's ED and put it on the "modern" ED, and guess what it worked just as well as his ED did! So whatever change happened between rev 3 and 4 of the ED firmware seems to be the reason. I put the latest version of firmware on Jason's ED and it failed in the same way the "modern" ED failed.

These are good data points on tracking down the problem I think.

I was thinking of making a video showing this happening.

Regarding the HDMI connector fit, I test fitted my toploader with the cable I have here and it worked OK so I thought it was going to be fine. The connector is recessed as far as it is so I could use the same board on the NES and the nt both. I tested so I thought it was OK, but turns out it isn't. Various cables seem to have different "tongue" lengths. I modified one by cutting some of the plastic off with an xacto knife and it only took me about a minute to do this. I was surprised how easy it was actually.

This board would work fine on a front loader I think. the plastic is much thinner on the back so the fit should not be an issue there.

On the next run I will move the connector out on a little PCB "flag" to fix this issue.

Like any other brand new high complexity product, there's going to be some things to fix. There's literally hundreds or even thousands of little things that could go wrong, so it's not unlikely one or two of these things will slip through. I tried to do extremely thorough testing here. This included 20 sets of CPU/PPU's, 4 different NES main boards (front loaders and top loaders), 12 or 13 Hidef NES proto boards I hand stuffed and reflowed, and 10 different monitors. There is also the HDMI Analyzer that I paid quite a lot of money for just specifically so I could debug the HDMI link on this project. Overall I am in fairly deep on this project financially so I hope it will eventually pay off, and that I will make a bit more than minimum wage for the hours I put in and the cash I spent for tools and prototypes. Overall 5 or 6 people were helping me test/debug it (it wasn't just 2 people as someone claimed).

Not a whine or anything, just stating what the facts are. Hope this clears up some of the loose ends people have about the project. I hope to be able to supply as many boards as the modding community can use. There's not going to be any limit. So long as people buy them I will sell them, barring any parts availability issues.


Looks like that'll satisfy most people. :) From the looks of your ebay auctions you can BIN price these at $499 through at least the end of the year. An included (fitting) HDMI cable/ dongle would be a classy move with those initial systems though.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 2:10 pm 


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Some of the Analogue NT's have made it out to customers.
Here's a link to one guy's review of it with the Hi-Def kit installed:
http://filthypants.blogspot.com/2015/08 ... -look.html
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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 3:22 pm 


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Too bad you can't have the RGB board and the HDMI board installed simultaneously. Tim and Kevtris should get together one day and solve that.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 3:44 pm 


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Looks like 4x and 5x scale with vertical centering wasn't included in the released HDNES. The horizontal scaling is adjustable, but the vertical scaling is not. :|

Quote:
At 1080p, the scanlines are uneven thickness (alternating thinner and thicker), just like you would get on an emulator at 4.5x scale. I would have liked to see an option to force integer scaling to avoid this issue, but I didn't see anything like that (I'll update this post if I find otherwise; such a thing may also be added in a future firmware update)


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 6:32 pm 


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Initial stages of fitment of kit to front loader NES.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0cwm2thGQs
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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 10:43 pm 



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game-tech.us wrote:
Initial stages of fitment of kit to front loader NES.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0cwm2thGQs


Glad to see it!
Not so glad about cutting away plastic pillars and removing the bottom RF sheilding, even if it's not used, keeping the unit as much original as possible is important, at least for me.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 12:42 am 


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I've championed the idea of consolidating your I/O connections by putting your A/V outputs in-line on the front loader for years. I've never understood why people want to put that business on the far end.

Image

I've always given my customers the choice of connector placement, and I've never had anyone want it anywhere else.

That's where I'd recommend you place the HDMI port, for the front loader at least.
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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 3:21 am 


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Voultar wrote:
I've never understood why people want to put that business on the far end.

I've never understood why people want the SNES/N64 multiout block connector - but everyone is different. I'd prefer the connection in the center, and that is where I put my RGB out on my toaster. Lots of real estate back there. Very easy to add as many connections as you want.

But ultimately, how many people are really going to look at the back of their system after it is hooked up?


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 5:47 am 



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game-tech.us wrote:
Some of the Analogue NT's have made it out to customers.
Here's a link to one guy's review of it with the Hi-Def kit installed:
http://filthypants.blogspot.com/2015/08 ... -look.html


Looks like the NT doesn't do HDMI and analog together, it requires hardware modification to switch. Also bummed about the lack of integer scaling in 1080p. Hope scaling gets a firmware fix ASAP!


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 1:12 pm 


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Voultar wrote:
I've never understood why people want to put that business on the far end.


I don't think the 3D-printed ones fit below the RF block, but I'm not sure on that.

CkRtech wrote:
I've never understood why people want the SNES/N64 multiout block connector - but everyone is different. I'd prefer the connection in the center, and that is where I put my RGB out on my toaster. Lots of real estate back there. Very easy to add as many connections as you want.



It's convenient because it's one plug that provides all types of analog output, besides component. Unlike Tim's kit defaults, you don't have to make a choice to use composite sync or composite video for sync; you can chose composite sync or composite video for sync just by getting the appropriate cable. Cables for it are easy to find, most people already have some from other Nintendo consoles. And aesthetically, it fits in with other Nintendo consoles from the classic generations.

CkRtech wrote:
But ultimately, how many people are really going to look at the back of their system after it is hooked up?


I don't keep my consoles hooked up in any permanent location. I keep my consoles in a closet, each next to its own plastic bin that contains its controllers, memory cards, power adapters, and RGB cables. This is because I take them back and forth between my CRT in the office and the XRGB-mini/Plasma TV in the living room. So I see the backside of my consoles a lot, and would prefer them to be aesthetically pleasing and ultimately, stock-like.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 6:13 pm 


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darcagn wrote:
CkRtech wrote:
But ultimately, how many people are really going to look at the back of their system after it is hooked up?


I don't keep my consoles hooked up in any permanent location. I keep my consoles in a closet, each next to its own plastic bin that contains its controllers, memory cards, power adapters, and RGB cables. This is because I take them back and forth between my CRT in the office and the XRGB-mini/Plasma TV in the living room. So I see the backside of my consoles a lot, and would prefer them to be aesthetically pleasing and ultimately, stock-like.

You know that is a very fair point. I keep a bulk of mine hooked up all of the time, but the rest are stored on floating shelves above the sitting area. Therefore, any back panel modding would certainly be exposed during hook-up.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 10:58 pm 


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CkRtech wrote:
Voultar wrote:
I've never understood why people want to put that business on the far end.

I've never understood why people want the SNES/N64 multiout block connector - but everyone is different. I'd prefer the connection in the center, and that is where I put my RGB out on my toaster. Lots of real estate back there. Very easy to add as many connections as you want.

But ultimately, how many people are really going to look at the back of their system after it is hooked up?



Darcagn made a sound reply, but I'll address this since I was quoted.

It's a matter of standardization. There are standards for these things, after all. And whenever possible, I try to align myself with them. It's typically yields the cleaner, more efficient way.

It is rather arbitrary. Whatever works for you works. But in my experience, people typically want to consolidate their analog I/O into one connector. When it comes to Nintendo, they like the multi-out. ;)
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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 12:03 am 


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Voultar wrote:
But in my experience, people typically want to consolidate their analog I/O into one connector, and they like the multi-out. ;)

I guess my counter would be that there really isn't a standardized connector (sadly). With the installation option and space available for the front loader, I would say that separating the audio and video would be the better option. But then I guess laziness of the end user (not the installer, of course) so they can use the same cable typically wins over signal quality.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 3:13 am 


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CkRtech wrote:
I guess my counter would be that there really isn't a standardized connector (sadly).


Sure there is. Nintendo standardized and consolidated their analog and audio outputs after the NES. It's called a multi-out, and it was used over a span of 3 generations of hardware....

Composite, S-Video and RGB cables work properly across these 3 generations of systems that support the signals. Just because the NES didn't employ it doesn't make it any less of a standard. Sega standardized their A/V outputs with DIN/Mini-Din, that could be used as well.


CkRtech wrote:
I would say that separating the audio and video would be the better option. But then I guess laziness of the end user (not the installer, of course) so they can use the same cable typically wins over signal quality.


Laziness of the end-user? Signal quality? Do you seriously believe that the proper use and termination of a multi-out yields cross-talk and signal degradation? Let's refrain from spreading silly misinformation.
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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 5:49 am 


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I don't really appreciate your tone. There is snark, and then there is condescending.

The multiout is not standardized at all. In fact, it is a pretty pathetic connection. For one, it is ugly. More importantly, though, it is inconsistent. I don't really know how much work you do for these systems since I don't really follow other modders much, but the PAL and NTSC SNES systems have some very alarming inconsistencies. The composite sync line on an NTSC system is 12V on a PAL system. Also, the RGB output circuits require different components to get them TV out ready. Compound that with the same on the outside but different on the inside SCART vs JP-21 side of the plug. Simply grabbing an RGB output cable for a Nintendo system does not mean it will work.

I maintain that if these things were standard, they would have been consistent or...."standard" :mrgreen:

Quote:
Do you seriously believe that the proper use and termination of a multi-out yields cross-talk and signal degradation? Let's refrain from spreading silly misinformation.

Here is an example of how not to have a discussion. Adjust your attitude.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 6:31 am 


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CkRtech wrote:
I don't really appreciate your tone. There is snark, and then there is condescending.

Sorry, I wasn't being condescending. I was just being honest.
CkRtech wrote:
The multiout is not standardized at all.


Yes, it is.

CkRtech wrote:
In fact, it is a pretty pathetic connection. For one, it is ugly. More importantly, though, it is inconsistent. I don't really know how much work you do for these systems since I don't really follow other modders much, but the PAL and NTSC SNES systems have some very alarming inconsistencies. The composite sync line on an NTSC system is 12V on a PAL system. Also, the RGB output circuits require different components to get them TV out ready. Compound that with the same on the outside but different on the inside SCART vs JP-21 side of the plug. Simply grabbing an RGB output cable for a Nintendo system does not mean it will work.


So, you're arguing that territorial differences in the termination in the multi-out merit it as being a non-standard? If you have a PAL system, you should probably buy PAL terminated cables. If you have an NTSC system that's been wired in accordance to the NTSC standards, you should probably buy NTSC terminated cables. There are territorial consistencies per territory standards. That's simply what Nintendo decided to do. That's like arguing that an RJ-45 CAT5E port isn't standardized because some people like to terminate it T568A, and others prefer the T568B standardization.

You seem to want to continue to go back and forth on this. I'd rather not dilute Jason's thread with this exchange. My initial comment was directly regarding the HDMI placement for his Front-Loader systems. Clearly you have a difference of opinion, which is perfectly fine. If you're still eager in going back and forth, you should probably just PM me to keep this thread clean from discussion that's entirely irrelevant from the subject matter.

Voultar wrote:
Do you seriously believe that the proper use and termination of a multi-out yields cross-talk and signal degradation? Let's refrain from spreading silly misinformation.


CkRtech wrote:
Here is an example of how not to have a discussion. Adjust your attitude.


I appreciate the lesson in levity. But I was being pretty honest there, too. Adjust my attitude? Are you my father?

You're asserting that using a Multi-Out is merely used by the lazy end-user and it's the lesser option. Sorry, but if you're really being serious with that, I think that's silly.
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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 6:52 am 


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Voultar wrote:
Are you my father?

Yessss...... :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 8:30 am 



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Keep on topic please :(


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 12:07 pm 



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I'm going to be bidding on one of these today, hope I win one!

Any word on when kits will be available? I'd like to install it in my top loader (may as well have two hi def nes around).


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 12:51 pm 


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CkRtech wrote:
I guess my counter would be that there really isn't a standardized connector (sadly).


I can see your point with the differences in NTSC vs. PAL multiouts. One could also counter, however, that an RCA jack carrying a composite signal is pretty damn standard, yet, there are still NTSC vs. PAL concerns to factor in when using a composite signal on an RCA jack. It certainly would have been nice for Nintendo to include an extra separate pin for 12V, and not use different components in the SCART cable.

There is no 100% perfect solution here, sadly. However, that isn't going to stop me from playing and modding consoles. I still need to mod my consoles and make an appropriate choice as to what connector to use. The multiout connector has a long history, having been in use since at least 1990 with the introduction of the Super Famicom, and has been backported on the AV Famicom and NES top-loader (never used in off-the-shelf systems but sometimes people who had their top-loaders repaired by Nintendo received consoles back with multiout connectors). At the end of the day, the multiout is still the best choice, even with its faults.

CkRtech wrote:
With the installation option and space available for the front loader, I would say that separating the audio and video would be the better option. But then I guess laziness of the end user (not the installer, of course) so they can use the same cable typically wins over signal quality.


It may be, but we're talking in terms of standard connections right now, aren't we? It's extremely rare for consoles to have this. And with properly shielded cables which are available from reputable vendors, this consideration isn't all that important.

If you're a modder doing work for end users, all you have to do is point them to the best cables and say "I highly recommend that you use this cable for best quality with your new console." 99% of what I do is for myself only; I have only done a handful of mods for other people, and on occasion I mod and sell spare consoles that may come into my hands, and I always include a link to retro_console_accessories when I do so. But, on the other hand, if those consoles for whatever reason end up in someone else's hands, a standard cable bought from any vendor will still work.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 7:36 pm 


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Joined: 27 Aug 2012
Posts: 668
Location: Seattle, WA
On the whole, it is a great time for console mods regardless of output choices. I have certainly enjoyed following the Hi-Def NES project.

And I also enjoy chatting with you guys about it, as always. Didn't mean to derail the thread. :mrgreen:

I actually consider the Hi-Def NES a fairly gift-worthy mod for casual users (without CRTs or upscalers). I have a few friends and family members that just want to load up SMB and some other games on occasion, and I think this would be the ultimate "wow" for them.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 8:07 pm 



Joined: 06 Oct 2012
Posts: 1209
yeah thats definately one thing the hd nes has in its favor.

Its simple to hook up for the end user instead of having them try to figure out how to do rgb right.

I also like Tims Internal component video nesrgb add on boards for that reason. Im going to start installing them in rgb systems by default.


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 Post subject: Re: Hi-Def NES - a 1080p HDMI mod kit!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 9:08 pm 


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Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 81
CkRtech wrote:
On the whole, it is a great time for console mods regardless of output choices. I have certainly enjoyed following the Hi-Def NES project.

And I also enjoy chatting with you guys about it, as always. Didn't mean to derail the thread. :mrgreen:

I actually consider the Hi-Def NES a fairly gift-worthy mod for casual users (without CRTs or upscalers). I have a few friends and family members that just want to load up SMB and some other games on occasion, and I think this would be the ultimate "wow" for them.


You are right CkRtech. I also have a few friends that would love the idea of having their old NES just hook up to the TV via HDMI without all the RGB SCART and XRGB cost and mess. :roll:

mvsfan wrote:
yeah thats definately one thing the hd nes has in its favor.

Its simple to hook up for the end user instead of having them try to figure out how to do rgb right.

I also like Tims Internal component video nesrgb add on boards for that reason. Im going to start installing them in rgb systems by default.


Only thing to watch out on component video is the fact it's a 240P signal and a lot of LCD TV's won't display it or see it as 480i which it still looks much better than composite just not as good as having a proper upscaler. If it's a CRT, 99% of them should display the signal. My parents old Sanyo 32 inch CRT didn't and that surprised me greatly. Either way it's easy for anyone that doesn't want to mess around with RGB SCART. :)


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