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 Post subject: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:23 am 



Joined: 22 Mar 2020
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I recently picked up a CRT PC monitor, specifically Sony GDM-400PS. It has VGA and 5 BNC inputs for R-G-B-HD-VD. It's my understanding that simply (I use that loosely) RGB-modding my NES and then connecting it to the monitor won't work because the NES requires a display with 15 kHZ, while this monitor is 60+. Is there a way to play my NES on this monitor?

Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:55 am 


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mbstone wrote:
I recently picked up a CRT PC monitor, specifically Sony GDM-400PS. It has VGA and 5 BNC inputs for R-G-B-HD-VD. It's my understanding that simply (I use that loosely) RGB-modding my NES and then connecting it to the monitor won't work because the NES requires a display with 15 kHZ, while this monitor is 60+. Is there a way to play my NES on this monitor?

Thanks.

I'd recommend GBS-Control if you're going to RGB mod the NES

https://github.com/ramapcsx2/gbs-control/wiki/Build-the-Hardware
https://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=52172


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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:20 am 


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A potentially less DIY solution is to connect an NES to a RetroTINK 2X-MINI (if you don't RGB mod it) or a RetroTINK 2X-SCART (if you do RGB mod it) and then connect that to an HDMI-to-VGA adapter.


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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:07 pm 



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mbstone wrote:
...the NES requires a display with 15 kHZ, while this monitor is 60+.

Generally, VGA-compliant monitors will go down as low as ~30kHz. If your monitor says it's 60kHz, then that's probably the upper bound, not lower.


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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:12 pm 


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Was just about to say Retrotink 2x plus a HDMI-to-VGA adapter if you plan on leaving your NES stock, yeah
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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:21 pm 


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nmalinoski wrote:
mbstone wrote:
...the NES requires a display with 15 kHZ, while this monitor is 60+.

Generally, VGA-compliant monitors will go down as low as ~30kHz. If your monitor says it's 60kHz, then that's probably the upper bound, not lower.

or he's conflating it with 60Hz refresh...


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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:15 pm 


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https://aliexpress.com/i/4000108431206.html

There's this thing... is this an exact clone (parts-wise, obvi the layout is different) of the RetroTink, or a 'heavily inspired by'?
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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:57 pm 


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How about the Extron IN1502? Aren’t those supposed to be decent? I know they can be found for around ~$20-30 USD...
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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:49 pm 


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No, Cats, to be honest the IN1502 is not an acceptable solution. I had the same idea years ago. What a mess. Yes, it is fast, but not 100% lagless if I remember. I think it lagged one frame, which of course for many games will not matter. I like action games though, which the NES library is rather skewed towards.
The biggest problem with the IN1502 is that the picture is trash. It produces a dirty, noisy, jittery image. S-Video produces a far more acceptable image, but it is still noisy and you will notice the bad jitter. I tried it with several consoles, not just the NES and SNES, so the jitter is not Nintendo's fault but Extron's. Also, worst comb filter ever ever. I think it even forced deinterlacing, but mine went into the trash years ago so I can not confirm that. The cheapest, crappiest, on-its-last-legs CRT television will produce a vastly superior image, even over RF. Hell, so would most LCDs.

I'm not big on the RetroTink2X to be honest, but I still consider it to be the second best option usually. Some of my CRTs do not like the 480p that it spits out, and will not sync to it. Still, on an unmodified NES, it is the only acceptable option. Still, the picture is not great over composite. It does not hurt to look at though, and is lagless of course. The filter helps, and is quite nice for Mario and such.

The ideal solution if you have lots of money is the OSSC with an RGB-modded NES, or even wait for the OSSC-Pro. That will be far superior to any other setup that I can think of for NES on a PC-CRT using real hardware. And, it will be SHARP.

GBS-Control is also an option if you have an RGB-modded NES, but the OSSC is still faster. The images that it produces are very good though. I'm a bit "autistic" about lag, and although it is hard if not impossible to perceive 4ms of display-lag, it would make me crazy just knowing that it was there. I play fighting games...

The other option is of course to get an FPGA based NES or a MiSTer. Maybe even just an OSSC-PRO. They say that it will be able to run FPGA video game cores MiSTer style, so you would not even need a console, just a controller and an OSSC-PRO.

MBSTONE, that monitor that you have is capable of incredible images. It would really be a shame to not give it the best possible signal, and in my mind, the OSSC is the absolute best solution for you. Do you play other consoles?


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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:04 pm 


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For a PC monitor exclusively, you might look up the XRGB-1, XRGB-2, or XRGB-2+ as well.
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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:19 pm 


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According to Marqs, the upcoming OSSC Pro will be able to convert the NES 240p60 signal to 240p120 for use on PC CRT monitors. Will look sweet.


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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:24 pm 


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orange808 wrote:
For a PC monitor exclusively, you might look up the XRGB-1, XRGB-2, or XRGB-2+ as well.


I was going to suggest this as well. These devices are still quite useful when running into a VGA monitor.
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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:54 pm 



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SCARTicus wrote:
MBSTONE, that monitor that you have is capable of incredible images. It would really be a shame to not give it the best possible signal, and in my mind, the OSSC is the absolute best solution for you. Do you play other consoles?


No, I only play NES and retro PC Games (think Sim City, Oni, KOTOR, Starcraft 1/2, pre-2000s Worms franchise, etc.). After looking up various suggestions people have listed here, it seems like the OSSC is my best bet and I agree.


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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2020 1:01 am 


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Josh128 wrote:
According to Marqs, the upcoming OSSC Pro will be able to convert the NES 240p60 signal to 240p120 for use on PC CRT monitors. Will look sweet.


I don't at all mind the look of 240p @ 120Hz on PC CRTs, but I've encountered some pretty bad image distortion in games that have a lot of scrolling, both vertical as well as horizontal (moreso the former). I wonder if he's putting in any work to alleviate that issue? I would doubt so, that's a pretty niche aspect of the OSSC Pro as a whole, and obviously somewhere near the very bottom of the priority list. It's nice that he's even opted to include it :P
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 Post subject: Re: NES on PC CRT monitor?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:09 am 


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KittyCats, Marqs has stated that 240p120 with frame/motion interpolation will also be possible. This would alleviate the issues you speak about. Whether and when it gets implemented is anyones guess though.


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