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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:39 am 


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It's called gcompsw and it's coming:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=50851&start=3335

First post on the page.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:04 am 



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Lomax wrote:
It's called gcompsw and it's coming:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=50851&start=3335

First post on the page.


Well, ok then. I guess I just saw the name and the current product and got confused. Big thanks, first day on the forum and I didn't know what the new product actually was but that explained it. Can't wait to combo this with my HD Retrovision cables. Is there any kind of mailing list or do I need to just keep checking back?

Edit: Don't know if this will be mountable but that would be amazing.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:20 am 


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Subscribe to this thread and keep an eye on it. The first post is always updated with the current status - so that's what to check if you're just waiting for availability.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:49 pm 


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sMack wrote:
Hopefully someone can help me out here as I've been looking for this for months. I'm needing an active 8-port auto component switcher. Is gRetroStuff considering making one or does anyone know of any commercial model out there? It's a must for me and after half a year or so of searching I can't find anything. Also, not really looking to daisy chain as I'll need all the ports.

After I complete this current SCART switch version (almost done), I will start working on 8:2 component version. But I can't tell when it's going to be available.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:16 pm 



Joined: 27 Sep 2018
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superg wrote:
energizerfellow‌ wrote:
Does the new gscartsw put out any voltage on SCART pin 8? If so, what's the SCART spec for any current draw on this line?

Yes, 12V, you can draw 25mA from there.

Is that for your design specifically or part of the SCART spec? I ask as I can't seem to find any termination or draw info on pin 8 in any of the free official specs documents I can find without paying money for some PDFs.

If you're open to chip suggestions, check out the ISL59885, which should be a drop-in replacement for the LM1881/EL1883. I've seen a number of reports that the LM1881 can bend images slightly and the ISL59885 is just plain more modern chip with a cleaner output that kills Macrovision. The ISL59885 can be found in the HAS supergun, for instance. If you want a fun bonus side project, the ISL59885 has a detect pin for >25khz sync, so you could create an automatic video output switch that selects between a standard/medium resolution csync output or HV-sync EDTV/HDTV output depending on input video signal (think 15khz CRT on one output and modern 31khz monitor on the other with auto switching).


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:27 pm 


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energizerfellow‌ wrote:
superg wrote:
energizerfellow‌ wrote:
Does the new gscartsw put out any voltage on SCART pin 8? If so, what's the SCART spec for any current draw on this line?

Yes, 12V, you can draw 25mA from there.

Is that for your design specifically or part of the SCART spec? I ask as I can't seem to find any termination or draw info on pin 8 in any of the free official specs documents I can find without paying money for some PDFs.

If you're open to chip suggestions, check out the ISL59885, which should be a drop-in replacement for the LM1881/EL1883. I've seen a number of reports that the LM1881 can bend images slightly and the ISL59885 is just plain more modern chip with a cleaner output that kills Macrovision. The ISL59885 can be found in the HAS supergun, for instance. If you want a fun bonus side project, the ISL59885 has a detect pin for >25khz sync, so you could create an automatic video output switch that selects between a standard/medium resolution csync output or HV-sync EDTV/HDTV output depending on input video signal.

You can't draw from pin 8 / 16 as these are status only, some official RGB cables (PlayStation for instance) have components in the cable for to limit the current.
I don't currently use LM1881/EL1883, everything is performed digitally by Altera thus no bend and latency is so much better. I decided not to implement HV sync in newer gscartsw (starting from lite) as low resolution console output is usually a problem for most VGA monitors.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:51 pm 



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superg wrote:
sMack wrote:
Hopefully someone can help me out here as I've been looking for this for months. I'm needing an active 8-port auto component switcher. Is gRetroStuff considering making one or does anyone know of any commercial model out there? It's a must for me and after half a year or so of searching I can't find anything. Also, not really looking to daisy chain as I'll need all the ports.

After I complete this current SCART switch version (almost done), I will start working on 8:2 component version. But I can't tell when it's going to be available.


Thanks for making this. It is something that is absolutely needed. I have two sets that have 6 consoles each plus a DVD player, all using HD Retrovision cables(as soon as the Dreamcast cables come out anyways), and it will leave me with one more space if I ever need to add another console. Do your thing then name your price and I'll for sure pick a couple up.

Btw, any chance it would be in the estimated range of 35.5 X 31.75 centimeters, length and width?


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 7:14 pm 


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sMack wrote:
Btw, any chance it would be in the estimated range of 35.5 X 31.75 centimeters, length and width?

I can't say for sure at this point, first PCB has to be redesigned. Ultimately I'd like to make it as tall as gscartsw (if I manage to order custom connectors with reduced height) and with more or less same width as gscartsw. As of length, it will be minimum to accomodate the connectors, I'm currently thinking 5x2 connector rows - 4x2 inputs and 1x2 outputs.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 11:49 pm 


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Update: SoG->RGBS HD and forwarding works as expected! That was most crucial thing to test.
There is some minor issue, probably configuration, didn't have time to investigate yet.
What is left is to implement other DIP options (just the configuration) and make final tests.
I mostly work on weekends, not always able to do something every day.
After firmware is finalized I make the 2nd sub batch order (which will cover all ordered units) and start shipping 1st sub batch, hope that explains it.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 2:51 am 



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Does the switch strip the sync from green or just duplicate the sync data? In the generic sense do most displays gracefully handle having multiple copies of the same sync data sent across multiple pins?


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 3:18 am 


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superg wrote:
Update: SoG->RGBS HD and forwarding works as expected! That was most crucial thing to test.
There is some minor issue, probably configuration, didn't have time to investigate yet.
What is left is to implement other DIP options (just the configuration) and make final tests.
I mostly work on weekends, not always able to do something every day.
After firmware is finalized I make the 2nd sub batch order (which will cover all ordered units) and start shipping 1st sub batch, hope that explains it.


Awesome!
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  • YPbPr->Garo
    • PSP
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 2:05 pm 


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energizerfellow‌ wrote:
Does the switch strip the sync from green or just duplicate the sync data? In the generic sense do most displays gracefully handle having multiple copies of the same sync data sent across multiple pins?

It strips, or you can leave it there if DIP switch is set.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 3:51 pm 



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Is there any way for us (customers) to upgrade the firmware on these switches if there is a bug? Or is the only option is to ship it back?
I don't have a switch yet, just was wondering.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 3:55 pm 


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Dazdigo wrote:
Is there any way for us (customers) to upgrade the firmware on these switches if there is a bug? Or is the only option is to ship it back?
I don't have a switch yet, just was wondering.

There are no current plans to publish the firmware so the only way is to ship it back.
On a bright note this never happened before, once it works it works, it's not software, I always test everything and I have most used equipment here.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:04 pm 



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With how highly rated your switches are, I'll take your word on it :D


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:37 pm 


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I currently experience some difficulties implementing DIP switch SoG configuration, thought it will go easier, it just needs more time.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:16 pm 



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Super G, what to do think the timeline is for your next batch of gCOMPsw? Six to eight months after the current SCART project? I'm curious because I'm thinking of ordering a JVC 3/1 component switch in the meantime.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:27 pm 


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Reluctant Hero wrote:
Super G, what to do think the timeline is for your next batch of gCOMPsw? Six to eight months after the current SCART project? I'm curious because I'm thinking of ordering a JVC 3/1 component switch in the meantime.

I'd say no longer than 6 months from now until I can accept pre-orders for it.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:08 am 



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I was wonder if we can use the gcompsw composite port for digital coaxial audio or would this cause issues with it?


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:38 am 



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Dazdigo wrote:
I was wonder if we can use the gcompsw composite port for digital coaxial audio or would this cause issues with it?

It'll probably be safe electrically, but I'm not sure that the chip would pass S/PDIF. Even if it works, it'll be impractical, because, as far as I know, no game consoles use coaxial cabling for S/PDIF, just TOSLINK; which means you'll need additional cabling and power requirements for every TOSLINK-capable console you want hooked up.

You'd be better off trying to use that TOSLINK addon for the gscartsw with your gcompsw. I believe the EXT ports are wired the same between the gcompsw and gscartsw, so I'd expect it to work fine, though only ports 1-4 would get automatically switched.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:08 pm 


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nmalinoski wrote:
Dazdigo wrote:
I was wonder if we can use the gcompsw composite port for digital coaxial audio or would this cause issues with it?

It'll probably be safe electrically, but I'm not sure that the chip would pass S/PDIF. Even if it works, it'll be impractical, because, as far as I know, no game consoles use coaxial cabling for S/PDIF, just TOSLINK; which means you'll need additional cabling and power requirements for every TOSLINK-capable console you want hooked up.

You'd be better off trying to use that TOSLINK addon for the gscartsw with your gcompsw. I believe the EXT ports are wired the same between the gcompsw and gscartsw, so I'd expect it to work fine, though only ports 1-4 would get automatically switched.

Actually I'd suggest to wait a bit on TOSLINK addon because I didn't really check everything there and what I provide on EXT header in gscartsw_lite is 5v power and 3 inputs wired directly to Altera without any level translation. Altera is 3.3V so some level translation has to be performed on the board or there is a risk of damaged Altera. New switch has protection for that.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:25 pm 



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Assuming people are using HDMI on things like the 360 and PS3, what even uses SPDIF? Just the PS2 and OG Xbox, right?


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:54 pm 



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energizerfellow‌ wrote:
Assuming people are using HDMI on things like the 360 and PS3, what even uses SPDIF? Just the PS2 and OG Xbox, right?

PS2 and Xbox were the only consoles that have TOSLINK and no better options for digital audio.

PS3, Xbox 360, PlayStation 4 (original and Pro), and Xbox One (original, S, X) all have TOSLINK ports, but they also have HDMI, which is far more capable than TOSLINK.

Then there are TOSLINK mods for several consoles, including the SNES, Saturn, Dreamcast, PlayStation, and GameCube. There might be others, but I figure this is enough of an example.

Outside of consoles, you'll mostly see TOSLINK on CD players, especially those that support surround and quadraphonic formats like SACD or DVD-Audio, and it will often be available on DVD and Blu-ray players. You'll also see it on some PC motherboards that were manufactured in the mid- and late-aughts.


Last edited by nmalinoski on Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:48 pm 



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I'm fully aware of the other sources, but with the exception of LaserDisc (S-Video + Toslink) and some legacy pro tape formats (likely BNC YPbPr + balanced AES3), all those optical discs can be played in a modern Blu-ray player that will have HDMI, including both DVD-Audio and SACD. We've also hit the "HDMI all the things" when it comes to console mods these days. It's likely to be very rare for anybody to need more than 2-3 Toslink ports.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:25 pm 



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nmalinoski wrote:
energizerfellow‌ wrote:
Assuming people are using HDMI on things like the 360 and PS3, what even uses SPDIF? Just the PS2 and OG Xbox, right?

PS3, Xbox 360, PlayStation 4 (original and Pro), and Xbox One (original, S, X) all have TOSLINK ports, but they also have HDMI, which is far more capable than TOSLINK.

There was also the original Xbox 360, which did not have HDMI but did have TOSLINK.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:56 pm 



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copy wrote:
There was also the original Xbox 360, which did not have HDMI but did have TOSLINK.

And most of them have probably RRODed by now.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:36 am 


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energizerfellow‌ wrote:
Assuming people are using HDMI on things like the 360 and PS3, what even uses SPDIF? Just the PS2 and OG Xbox, right?

If they have an old ass receiver they may still need SPDIF for all their connections. I actually was just able to switch my HDMI systems to HDMI audio because I just got a new TV with Optical out to go in to my 2005 surround sound system for example, before that I needed optical switchers to get everything going.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2018 6:58 pm 



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You can get optical out of both the original xbox and the xbox 360 with their component cables/adapters. I am aware that there are adapters for the xbox360 that break out the audio for the jasper models as well that have the HDMI output included.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:07 pm 


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Update: good news, the root cause of the current problem is found. It will take another 7-10 days to build everything around it but everything is clean and nice (Altera firmware).
I really hope to order second sub batch and start shipping in time. Thank you all for the patience.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:13 am 



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Does the sync DSP have Automatic Frequency Control (AFC) (Sony's branding for the simple line TBC or frame sync found in SVHS and DVD recorders?) for correcting a wavy flagging image due to a corrupt sync signal missing the horizontal slices in the vertical sync block? This is a thing with the SMS, PCE, or MVS/AES on the A-series BVMs that lack VCR mode, along with the JVC DT-V and some Ikegami, possibly others. I'm also 99% sure it's the root cause of Taito F3 on OSSC issues as well. This can be fixed via the SERR switch on a Extron RGB 160xi (all Extron "xi" boxes including the current RGB 580xi?), but having it on the gscartsw would be nice.

More info:
http://retrorgb.com/bkm-68x.html
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=60403
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=57929

Since you mentioned SoG issues, is this what you ran into?

https://www.intersil.com/content/dam/In ... /tb476.pdf


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