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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:07 pm 



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 48
fagin wrote:
tcancian wrote:
Is there a thread on the new SLG SCART?

http://wp1114205.wp150.webpack.hosteuro ... ucts_id=43

I'm curious if it works with 480i signals on CRT in order to turn the TV in 240p mode, like the Emotia? Too bad the Emotia is big, old and heavy.

Now there's a product suggestion you know :mrgreen:


Use an Extron RGB interface (feed it a signal from the Sync Strike). Small and cheap.

BTW the Extron Emotia is for 480p inputs not 480i.


Forgot that, anyway, what you mean by Extron RGB Interface? You mean the Emotia line or is there another line of products capable of downscaling 480p/480i (preferably) to 240p?


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2011 7:46 am 


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SLG SCART is not able to scale down from 480i/p to 240p.
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2011 1:55 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2010
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Location: UK
tcancian wrote:
fagin wrote:
tcancian wrote:
Is there a thread on the new SLG SCART?

http://wp1114205.wp150.webpack.hosteuro ... ucts_id=43

I'm curious if it works with 480i signals on CRT in order to turn the TV in 240p mode, like the Emotia? Too bad the Emotia is big, old and heavy.

Now there's a product suggestion you know :mrgreen:


Use an Extron RGB interface (feed it a signal from the Sync Strike). Small and cheap.

BTW the Extron Emotia is for 480p inputs not 480i.


Forgot that, anyway, what you mean by Extron RGB Interface? You mean the Emotia line or is there another line of products capable of downscaling 480p/480i (preferably) to 240p?


Put "Extron RGB" into eBay. Any model number will do.

This unit does not downsample as it only works with 480i (for what we want it to do in this scenario).

You feed the Extron RGB a dsub15 480i image and it will output a pseudo 240p 15khz image.
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2011 8:35 pm 



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 48
@Fagin

Is there any difference from those models to the Emotia? I already own a YPrPb transcoder and a HD BOX PRO. So I assume that hooking up a PlayStation 2 to the HD BOX, and then to the Extron RGB and then to the YPrPb transcoder would give me 240p on a CRT right? Would you know of any model in particular that might suit this setup? Thanks in advance :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2011 9:22 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2010
Posts: 1647
Location: UK
No, that will not work.

As I said previously, this Extron device is for 480i signals. Your HDBOXPRO will be outputting a progressive image. However, you can ditch the scaler and do the following:

PS2 RGB SCART -> Sync Strike -> Extron RGB -> CRT
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2011 3:54 am 



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 48
fagin wrote:
No, that will not work.

As I said previously, this Extron device is for 480i signals. Your HDBOXPRO will be outputting a progressive image. However, you can ditch the scaler and do the following:

PS2 RGB SCART -> Sync Strike -> Extron RGB -> CRT


Thanks. You sure any RGB model will do? Would the 150xi do? Mind I ask, is there any other Extron device that you know of, aside the Emotia, that accepts 480p?

Is your model (580xi) capable of amplifying RGB signals?

bencao74 wrote:
SLG SCART is not able to scale down from 480i/p to 240p.


Mind I ask, what happens if you plug let's say a PlayStation 2 to the SLG SCART and then to the CRT TV? According to fagin, the 580xi isn't "true" 240p either, it's just a 480i in which either odd or even field is simply missing, resulting in scanlines (though the framerate is 30 fps).


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2011 12:17 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2010
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Any RGB device will do. Yes the one I have allows you to amplify the signal.

I personally don't know of any other device from Extron that deals appropriately with 480p.
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:34 pm 



Joined: 20 Jun 2009
Posts: 293
Location: UK - Essex
Hi All,

Sorry if this has been mentioned & I missed it but.

1. Does the resolution have to be set at 640x480 all the time (I usually have my desktop 1280x1040 I think it is) but MAME at 640x480
2. I have a Samsung LCD & I keep getting the PC box in the top left (channel name) & Check Signal Cable in the middle of the screen even tho I have a picture?


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 11:07 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2010
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Location: UK
Yes should be 640x480 if you want proper scanlines against an original 240p image.
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 11:25 pm 



Joined: 20 Jun 2009
Posts: 293
Location: UK - Essex
Oh OK - but how do I get rid of the Check Signal cable etc?


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 12:15 pm 



Joined: 19 Mar 2010
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Location: UK
Beaps wrote:
Oh OK - but how do I get rid of the Check Signal cable etc?


Don't know - sounds like a VGA input issue on your screen.
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 1:04 pm 



Joined: 20 Jun 2009
Posts: 293
Location: UK - Essex
hummmm yer I was thinking the same thing.

Gonna try some different vga cables as the one I have maybe cheap ones.

I seem to be not having much luck now matter what I try whether is this or the scaler. :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 11:09 pm 



Joined: 07 Jan 2012
Posts: 23
Location: Arizona, United States
Hey all, it's my first time on this site and I would like to apologize in advance for sounding like a noob, but here goes...

OK, so I've been getting in to older gaming consoles lately (SNES, N64, etc.), but I was dissapointed with how these systems were displayed on my HD TV. I upgraded to S-Video cables, which improved the color richness of the output, but I was still left wanting. After reading a bit on the subject of hooking up these older systems to newer sets, I stumbled upon the SLG 3000. This seemed to be precisely what I was looking for - a way to get the look of an old CRT display on a newer LCD screen, better capturing the feel of these retro consoles.

So I purchased a modest video upscaler (Hall Research TVB-250) to convert the S-Video outs of my SNES and N64 to VGA for the SLG 3000. This model upscaler can output to a variety of resolutions, from 640x480 to 1600x1200, so I figured I could tweak the settings a bit to suit my liking. I set up this upscaler/converter to my television and it seemed to do all right - the video upscaler that was built in to my TV set seems to be of poor quality, so this scaler offered a definite improvement.

Now today I recieved my SLG 3000 in the mail, and I enthusiastically hooked it into my setup... and nothing happened. The way I've got it set up is:

SNES (S-Video) -> TVB-250 (S-Video In/VGA out) -> SLG 3000 -> LCD HD TV

I've been tinkering around with my setup, adjusting my scaler to 640x480, 800x600, 1024x768, and 1600x1200 VGA outputs, I've changed the DIP switch configuration on the SLG to any and all combinations, even connected the whole rig to my LCD computer moniter to see if it was just the TV acting funny...

Anyways, I can't get any scanlines on my screen. When I set the upscaler to any output of 800x600 or above, the screen slightly darkens when the SLG is connected and I can darken it further by adjusting the knob (for scanline density, correct?) on the side of the SLG 3000 v2. When set to 640x480, the little LED on the SLG board springs to life, which I thought was a very good sign that I was on the right path - however, after fiddling with every setting I could think of, my display doesn't change in the slightest when in 640x480 mode (the screen doesn't even darken a bit like it does on the higher resolutions).

So, is there anybody that can offer any advice as to what the issue could be? I was really looking forward to some retro-looking visuals on my flat-screen, but now I don't know if maybe I need a better upscaler, television, or if there is something wrong with my SLG 3000. :(

Thanks in advance, and again I apologize for sounding like a newbie. :)


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 12:57 pm 


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If the dip settings on the SLG3000 don't help, then your upscaler outputs the wrong sync polarity. There's nothing you can do about that except building an external sync inverter. This is unfortunately true for a number of upscalers.


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:13 pm 



Joined: 07 Jan 2012
Posts: 23
Location: Arizona, United States
Thank you for your speedy reply! I haven't heard about a sync inverter before - that would solve the issue I am having? Where could I get such a device?

I've been trying other ways to test out the SLG 3000. I thought that perhaps it was my video scaler like you have suggested, so I removed that element from the equation and hooked the SLG up in between both my laptop computer's VGA output and my old desktop PC as well. I tried:

Laptop VGA out -> SLG 3000 -> LCD computer monitor

and also

PC VGA out -> SLG 3000 -> LCD computer monitor

On both attempts I could not get the SLG to work properly. I tried every output resolution my computers were capable of, every DIP switch and potentiometer setting on the SLG - all I managed to accomplish was a slight darkening of the screen adjustable through the potentiometer of the SLG (which I found strange, because this occured regardless of whether or not the SLG was flipped on or off, and didn't change as I altered the DIP configuration - when both DIP switches are set to OFF, the SLG shouldn't alter the VGA output at all, should it?).

I did notice some strange effect on the colors present on my screen as I went through various SLG configurations - streaks of color went across parts of the screen as I adjusted the potentiometer at times, looking as though the outputs color saturation and tint settings were being altered by the SLG.

I am not sure - perhaps this sync inverter is what I lack, but from what I've seen now that I've hooked 3 different devices into the SLG 3000 with the same results each time, I feel that perhaps it is my SLG that is the issue. Maybe I got a defective one?


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:38 pm 


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Location: Bedfordshire, England.
lunch_box wrote:
BuckoA51 wrote:
Yeah the US SNES outputs RGB, usually the caps are different than on the N64, though a stock N64 doesn't output RGB at all of course, so an "N64 cable" might just be a composite cable.

The wiring diagrams here should be accurate http://members.optusnet.com.au/eviltim/ ... t.htm#snes


Thanks for the help so far, it appears that the original USA SNES ouputs RGB as standard so thats ok, so im guessing the issue is with my scart lead.

Would this be the answer to my problems??

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Super-Nintend ... 2eb81fca1c

Thanks once again, hopefully I can get it all up and running soon



Regarding these cable, should you be able to change the colour when using a true scrat cable, as with the scart cable i have with my NTSC SNES i can change the colour, i was under the impression that the colour should be fixed and could alter it via the TV settings


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 4:13 pm 


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Quote:
Thank you for your speedy reply! I haven't heard about a sync inverter before - that would solve the issue I am having? Where could I get such a device?


I use an Extron RGB 580xi for this and it works well, though pretty much any Extron RGB should do the trick. Some of them you have to open and change jumpers internally for sync polarity whereas some of them have DIP switches for it.
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 5:51 pm 


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Would to buy the slg scart converter.

I rapid question: can i use - for an ntsc/jp ngc without rgb cable - this solution?

Ngc > simple composite to scart converter > slg scart > lcd tv

Or it will work only with pure rgb signal? :|

Thanks a lot, guys. :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2012 12:41 am 


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i don't really want to open a new topic for this, but couldn't find anything specific with the search function.

my new tv has a quiet bad scaler inbuilt and scaling up from 640x480 on vga to the native 1080p is quite bad.
the picture is very "soft" and muddy and scanlines also look like drawn with a soft pencil.

does it make sense to use something like this :
http://www.lenkeng.net/Html/Product/LKV352.html

would the picture get a lot sharper or will it do a similar job like my tv set. are more expensive options like the
similar atlona vga-hdmi scaler much more worth it.

or do i have to save for an edge ?


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:10 am 


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Just to double check the SLG3000 will work if connected to the XRGB-3 correct?

I'm assuming it goes something like this:

RGB consoles -> Scaler with VGA output -> SLG3000 -> TV
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:40 am 


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You may need to change the sync polarity in the XRGB3's menus too. Why do you want to attach it to your XRGB3 anyway?
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:32 pm 


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To get scanlines on the Dreamcast when it's projecting in VGA. Plus the 3000 has a dip switch option to adjust the polarity. I feel it will be useful for my friends Supergun. Enable us to play those games with a faint or glaring signal (Rival Schools Arcade Board). I'm told the XRGB-3 working in unison with the SLG3000 is unbeatable.

What's the best way to go about changing the sync polarity on the XRGB-3? It has so many menus I get confused.
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Last edited by Rock Man on Mon Jan 30, 2012 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:56 pm 



Joined: 20 Jun 2009
Posts: 293
Location: UK - Essex
Can you use this with Xbox 360?

I tried it via VGA and power light never came on so I never got picture.


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 3:06 pm 


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For the xbox360 you could just use a normal VGA cable and plug the slg3000 directly. Use 640x480 resolution. For the dreamcast a VGA box is recommended.
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:54 pm 


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Quote:
To get scanlines on the Dreamcast when it's projecting in VGA.


No reason to use the XRGB3 then, well I suppose it might cut down on cable clutter. You can use it in conjunction with the XRGB3 to put scanlines on 480p component sources like the Wii, Gamecube or Xbox 1 though.

Quote:
I feel it will be useful for my friends Supergun. Enable us to play those games with a faint or glaring signal (Rival Schools Arcade Board).


It won't make any difference to compatibility.

Quote:
I'm told the XRGB-3 working in unison with the SLG3000 is unbeatable.


Scanlines are pretty much the same, however the SLG3000 will give you scanlines in B0 if you want them (unlikely that you can use B0 on a modern TV though), and for 480p sources in B1 too.

Quote:
Plus the 3000 has a dip switch option to adjust the polarity.


I'm talking about sync polarity. That's not what the DIP switches are for.

Quote:
What's the best way to go about changing the sync polarity on the XRGB-3? It has so many menus I get confused.


Its um, V-Sync Pol I think? Mines not set up at the moment, I'm still renovating!
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:14 pm 


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Quote:
and for 480p sources in B1 too.

and it gives you 240p-ish scanlines for 480i sources as well, which I found kinda useful for games like Sengoku Ace, Dragon Blaze or all the classic compilations (Taito, Capcom etc) on the PS2.


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:11 pm 


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for testing purposes i connected my chain a bit different today. i wanted to
try sharpening out the picture a bit with the ebay scaler. so i did:

xbox360 (@640x480) -> slg -> ebay scaler (@1024x768) with the following result:

Image

the scanlines have a different colour which cycles every few lines.

is this something that might happen with other, higher quality scalers when
scaling it up to a higher resolution ?


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:11 pm 


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640x480 from the 360 is plenty sharp for me, are you using the official M$ VGA cable, because 3rd party ones are not good. I think you will run into the same problem with higher quality scalers because the resolution is not exact double of the original 15khz image.
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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:34 pm 


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Quote:
is this something that might happen with other, higher quality scalers when scaling it up to a higher resolution ?

that's uneven scaling. Some scalers do this fine, some fail. If you can grab a Gefen VGA to DVI Scaler (sometimes very cheap on ebay), they can do this fine (to any resolution, no matter if XGA or Full HD).


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 Post subject: Re: New Scanline generator SLG3000 - available now!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:49 pm 


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BuckoA51 wrote:
No reason to use the XRGB3 then, well I suppose it might cut down on cable clutter. You can use it in conjunction with the XRGB3 to put scanlines on 480p component sources like the Wii, Gamecube or Xbox 1 though.


Standard VGA mode on my HDTV looks whack yo. Blurry image with very slightly dark, wide lines going up and down the screen. It's just barely passable. But when I connect it through the XRGB-3's bypass it gives me a sharper picture. I can confirm a definite boost in color and contrast. At first I thought the mediocre picture when connected directly into the TV had something to do with my TV's settings so I tried adjusting them and that didn't really help. So the XRGB-3 in conjunction with the DC is ideal for my set-up. The SLG3000 forms the trifecta!

Quote:
It won't make any difference to compatibility.


Dammit. Looks like I got wrong information then. We had reason to believe the reason why a lot of the games didn't work was it had something to do with the voltage. I was told a potentionmeter could fix that and one was built inside the 3000. I assume this ones a different potentionmeter then?

Quote:
I'm talking about sync polarity. That's not what the DIP switches are for.


Sorry, I should have said "SYNC polarity" and not just "polarity". I thought you knew what I meant.

Quote:
Its um, V-Sync Pol I think? Mines not set up at the moment, I'm still renovating!


Think last I tried that V-Sync Pol it blacked-out the picture. Then again nothing was hooked up at the time. I doubt it would work on Rival Schools. Seems in the end the EGA/CGA/YUV motherboard along with a CRT or Arcade monitor that can take those different resolutions are unavoidable. I thought this would be something that may allow boards to work better but it was not meant to be.
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