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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:06 pm 



Joined: 17 Sep 2012
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Xyga wrote:
The W7 measured slightly below 14ms in at least in two reviews I's read, but not everyone uses the Leo Bodnar Lag tester the same way.

I think Fudoh's testing is done from the top bar (check page 1), some websites use the middle or bottom bar and try only the game mode on default settings.
Maybe the W8 would show a lower figure if it was tested the way Fudoh did ?
Don't know...


I used rtings.com and displaylag.com and looked their scores there. They both use the Leo Bodnar's tester. rtings I was not able to discern how they score theirs but displaylag either uses the average of all 3 bars or on some TV's, with just the bottom bar (though this is limited to pre June 24th, 2013 testing). The 2014 W8 I got scored 24.3ms on rtings and 22ms (average) on displaylag.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:09 pm 



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I haven't had a chance to read through the whole thread yet, so I apologize if this has been asked to death, but:

For people in the US, is the W950B series good for gaming, or should I be looking at a different model, instead? I'm trying to get something that's a good, all-purpose TV, but yeah... it has to be good for games, in particular.

Edit: Ideally, good enough for Beatmania.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 1:21 am 


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KDL-55W950B gets a 17ms rating, or one frame of lag @ 60FPS, from this site: http://www.displaylag.com/display-database/

That's the fastest rating for any HDTV in their list at the moment. Interesting, though, that there is a sizable jump from the monitors coming in at 13ms or lower.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 1:49 am 



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Wow, that seems pretty solid, then. I'm pretty sure that's less lag than my Panasonic plasma from 2008 had, so considering I could still kick ass in IIDX on that, I'm sure I'll be fine here.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 8:54 am 


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At $1599 that's definitely a better deal than the imported W7!
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:54 pm 


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@Fudoh: Please do the same review with the models KDL-42W705 and KDL-42W805.

I think the KDL-42W805 or at least the KDL-42W705 is the best gaming TV of 2014.

In following list the KDL-42W705 is already better then KDL-42W650: http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/input-lag


It would be very nice if you could at least test the KDL-42W805.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:05 am 


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Really nice review, thanks Fudoh!
I'm thinking about buying a new television for my gaming needs due of the poor upscaling of my current set-up.
Unfortunately the W6 series isn't really available anymore in Germany but there are the newer models of course.
What can I expect from the Sony BRAVIA KDL-42W805 for example? I would love to finally play Wii (and other stuff of course) so I'm especially concerned about the component-input of the television, is it of similar quality to the W6 series reviewed here?

Thanks in advance

Regads


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:06 am 


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All fine. Just pay attention that it's a VA and not an IPS panel. I certainly have lost track which display has which, especially since oftenimes the 2013 "A" models are different than the 2014 "B" models.

Component input quality on all Sony 2013/2014 models is great. Just don't expect too much from the Wii's output quality in general.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 9:44 am 


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The W7 (Sony KDL-42W705B) is available in Germany. It's 99% exactly the same as the W6.
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2014 5:42 am 



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I just bought one of these sets, thanks in large part to Xyga and Fudoh. I am wondering, how you are guys calibrating them? Which settings do you use? Do you use Game-Standard or Game-Original? etc.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2014 9:01 am 


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Personally I first disable the power saving mode in the system settings, then

Scene: Game
Mode: Game-Original
Backlight: 4 (sometimes 5 if I use strong 'scanlines')
Color: Neutral
Gamma: -1

^This is where I start.
Then I go the 'White Balance' menu and adjust the RGB gain sliders to my liking.

Sometimes I turn the 'Enhancer' on (set to 'Low'). It may or may not look better depending on your 'Sharpness' value.

As Fudoh already mentioned 'Sharpness' is the tricky one, I leave it at 50 most of the time, but depending on the source it can look better with a lower value. For instance some 480p sources will look better around 32-35. Sometimes I find certain component sources better if boosted to 55-60.

Everything other setting/option is Off.

All this is for my particular set which I believe wasn't very well factory-calibrated (too much green) and my own visual preference.
Yours may be different.
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2014 5:51 pm 


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Generally the models with the IPS panel will have slightly less lag than the ones with VA but much worse black levels. Right?

So better black levels are preferable over less lag when tv's reach a certain low input lag? On the other side VA panels has color problems. :)

Well i already ordered the KDL-42W705 just curious. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2014 7:27 pm 


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Not really, the panel type plays a very minor role in regards to lag. You'll find quite a bit of VA displays with less lag than IPSes.
The main cause for lag is the internal processing (the display's own internal scaler and how it manages video signals).

Regarding the LCD panels themselves the main difference lies in pixel response times; IPS panels are dealing with pixel color transitions more consistently than VA ones.
Today both types can be very close in terms of performance, but VA will still show some noticeable trailing on specific color transitions (i.e. black->dark grey->black) where IPS have no particular problem.

Still that doesn't make VA panels useless for gaming, curent models have very good RTC (pixel overdrive).
They're just 'not good enough' for games with very fast moving objects and therefore difficult transitions.
Yeah, essentially FPS games.

So;
- IPS are a bit faster, show more consistent colors and shades of black>grey, and their viewing angles are the best.
- VA have much superior contrast ratio and black levels, usually true 8bit colors without dithering, and less off-angle glow.
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2014 7:33 pm 



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I cannot find the overscan correction options anywhere on my KDL-50W700B. Could it be a feature available in Europe but not in NA?


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2014 7:35 pm 


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Should be in the screen settings (not in the picture options).

There you will find aspect and size controls, with three levels of overscan, -1, 1, +1.
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2014 7:45 pm 



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Ah, there we go. This is my first time owning and using a "smart" TV. Some options are only accessibly through its OS. And, for any NA members here, the options look slightly different than how they are described in this thread. The options are -1, Normal, and Full Pixel.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2014 7:47 pm 


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Yes that's it but I was just too lazy to power mine on and check. :lol:
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 5:59 am 


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Xyga wrote:
Not really, the panel type plays a very minor role in regards to lag. You'll find quite a bit of VA displays with less lag than IPSes.
The main cause for lag is the internal processing (the display's own internal scaler and how it manages video signals).

Regarding the LCD panels themselves the main difference lies in pixel response times; IPS panels are dealing with pixel color transitions more consistently than VA ones.
Today both types can be very close in terms of performance, but VA will still show some noticeable trailing on specific color transitions (i.e. black->dark grey->black) where IPS have no particular problem.

Still that doesn't make VA panels useless for gaming, curent models have very good RTC (pixel overdrive).
They're just 'not good enough' for games with very fast moving objects and therefore difficult transitions.
Yeah, essentially FPS games.

So;
- IPS are a bit faster, show more consistent colors and shades of black>grey, and their viewing angles are the best.
- VA have much superior contrast ratio and black levels, usually true 8bit colors without dithering, and less off-angle glow.

Thanks so much for your help Xyga. :)

Well got a bit confused with all of the different models and said to hell with it and bought the 42W705. :)

Also it generally seems that the fastest HDTV VA panels wants to be closer to 20ms in input lag. So a VA panel with this much speed and relative good viewing angles is pretty rare. :) I didn't dare go with the 42W805A & 42W805B which both are IPS panels and those seem to most of the time have pretty bad black levels. Plus no lag test reviews. The above 42" Sony tv's however seem to have a good deal of detailed reviews.

The 40W905A has a VA panel but is a bit out of my price range.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 8:53 am 


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So the 2014 W805 have an IPS panel like the 2013 W802 ? I've missed that part.
And the 40W905 is VA ? Lolwut Sony ? :lol:
edit: ah okay that particular W9 is 2013's, I'm getting more and more confused with all the renaming and stuff. *sigh* Sony.

The 2014 W8 series expanded to several new models (W805, W815, W829, W855) and I haven't read reviews with lag measurements for each but I doubt any of those would do any better than the W7 purely for gaming.
The biggest concern would be the atrocious use of IPS that Sony already demonstrated last year with the W802.

So yes I believe the W7 series is still the #1 choice for large screen gaming.
Maybe the new W805 would be preferable for people who actually think about playing FPS extensively on their TV, but I don't see the point since those games fare much, much better on dedicated fast PC monitors.
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:03 pm 


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Wait a minute teh W805 this year are VA, not IPS.
Only the W802 (2013) and W950 (2014) have an IPS panel.
All W8 (2014) are VA.
What a mess!
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:54 pm 


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Xyga wrote:
Wait a minute teh W805 this year are VA, not IPS.
Only the W802 (2013) and W950 (2014) have an IPS panel.
All W8 (2014) are VA.
What a mess!

Yes Sir it sure is confusing. Some pages say IPS others VA. :?

So the 2013 model 42W805A has the IPS panel and this years 42W805B has the VA?

And the 40W905 PSA panel? (VA type panel?)

Maybe someone can help clarify before i confuse any more people. :lol: Im just a total newbie searching with google. Maybe the only way to be sure is to mail Sony. :|


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:12 pm 


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Quote:
So the 2013 model 42W805A has the IPS panel and this years 42W805B has the VA?

I think so, yes.

Quote:
And the 40W905 PSA panel? (VA type panel?)

2014 W900 was VA, 2014 W900 is IPS.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:37 pm 


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I found this online pdf. Looks pretty correct: http://tinyurl.com/ny6f5uq

Spoiler: show
Image


Still missing the 42W805B lag test though. But it's properly pretty close to the 705B. :)


Last edited by spaceape on Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:49 pm 


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Quote:
I found this online pdf.

but that's strictly for the 2013 models which might no longer be available.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:57 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
Quote:
I found this online pdf.

but that's strictly for the 2013 models which might no longer be available.

Alright Thanks.

Well i guess there's nothing else to do then than wait for a lag test to be done on the tv's to be sure. :) But still im happy with my purchase of the 705B which i know for sure is a good screen (and cheaper than the 805B. 8) ). :)


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:36 pm 


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We need a full comparative list with each model/country/year/panel. :lol:

Or we just stick to the basic knowledge: in 2014 the W7 have the least lag and the W8 have a bit more but offer additional features.
And they're both VA.
Period. :P
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:46 pm 


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Xyga wrote:
We need a full comparative list with each model/country/year/panel. :lol:

Or we just stick to the basic knowledge: in 2014 the W7 have the least lag and the W8 have a bit more but offer additional features.
And they're both VA.
Period. :P

Yes you're right Xyga. Lol your avatar shows pretty well how you fell about it mate. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:49 pm 


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spaceape wrote:
Lol your avatar shows pretty well how you fell about it mate. :lol:

He's in a staring contest with yours, but I'm not sure he'll win... :lol:
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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 8:51 pm 


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Another review: http://www.trustedreviews.com/sony-kdl- ... _TV_review

This one mentions a lag of only 12ms. Well i trust the others a bit more but sounds great nonetheless. :D

One last question. Is the tv sometimes mentioned as the 42W705 the same as the 42w705B? Im pretty sure it is since both hdtvtest.co.uk and digitalversus.com writes both in the top of their reviews. There also exist a 706B where i guess the only difference is in the color.


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 Post subject: Re: Sony W6 series LCD review - 2013's best gaming TV
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 8:58 pm 


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700 series was new this year, so yes, there's only one version. The last digit can relate to the built in tuner versions. It's different from country to country and sometimes even more than one version is available per country.


Last edited by Fudoh on Wed Sep 10, 2014 8:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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