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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:51 pm 



Joined: 21 Aug 2016
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Hmmm, I was just following Tim's instructions. I imagine most of these are installed the same way. I've been thinking about grabbing Voultar's kit since it's entirely on the bottom and my console supports it, but I'm unclear if that will actually help. I suppose it wouldn't be worse, anyway...

Edit: just to follow up, I opened it back up and snipped off a bit of the shield where the digital wires go down. With the console open, I moved all the wires around and there was no difference in the noise. So I don't think that's it, either.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 12:17 am 


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thebigcheese wrote:
It's a little unorthodox, but this is the install: https://photos.app.goo.gl/dHdNy8YcEGDLs6L46.


I'm not crazy about how you're laying the pcb on the heat sink like that. Maybe that's what they show in the install instructions? But I would put something plastic underneath of it. Probably not responsible for the noise, but still...


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 1:24 am 



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vol.2 wrote:
thebigcheese wrote:
It's a little unorthodox, but this is the install: https://photos.app.goo.gl/dHdNy8YcEGDLs6L46.


I'm not crazy about how you're laying the pcb on the heat sink like that. Maybe that's what they show in the install instructions? But I would put something plastic underneath of it. Probably not responsible for the noise, but still...


That is the "official" location. It has some poster tape under it, I think, but it has been a while.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 2:02 am 



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What is the exact name of the five-pin phoenix connector used for audio in most Extron matrix switches? I'd like to order up a bunch of them, like 30+, but I'm in Japan and need to find an affordable supplier.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 3:23 pm 


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SamIAm wrote:
What is the exact name of the five-pin phoenix connector used for audio in most Extron matrix switches? I'd like to order up a bunch of them, like 30+, but I'm in Japan and need to find an affordable supplier.


The short answer is that there isn't one. The "Phoenix Connector" is so called because it is the proprietary connector standard used by the company "Phoenix Contact" who still use the pattern today. As far as I know it doesn't have a meaningful IEC designation or anything like that. I'm sure they submitted their designs and they have a number, but it's not going to come up on mouser.

You can order them by the billions on ebay from US sellers in all kinds of number row assortments.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 3:46 pm 


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vol.2 wrote:
SamIAm wrote:
What is the exact name of the five-pin phoenix connector used for audio in most Extron matrix switches? I'd like to order up a bunch of them, like 30+, but I'm in Japan and need to find an affordable supplier.


The short answer is that there isn't one. The "Phoenix Connector" is so called because it is the proprietary connector standard used by the company "Phoenix Contact" who still use the pattern today. As far as I know it doesn't have a meaningful IEC designation or anything like that. I'm sure they submitted their designs and they have a number, but it's not going to come up on mouser.

You can order them by the billions on ebay from US sellers in all kinds of number row assortments.

the choice ones which have the "tail" for zip tie attachment are still hard to come by


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 3:52 pm 



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vol.2 wrote:
SamIAm wrote:
What is the exact name of the five-pin phoenix connector used for audio in most Extron matrix switches? I'd like to order up a bunch of them, like 30+, but I'm in Japan and need to find an affordable supplier.


The short answer is that there isn't one. The "Phoenix Connector" is so called because it is the proprietary connector standard used by the company "Phoenix Contact" who still use the pattern today. As far as I know it doesn't have a meaningful IEC designation or anything like that. I'm sure they submitted their designs and they have a number, but it's not going to come up on mouser.

You can order them by the billions on ebay from US sellers in all kinds of number row assortments.

I've also seen them referred to as N-pole pluggable terminal blocks.

And yes, the ideal ones have cable-relief tails that let you zip-tie the cables in, and yes, they are indeed difficult to come by. I only have some because I was fortunate enough to receive a bunch of them with a CrossPoint that I picked up online; I haven't been able to find them elsewhere.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 4:01 pm 


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Quote:
And yes, the ideal ones have cable-relief tails that let you zip-tie the cables in, and yes, they are indeed difficult to come by

Any Extron dealer should be able to get these for you. $20 for a 10-pack of 5pin ones with tail. Not cheap, I know, but not this expensive either, unless you need a very high quantity.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 4:35 pm 


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vol.2 wrote:
The short answer is that there isn't one. The "Phoenix Connector" is so called because it is the proprietary connector standard used by the company "Phoenix Contact" who still use the pattern today.

It may be a single-company connector, but it surely must have a manufacturer part number?

nmalinoski wrote:
And yes, the ideal ones have cable-relief tails that let you zip-tie the cables in

The tailed ones aren't that much better IMHO - the tail on the power connector of my DSC 301 already broke off.
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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:09 pm 



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Unseen wrote:
The tailed ones aren't that much better IMHO - the tail on the power connector of my DSC 301 already broke off.

I have right around 30 of the audio ones, maybe 25 tailed, 5 not tailed. Guess which 5 have broke, numerous times each? I did however start making a tail for those 5 out of hot glue and they've been good so far lol (looks horrible, but whatever works! ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:55 pm 



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Unseen wrote:
nmalinoski wrote:
And yes, the ideal ones have cable-relief tails that let you zip-tie the cables in

The tailed ones aren't that much better IMHO - the tail on the power connector of my DSC 301 already broke off.

I wouldn't say they're indestructible, but the tail on the power connector on my DSC 301 HD is still intact, as are all the others that I had used to create RCA->Phoenix adapters, and that one broke (How?) would hardly be reason for writing off the stress relief that the tailed connectors provide.

Without that, even just moving something like a Crosspoint for maintenance could mean having to rewire your audio setup.

That said, there should still be RCA breakout boards available that supposedly work well with the non-tailed terminal blocks. Should be possible to create a 2-position PCB with tie-down notches to replace your broken one.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 11:37 pm 


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René of dbElectronics made an open source PCB adapter (which Retro Gaming Cables UK sell fully assembled) but those aren't ideal with units that have vertically stacked audio terminals, of course (since it's blocking the port above)
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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:54 am 


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Unseen wrote:
It may be a single-company connector, but it surely must have a manufacturer part number?


Undoubtedly. I was just being lazy because it didn't seem relevant. If someone finds it more useful than going to ebay for them, I believe the 5-pole version is this
https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/324/ ... 146119.pdf


nmalinoski wrote:
Without that, even just moving something like a Crosspoint for maintenance could mean having to rewire your audio setup.


One thing you can do with screw terminals is solder the ends of the wires. If you really want to keep it from breaking, make the end twice as long as it need to be, tin all exposed wire and use heat shrink tubing to span between the shielding and the tinned wire. That will act as strain relief, and then tightening the soldered wire end in the screw terminals keeps it from easily crushing and breaking in the contact. They also make ferrule ends that you can solder onto the tips of wire for this purpose, but I think that's overkill.

Personally, I don't like the tails because I always seem to lack the room behind my equipment for extra wire protrusions.


Last edited by vol.2 on Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:15 am 



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Thanks for the replies.

I'm really hoping to keep things as cheap as possible, especially since I'm in Japan and want so many. The only local ones I can find at the moment are about $5 apiece, and if I get 30, that's $150. Every dollar that comes down is another $30 to me, so I'd like to shop around.

It looks like there are seven-digit part numbers for the various types? Like 1768936 is the one with the little tails.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:20 am 


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SamIAm wrote:
Thanks for the replies.

It looks like there are seven-digit part numbers for the various types? Like 1768936 is the one with the little tails.


Yes, there are literally hundreds of possible part numbers. Be careful you get the correct pitch. AFAIK, Phoenix makes them in various sizes. I'm not 100% sure the one I linked is the right one, I didn't compare the pitch.

Also, you might have some luck if you contact one of the ebay suppliers. I have done that in the past for other parts and was able to work out a bulk deal. Also try Ali Express.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:33 am 



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3.5mm seems to be the correct pitch.

This would work, right? $2 apiece is a great price. Since I'm actually not in a hurry (this is for a backup matrix switch) I suppose I could ship these to a friend in the US and get them piggybacked onto some other package.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:21 am 


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$2 is what the Extron ones with tails cost. Why don't you check a local Extron dealer in your country?

100-457-01 is the part number for the 10-pack, 5-pins, 3,5mm pitch, with tail. Official pricing is $20 per pack.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:19 pm 


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SamIAm wrote:
3.5mm seems to be the correct pitch.

This would work, right? $2 apiece is a great price. Since I'm actually not in a hurry (this is for a backup matrix switch) I suppose I could ship these to a friend in the US and get them piggybacked onto some other package.

3.5mm is the correct pitch, but $2/per is not a great price at all for non-tails

I think I got a 5 pack from china for less than $3


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:42 pm 


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SamIAm wrote:


As MTR says, ali express or one of those from china places. 100 pieces for $45USD


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 5:01 am 



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Well I'll be darned.

Thanks, guys.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 6:01 pm 


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Anybody know what this kind of black tape is called and how I can buy it?

It's 3/8" wide.

Spoiler: show
Image


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2020 6:25 pm 



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Potentially stupid question, but I genuinely don't know the answer to this.

I'm in North American. I just bought a Japanese AV Famicom. Can I use the original power supply for it, or do I need to get a different one for NA?


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:35 pm 



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Just following up on my earlier post about the N64RGB. I got Voultar's board and put that in and aside from a much tidier install, I do think the noise is improved. I haven't hooked it up to my big LG C9 to truly see, but initial testing on a little monitor were promising. Anyway, I'm good now. Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:02 am 


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@lechu in the short term, there's no problem. But since this puts a bit more strain on your japanese console, in the long term it will reduce its life span some.

in Hi-Fi it's always recommended to use a step uo converter for that reason, since some gear is worth undreds if not thousands of dollars, better protect your investment. for consoles, some may view things different and not bother. but it does reduce the lifespan regardless

There are some pretty cheap, perfectly reasonably performing step up converters for like $30
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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 3:00 am 



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FinalBaton wrote:
@lechu in the short term, there's no problem. But since this puts a bit more strain on your japanese console, in the long term it will reduce its life span some.

in Hi-Fi it's always recommended to use a step uo converter for that reason, since some gear is worth undreds if not thousands of dollars, better protect your investment. for consoles, some may view things different and not bother. but it does reduce the lifespan regardless

There are some pretty cheap, perfectly reasonably performing step up converters for like $30

Wouldn't you use a step down converter? Step up converters are if you're using a PAL console (220v-240v) in North America.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 3:31 am 


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I honestly can see it making a difference. As long as the AC adapter you are using is rectifying the wall power to the correct DC voltage, the console doesn't care it started out as 100, 120. 240 or whatever.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 3:36 am 


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vol.2 wrote:
I honestly can see it making a difference. As long as the AC adapter you are using is rectifying the wall power to the correct DC voltage, the console doesn't care it started out as 100, 120. 240 or whatever.

sometimes it matters, most of the time it doesn't

depends on the PSU design to be 100% sure but using JP on US is almost always ok


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:58 am 



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The AV Famicom uses an external power supply so there’s no need for a step-down converter. Just get a US power supply or better yet a modern universal power supply.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 12:41 pm 



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I've heard that the original Sega Genesis Model 1 Power Supply (1602) works perfectly with the AV Famicom in North America. It can also be used for a couple of other Japanese consoles like the later revision Japanese Neo Geo AES.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:53 pm 



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ross wrote:
The AV Famicom uses an external power supply so there’s no need for a step-down converter. Just get a US power supply or better yet a modern universal power supply.

Definitely need to make sure that the output from the PSU matches that of the console, because it's not always the same across regions.

For example, the PSU for the North American SNES outputs DC, but the PAL one, aside from being 50Hz instead of 60Hz, outputs AC; I encountered someone recently who had heard that you can just use a SNES PSU with the VB AC tap, but they didn't check the power output from their PAL SNES PSU before trying it and ended up frying their VB.


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