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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:33 pm 



Joined: 02 Sep 2016
Posts: 131
Does anybody know if I can replace the NES-001 (front loader) voltage regulator with a higher output version (5v, 2a) and then not use the NESRGB external regulator?

According to the NESRGB pinout, I can short J3 to use the NES voltage regulator instead of the external regulator included with the NESRGB. Does this mean I don't need to connect anything to the +5V and GND pads on the NESRGB? (i.e. the NESRGB would be powered through the PPU socket on the motherboard?)

I think replacing the NES regulator would make the installation a bit cleaner but is the external regulator still recommended regardless?


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 6:36 pm 



Joined: 13 Mar 2011
Posts: 1040
Location: Toronto, Canada
sofakng wrote:
Does anybody know if I can replace the NES-001 (front loader) voltage regulator with a higher output version (5v, 2a) and then not use the NESRGB external regulator?

According to the NESRGB pinout, I can short J3 to use the NES voltage regulator instead of the external regulator included with the NESRGB. Does this mean I don't need to connect anything to the +5V and GND pads on the NESRGB? (i.e. the NESRGB would be powered through the PPU socket on the motherboard?)

I think replacing the NES regulator would make the installation a bit cleaner but is the external regulator still recommended regardless?


I've installed a few hundred NESRGB's into NES-001 consoles. I've never installed Tim's external regulator; it's not needed. For the past 2 years I have been installing the 5V/2A regulator as well as doing all caps on the system as a preventative maintenance.

Not sure why Tim still ships that regulator. He can save a couple of bucks by not shipping it. He doesn't ship it with NES Top Loader.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:34 am 



Joined: 02 Sep 2016
Posts: 131
Thanks for the information.

Yeah, I'm not sure on the difference between the NES-001 (front loader) and NES-101 (top loader) that makes Tim not include the external regulator for the NES-101.

I can't find any information on the NES-001 voltage regulator besides it showing part "AN7805". Maybe it has a lower max current (500ma/1a?) which is why Tim recommends the external regulator. Hopefully the upgraded 5v/2a will work OK (and based on your installs it sounds like it will!)

The only other part I'm adding to the system is a Borti NES I/O board but it looks like that uses an additional voltage regulator anyways.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 10:28 pm 


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Posts: 871
Location: San Jose, CA
sofakng wrote:
Thanks for the information.I can't find any information on the NES-001 voltage regulator besides it showing part "AN7805". Maybe it has a lower max current (500ma/1a?) which is why Tim recommends the external regulator.

I think it's largely because the front loader has a tiny heat sink on the 7805 whereas the top loader and AV Famicom have pretty chunky heat sinks. On mine I installed the external regulator, but I think if you add some thermal compound on the 7805 you might be able to get away without it.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 11:07 pm 


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Joined: 28 Jan 2012
Posts: 871
Location: San Jose, CA
ApolloBoy wrote:
Tim sent me a couple of firmware updates to fix the unstable sync issue, one that cleans up the entire sync signal and another that just fixes sync on the first line. I just flashed the second update and it seems to completely fix the problem!

Just to follow up, Tim wanted me to try the first firmware update he sent me and it wound up not really fixing the problem. Flashed it back to the second one and it's working fine again.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 12:51 pm 


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Joined: 02 Jan 2016
Posts: 119
sofakng wrote:
Does anybody know if I can replace the NES-001 (front loader) voltage regulator with a higher output version (5v, 2a) and then not use the NESRGB external regulator?

According to the NESRGB pinout, I can short J3 to use the NES voltage regulator instead of the external regulator included with the NESRGB. Does this mean I don't need to connect anything to the +5V and GND pads on the NESRGB? (i.e. the NESRGB would be powered through the PPU socket on the motherboard?)

I think replacing the NES regulator would make the installation a bit cleaner but is the external regulator still recommended regardless?


Replacing the stock VR with one of higher amp will not improve heat dissipation. Viletim commented on this here:

viletim wrote:

mvsfan wrote:
the second voltage regulator isnt nessecary if you replace the original one with a 1.5a 7805CV regulator.


Changing the regulator from the 1A to 1.5A version has no effect at all on the power (heat) dissipated by it. That is dependant on the load and input voltage. The only time it would source > 1A is under a fault condition, anyway.


The reason viletim includes the additional VR for NES-001 kits is for improved heat dissipation. NES-101 consoles have a proper heat sink, NES-001 consoles don't. Before installing a NESRGB kit into a NES-001 you will find the heat sink gets warm to the touch. After installing the NESRGB you will find it gets hot to the touch. It will get even hotter if using a flashcart like the Everdrive N8. A NES-001 with NESRGB + EDN8 will only draw roughly ~500 mA so I don't see how replacing the stock VR with a 1.5A or 2A type yields any kind of benefit. Maybe I'm missing something?

I don't know why people skip installing the additional VR. It will not hurt your console and it only takes 3 minutes to install. I would recommend installing it if it's even for peace of mind. Your console will have improved heat dissipation which will be better for long term reliability.
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Last edited by unmaker on Wed Mar 06, 2019 2:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:47 pm 



Joined: 02 Sep 2016
Posts: 131
That's good information to know, thanks. It's definitely cleaner to not have the extra wires and regulator, but if it's less stable then it sounds like the extra regulator is probably worth it. It's not a big deal, but it would be nice to have the installation be as clean as possible.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 11:33 pm 



Joined: 02 Sep 2016
Posts: 131
One more question...

Do I need to remove any capacitors on the NESRGB if I'm using an SNES SCART cable that has 220 uF capacitors on the RGB lines?

Also, should the SCART cable have a 470 Ohm resistor on the CSYNC line? Should I then short J8 for 75-ohm termination? (I'm using an NESRGB 2.0)

Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 3:28 am 


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Joined: 02 Jan 2016
Posts: 119
sofakng wrote:
One more question...

Do I need to remove any capacitors on the NESRGB if I'm using an SNES SCART cable that has 220 uF capacitors on the RGB lines?

Also, should the SCART cable have a 470 Ohm resistor on the CSYNC line? Should I then short J8 for 75-ohm termination? (I'm using an NESRGB 2.0)

Thanks


The NESRGB 2.0 does not have any caps on the RGB lines so you don't need to worry about that.

If your scart cable has a resistor on the CSYNC line then leave J8 open. If your cable does not have a resistor on the CSYNC line then short J8.
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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 4:00 am 



Joined: 02 Sep 2016
Posts: 131
Great, thanks! Does J8 add a (470?) resistor to CSYNC line?


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:30 pm 



Joined: 02 Sep 2016
Posts: 131
OK ... I'm making progress but after finishing the install, the picture is very yellow/green tinted (with all palettes):

Image

I'm using the NESRGB 2.0 (stock firmware) and SNES multi-out cable. The cable has 220 uF capacitors on the RGB lines and no CSYNC resistor.

The NESRGB has:
J5 shorted (NTSC)
J7 open (NTSC)
J8 shorted (75 Ohm)

Are the 220 uF capacitors on the RGB lines the problem?


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:54 pm 


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Joined: 21 May 2013
Posts: 150
sofakng wrote:
OK ... I'm making progress but after finishing the install, the picture is very yellow/green tinted (with all palettes):

Have you tested continuity for the blue signal from the NESRGB PCB to the SCART pin?


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 5:09 pm 



Joined: 02 Sep 2016
Posts: 131
Yeah, I just verified R, G, and B from the SCART connector to the NESRGB and they are all fine.

EDIT: Maybe it was a lose cartridge connector. It seems OK now. I'm using a front-loader and I often test the NESRGB w/o the cover on and I think this might be causing some problems. (I'm using a BlinkingLightWin mod but I still think it sometimes doesn't have a great connection)


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:49 pm 



Joined: 18 Mar 2019
Posts: 2
Also having jitter problems when first turning on my NESRGB AV Famicom. The edges wobble like mad but clear up after a while as the console heats up. I bought the system modded and I think the board is flashed with 2.1, am I right in think that flashing the board with 2.2 would fix this issue? It's not a huge deal but it's a little annoying


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:20 pm 


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Joined: 28 Jan 2012
Posts: 871
Location: San Jose, CA
Get the latest firmware flashed and it should clear up the video instability issues. Tim said that the dejitter feature in the 2.1 firmware is bugged and that's why the sync signal becomes unstable.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 2:13 pm 



Joined: 18 Mar 2019
Posts: 2
Can you use one of those cheap usb blaster clones? Might attempt it myself as it seems quite simple to solder a few wires from the 10pin to the NESRGB.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 10:01 pm 



Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
nmalinoski wrote:
Soundwave GI wrote:
So what install guide is best to follow if I want to use a shielded cable for audio on the top loading AV Famicom and keep the audio all on the Multi-AV out? Thanks!

Do you mean using shielded cabling from the NESRGB to the AV Multi-out, or from the AV Multi-out to your display/video processor?


Damn, missed this reply. There’s a chance I’d been drinking. I’m using retro access snes cable from the multi out and I watched Voultars install of the 1.4 where he removes caps. My understanding now though is that I can just leave J8 open and use the same cable. For Audio, is the procedure the same to use the NESRGB sound as the 1.4? I do have Castlevania 3 and Rolling Thunder that use extra channel. Any link to a good guide for that would be appreciated.

https://retro-access.com/collections/sc ... nded-cable

W 75ohm


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 11:15 pm 



Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
So not sure if I screwed the whole AV Famicom or not...I did admittedly start with a manual solder pump on the PPU and it wasn't pretty even being careful. I have a machine now, but hoping to salvage this. I had two of the pins break on the PPU when I pulled it out and a few of the posts from the through holes came out on the pin which I removed. I jumped the two broken pins to the pin on the socket and tested every pin on the PPU to the pin on the socket once inserted. J3, J5 are shorted and GRD to 3 on the pallete.
Image

Image

Image

Here's the bottom of the board with the new IC socket. As you can see, the 5V connection ring is gone. Thinking I can bridge that to pin 15 on the EXT as shown? I've tried it with and without to no avail.

Image

For good measure, connection to the Multi AV out.

Image

So I've gotten better tools and more skilled since this project, but hoping I can salvage. I don't see the OSSC getting any signal from the AV Famicom. Maybe with the posts pulling from the holes on the mobo it's just done, idk. Could use any advice.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am 


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Posts: 871
Location: San Jose, CA
There are lots of sources to grab 5V from, pin 40 on the CPU is a good example that's fairly close by the PPU.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 1:09 pm 



Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
ApolloBoy wrote:
There are lots of sources to grab 5V from, pin 40 on the CPU is a good example that's fairly close by the PPU.


I’ll try that, but as configured, jumper-wise, should I be able to use a retro access snes RGB csync/75ohm SCART cable? My goal is to be able to use the same hookup as my SNES. TIA!


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 8:28 pm 



Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
ApolloBoy wrote:
There are lots of sources to grab 5V from, pin 40 on the CPU is a good example that's fairly close by the PPU.

I jumped to that, but seems I’m still not getting video or audio. I put a multimeter on it and got 5V getting to the adapter board on pin 40 though. I’d think maybe video/resistor issue, but don’t seem to get audio either.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:43 pm 



Joined: 17 Sep 2018
Posts: 49
Soundwave GI wrote:
So not sure if I screwed the whole AV Famicom or not...I did admittedly start with a manual solder pump on the PPU and it wasn't pretty even being careful. I have a machine now, but hoping to salvage this. I had two of the pins break on the PPU when I pulled it out and a few of the posts from the through holes came out on the pin which I removed. I jumped the two broken pins to the pin on the socket and tested every pin on the PPU to the pin on the socket once inserted. J3, J5 are shorted and GRD to 3 on the pallete.

Here's the bottom of the board with the new IC socket. As you can see, the 5V connection ring is gone. Thinking I can bridge that to pin 15 on the EXT as shown? I've tried it with and without to no avail.

Image

For good measure, connection to the Multi AV out.

So I've gotten better tools and more skilled since this project, but hoping I can salvage. I don't see the OSSC getting any signal from the AV Famicom. Maybe with the posts pulling from the holes on the mobo it's just done, idk. Could use any advice.


Hi,

I just completed one of these mods myself and had an issue with a solid colour screen afterwards, I like yourself had the multi meter out and every pin was checking out ok from the PPU to the cartridge slot / CPU, RAM etc. However it turned out to be a damaged trace shorting out one of the pins on the way past as some traces run in between the PPU pads.

Looking at your image here I can see a lot of copper exposed to the traces around some of the PPU pins where the heat has got to them and also where new solder has attached to some of them.

Have a look at my thread here viewtopic.php?f=6&t=64315 and check for anything similar on yours!


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:55 pm 



Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
flex wrote:
Soundwave GI wrote:
So not sure if I screwed the whole AV Famicom or not...I did admittedly start with a manual solder pump on the PPU and it wasn't pretty even being careful. I have a machine now, but hoping to salvage this. I had two of the pins break on the PPU when I pulled it out and a few of the posts from the through holes came out on the pin which I removed. I jumped the two broken pins to the pin on the socket and tested every pin on the PPU to the pin on the socket once inserted. J3, J5 are shorted and GRD to 3 on the pallete.

Here's the bottom of the board with the new IC socket. As you can see, the 5V connection ring is gone. Thinking I can bridge that to pin 15 on the EXT as shown? I've tried it with and without to no avail.

Image

For good measure, connection to the Multi AV out.

So I've gotten better tools and more skilled since this project, but hoping I can salvage. I don't see the OSSC getting any signal from the AV Famicom. Maybe with the posts pulling from the holes on the mobo it's just done, idk. Could use any advice.


Hi,

I just completed one of these mods myself and had an issue with a solid colour screen afterwards, I like yourself had the multi meter out and every pin was checking out ok from the PPU to the cartridge slot / CPU, RAM etc. However it turned out to be a damaged trace shorting out one of the pins on the way past as some traces run in between the PPU pads.

Looking at your image here I can see a lot of copper exposed to the traces around some of the PPU pins where the heat has got to them and also where new solder has attached to some of them.

Have a look at my thread here viewtopic.php?f=6&t=64315 and check for anything similar on yours!


I did some hunting around last night after this pic and did some cleanup. I may give it another go. I appreciate the feedback and will check you thread. Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:27 pm 



Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Posts: 218
Location: Philly Area
Are there instructions for getting expansion audio running through the NESRGB for a Sharp Twin Famicom? Not a fan of how the stock Twin audio circuit sounds.

EDIT: Could I take the audio output from the NESRGB, cut the trace to pin 45, feed it into there, and then grab the audio at the RCA jack?


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:29 pm 



Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
daskrabs wrote:
Are there instructions for getting expansion audio running through the NESRGB for a Sharp Twin Famicom? Not a fan of how the stock Twin audio circuit sounds.

EDIT: Could I take the audio output from the NESRGB, cut the trace to pin 45, feed it into there, and then grab the audio at the RCA jack?


Check Voultars diagram here on that exact question...about 1/2 way down.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47617&start=3420


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:55 pm 



Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Posts: 218
Location: Philly Area
Soundwave GI wrote:
daskrabs wrote:
Are there instructions for getting expansion audio running through the NESRGB for a Sharp Twin Famicom? Not a fan of how the stock Twin audio circuit sounds.

EDIT: Could I take the audio output from the NESRGB, cut the trace to pin 45, feed it into there, and then grab the audio at the RCA jack?


Check Voultars diagram here on that exact question...about 1/2 way down.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47617&start=3420


Thanks, but not sure where C51 on the NESRGB is located. Mines an older rev, circa 2014-15.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 12:29 pm 



Joined: 07 Apr 2019
Posts: 1
I've started my NESRGB mod and have run into some issues with the PPU. I've been using a Hakko desoldering gun which has worked quite well, but it appears that the NES ground plane is my enemy. I started by putting fresh solder down on the fillets, and using the gun to remove it. That's worked out pretty well, but I have about 2 or 3 "stuck" pins on the ground plane. From the underside, the pins look free, but aren't moving compared to the non-ground pins. The top side looks like this:

https://imgur.com/gallery/CnI4XJ5

I'm wondering if the solder on the base of the legs is holding the top-side of the chip to the board. I've tried using some solder braid, but it doesn't appear to be picking it up. Any other recommendations?


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 2:07 pm 



Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
I still can’t seem to get picture or sound. Is there a diagram anybody can point to in order to test each pin from PPU to under the board via multimeter? I’m pretty sure this is shot, but one last ditch effort.


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 5:08 pm 



Joined: 17 Sep 2018
Posts: 49
Soundwave GI wrote:
I still can’t seem to get picture or sound. Is there a diagram anybody can point to in order to test each pin from PPU to under the board via multimeter? I’m pretty sure this is shot, but one last ditch effort.


Original Famicom schematics can be found on this page:

https://console5.com/techwiki/index.php ... ew_desktop

I stuggled to find one specific to the AV Famicom model.

The image I used when troubleshooting was the full one https://console5.com/techwiki/images/8/ ... ematic.png and I was able to verify all the pins from the PPU. The only difference really being that chips U3, U7 & U8 are replaced by a single PIO chip labelled U3 JIO (JIO A BU3270S). If you need to test one of the pins going to one of those original chips look up its equivalent on this pinout http://nesdev.com/nes_pio_pinout.txt or just run your multimeter along the pins of this chip until you find the right one :lol:

Pinouts also worth refrencing are:

PPU - http://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/PPU_ ... escription
CPU - http://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/CPU_ ... escription


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 Post subject: Re: NESRGB board available now
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:01 pm 



Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 36
flex wrote:
Soundwave GI wrote:
I still can’t seem to get picture or sound. Is there a diagram anybody can point to in order to test each pin from PPU to under the board via multimeter? I’m pretty sure this is shot, but one last ditch effort.


Original Famicom schematics can be found on this page:

https://console5.com/techwiki/index.php ... ew_desktop

I stuggled to find one specific to the AV Famicom model.

The image I used when troubleshooting was the full one https://console5.com/techwiki/images/8/ ... ematic.png and I was able to verify all the pins from the PPU. The only difference really being that chips U3, U7 & U8 are replaced by a single PIO chip labelled U3 JIO (JIO A BU3270S). If you need to test one of the pins going to one of those original chips look up its equivalent on this pinout http://nesdev.com/nes_pio_pinout.txt or just run your multimeter along the pins of this chip until you find the right one :lol:

Pinouts also worth refrencing are:

PPU - http://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/PPU_ ... escription
CPU - http://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/CPU_ ... escription


Perfect l, thanks! I’ve got some work to do I see. Is the board completely trashed if any of the copper from the through holes got pulled w the PPU. Seems like a dumb question, but if they connect to where they need ultimately I should be ok?


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