GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

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NoAffinity
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by NoAffinity »

rama wrote:Port can stay the same.
I figured it out. Just have to access each GBS by their IP address (gleaned from my router's DHCP table). However, one of them still kept dropping off the wifi. I tried different channels, and didn't seem to make any difference.

But, I got a few clips together before it became too much of a pain to give up. Unfortunately, youtube is butchering the footage. Not sure what I'm doing differently now than a few months ago when most of my footage posted to youtube would look better, but something changed.

At any rate, if you want to look at the footage, there are samples of the following:

1) PS2 480p output -to- GBS Control 15khz downscale -to- 2nd GBS Control upscaling to 1280x960p
2) PS2 480i output -to- GBS Control 15khz downscale -to- 2nd GBS Control upscaling to 1280x960p
3) PS2 480p output -to- GBS Control deinterlacing and upscaling to 1280x960p
4) PS2 480i output -to- GBS Control 15khz downscale -to- OSSC @ line4x
5) PS2 480p output -to- GBS Control 15khz downscale -to- OSSC @ line4x
6) PS2 480p output -to- GBS Control 15khz downscale -to- OSSC @ line5x
Spoiler
My summary: descaling and rescaling doesn't look great. Would be nice to descale 480i and get something comparable to a properly scaled 240p, but unforutnately that's not the case. The use case for the 15khz downscaling, as rama mentioned, really is for 15khz monitors to display 480i/p (in the case of 480i, display it more cleanly).
Ryoandr
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Ryoandr »

NoAffinity wrote:Unfortunately, youtube is butchering the footage. Not sure what I'm doing differently now than a few months ago when most of my footage posted to youtube would look better, but something changed.
VP9 encoding threshold is now way higher if you're not a big channel.
You need to be at least at 1440p60 now (was 720p60 a few months ago)
And for typical 2d games if you want to upscale you need to be careful of your algorithm (it's surprising how few programs support integer scaling).
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Gunstar
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Gunstar »

@NoAffinity - Interesting, appreciate the vid and your summary. Downscale to a consumer CRT will be my primary use I think.
rama
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by rama »

Yep, your 480i > anything captures show the field order before downscaling is wrong.
This is resolved by the option that I thought could make a difference.
I'll see if implementing it helps.

I think the 480p downscales look good though. They'll certainly work well on a CRT TV :)
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NoAffinity
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by NoAffinity »

Ryoandr wrote:
NoAffinity wrote:Unfortunately, youtube is butchering the footage. Not sure what I'm doing differently now than a few months ago when most of my footage posted to youtube would look better, but something changed.
VP9 encoding threshold is now way higher if you're not a big channel.
You need to be at least at 1440p60 now (was 720p60 a few months ago)
And for typical 2d games if you want to upscale you need to be careful of your algorithm (it's surprising how few programs support integer scaling).
Good to know, thanks! I was using a 1440p canvas for a while, with the image at its native resolution within the 1440p field, because I had read youtube allocated more bandwidth for 1440p videos. I had tested 1080p, and found it to also be retaining good quality, but sounds like that has recently changed. :( Back to 1440p it is!
shift838
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by shift838 »

rama wrote:Yes, and good idea :)
i'm a bit confused based on the reference photos on the mod page https://github.com/ramapcsx2/gbs-contro ... capacitors

The mod references C23, C41, C42, C48.

But on the reference pics it shows a 0805 in parallel on C42 (some boards can use C43 from what I read). i do not see any installed on C23, C41 or C48

It then shows in the second pic the SMD caps installed in paralell on the C6, C7 and C3 of electrolytic caps on the back side of the PCB.

Can you verify?
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by rama »

shift838:
I will recommend you try and understand what's being done there.

This is a do it yourself project with an emphasis on learning electronics.
That means that I am learning as I go, and so should you as a user.
It's hard to give out detailed specifications and instructions down to component sizes,
so I really prefer it if users get an understanding first, then maybe ask for specific details / confirmations only.

You will find that lots of creators struggle with detailed documentation, probably similar to myself.
Please go a bit more easy on me :)
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Gunstar
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Gunstar »

All done, just waiting for the clock gen parts to arrive now.
Image

Such a huge improvement over stock. Deinterlacing, res switching and scaling are hugely improved. Amazing work Rama and everyone else who has contributed to this project.
shift838
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by shift838 »

rama wrote:shift838:
I will recommend you try and understand what's being done there.

This is a do it yourself project with an emphasis on learning electronics.
That means that I am learning as I go, and so should you as a user.
It's hard to give out detailed specifications and instructions down to component sizes,
so I really prefer it if users get an understanding first, then maybe ask for specific details / confirmations only.

You will find that lots of creators struggle with detailed documentation, probably similar to myself.
Please go a bit more easy on me :)
after reading up on the circuit and doing some tracing with my continuity tester. I find that the caps can be installed on the back side as shown in your photo as they are in the same circuits as the ones referenced in the capacitor mod. I just powered it up and what a huge difference!
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AndehX
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by AndehX »

my clock gen parts have arrived too, is there any progress on this so far rama?
rama
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by rama »

Are there any questions about the clock generator?
You can install it just like shown in the pictures :)
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AndehX
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by AndehX »

oh is that literally all you do? there's no gbscontrol update to enable any features or anything?
rama
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by rama »

It's fully transparent, yes :>

You do need to update to get the code, of course.
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AndehX
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by AndehX »

roger. I will update when I have some time (suddenly have a woman taking up most of my time lately :wink: )
Twin-X
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Twin-X »

Did anyone had suc6 with the xbox 360 and downscaling? I get massive artifacts.
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Gunstar
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Gunstar »

@Twin-X - not tried 360 yet but will try in the next few days. What input into the GBS did you use?

Playing around with downscaling today, god I love being able to move the picture without going into the service menu. Also beats my Extron since that has the corner flagging issue when you're using the centring controls.

ypbpr PS2/Xbox > GBS > Ultimate Scart Adapter (UMSA) > Sony consumer CRT

CFJam (PS2) - 480p downscale
Image

SF Anniversary Collection (Xbox) - 480i downscale - I think Hyper SF2 is filtered so looks a bit soft, there's no option to remove it like there is with 3rds Strike
Image

For some reason the Ultimate Scart puts out a way too bright picture, turning down the brightness on the CRT solves that though.
rama
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by rama »

All supported downscale modi should at least look decent. There should be no garbage, no matter the source (as long as it's 480p/i or 240p).
* 480p should look awesome, actually. It's just 480i that has inherent issues, due to the need to decide on field order.
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kitty666cats
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by kitty666cats »

Gunstar wrote:Also beats my Extron since that has the corner flagging issue when you're using the centring controls.
Which Extron device? If it has dipswitches, have you messed around with those?
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Gunstar
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Gunstar »

kitty666cats wrote:
Gunstar wrote:Also beats my Extron since that has the corner flagging issue when you're using the centring controls.
Which Extron device? If it has dipswitches, have you messed around with those?
201 and 203. Yeah the DDSP/ADSP dipswitch will stop the flagging but you lose centring controls. You can chain two Extrons like some people suggest here but I'm not fond of the idea.
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kitty666cats
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by kitty666cats »

Gunstar wrote:
kitty666cats wrote:
Gunstar wrote:Also beats my Extron since that has the corner flagging issue when you're using the centring controls.
Which Extron device? If it has dipswitches, have you messed around with those?
201 and 203. Yeah the DDSP/ADSP dipswitch will stop the flagging but you lose centring controls. You can chain two Extrons like some people suggest here but I'm not fond of the idea.
Have you tried SERR, maybe with just one of' em? Sometimes that one can clean stuff up, but yeah on my 580xi I mostly just leave DDSP and csync on 95% of the time. I have some no-name down scan converter from this brand called Analog Way and it's a great tag team partner to go with the 580xi. Gotta toy around with them some more sometime soon!
Twin-X
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Twin-X »

Gunstar wrote:@Twin-X - not tried 360 yet but will try in the next few days. What input into the GBS did you use?
I used XBOX360 to VGA --GBS -- vga -- scart TV
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Gunstar
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Gunstar »

@kitty666cats - I did try SERR but no luck. Sounds like you've got a good setup, would love to see how well your down scaler handles things.
Twin-X wrote:I used XBOX360 to VGA --GBS -- vga -- scart TV
I just tried VGA to the GBS, it freaks out but if I move the picture right it will sync and hold steady. The more I try to move the screen left to hide the green bar the more it will go crazy, the two fields begin to shake and the screen becomes jumbled. So yeah, a strange green pillar on one side and I can't move the picture to perfectly centre it without it freaking out.

Image

I think GBS Control web interface mentions that RGBHV downscale is experimental? I need to find my 360 ypbpr cables so I can test how that behaves, I assume it'll be okay like the PS2/Xbox classic.

Btw is vertical scaling disabled?
rama
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by rama »

Uh, I suppose I haven't tested the downscale preset with RGBHV :p

The whole RGBHV situation is hard anyway, due to not having the Mode Detect unit.
Each time I fire it up, it is kind of glitchy.
I know why each issue happens, but to fix them all comprehensively, that'll take time.
Twin-X
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Twin-X »

Yes it's exactly what i get. Glad to hear it is not only me :) . Thx for the pictures Gunstar. and rama i am allredy happy what you have achieved. great work here. Thanks
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Twin-X »

I found an ybpr cable, no clue how i got one but this works great on xbox360. Downscaling looks like a succes!!!
I can sell my extron devices :)

Image
Image
Image
Image
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Gunstar
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Gunstar »

Those shots look great, Twin-X. Glad that you found a ypbpr cables and confirmed it works fine. Seemed to have misplaced mine so I had to order another.

Can't thank you enough for this feature, Rama.
Image
360 - JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure HD Ver. - 480p downscaled to 240p
rama
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by rama »

Appreciate the appreciation guys. Enjoy! :)
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NoAffinity
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by NoAffinity »

Agreed, much appreciation for continually expanding the feature richness of this project.

Love the crt pr0n too. :)

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Shiver_169
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Shiver_169 »

Hi guys I think it's amazing everything that has been able to move forward with this project. Seeing the new features he asked me how they use the Downscale? Do they only use it for retro game versions on consoles like Xbox 360 and others or do they use it for any 480p content? Now I suppose the Downscale do it to connect their CRT monitors or use 240p on LCD?
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Gunstar
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Re: GBS 8200/8220 CFW Project

Post by Gunstar »

Did some testing with the Wii and PSP today, 480p/i worked perfectly on the Wii. I also tried out the PSP via ypbpr to see how the odd resolution it puts out looks like on an SD crt, it worked as you'd expect, windowed (with the PSP set to 16:9 or 4:3) like this example:
Image

I then tried to scale it horizontally, which works up to a point but then a blue bar would tint the right side:
Image
I don't know if a custom preset could be made as it seems vertical scaling is disabled/doesn't do anything making any horizontal scaling pointless anyway.

Not sure if this is a bug but whenever 480i is detected by the GBS using downscale mode I can no longer use the GBSControl web interface. I have to set it back to a progressive signal before I can access the GBS control again.

EDIT: OSSC says the PSP is outputting 576p
Last edited by Gunstar on Tue Feb 25, 2020 9:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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