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 Post subject: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 9:05 am 


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Another hardware thread started by me! This time I need some computer advice. Here's my shmupping situation: I own a 360 and all the Cave ports and a six year old computer for pc games and emulation. This way I can pretty much play every shooter there is except one: Ibara Kuro Black Label for a lack of a port and a good enough computer. But I love this game and really want to dig into it. Since it was recently re-added to MAME I am thinking about getting a new machine just for this and the new Civilization coming out this fall. My current machine is getting really crappy. Even Spotify has horrendous loading times by now. :D

But I don't know what kind of hardware is required to run SH3 games properly. On my AMD XII 2,4ghz there is very noticable stuttering. What would be the hardware specs to be able to play this game and all the other SH3 games 100%? AFAIK the main factors are CPU and RAM, is that right?
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:40 pm 


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You want to get an Intel processor, ideally. However, emulation is still far from perfect. I'd suggest going with an XBox 360, since it has ports for most CV1000 games anyway.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:15 pm 


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Waste of money. Wait for the new demul.


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:33 pm 


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Muchi Muchi Spork wrote:
Wait for the new demul.

Should be released soon (in about 3-4 years).
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:37 pm 


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Probably in the next 2 months.


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:53 pm 


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Really ? Sorry I've kind of become used to read announcements about DEmul followed by... silence for like over a year.

I know it's tough but they have a habit of teasing with new progress... and then nothing gets released for so long that you kind of forget it's still alive. ^^
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:15 pm 



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I7 sure is best. However amd core fx is also fine considering price difference.

If you use your computer a lot it might be worth paying for the cooler, more efficient Intel.

HOWEVER if you're really pushing down the budget ... you could see about keeping your motherboard and just upgrading the processor. If you've only a dual core then you can probably upgrade to a faster quad or six core should handle the emulation and civ - assuming your motherboard supports it.

Ram won't really matter for emulation. 8gb is probably enough for civ.


Depends on what suits but if it's just emulation you might be able to cut some corners for now


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:26 pm 


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I don't know much about this but rather than cores don't Hz/dotclock matter more than anything for Mame ?
(Moar Hz = faster ?)
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:46 pm 


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Xyga wrote:
I don't know much about this but rather than cores don't Hz/dotclock matter more than anything for Mame ?
(Moar Hz = faster ?)

Somewhat, one can argue an overclocked 3.2 GHz core 2 duo computer is less than powerful to an normal 2.4 GHz Sandy Bridge i5 computer due to better bandwidth on the memory bus and faster CPU cache. This is all dependent on mobo.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:11 pm 



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Sure in nearly all cases. however most emulators of more sophisticated systems take advantage of sse(2) -had presumed whatever drivers dealt with cave stuff were similar... Perhaps not. Altugh I guess most processors over 3.4 are quads and up?

Also for civ, a quad or more core is highly recommended - one of the few games that really takes advantage of available cores - especially in large/late games. Also since it's one of those games suited to multitasking / windowed play.

Of course the effectiveness of a single core is not all clock speed - hence the i7 at 3.4 will outperform the 4ghz fx even on a single core.

Is this a premium worth paying for however? Depends on individual situations :)


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:48 pm 



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No point getting i7 for something like this though, unless it supports hyperthreading which I doubt it does.

i5 for gaming.


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:51 pm 


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The slowdown is still no good, if you're used to the PCBs then I wouldn't build a machine for CV1000 emulation just yet.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:55 pm 


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I still dream of a laptop with a big IPS screen and enough juice and cooling to handle even super-demanding emulators like PCSX2 and the heaviest Mame stuff. :mrgreen:

'Come back in 10 years Xyga' -> yeah I know. :(
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:29 pm 


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Jockel wrote:
You want to get an Intel processor, ideally. However, emulation is still far from perfect. I'd suggest going with an XBox 360, since it has ports for most CV1000 games anyway.


As stated above, I do have a 360 with all the Cave ports but there is no port of Ibara Kuro. :)

That it is not accurately emulated yet doesn't really matter. I suppose it's being worked on and then the hardware reqs will be the same. And I need a new machine anyway with Civ Beyond Earth on it's way. Civ 5 is playable on my machine but when I load a savegame it takes forever and when it's finally loaded the clouds take like 30 seconds to appear. :D

So, apparently it will be an i5 with 8gb of RAM.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:36 pm 


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Well IMHO Ibara Kuro is a cool game but definitely not one of Cave's best. I don't think it's worth upgrading a computer just for playing it emulated.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 11:47 pm 


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Aww Xyga man, why you change your avatar? I got used to that big red angry face bearing down on me.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 12:11 am 


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PAPER/ARTILLERY wrote:
Aww Xyga man, why you change your avatar? I got used to that big red angry face bearing down on me.

Okay, here's Red's angry face.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 12:34 am 


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CDexWard wrote:
Jockel wrote:
You want to get an Intel processor, ideally. However, emulation is still far from perfect. I'd suggest going with an XBox 360, since it has ports for most CV1000 games anyway.


As stated above, I do have a 360 with all the Cave ports but there is no port of Ibara Kuro. :)

That it is not accurately emulated yet doesn't really matter. I suppose it's being worked on and then the hardware reqs will be the same. And I need a new machine anyway with Civ Beyond Earth on it's way. Civ 5 is playable on my machine but when I load a savegame it takes forever and when it's finally loaded the clouds take like 30 seconds to appear. :D

So, apparently it will be an i5 with 8gb of RAM.


The single most significant way to speed up a computer these days is to get a Solid-State Drive. Get a smallish one and throw some games on there, and preferably your OS as well, keep your HDD for data storage.


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 1:02 am 


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Xyga wrote:
PAPER/ARTILLERY wrote:
Aww Xyga man, why you change your avatar? I got used to that big red angry face bearing down on me.

Okay, here's Red's angry face.


Haha! That's better, but it's no sweaty crackhead major though. ;)
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 1:04 am 


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PAPER/ARTILLERY wrote:
Haha! That's better, but it's no sweaty crackhead major though. ;)

Lost the pic, I'll redo it sometime. I admit it was, er... nice.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 7:14 am 


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If you want to play Kuro just pick up a PCB and sell it on at a later date? Won't lose much if any value.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2014 2:15 am 


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cools wrote:
If you want to play Kuro just pick up a PCB and sell it on at a later date? Won't lose much if any value.


That was my thought as well. Or do both, so you can hang out in the Cave on Steam threads.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:05 am 


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It is one thing to already have a computer capable of doing it, I'm not sure it is worth buying new hardware for that purpose alone.
My 5+ year old computer can do it at 100% emulation speed for most of the games, minor dips in Ibara and Pink Sweets at times, and that is using an overclocked core 2 quad cranked to over 4Ghz.
I have a new computer now though that runs everything perfectly, but SH3 emulation is just an afterthought.

I would get a cheap GPU and put your money towards a high clocked over-clockable Intel chip and a good heatsink for it and run it at 4Ghz+ since MAME and especially SH3 needs a single high frequency core to shine. Some chips prioritize multi-core performance and cost more because of that. I would get the highest frequency intel core i3 you can find. You will save money and will likely perform no worse than an i5 or i7 since you just need one fast core.

SH3 emulation is actually really good. I use the HLSL CRT/ scanline configuration someone made and posted on this board.

The only issue with playing these SH3 games in MAME is that if you turn on v-sync or triple buffering there is noticeable input lag, having them off results in very little input lag but there will be minor screen tearing. It looks like a vertical line, or a slight alignment tear that floats across the screen every once in a while. But with scan lines you can't even see it.

Some games seem to retain the slow down of the Xbox ports I have to some degree. Some games have much less slowdown, good luck beating Ibara Kuro. You can adjust the blitter delay to improve this supposedly.


Last edited by Astraea FGA Mk. I on Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:10 am 


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If using MAME then stick with an Intel processor, the i5 range is recommended, i7 is over kill and only offers HyperThreading over the i5 and if your not video encoding then the i7 is a complete waste of money and not needed as no games and especially MAME doesn't take advantage of HT so you'll be wasting the extra £80 odd the i7 is over an i5. If your wanting to save even more money then even a i3 would do for MAME as at the time of typing MAME doesnt support more than dual cores and for PC gaming if this was coupled with a decent GPU then you could probably get away with a high clock speed i3 as games depend more on GPU horsepower....but there is a balancing act between the 2. Thing to remember is MAME is CPU driven, it doesn't hardly use any GPU processing power (unless your using the HLSL settings), its something like a ratio of 90/10 in favor of the CPU.

Regarding actual PC gaming, then the 3 GPU is king and get yourself a SSD also to make thing even more rapid on the system, a 256GB SSD can be had for as little as £79 now!!!! and after the GPU is the next best upgrade you can get to speed the PC up.

If this system was just going to be used for MAME then i would suggest getting an old ATI x600- x900 card, GroovyMame (more or less eradicates input lag) and the CRTEmuDriver (if using a CRT), but if your wanting to play PC games then stick with a Nvidia card something like a 660 can be had rather cheaply now and will run majority of games at high settings when gaming at 1080p res, for example my 2-3 year old 560Ti runs MAME with HLSL settings @ 1080p flawlessly and modern games with high settings.

How much are you wanting to spend?


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2014 8:43 pm 


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I have a GM set up with a E8500 and a HD4350 which im really happy with but once I know CV1000/SH3 is 100% id be willing to build another decent PC, pretty sure it will be a while yet though..
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2014 8:11 am 


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Astraea FGA Mk. I wrote:
The only issue with playing these SH3 games in MAME is that if you turn on v-sync or triple buffering there is noticeable input lag, having them off results in very little input lag but there will be minor screen tearing. It looks like a vertical line, or a slight alignment tear that floats across the screen every once in a while. But with scan lines you can't even see it.


Thank you. I've been wondering how people were getting good results with certain processors, and I always have vsync on ( CRT cab). Explains it.
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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 9:50 am 


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This would be an excellent computer for your intentions.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/registry/wis ... av_lists_1

The total is £473.52 from Amazon.co.uk.

For wireless internet you could get a USB WiFi dongle. I would also suggest a USB hub for your controllers, if you trip over the cable you won't break the case.

edit *I previously had a micro-atx motherboard that would not fit the case on the list, I swapped it out for a micro-itx board so everything should be fine. Thanks for pointing it out, always double-check the parts when people like me suggest a build*

It may be more than you wanted to spend, it could be adjusted.
I picked high quality parts. High quality doesn't always mean high end, or unnecessarily expensive. They are well designed, durable and come with excellent warranties (Corsair).
It would also be capable of a lot more than MAME, it would handle any kind of emulation and even recent PC games.
If you intend to use GroovyMame to connect the machine to a CRT you would want a GPU compliant with that.

Turns out intel i3 processors Can't be overclocked, but this one runs at 3.7Ghz which should have no problem running SH3 at 100%, modern chips can do a lot more with their clock rate. An equivalent clocked i5 quad core would cost a lot more.
Your local Amazon will have all of this, as will any good retailer of computer components.

Even though I am almost certain this combination would be compatible, It would be worth going over the list carefully and double checking that everything is right.
*see above edit XD

This is what I would get for a dedicated emulation box.

You could even drop the GPU as the processor has on board graphics. Reduces the price to £393.52. The machine should run MAME just as well. Having the GPU I listed would be for emulation that utilizes it, and PC games.


Last edited by Astraea FGA Mk. I on Tue Aug 19, 2014 10:23 am, edited 7 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 2:17 pm 


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Astraea FGA Mk. I wrote:
Even though I am almost certain this combination would be highly compatible, It would be worth going over the list carefully and double checking that everything is right.

I don't think you'll be able to fit a Micro-ATX board into a case that is meant for Mini-ITX boards.


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 7:12 am 


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Yes you are correct I made a mistake, it needs a micro-itx motherboard or a micro-atx case I'll fix that... *fixed*


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 Post subject: Re: New machine for MAME SH3
PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 12:51 pm 


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I agree on everything, I have a i3 4330, 8gb ram, 256 gb ssd and a 750ti as GPU and MAME 0.153 runs very smooth in all games.
Slowdown emulation is another subject unfortunately... now where is my cave collection kawaii for PS4?


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