The Supergun discussion and Q&A thread.

[Lynx Winters]

That's what I figured, thanks for confirming.

[goatboy]

Got a Combo AV supergun here. There's 3 banks of dipswitches at the combo's control port. Downloaded the Japanese manual but does anyone have this in english possibly? Would love to know what all those dip-switches are for.

Thanks, Henk.

[shinjig]

another project

Where did you get that enclosure?

[kowal]

custom
I put final soon

[ChurchOfSolipsism]

For those of you who are using a SCART TV: can you recommend a good scart cable, i.e. one with proper shielding? I am trying to decide which of these to get and would be grateful for any pointers:

http://www.amazon.de/Goldkabel-Profi-Sc ... cart+kabel
http://www.amazon.de/All4u-BBVC-Scartka ... cart+kabel
http://www.amazon.de/Hama-Scart-Verbind ... cart+kabel
http://www.amazon.de/Schwaiger-FLV61503 ... cart+kabel
http://www.amazon.de/Clicktronik-Scart- ... cart+kabel

[kowal]

real coax are thick, above 10-12mm on diameter

http://uk.shopping.com/Hama-Hama-ProCla ... -1-5m/info
this use coaxial, dielectric is standard isolation silicon/rubber but all is fine good internal shild on audio and RGBS line

Best option DIY use bnc>VGA adapters many use high quality mini coaxial wire and is cheap, dielectric is the same how on normal coax.

[ChurchOfSolipsism]

For those who care, I bought this shielded Scart cable

http://www.amazon.de/All4u-BBVC-Scartka ... cart+kabel

and it's absolutely brilliant - it provides a crystal clear picture without any kind of interference whatsoever. The price (5 Euros) is ridiculous, the internet says the standard price for it is 80 Euros.

[Icarus]

Potentially stupid question: if a supergun only outputs video correctly if a proper SCART-to-SCART cable is used (and not SCART-to-S-Video or SCART-to-Composite, tested with these and display is whited out), will a SCART-to RGBs cable like this work?
http://www.keene.co.uk/multi.php?mycode=SBB601

[Ed Oscuro]

In this case the SCART is referring to the physical form factor, not some kind of exotic video standard. It's just carrying 15KHz RGB (assuming typical JAMMA), and if the phono plugs are wired up right for your equipment, you should get RGB out of that.

As far as I understand it, RGsB uses composite sync, so keep that in mind for your setup. (The page threw me for a loop when it equated RGB with component video, although this is technically correct it will cause lots of headaches if people assume RGsB = YPbPr.) I also wonder what use RCA-style plugs would be; if you are using this with e.g. a Sony BVM I think you'd have to hunt down some phono to BNC adapters.

[Icarus]

In this case the SCART is referring to the physical form factor, not some kind of exotic video standard. It's just carrying 15KHz RGB (assuming typical JAMMA), and if the phono plugs are wired up right for your equipment, you should get RGB out of that.

As far as I understand it, RGsB uses composite sync, so keep that in mind for your setup. (The page threw me for a loop when it equated RGB with component video, although this is technically correct it will cause lots of headaches if people assume RGsB = YPbPr.) I also wonder what use RCA-style plugs would be; if you are using this with e.g. a Sony BVM I think you'd have to hunt down some phono to BNC adapters.

I want to use this with my iScan VP30, which has RGBSV connectors at the back. I also have BNC connectors for it as well, just in case. I just need to know if this cable will do the job that a number of cables so far have failed to do, and that is output video to my scaler. £30 is a bit much to take a punt on something on the off-chance it might work. :/

[Rob79]

Anyone know if there's a place in Toronto area that has a well built Supergun for sale that uses Neo geo controllers ?

thanks

[moh]

Anyone know if there's a place in Toronto area that has a well built Supergun for sale that uses Neo geo controllers ?

thanks

pm sent

[SA-DaleCooper]

Hey guys, ok so i'm lazy but i want a supergun, are there any good supergun makers that don't reach the japanese supergun pricers? preferably in the united states

[Evilmaxwar]

A question about supergun Tate orientation.

I bought a Vogatek Supergun MKV and my first Arcade PCB, Aero fighter.

By default it tates clockwise, but my Tate setup is Counterclockwise. CCW seems more standard for console games and my screen is close to impossible to change orientation so ideally i would like it to stay like that.

So my question is is there a way to flip the screen with the supergun or maybe the PCB itself?

[emphatic]

So my question is is there a way to flip the screen with the supergun or maybe the PCB itself?

Yes: http://crazykong.com/dips/Aerofigh.txt

In the Second DIP switch bank, SW2, change the setting for the first DIP. DO THIS WITH THE BOARD POWERED OFF.

[Evilmaxwar]

Yes: http://crazykong.com/dips/Aerofigh.txt

In the Second DIP switch bank, SW2, change the setting for the first DIP. DO THIS WITH THE BOARD POWERED OFF.

Thanks! That totally fixed my problem. Somehow I had missed the dip switches when inspecting the board yesterday and thought it didn't have them.
It is good to know that those dip setting tables are available on the web, ill look for them when I get another PCB.

The other issue I have Is that the image is kind of flaky with my Vogatek supergun. I am using s-video. I adjusted the "Sync width" trim pot and made the image better but it still kind of slowly flickers.
I think I will try with another Power supply. I read 400w is recommended. Do some of those PCBs really take that much power?? I am currently using a 300w I borrowed from a P4, so its a bit old.

Also, there is a Switch for " Sync Normal" or "Sync correct" on the supergun.
It was on normal by default and when I put it on correct the image goes askew.
Any idea what this switch is normally for?

[XianXi]

Yes: http://crazykong.com/dips/Aerofigh.txt

In the Second DIP switch bank, SW2, change the setting for the first DIP. DO THIS WITH THE BOARD POWERED OFF.

Thanks! That totally fixed my problem. Somehow I had missed the dip switches when inspecting the board yesterday and thought it didn't have them.
It is good to know that those dip setting tables are available on the web, ill look for them when I get another PCB.

The other issue I have Is that the image is kind of flaky with my Vogatek supergun. I am using s-video. I adjusted the "Sync width" trim pot and made the image better but it still kind of slowly flickers.
I think I will try with another Power supply. I read 400w is recommended. Do some of those PCBs really take that much power?? I am currently using a 300w I borrowed from a P4, so its a bit old.

Also, there is a Switch for " Sync Normal" or "Sync correct" on the supergun.
It was on normal by default and when I put it on correct the image goes askew.
Any idea what this switch is normally for?

On these Vogatek superguns, NEVER adjust the sync width or amplitude. I have no idea why he added those to his superguns as they are superfluous. The sync correct turns on the sync cleaning circuit which removes most noise from the sync signal and also raises/lowers the sync voltage to a correct level. You only need to turn it on if you are experiencing any sync issues.

Now you can try and adjust the width to get it back to normal although it's probably easier to just remove the pots.

[Evilmaxwar]

On these Vogatek superguns, NEVER adjust the sync width or amplitude. I have no idea why he added those to his superguns as they are superfluous. The sync correct turns on the sync cleaning circuit which removes most noise from the sync signal and also raises/lowers the sync voltage to a correct level. You only need to turn it on if you are experiencing any sync issues.

Now you can try and adjust the width to get it back to normal although it's probably easier to just remove the pots.

I was experiencing distortion in the lower half of the image when I first tried the supergun, kind of like what you get when you mess with the tracking on an old VCR. I fixed this by turning the Sync width clockwise a little bit. Seems to me it was not adjusted properly to begin with.

I still have the issue where the image kinds of flickers though. It was not caused by me trying to adjust the sync, it was already present when I first powered the machine.
Adjusting the width even seems to have helped a bit for that too.
Also, the colors seem too strong and bleeding off a bit. I may have to reduce the RGB level some.

[XianXi]

On these Vogatek superguns, NEVER adjust the sync width or amplitude. I have no idea why he added those to his superguns as they are superfluous. The sync correct turns on the sync cleaning circuit which removes most noise from the sync signal and also raises/lowers the sync voltage to a correct level. You only need to turn it on if you are experiencing any sync issues.

Now you can try and adjust the width to get it back to normal although it's probably easier to just remove the pots.

I was experiencing distortion in the lower half of the image when I first tried the supergun, kind of like what you get when you mess with the tracking on an old VCR. I fixed this by turning the Sync width clockwise a little bit. Seems to me it was not adjusted properly to begin with.

I still have the issue where the image kinds of flickers though. It was not caused by me trying to adjust the sync, it was already present when I first powered the machine.
Adjusting the width even seems to have helped a bit for that too.
Also, the colors seem too strong and bleeding off a bit. I may have to reduce the RGB level some.

If adjusting the width helped fix the picture, it means someone messed with it before taking it out of range.

What flickering are you seeing?

[Evilmaxwar]

If adjusting the width helped fix the picture, it means someone messed with it before taking it out of range.

What flickering are you seeing?

I had to turn the width pot for only a tiniest bit to fix the initial problem. Maybe the problem did not show on the test setup this supergun was initially calibrated on but showed on my SONY TV? Also, those pots are very rough, I may change them for precision ones.
I also tried replacing my PSU by a more modern 500W one, that did not change anything.

The "flickering" I observed was like the image was jumping a bit about 3 times a second.
But you know what? I just fixed it.

I activated the sync correct filter switch, which made the image initially all garbled up. But then I adjusted the width counter clockwise like 1/4 turn and at some point everything got right.
The flickering went away and some noise that I still had in the background ( visible on dark screen ) disappeared too. I then lowered the RGB pots by quite a lot and colors and red bleeding got more under control.

I am now satisfied with the image I have. It is not the best S-video I have ever seen but it is honestly good and much better than composite. That should do, at least for now.

However I did not change the Sync amplitude pot. Should It be readjusted after the Correct filter switch is used?
Btw thanks for the support!

[XianXi]

If adjusting the width helped fix the picture, it means someone messed with it before taking it out of range.

What flickering are you seeing?

I had to turn the width pot for only a tiniest bit to fix the initial problem. Maybe the problem did not show on the test setup this supergun was initially calibrated on but showed on my SONY TV? Also, those pots are very rough, I may change them for precision ones.
I also tried replacing my PSU by a more modern 500W one, that did not change anything.

The "flickering" I observed was like the image was jumping a bit about 3 times a second.
But you know what? I just fixed it.

I activated the sync correct filter switch, which made the image initially all garbled up. But then I adjusted the width counter clockwise like 1/4 turn and at some point everything got right.
The flickering went away and some noise that I still had in the background ( visible on dark screen ) disappeared too. I then lowered the RGB pots by quite a lot and colors and red bleeding got more under control.

I am now satisfied with the image I have. It is not the best S-video I have ever seen but it is honestly good and much better than composite. That should do, at least for now.

However I did not change the Sync amplitude pot. Should It be readjusted after the Correct filter switch is used?
Btw thanks for the support!

Don't adjust the other pot. If the sync width is correct now it should be perfect for all boards.

[Evilmaxwar]

Don't adjust the other pot. If the sync width is correct now it should be perfect for all boards.

Ok Ill leave it as is.
I was just reading some more into the subject and went through this document. http://www.jamma-nation-x.com/jammax/fi ... nbuild.pdf
Was a good helpful read and apparently you are the author of that too ( thumbs up ). A big Thank to you and others who helped me, namely emphatic and Drakon(from somewhere else ) .
I still have much to learn about superguns and arcade PCBs but 24H ago I was totally clueless and at least now I feel like I have a good start.
Next step is wiring the test and service Switches

[emphatic]

Cool, nice to hear you got it working! Which Vogatek model do you own? I have a MK III (with screw terminals), but it's rarely used as I haven't hooked controls up to it yet and the fact that I have two working cabs.

Here's a clever tip as you continue to purchase PCBs;
Most smart phones has the ability to store and display .PDF files, so if you have an iPhone for example (like I do) you can use the app iBooks to keep all of your game's manuals at hand at all times. This is very convenient when you quickly wanna find what DIP does what and you don't have access to the Internet. For Apple's phones, you have download them to your computer first then transfer them to iBooks using iTunes AFAIK, so it's a bit of a PITA, but I'm sure it's easier with other O/S phones.

[Evilmaxwar]

Cool, nice to hear you got it working! Which Vogatek model do you own? I have a MK III (with screw terminals), but it's rarely used as I haven't hooked controls up to it yet and the fact that I have two working cabs.

Here's a clever tip as you continue to purchase PCBs;
Most smart phones has the ability to store and display .PDF files, so if you have an iPhone for example (like I do) you can use the app iBooks to keep all of your game's manuals at hand at all times. This is very convenient when you quickly wanna find what DIP does what and you don't have access to the Internet. For Apple's phones, you have download them to your computer first then transfer them to iBooks using iTunes AFAIK, so it's a bit of a PITA, but I'm sure it's easier with other O/S phones.

Mine is a MK V so it has S-video and NeoGeo db15 style controller ports.
I made an adapter to use it with my modded universal joystick. ( Do you remember my modded X-arcade? You actually helped me alot getting started on modding that stick )
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=36057

Since then I modified it even further. I built a custom made octagonal gate for the Suzo 500 ( once again inspired by you), added seimitsu buttons and completely removed the X-arcade circuitry. It now has a DB25 port with direct contacts. I built various adapters and project boxes with hacked pads to use it with all my systems. It works merrily on the supergun with the Neo Geo adapter.

That smartphone idea is very neat but I do not have a smartphone, haha. I still use an old school clamshell flip phone with no internet. However I have computers and easy internet access in my gaming laboratory so I make do with that :p

[emphatic]

Ah, cool. I'd love to see that gate sometime.

[Evilmaxwar]

Well, to be honest, I did not really make it, I cheated.
All I did was take a LS-56 restrictor and made new holes in it with a press drill :p
I used to original gate as a template.

Works great though, I like it much better than the square gate. I should have taken pictures of it. I will do next time I open it up.
The next mod I want to make on that stick is build an autofire circuitry using a 555 chip. That and/or making a new CP.

[kowal]

I remember problems with vogatec scart rgb ver. on LCD screan jitter every few seconds.
vogatec have 390R resistor on sync when I change on 680R all shake disappeared
now I add 1k pot on sync on all my MAKs

[lettuce]

Where can one get a shielded cable that has approx 7-8 cores inside??

I can only seem to find really thick shield coaxial cable that has like 12 cores inside, so is way to thick for a custom scart cable.......im guessing it the custom cable is short then interference inst too much of an issue and shielded cable might not be needed??

[guldberget]

After a looong time searching I've just bought a sigma av5000 supergun. I haven't actually tried it yet since I'm currently pcb-less but I'm wondering how fellow europeans are powering it? It is currently set to 110v on the internal psu (but possible to switch to 220v) and it has the original 2-pin japanese power cord. I know I can buy a big-ass step down converter since I'm in a 230v country but is it possible to just set the psu to 220v and use a plug adapter instead? Is there anything I should be aware of if it's possible to go the plug adapeter route or any advantages/disadvantages with either option, risk of electrocution or such ?

Thanks!

[Bar81]

After a looong time searching I've just bought a sigma av5000 supergun. I haven't actually tried it yet since I'm currently pcb-less but I'm wondering how fellow europeans are powering it? It is currently set to 110v on the internal psu (but possible to switch to 220v) and it has the original 2-pin japanese power cord. I know I can buy a big-ass step down converter since I'm in a 230v country but is it possible to just set the psu to 220v and use a plug adapter instead? Is there anything I should be aware of if it's possible to go the plug adapeter route or any advantages/disadvantages with either option, risk of electrocution or such ?

Thanks!

On my AV7000 all you do is push the little switch to 230V(?) and you're set. I expect the AV5000 is no different. Just get a plug adapter and you're ready to go.