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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 4:05 pm 


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Heh, old story - I highly recommend following the above two poster's advice if you're not to keen on seeing "one of your faves" dead. :wink:
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 5:47 pm 



Joined: 30 Nov 2007
Posts: 137
I have been wondering about ways to protect boards and make change overs easier. Obviously JAMMA was designed for use inside a cab and not being changed much.

You can get plastic document cases which are about the right size for many PCBs. Then there is the edge connector... I was thinking along the lines of using something like a 68 way SCSI cable as they have nice connectors on them.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 8:27 pm 


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Advice duly noted. I pretty much kept the board that way since that's how it was shipped to me, I got some wood planks I can use though.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:58 pm 


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mojo wrote:
I have been wondering about ways to protect boards and make change overs easier. Obviously JAMMA was designed for use inside a cab and not being changed much.

When that nice gentleman makes the JAMMA connector with self-healing fuse protected lines, it would ease wear on the board edges. I think that keeping some kind of extension or loom always mounted to a couple PCBs (so that the points being rubbed together are not actually on the board or, ideally, the SG either) you change most often is the best route...but that would be a bit expensive insurance for all but the more expensive boards, and I don't use boards enough to invest in such an idea yet.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 26, 2010 6:48 pm 



Joined: 30 Nov 2007
Posts: 137
I don't think it would cost too much as you could recycle SCSI cables which are very cheap on eBay now. You could use a 68 pin cable and use the spare lines for extra power wires, or use a 50 pin cable and have separate power and audio lines (might be a good idea for high power boards and if you want to run a speaker directly).


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 3:18 pm 


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Here's my supergun:

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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 3:33 pm 


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^Nice :)

I'd love to hear advice about making square holes in various plastics materials - I have enough dremel tools but that stuff gets just too hot and melts the edges... result = looks ugly.
Do I have to cut at low speeds or at very high speeds? Do you guys even use a dremel for that kind of work?

Thanks in advance.
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 3:50 pm 


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Thanks.

To answer your question - I first cut a smaller hole with a dremel tool, and then enlarge it with a utility knife.
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 4:01 pm 


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Figured as much - next time I'll try it with good sharp knife too. Seems to me like the only way to not mess up the edges too much.
I used a typical euro-casing for my sgun, one of those with the pcb-"ribs" on the innerside and it was a bit of a pain to work with because of those.
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 5:51 pm 



Joined: 30 Nov 2007
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How did you interface the Saturn pad? Is the pad itself modified or is there a decoder inside the SG itself?


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 6:21 pm 


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I went the easiest (for me) road - pad modification. A decoder would be nice, though, but I'm afraid it could introduce lags like every additional electronics :/
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:07 pm 



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I have made a decoder for mine.

Lag is not an issue. The documentation for the Saturn Peripheral Controller states that to read the pad you have to do it in four stages each taking a minimum of 2μs (2 one-millionths of a second). In actual fact the standard Saturn pad can tolerate 0.2μs per stage, but let's go with the official number. That means that reading the pad takes a minimum of 8μs, say 10μs with time for processing the results with things like button mapping and auto-fire.

10μs is 0.00001 seconds or 100,000 updates per second. In other words, zero lag.

Consider also that an actual Sega Saturn has to decode the pad when reading it, so it too is subject to the same amount of lag (i.e. none).

Playstation 1 pads can be read at a maximum of about 1,000 times per second, Playstation 2 pads in analogue mode are more like 250 times per second. Those numbers are not that important in Playstation games, only the response time of the pad is because they do not run continuous updates. For a Supergun though 250 times per second is a bit lower than I would like, although a digital arcade stick should be okay.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 10:05 pm 


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Since a move into a smaller apartment has made it necessary to get rid of my cab, it looks like I need to figure out some sort of Supergun setup to use in my new place. Based on some searching around on the Internet it looks like doing one of these as a DIY project may actually be plausible if I use something like a JROK component encoder board (although I only have relatively minimal electronics experience.) I've got a couple of questions on this though before I start messing around with things:

-What type of power supply would work best for this? I see some relatively cheap 110w power supplies out there, would these be sufficient for what I'm doing here?

-Is jammaboards.com a reputable place to shop for parts?

-Are there any specific recommendations on joystick enclosures that people have? I've got parts on hand to build at least one stick, but I haven't tried building one before.
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 2:41 am 


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Vexorg wrote:
Since a move into a smaller apartment has made it necessary to get rid of my cab, it looks like I need to figure out some sort of Supergun setup to use in my new place. Based on some searching around on the Internet it looks like doing one of these as a DIY project may actually be plausible if I use something like a JROK component encoder board (although I only have relatively minimal electronics experience.) I've got a couple of questions on this though before I start messing around with things:

-What type of power supply would work best for this? I see some relatively cheap 110w power supplies out there, would these be sufficient for what I'm doing here?

-Is jammaboards.com a reputable place to shop for parts?

-Are there any specific recommendations on joystick enclosures that people have? I've got parts on hand to build at least one stick, but I haven't tried building one before.

You really should use a true arcade power supply. I think you will regret it if you don't.

Jammaboards.com is reliable.

The only enclosure I have experience with is the Pactec PT-10. It's not perfect, but I think it's pretty decent for what it is. It's fairly compact, so two rows of four buttons is too much. I went with two rows of three buttons, but I could have done a neo-geo layout rotated slighty and it would have worked just as well. It has a sizable angle between the top of the enclosure and the level bottom, but it doesn't bother me as much as some other people.

Edit - Picture:

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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 7:12 pm 



Joined: 30 Nov 2007
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Arcade PSUs are just normal industrial type PSUs that the cabinet manufacturer decided to use. There is nothing special about them so there is no point paying well over the odds for one.

For joysticks I have converted a couple of Dreamcast sticks. They are okay-ish, plenty of room inside but you need to widen the button holes a bit. Be careful not to damage the paintwork if you widen them, unless you plan to re-paint or cover it anyway. You also need to mod the joystick bracket quite a bit.

I picked up a Supergun joystick in Japan earlier this year for 3000 yen. It has auto-fire and takes a Seimitsu or Sanwa stick. It was used but in reasonable condition. I have stripped it and am currently replacing the electronics with my own design. That sort of base is ideal if you can find one, otherwise you can buy wood frames for a reasonable amount. Unless you like modding or on are on a tight budget I'd say getting a purpose built base and installing your own buttons and joystick is the best option.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 6:17 pm 


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I already have a couple of Sanwa JLF-TM-8T sticks and some buttons I was planning to use for a control panel mod I never got to on my current cabinet, so I'll probably end up using those if I build sticks.

Also, in terms of kick harnesses for 6-button controllers, how are those generally handled in Supergun setups?
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 6:26 pm 



Joined: 30 Nov 2007
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Kick harnesses vary depending on the manufacturer so you can either just add one specifically for, say, Capcom board or you could add a DB9 socket and then make adapters for different boards which connect to that.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 7:53 pm 


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I'm pretty sure that the only 6-button games I'd use would be CPS2 (I'd like to get Marvel Vs. Capcom at some point,) but I'm wondering how MVS would be handled in this scenario (it looks like that's done with an MVS-to-JAMMA adapter, right?)

I could actually play all of my current boards on just a plain JAMMA harness with 3-button controls, but I've been limited only to vertical orientation games by my cabinet, so this would also provide a chance to diversify a bit.
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:00 am 


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I'm looking to get a Supergun, but I unfortunately do not possess the ability to simply make one of these. Anybody know of places to buy them?


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 5:15 pm 



Joined: 30 Nov 2007
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I hope to start making them for people later this year, depending on how much time I have. Otherwise it might be next year. I will post on these forums when I eventually get going.

I'd post about it in the trading section, there must be people doing them at the moment.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2010 7:46 pm 


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Gotta quick question about a supergun I found on ebay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/SUPERGUN-SYSTEM-PSONE-SHELL-NEO-GEO-MVS-JAMMA-ARCADE-/160464272793?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0

This says it's for MVS carts, but would it work for other PCB's such as CPS-2 boards?



I'm scared to venture off and attempt to build on of these.....maybe I need to read a bit more.
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2010 8:25 pm 


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Can someone help me out with wiring?

So I got this illuminated switch and I'm not sure how to read the diagram for it

here is the switch I got:
http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...0001_316153_-1

And the wiring is labeled C in this pdf:
http://www.jameco.com/Jameco/Products/ProdDS/316153.pdf

so just wondering how I would go about the +5 and the +12 and getting it lit up when the power is on.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 08, 2010 9:59 pm 



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Posts: 137
The light in that switch says that it is designed for 240V or 120V AC. The bulb is actually in-line with the switch.

To make it work you will have to wire it into the mains side of your PSU. The 5V and 12V lines won't illuminate it. Unfortunately the link the posted is broken but if you have type B from the datasheet just wire it inline with the live wire connected to 1 and 2, and the neutral wire connected to 3. If you have type C make the live wire A1-A2 and the neutral wire B1-B2.

For the 5V and 12V lines I would suggest using resistors if you want to see when they are powered up.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 8:54 pm 


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I just dont get how the switch needed to be wired so I just went ahead and made the supergun, here are some pics. it uses a japanese rgb cable from an MSX connected to an XRGB-3.

Image
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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 15, 2010 1:41 am 


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Location: Toronto
I have a quick, simple question. (Yes I am kinda noobie) :mrgreen:
I have a Sony FW900 16:10 CRT monitor.

Is it possible to hook up one of these Superguns using a VGA cable cobbected to my monitor ?

Also, do I need to tate my monitor to play the games ?

thanks

Here's a pic of the VGA cable. Dunno if theres differenr types or not.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 15, 2010 7:55 pm 


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The HD and VD connectors there are the syncs needed that make this not RGB compatible. True RGB is sync on green or something usually (iirc). Anyway, answered by Fudoh already in your other thread; you know you only ought to ask these questions once.


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 3:52 am 



Joined: 18 Dec 2009
Posts: 1
Hey guys, great thread, just read through the entire thing twice.

Have a couple of questions.

1. What's the name of the RGB/Scart solder plug? I can't find it anywhere.

Found the answer - scart sockets.

2. Is there a one-stop-shop to buy the parts online(DIN, DB-15, etc)? I'm in the US and I guess I could try some place like Radio Shack, but I'd rather order online if possible.

I'll check out jameco, thanks Kiel!

3. How do you add "RGB POTS" to the outside of a case like I see on some pictures? Potentiometers?


Last edited by suffah on Wed Sep 08, 2010 5:16 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 3:50 pm 


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I used jameco.com to order all my stuff in one shot


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 Post subject: Re: What pinout configuration do you use?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 11:29 pm 



Joined: 22 Jan 2009
Posts: 40
Location: Jamma Nation X
Fire-bug wrote:
Here is what I use-

1- Ground
2- Hard Kick (capcom)
3- Select (neo), Medium Kick (capcom), E (atomiswave)
4- D (neo/ atomiswave), Light kick (capcom)
5- B (neo/ atomiswave), Medium punch (capcom)
6- Down
7- Right
8- +5 volts (needed for certain adaptors and neo pads/ sticks)
9- Not used, but can be connected as Neo D (like pin 4)
10- Select (neo), Medium Kick (capcom), E (atomiswave)
11- Start
12- C (neo/ atomiswave) Hard punch (capcom)
13- A (neo/ atomiswave) Light punch (capcom)
14- Left
15- Up

Can anyone improve on this? Or do you use a different layout?


I usually use the pinout below. It's based on the Neo Geo pinout. Pins 2, 9 and 10 are not needed on the arcade system, I use them for the 3 kicks for Capcom fighters via kick harness. Neo select is the same as Atomiswave E aka Push 5:

1-Ground
2-Kick 1 (Light Kick Capcom)
3-Select (Neo) (E - Atomiswave) Sometimes I use it as a coin button as well since it's rarely pressed.
4- D (Neo / Atomiswave)
5- B (Neo / Atomiswave), Medium punch (Capcom)
6- Down
7- Right
8- +5 volts
9- Kick 2 (Medium Kick Capcom)
10- Kick 3 (Roundhouse Kick Capcom)
11- Start
12- C (Neo / Atomiswave) Hard punch (Capcom)
13- A (Neo / Atomiswave) Light punch (Capcom)
14- Left
15- Up


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 Post subject: Re: The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 5:26 am 



Joined: 16 Oct 2009
Posts: 1
Few noob questions that I haven't been able to track down an answer to. I just started learning electronics and playing around with a breadboard so a supergun will be my first big project.

1. In the jamma diagram linked below, how are the ground cables physically bundled together. I understand how the controller grounds are done, they are just bridged to the bottom row grounds. But how are they actually connecting 4 ground points into 1 cable for the power connector? Just twisting a bunch of the copper strands together and soldering it ?

http://www.gamesx.com/arcade/cheapjamma.htm


I will probably end up using a small pcb as described in the document below, but I was wondering how one would do it without a pcb. I'm sure this is like project building 101, but looking at a bunch of different supergun internals didn't give me the answer to it.

http://www.jabba.demon.co.uk/retroranch ... st_rig.doc


2. I run a SCART/RGB - > Component converter, the csy-2100 I believe. Can I just take the RGB+sync directly from the jamma harness to a scart connector and run a scart cable to my component converter? Or do i need to go with a neobitz. I am outputting to a sony crt tube tv if that matters at all.


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