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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:15 pm 


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Joined: 20 Jul 2017
Posts: 210
Okay it still may also be worth checking inside the cable to make sure it is wired up correctly. Even better, check the pins are connected properly with a multimeter if you have one.

Here are the pins for the RGB input on the FM:

Image

and EuroSCART:

Image

Sometimes consoles may not output sync at a high enough level to be detected by the Framemeister, so try turning up the SYNC_LEVEL setting and see if that helps.

Also obviously make sure the Framemeister is set to the RGB input.

Are both/either of your cables confirmed working on another device? I understand most households don't have many SCART compatible devices these days but if you can be certain that the cable/console combinations are working then it helps for diagnosing issues.

I think Solaris also have pretty good after-sales support, so if your unit is faulty then they should be able to help you out. Don't do anything that would void your warranty while trying to diagnose issues.


Last edited by Kez on Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:16 pm 



Joined: 18 Sep 2012
Posts: 90
I bet this has been asked a billion times but if I use a simple VGA cable with my Dreamcast like this:

https://s4.postimg.org/bz1eeyj8t/cable_1.jpg

How can I hook it up to the xrgb while outputing 480p?
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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:21 pm 


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VGA output is RGBHV, the FM can only accept RGBS. You need to combine the HV sync into CSYNC with a sync combiner. Sync combiner circuits aren't that tough or expensive to build if you have a bit of knowhow, so that is the cheapest option.

You can also use an Extron RGB interface which will output RGBS over BNC.

The Toro by Beharbros is specifically designed for this purpose, and outputs RGBS over SCART. This is the simplest option but also the most expensive.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:25 pm 



Joined: 28 Mar 2018
Posts: 9
Location: Germany
@Kez Thanks again for the advice.

Scart Ports are rare on modern TVS indeed but I have a Sony 43 8305 and this TV has a Scart Port. I was using this port for a long time before I decided to buy the Framemeister. All my cables were working properly.

Checking the pins is a good idea. I will do do it.

I have also checked always If the remote is set on the RGB mode. It was all the time as well.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 4:44 am 



Joined: 01 Feb 2016
Posts: 24
Has anyone tried adding RCA inputs for RGBS, like this Japanese blogger?
http://www.mieow.jp/stripe/blog/2013/05 ... %E9%80%A0/

Seems fairly easy solder-wise, and I already have a power drill and step bit for making the holes.

I'm just not sure what kind of RCA sockets to get, or where to get them from. About the only RGB colored ones (not required, but would be nice) I see are from uxcell, and some of their products get pretty bad reviews on Amazon.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:09 am 


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jd213 wrote:
Has anyone tried adding RCA inputs for RGBS, like this Japanese blogger?
http://www.mieow.jp/stripe/blog/2013/05 ... %E9%80%A0/

Seems fairly easy solder-wise, and I already have a power drill and step bit for making the holes.

I'm just not sure what kind of RCA sockets to get, or where to get them from. About the only RGB colored ones (not required, but would be nice) I see are from uxcell, and some of their products get pretty bad reviews on Amazon.


If he's going to cut up the top of the shell like that, I'd just install a female SCART socket instead. I'm pretty sure it would fit if he can fit those RCA jacks in it like that.
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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:33 am 



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I live in Japan and don't have any SCART cables, so that wouldn't be of any use to me.

I mainly wanted to use RCA for RGB over a PS2 component cable (plus composite from a SCPH-1160 PS1 AV adapter for sync) to replace the official Sony JP21 PS1 cable I have, which I assume has capacitors in it already, making it not as good for PS2 use.

I also have an DB Grafx Booster style RGB amp for PC Engine that I got off Yahoo Auctions, and that uses RGBS over RCA, but I probably won't be using it with the Framemeister very often.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 9:29 pm 



Joined: 26 Feb 2018
Posts: 5
Just curious if anyone on here has picked up one of these or has any experience with something similar.

https://hdfury.com/product/linker-4k60-444-600mhz-scaler/

I'm running a Framemeister into my LGB6 Oled and I was curious if something like this might upscale better than the TVs internal upscaler.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2018 2:35 pm 


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Kez wrote:
The Toro by Beharbros is specifically designed for this purpose, and outputs RGBS over SCART. This is the simplest option but also the most expensive.


Does anyone know the voltage level the Toro outputs for CSYNC on the SCART and the VGA ?

SCART level should be: 0.3V
VGA level should be TTL: 5V

However the FrameMeister does not want more than: 0.3V peak to peak.

The FrameMeister RGB input specification is actually the same as the SCART specification.

From the official MicomSoft site:

Code:
RGB端子(8ピン miniDIN):NTSC 21ピンRGBマルチ
アナログRGB信号:0.7Vp-p(75Ω)
同期信号:複合同期(C sync)0.3Vp-p負極性
水平同期周波数:15kHz(NTSC相当)
垂直同期周波数:60Hz
音声:アナログ音声(ステレオ2ch)
※TTLデジタルRGBの入力には対応いたしません。
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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 2:12 pm 



Joined: 26 Jan 2017
Posts: 4
Received my XRGB Mini today and have a small issue. I don't get any video when trying to output though my AV receiver. The receiver i have just passes signals though to the output, with no processing at all, so shouldn't be stopping anything. If i plug it straight into my TV then that works no probs, but as there's no external audio out on the Mini I'm plugging the XRGB Mini into my DVDO Edge and then sending that through the amp which works fine. This isn't really an issue, but just curious if anyone else has had any problems with receivers?


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 2:43 pm 


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You can try to toggle the FM between HDMI and DVI output modes. Might be a colorspace issue with your receiver and one of the two output modes....


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 3:14 pm 



Joined: 26 Jan 2017
Posts: 4
Thanks, just tried but unfortunately it's the same.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:21 am 


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JamieS wrote:
Received my XRGB Mini today and have a small issue. I don't get any video when trying to output though my AV receiver. The receiver i have just passes signals though to the output, with no processing at all, so shouldn't be stopping anything. If i plug it straight into my TV then that works no probs, but as there's no external audio out on the Mini I'm plugging the XRGB Mini into my DVDO Edge and then sending that through the amp which works fine. This isn't really an issue, but just curious if anyone else has had any problems with receivers?


Did you try turning deep color mode off? After that, try changing the output mode from "Auto" to "RGB".
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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:52 am 



Joined: 13 Mar 2011
Posts: 1007
Location: Toronto, Canada
I have a dream .. a dream where Micomsoft open sources the XRG firmware and it becomes the best scalar ever made.

I have a lesser dream - a dream where Micomsoft gives users the ability to control the LPF level similar to an OSSC.

Anyone have similar dreams??


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 1:31 am 


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leonk wrote:
I have a dream .. a dream where Micomsoft open sources the XRG firmware and it becomes the best scalar ever made.

I have a lesser dream - a dream where Micomsoft gives users the ability to control the LPF level similar to an OSSC.

Anyone have similar dreams??


I had a dream where my Framemeister didn't die after just under a year of light use. :(


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:41 am 


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What's the consensus on HDTV's deinterlacing 480i and connecting 480p directly to a HDTV over the Framemeister? I noticed that Asian LG tv's displays SD content remarkably well, so much so that I'm inclined not to use the XRGB anymore. Am I just lucky that I have a TV that compares to the XRGB favorably or are there benefits of the XRGB upscaling that I might overlook?


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:47 am 


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The FM is not great at 480p so there aren't any real advantages to using it if your TV does a good job.

Its interlacing is very good, though. Motion and input lag is normally where deinterlacers will suffer, so those are the things to look out for when comparing it against a TV directly.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:33 am 


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Quote:
What's the consensus on HDTV's deinterlacing 480i and connecting 480p directly to a HDTV over the Framemeister?

480p directly into the TV is certainly the better choice over the FM. Eventually the TV's 480p handling differes from manufacturer to manufacturer. 480p upscaling on the LGs is OK'ish, but far from great. Sonys have the best 480p handling.

480i is a different matter though. The deinterlacing on most TVs is really good these days, but the whole algorithm is optimized for video, not graphics, so you're definitely losing the clear pixels you get from 480i content on the FM. 480i deinterlaced by a TV will always look softer than native 480p from a console. The FM on the other hand makes static 480i look as good as true 480p.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:51 am 


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Kez wrote:
The FM is not great at 480p so there aren't any real advantages to using it if your TV does a good job.

Its interlacing is very good, though. Motion and input lag is normally where deinterlacers will suffer, so those are the things to look out for when comparing it against a TV directly.


Fudoh wrote:
Quote:
What's the consensus on HDTV's deinterlacing 480i and connecting 480p directly to a HDTV over the Framemeister?

480p directly into the TV is certainly the better choice over the FM. Eventually the TV's 480p handling differes from manufacturer to manufacturer. 480p upscaling on the LGs is OK'ish, but far from great. Sonys have the best 480p handling.

480i is a different matter though. The deinterlacing on most TVs is really good these days, but the whole algorithm is optimized for video, not graphics, so you're definitely losing the clear pixels you get from 480i content on the FM. 480i deinterlaced by a TV will always look softer than native 480p from a console. The FM on the other hand makes static 480i look as good as true 480p.


Thanks for the reply guys. I do have the Framemeister, or rather, I did until it decided to die on me a few weeks back after just under a year. I searched high and low on how to fixe it until Solaris offered to repair it for a fee (although it's been a month since they contacted me). I primarily use the XRGB for 480i content (PS2, GC and Wii) with FireBrandX's profiles.

Subjectively, I found that all 3 of my LG TV's compared favorably to the image quality of the XRGB sans integer scaling and it kinda baffles me considering I've also tried on my SHARP TV and it looked as bad as I expected. The image quality on my LGs are sharp and they all pass the "interactive tests" of the 240p test suite. I also found out that TV's in sold South East Asia are different than American or UK models, and perhaps that might explain it.

Are there tests I could run on my TV that will confirm that it's doing a good deinterlacing job? I consider myself a novice video/audiophile so my TVs are properly calibrated.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:03 am 


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Hey, so, I've been wrestling with my setup for a good two years now and I've finally reached my wits end, don't know what to do. I've got all my consoles hooked up to my Framemeister through a gscartsw-lite, and everything works... technically. Only problem is I've got hecka white noise all over the place.

Examples can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/WillCarpenterJR/sta ... 2178462720

Any ideas? I'm using SCART cables from Retro Gaming Cables UK, for what that's worth.


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:19 am 


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Location: UK
Quote:
Hey, so, I've been wrestling with my setup for a good two years now and I've finally reached my wits end, don't know what to do. I've got all my consoles hooked up to my Framemeister through a gscartsw-lite, and everything works... technically. Only problem is I've got hecka white noise all over the place.

Examples can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/WillCarpenterJR/sta ... 2178462720

Any ideas? I'm using SCART cables from Retro Gaming Cables UK, for what that's worth.



have you tried something like one of these? https://www.futureshop.co.uk/tacima-cs9 ... 2cQAvD_BwE
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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:55 pm 


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BuckoA51 wrote:
Quote:
Hey, so, I've been wrestling with my setup for a good two years now and I've finally reached my wits end, don't know what to do. I've got all my consoles hooked up to my Framemeister through a gscartsw-lite, and everything works... technically. Only problem is I've got hecka white noise all over the place.

Examples can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/WillCarpenterJR/sta ... 2178462720

Any ideas? I'm using SCART cables from Retro Gaming Cables UK, for what that's worth.



have you tried something like one of these? https://www.futureshop.co.uk/tacima-cs9 ... 2cQAvD_BwE


No, and come to think of it, my power supply is just some rando cheap thing I found in my garage, so I guess that's worth trying. Went ahead and ordered it, can't hurt. Thanks.

Though my HD consoles look fine; if it were the power supply, would it not affect those as well?


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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:03 pm 


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Quote:
Though my HD consoles look fine; if it were the power supply, would it not affect those as well?


Not necessarily, if they're using HDMI that's an entirely digital, packet based transmission so isn't really susceptible to things like analogue video interference.
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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:16 pm 



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Posts: 90
BuckoA51 wrote:
Quote:
Though my HD consoles look fine; if it were the power supply, would it not affect those as well?


Not necessarily, if they're using HDMI that's an entirely digital, packet based transmission so isn't really susceptible to things like analogue video interference.


This is isn't entirely true. I agree that a PSU can't cause his problems, also not like analogue signals interference I agree but from personal experience:
I have a pc on my office that I hook it with a 15 meters HDMI cable to my receiver and this into my tv.

I had to return the first cable and get another one because I was getting green artifacts on the screen.
I know 15 meters is beyond hdmi specification but it works, and I'm not using a active cable, just a plain passive one.
It also works with hdmi 2.0 to display 4k at 60hz 4:4:4 without chroma subsampling and even HDR is possible together with dolby atmos.

So this theory that hdmi is image on or off isn't true. You can get artifacts or some weird grain.
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 Post subject: Re: XRGB-mini Framemeister
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:43 pm 


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Smile_Kaiser wrote:
Hey, so, I've been wrestling with my setup for a good two years now and I've finally reached my wits end, don't know what to do. I've got all my consoles hooked up to my Framemeister through a gscartsw-lite, and everything works... technically. Only problem is I've got hecka white noise all over the place.

Examples can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/WillCarpenterJR/sta ... 2178462720

Any ideas? I'm using SCART cables from Retro Gaming Cables UK, for what that's worth.


You need to be able to isolate the cause. Lets try a few things:

1. Do you get this same noise on D-Terminal input?

2. Do you get this same noise using the HDMI inputs on the Framemeister? (try both passthrough mode and active processing mode).

3. If 1 and 2 turn out to also have the same noise, can you try on a different monitor?

4. If a different monitor shows the same noise, then we're left with it being something wrong with your FM or 'possibly' a power issue.
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