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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:52 pm 



Joined: 15 Oct 2017
Posts: 247
Pretty much any multi sync CRT monitor can natively display 720p, right? Would be hard and expensive to find one that's widescreen, but I feel like they're worth mentioning.

Not sure if by 'still available', you mean 'still in production' though.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:32 am 



Joined: 03 Jan 2021
Posts: 54
I just tested an HD Box outputting 480p to an OSSC via the vga port and was surprised to see it actually does prevent the sync drop problem on PS2.

Unfortunately the picture quality is not the greatest (not bad though) and it ruins scanlines for some reason. I went back to 480i line4x and it's much better.

That got me thinking, is there a device with good 480i pass-through? It seems all of my scalers can only output 480p minimum.

It seems like locking the output to 480p is what prevents the drops in the first place but I'm looking for a way to achieve 480i line4x without drops though maybe that is not possible.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:38 am 


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The ossc can do 480i passthrough no problem


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:51 am 



Joined: 03 Jan 2021
Posts: 54
maxtherabbit wrote:
The ossc can do 480i passthrough no problem


The OSSC has sync drops on PS2 so I mean some other device that outputs 480i to connect to the OSSC that might be able to prevent the sync drops.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:18 am 


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Guile wrote:
The OSSC has sync drops on PS2


This is not normal behaviour. If the light is going off on your OSSC then many you need to look at your cables. If the light is staying on then the OSSC is not dropping sync.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:51 am 



Joined: 03 Jan 2021
Posts: 54
Kez wrote:
Guile wrote:
The OSSC has sync drops on PS2


This is not normal behaviour. If the light is going off on your OSSC then many you need to look at your cables. If the light is staying on then the OSSC is not dropping sync.


I've been searching for a solution to this problem for a little while now. The light does turn red and the image is lost for 1 to 3 seconds while it resyncs. It seems to be related to resolution switching and happens when the screen transitions on loading.

I've found several posts by people who have the same issue. It doesn't happen in every game but I can confirm it definitely happens in Klonoa 2 and Tony Hawk 3 for PS2.

It does not happen with other scalers like a DVDO I have so my cables should be fine.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:10 am 


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Ahh okay, yeah sounds like resolution switching. The OSSC can't really do much about that, when the signal changes it responds quite quickly.. It might just be that your TV is a bit slow to pick up on the new signal. You could experiment with feeding the OSSC Line4x signal into other devices and see if they handle it better.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 2:42 am 



Joined: 03 Jan 2021
Posts: 54
I have a bit of an emergency with my OSSC. I was trying out different scaler combinations with the VGA input and something has gone wrong. The image is now way too bright and overblown and looks slightly greener than it should on the YPbPr AV2.

I tried resetting settings and restarting, I tried reinstalling firmware 0.88 but the issue is still there.

I checked my cables as well and they seem fine, did a component get damaged or something? This is pretty upsetting as it ruins the entire image and I cannot fix it.

Edit: Well it seems like it was my new component distribution amp that is maybe bad. I tried my old one again and it looks good again on the OSSC so maybe the new one is sending out a bad signal though it looks fine on a crt and looked fine before.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:36 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1963
Guile wrote:
I've been searching for a solution to this problem for a little while now. The light does turn red and the image is lost for 1 to 3 seconds while it resyncs. It seems to be related to resolution switching and happens when the screen transitions on loading.

I've found several posts by people who have the same issue. It doesn't happen in every game but I can confirm it definitely happens in Klonoa 2 and Tony Hawk 3 for PS2.

It does not happen with other scalers like a DVDO I have so my cables should be fine.

This is normal for line multipliers like the OSSC; unlike the DVDO, the OSSC doesn't have a framebuffer, so it can't cache entire frames in order to do things like framerate conversion, sync correction, or smooth video mode changes. It can only buffer maybe a couple lines at most; this is why the OSSC can operate without perceived lag, while your DVDO likely introduces at a minimum 1 frame of additional lag.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:42 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2017
Posts: 474
nmalinoski wrote:
your DVDO likely introduces at a minimum 1 frame of additional lag.


Half a frame.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:35 am 



Joined: 03 Jan 2021
Posts: 54
What are some of your preferences for handling 480i? I really like line4x with scanlines on the OSSC if only it wasn't for that annoying sync drop in some games.

Every time I try the DVDO again I realize that I underrate it and it really does do a good job, just a little softer than I'd like and I think I see ringing on fast motion with lines.

Those are probably the best two options I've tried but some random scalers also do well with not dropping sync and decent deinterlacing.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:48 am 


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The GBS-Control is quite nice with deinterlacing, and as a bonus it handles 240p/480i switching with no dropouts whatsoever. I will check Klonoa 2 on it at some point but I suspect it will handle it just as well. I confirmed the OSSC dropouts with Klonoa 2, but my TV resyncs pretty quickly so it's not a big problem for me.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:49 pm 


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Location: BW, Germany
ross wrote:
What is the current state of Super FX/SA1/complex enhancement chip emulation like on the latest Krikzz flash carts? I know the FXPAK PRO touts support for those chips, but is the implementation fully accurate to an original cart?

With regards to the SD2SNES/FXPAK PRO, off the cuff, the following inaccuracies spring to mind that were thematized at least during the last ~1-2 years, let me know if you need sources:

* There was an SA-1 address line issue that caused graphical corruption in Super Mario RPG. I believe this is fixed now in the official firmware.
* The CX4 implementation is (still) inaccurate, I believe there might be some noticable consequences in the Mega Man X games under certain circumstances.
* I believe there was also something with regards to the DSP-4 chip (only used by Top Gear 3000) where some calculations were off
* The 'Pilotwings crashing plane phenomenon' revolving around the S-DD1 chip. [1] [2] Although not an inaccuracy per se, it's noteworthy, and I'm not sure currently what revision is emulated by the SD2SNES or FXPAK PRO.

There are probably more, but whether you actually notice them during gameplay is a different kettle of fish. I guess time will tell if there are any more (noteworthy) ones, chances are that there are. Although it requires a lot of effort, decapsulating and imaging the die under a microscope, then carefully retracing and reimplementing the logic would go a long way towards preservation, for software and hardware emulation alike.

クリスチャン wrote:
Are scanline filters simply overlays that mask existing pixels or do they generate new pixels beneath or above the original pixels? Does this depend on the scanline filter? If so, how does the OSSC behave?

There are various ways to generate faux scanline effects; 'simply' overriding pixels as a post-processing step (which the OSSC Classic does, but the new pixel values are carefully calculated), replacing every other video field with blackness while employing weave deinterlacing, and generating them as part of a raster graphics scaling process by using an appropriate interpolation filter, are some.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:50 pm 



Joined: 15 Oct 2017
Posts: 247
Bit of an obscure question, but does anyone with an NTSC-U/C PS2 know whether black is output at 0 or 7.5 IRE over composite/S-Video? It was the latter in the case of the NTSC-U/C PlayStation, which is kind of unique in the world of retro consoles, but I’ve heard conflicting statements on the PS2.

6t8k wrote:
With regards to the SD2SNES/FXPAK PRO, off the cuff, the following inaccuracies spring to mind that were thematized at least during the last ~1-2 years, let me know if you need sources:

* There was an SA-1 address line issue that caused graphical corruption in Super Mario RPG. I believe this is fixed now in the official firmware.
* The CX4 implementation is (still) inaccurate, I believe there might be some noticable consequences in the Mega Man X games under certain circumstances.
* I believe there was also something with regards to the DSP-4 chip (only used by Top Gear 3000) where some calculations were off
* The 'Pilotwings crashing plane phenomenon' revolving around the S-DD1 chip. [1] [2] Although not an inaccuracy per se, it's noteworthy, and I'm not sure currently what revision is emulated by the SD2SNES or FXPAK PRO.

There are probably more, but whether you actually notice them during gameplay is a different kettle of fish. I guess time will tell if there are any more (noteworthy) ones, chances are that there are. Although it requires a lot of effort, decapsulating and imaging the die under a microscope, then carefully retracing and reimplementing the logic would go a long way towards preservation, for software and hardware emulation alike.

Cheers, I’ll take your word for it :D Appreciate the in depth response, that’s a shame about the CX4 considering the price of those Mega Man X titles on cart.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:30 am 


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ross wrote:
Bit of an obscure question, but does anyone with an NTSC-U/C PS2 know whether black is output at 0 or 7.5 IRE over composite/S-Video? It was the latter in the case of the NTSC-U/C PlayStation, which is kind of unique in the world of retro consoles, but I’ve heard conflicting statements on the PS2.


I can't give you a definitive answer, but I looked into it years ago when I was getting cables for my PS2, and most of the anecdotal evidence I found pointed to Zero. Most accounts I remember from the time were that PS2 was too dark and generally had to be cranked up (which would indicate a zero source on a 7.5 display). Sorry I can't say for sure, but I have subjectively found the PS2 to be darker looking on my own equipment so I believe it. Without actually doing a measurement (or finding a source who has done one) I don't think there's any way to know for certain.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 9:29 am 



Joined: 15 Oct 2017
Posts: 247
Fair enough, thank you. I do know the NTSC-U/C PS2 outputs black at 0 IRE over S-Video when playing DVDs, but I wasn’t sure if that was the case with games too based on what I’d heard.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 12:06 pm 



Joined: 31 Jul 2019
Posts: 10
Hi,

I am wondering if it is possible to install an SNES borti supercic + uIGR + Dual Oscillator (the older superCIC board without the de-itter mod) board that is meant to installed in a 1-chip system into a 3-chip system?
The simple reason I am asking, I don't have a board that is for the 3-chip system, only the DFO version for the 1-chip model.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:28 pm 


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Freedy wrote:
Hi,

I am wondering if it is possible to install an SNES borti supercic + uIGR + Dual Oscillator (the older superCIC board without the de-itter mod) board that is meant to installed in a 1-chip system into a 3-chip system?
The simple reason I am asking, I don't have a board that is for the 3-chip system, only the DFO version for the 1-chip model.


Nope. https://github.com/borti4938/SNES_RGB_Bypass


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:15 pm 


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Joined: 27 Feb 2021
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Location: Montreal
I'm looking for recommendations for wired PC pads (Bluetooth is ok if you can also use the pad over a wired connection). Not having much luck searching the forums here.

For a little context, I already have a HRAP IV (modded with a Sanwa JLF), but I do sometimes want an analog stick. I have some wireless 360 controllers but they are aging and laggy (I live in an apartment building and there's tons of wireless interference).

I'm considering the Razer Wolverine but it is $$$, also looking at the 8Bitdo SN30 for a cheaper alternative.

Any input / links appreciated!


Last edited by Jasonbartfast on Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:21 pm 


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Maybe I'm wrong, but I think most people use Xbox One controllers. They can connect to a PC via a mini USB to USB A cable.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:36 pm 


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vol.2 wrote:
Maybe I'm wrong, but I think most people use Xbox One controllers. They can connect to a PC via a mini USB to USB A cable.


Ok cool, for some reason I didn't think they could. That would be a nice solution.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:49 pm 


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Jasonbartfast wrote:
vol.2 wrote:
Maybe I'm wrong, but I think most people use Xbox One controllers. They can connect to a PC via a mini USB to USB A cable.


Ok cool, for some reason I didn't think they could. That would be a nice solution.


AFAIK, they can. Take a look at the product page: https://www.xbox.com/en-us/accessories/ ... ller-usb-c

"Connectivity Connect to Xbox consoles with Xbox Wireless, or using the included 9’ USB-C cable."


I never tried it because I like using the wireless. Maybe there is some lag, but I don't really care for anything I would be using that controller for.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 7:03 pm 


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The newer Xbox One controllers added I think Bluetooth, but all versions can use a wired connection?

I had a Razer Xbox controller once (Onza I think?) and it was worse than any Mad Katz or other third party controller I've ever owned. RB stopped working completely, the left thumbstick grip disintegrated, there was this mechanism to change how tight the thumbsticks were that would cause the sticks to randomly lock up and get 10x stiffer until you moved them around several times... Never buying another controller from them again.

A third party controller I did enjoy using lately was the Power A Fusion Pro. Wired only and the D-Pad was pretty mushy, but build quality felt like OEM and the back paddles were very nice. That's the main draw though, so if you don't think you'll use them then stick with OEM. I ended up returning it because Xbox One triggers hurt my fingers, both OEM and the Power A.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 8:50 pm 



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I thought I read that on XBO controllers there was MORE lag (don't ask me how but it was a pretty scientific test) on the wired connection vs. wireless...

Also never, ever, buy the super pricy Xbox Elite controllers. I gave up after two in a row had issues, then googled it a ton and like nearly everybody and their mother has issues with them do for some reason.

Myself for computer use (which is more like Raspberry Pi 4 / RetroPie use) I use Xbox 360 wireless adapters with minty Xbox 360 TRANSFORMING wireless controllers - those have a D-Pad which I like quite a bit and were the last type made I believe. Also can use WIRELESS fightsticks on that same wireless adapter, and I like those a lot (not as good as my Sanwa/Seitmitsu's but very nice... actually modding one now with Sanwa parts).


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 8:53 pm 


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A Sony DS4 and DS4Windows is a fairly easy solution with low polling time; that's what I use. I also appreciate the DS4 build quality. Although, I'm sure someone will chime in with horror stories and tell you DS4 suckzzzzzzz. YMMV. The DS4 has more latency wired, so 2.4 band interference might be a deal breaker.

PC input lag is a complicated rabbit hole and there's hundreds of different stories and experiences out there. Good luck.
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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:19 am 


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I mean I don't really like the DS4 if that counts, but at least it's 10x better than the DS3 :P

Never been bothered by input lag on native PC games on a fast display. I use bluetooth myself, so I'm sure lag is up there if I actually measured it.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 2:08 pm 



Joined: 17 Apr 2021
Posts: 1
Hello, new here


Last edited by RetroNoob54 on Sun Apr 25, 2021 8:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 5:13 pm 



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 1963
orange808 wrote:
A Sony DS4 and DS4Windows is a fairly easy solution with low polling time; that's what I use.

I've been using a mix of a DS4 via Bluetooth (without DS4Windows; support for it in Steam has been good; I can play Spyro Reignited with the correct button glyphs) and Xbox 360 controllers with the Wireless Receiver for Windows peripheral.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 6:17 pm 



Joined: 31 Jul 2019
Posts: 10
vol.2 wrote:
Freedy wrote:
Hi,

I am wondering if it is possible to install an SNES borti supercic + uIGR + Dual Oscillator (the older superCIC board without the de-itter mod) board that is meant to installed in a 1-chip system into a 3-chip system?
The simple reason I am asking, I don't have a board that is for the 3-chip system, only the DFO version for the 1-chip model.


Nope. https://github.com/borti4938/SNES_RGB_Bypass


Thank you, but my question was about the multiregion supercic board, not about RGB bypass.

(According to the description you linked, the bypass board meant for the 1-chip motherboard is also compatible with 3chip boards. )


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 Post subject: Re: Questions that do not deserve a thread
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 8:06 pm 


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Freedy wrote:

(According to the description you linked, the bypass board meant for the 1-chip motherboard is also compatible with 3chip boards. )


Ah well. Sorry for not reading your question carefully, and glad you figured it out.


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