DVDO EDGE - How it performs

[Fudoh]

yes, it does.

[BuckoA51]

Yes, 240p handling is still broken in the Edge Green.

[cfx]

Ok so then I understand either an Edge (not Green) or VP50pro would be preferable, but if I can't find either then they're not practical options for me.

So, just two further questions about the Duo then. Could you elaborate a bit on how it is inferior with 240p? I would always be using a SLG with it if that changes anything as I'm someone who can't stand the "emulator look" for games. Also does it have any issues with 480i compared to the Edge?

[Fudoh]

For 240p neither the Edge nor the 50Pro are ideal. Both add severe ringing and if your focus is on 240p material, there are many other and better processors out there you can get.

That's 240p on the Edge Green. http://pms.hazard-city.de/edge_green_240p.mov I think it was similar on the Duo. It's useable in parts once you disable the gamemode.

The DVDO processors are as far from "emulator look" as I can imagine.

None of the DVDO processors have any issues with 480i. On the contrary - that's where they really shine.

And the original Edge is certainly not hard to find. Would surprise me if it took you longer than two weeks to get a sub-$300 machines after browsing the AVS classifieds or placing an ad yourself.

[cfx]

Really I just only want to use one processor and besides 240p I want real deinterlacing for 480i for PS2 RPGs. I've studied the pictures on your site of the DVDO+SLG3000 and with that combination the ringing doesn't bother me, and I actually prefer the slight softness compared to some other processors because it looks more like the arcade CRT monitors I'm used too instead of the extra sharpness of a BVM/PVM. The XRGB-mini is out for me because of the blackout issue for games that switch between 240p and 480i.

I guess emulator look wasn't the best term; I just mean I don't like 240p without scanlines at all, whether it's sharp square pixels or the diagonal enhanced result from the DVDO. I'm also really bothered by interlacing artifacts which is why I want good 480i deinterlacing.

I've only been looking on ebay for an Edge but haven't seen any there. Was a VP50pro recently but it went for a high amount of course.

[Fudoh]

As said, place an ad on the AVS classifieds. $250-300 gets you an Edge in no time.

PS: and don't forget that you need a D/A converter (HDFury or similar) to use a SLG3000 with an Edge. You also require a VGA input on your display.

[slk486]

I'll be putting up an Edge soonish, but the hdmi inputs don't work. If you don't need those, the it'll be perfect

[cfx]

As said, place an ad on the AVS classifieds. $250-300 gets you an Edge in no time.

PS: and don't forget that you need a D/A converter (HDFury or similar) to use a SLG3000 with an Edge. You also require a VGA input on your display.

Yeah I know and as I learned from early in this thread, the HDFury2 isn't a good idea. I have a Panasonic S30 so no VGA input either meaning I'll need something to convert back as well. Nothing is ever easy it seems.

[BuckoA51]

The XRGB-mini is out for me because of the blackout issue for games that switch between 240p and 480i

That problem is not unique to the Mini, please do not think that the Edge doesn't do this, because it does, it's not as slow as the Mini but it's slow enough to spoil many games.

[Fudoh]

I'd say the main difference is that most processors just need to re-sync the input, while the Mini - for some reason - re-syncs the output as well and that's what takes time....

[cfx]

Well I wish I could avoid that entirely, but yes the real problem is how long it takes on the Mini. That delay will make some Saturn games unplayable.

It's been a lot of years since I owned an XRGB-2 and XRGB-2plus, but I don't remember them doing this? Or maybe it's just I had so many other problems with them that I don't remember that one.

[Xyga]

Necro-ing this thread for I have three questions !

1.
Is it normal that I can bring the Audio Delay slider down to -25ms even while Game Mode is enabled ?
This happens when I feed the Edge (non-green) with low-res progressive sources that are really recognized as such.

- MD2 (60Hz switched): -25ms
- Ibara (pcb): -25ms
- Turbo Force (pcb): -8ms (input info says 720x478i@61.45Hz)
- Dogyuun (pcb): -25ms

2.
Are the 1.1 framerate & PrEP setting of any use ? What should the defaults be ?

3.
How come the EDGE's output is sometimes stable, sometimes completely erratic ? (picture flashes on the screen like the device was stuck in a crazy on-off-on-off-on-off cycle)

Thanks a lot.

[Fudoh]

I think that you're really dealing with 25ms of delay in times when you're able to pull the slider down to this value. This should not happen with 240p in general. It was (or is) a bug of some kind and it's not limited to 240p either. Even with a XRGB conected to the Edge it can happen with various sources.

The framerate option is used to have the Edge's output switch between 50 and 60Hz automatically. PREP is used to reinterlaced 480p sources. That's used for DVD players without 480i option. Should be turned off for videogames (of course).

(3) happens when the output is locked to some bad input sync timing. Can happen on other VPxx units as well. If you unlock the output refresh rates on those sources, it should be fine.

[Xyga]

Thanks for the clarification Fudoh !

Any way to fix/dodge that 'bug' ?

I have the latest firmware btw.

[Fudoh]

I don't think so. I don't even think that anybody ever figured out what exactly causes it.

[Xyga]

I love my VP30.

[Fudoh]

(3) can happen on the VP30 (w/ ABT102) as well. Also depends on the display. NES and SNES with locked output, either through the XRGB or directly can cause it.

[Xyga]

Indeed, I have experienced the same issues with the VP30+ABT.

Still, as a standalone machine thanks to the ABT102 the superior image quality of both game modes completely steals it.
(when I write superior image quality understand: no ringing)

From my experience so far the only field where the EDGE has been clearly superior is motion handling on 480i sources.

I have yet to try it as a combo element with XRGB-2/3 (tomorrow).
Read lots of yours and Bucko's posts/website already but I have to try and see with my own eyes.

[Fudoh]

From my experience so far the only field where the EDGE has been clearly superior is motion handling on 480i sources.

ABT2010 (Edge) and ABT102 (VP30+Upgrade) should handle SD 480i absolutely identical. The only difference is the DE/EE engine the 2010 adds on top, but that wouldn't affect motion handling on interlaced sources.

[Xyga]

Well I have absolutely no idea why...
On a static image ABT102 most certainly wins (GM2: lots of details and no ringing), but when moving around ingame the difference is very noticeable, on the EDGE nothing gets blurred whether it's on the foreground or background (i.e in 3D games).
Tried this with many games on both machines -> always the same results.

[Fudoh]

If you only tried GM2 then that's probably the reason. GM2 was eliminated from the Edge. On the ABT102 you have to use "video" to to get the same results as the Edge without GM.

[Xyga]

Great ! I'll give it a try tomorrow.

On that topic I always leave the EDGE's deinterlacing on 'Auto'. Bad idea ?

[Fudoh]

if you don't run into combing problems, then it's ok. Usually forced movie modes (with 2:2 or 3:2 cadence locks) are more important than video locks.

[BuckoA51]

For the input lag thing, make sure PrEP is disabled (yes, even when using game mode) then power cycle the Edge (on the remote, no need to unplug/replug) and see if that cures it.

[Xyga]

Tried that already but it didn't help...

Mmh. I think there's something wrong with my EDGE's PSU anyway.
I can hear a buzzing sound and lately it got worse (higher-pitched).
What I'm experiencing is very similar to what this guy described here: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/37-video- ... fritz.html

Don't know if a hard reset would help nor if there's a type of reset procedure that won't make the current firmware disappear.
Anyway I think I'm good for a PSU replacement.

[Xyga]

Successfully connected the XRGB-2 to the EDGE, however I'm stuck with the flashing screen issue, so I didn't see much...

Still no idea if it's the PSU that's about to die or something else.
At some point I hit the EDGE and it worked fine for about 30 seconds, then it went back to the flashing madness.

[BuckoA51]

I had to have the PSU replaced in mine because of that buzzing, but I didn't notice any picture dropouts. I think it's a common fault with them.

[kel]

Me too. I replaced the power supply in mine because the buzzing was annoying me although it didn't actually cause any problems.

I think it's probably an inductor or transformer resonating, it's pretty common in power supplies. manufacturers usually cover them in some kind of glue/epoxy for this reason.

I've still got my old one. As far as I can remember it's in perfect working order apart from the high pitched noise.

The model number is CFM60S050 assuming that it hasn't changed since the Original EDGE (non green version).

[Xyga]

I had no idea the EDGE had so many issues even with the latest firmware.
Did they stop development too early ?

Thanks for the p/n I'll double check and get a new one.

[BuckoA51]

I had no idea the EDGE had so many issues even with the latest firmware.
Did they stop development too early ?

It does but then so do a lot of video processors really. They should have put more work into the Edge and especially the VP50.