The Cancel Culture thread! WOO!

[Mischief Maker]

There is a concerted effort in right-wing media to shift the focus from covid and BLM to the dreaded "cancel culture" to dilute the issues.

So to prevent that dilution on these forums, I'm quarantining my own discussion of the topic from the covid thread to this one.

Let the aggrievement party begin!

Cancel-culture-focused guys! When a joke is described as "edgy," what is it at the edge of?

[qmish]

inb4 someone is cancelled for loving sine mora

[cave hermit]

Generally it is at the edge of

Spoiler

The crater
Like the prophets once said
And the ashes are all cold now
No more bullets and the embers are dead
Whispers in the air tell the tales
Of the brothers gone
Desolation, devastation
What a mess we made, when it all went wrong
Watching from the edge of the circus
For the games to begin
Gladiators draw their swords
Form their ranks for Armageddon
I'm nuclear
I'm wild
I'm breaking up inside
A heart of broken glass
Defiled
Deep inside
The abandoned child
Standing on the edge of the underworld
Looking at the abyss
And I'm hoping for some miracle
To breakout, to escape from all this
Whispers in the air tell the tales
Of a life that's gone
Desolation, devastation
What a mess we made, when it all went wrong
I'm nuclear
I'm wild
I'm breaking up inside
A heart of broken glass
Defiled
Deep inside
The abandoned child
I'm nuclear
I'm wild
I'm breaking up inside
A heart of broken glass
Defiled
Deep inside
The abandoned child

[BryanM]

Bullying the powerful is not allowed guys.

[Queen Charlene]

Bullying the powerful is not allowed guys.

the rich have feelings too

[FinalBaton]

Cancelling is very very important for executing sweet, sweet combos in FTG

[system11]

"This is my thread to undermine a problem I don't want to be addressed honestly": the thread.

[WelshMegalodon]

Cancelling is very very important for executing sweet, sweet combos in FTG

Before FADC, we had Feint Canceling in Mark of the Wolves! Not that canceling is particularly difficult. Link timing and hit-confirms are what always get me.

[BIL]

When a joke is described as "edgy," what is it at the edge of?

The lines set by the moral majority du jour. cf Nick Cannon's bank account. He done did the day's wrong sort of racism. Wild 'n Out more like Kosher Salami In Your Mouth

[orange808]

Or, we could obsess about words that have direct gender associations.

Let's ban all Latin based languages tomorrow!

.......

Honestly, all the issues are important.

Here's where you're wrong: If we decided we could never talk about low priority social issues, we never would! There's always pressing needs. Always has been and always will be. The next big problem is right around the corner.

Also, I fail to see how plebs talking about a variety if issues prevents leaders from taking action on major issues. There's very little correlation. We aren't taking precious resources away from COVID-19 or battling institutionalised racism. It's just talk.

Reminds me of ancient politics. I laugh when I read that certain authors "deserved" to die for criticism of dead authors that couldn't defend themselves. More picking and choosong. Criticism of a dead author that couldn't defend himself for criticism of another. The real issue is obvious: there was no crime and the real reason for stoning the individual was a difference of opinion. Newsflash: the guy that got legally murdered is dead and he can't defend himself. Hypocrites.

The more things change, the more they stay the same. People are still as awful as ever.

[Blinge]

I'm amazed Deadly Premonition 2 came out. I also heard it's been slightly cancelled ? but not really?
Something about transphobia, I don't know, i'll get back to youze when i catch up watching someone else play it because i don't own a switch.

I've appropriated youze from the Irish. I dislike how my dialect doesn't have a second person plural, forcing us to render it as "you lot"

[BIL]

I've appropriated youze from the Irish. I dislike how my dialect doesn't have a second person plural, forcing us to render it as "you lot"

I'm half-Irish, I'll okay it. I'll also let you have the Jamaican "unna" if you post nudes. (■｀ω´■)

[BryanM]

"This is my thread to undermine a problem I don't want to be addressed honestly": the thread.

We'll have to disagree. I don't think Jeff Epstein was a good guy, and bullying him, his friends, and their many many supporters is actually the right and moral thing a human being with a soul would do.

[orange808]

"This is my thread to undermine a problem I don't want to be addressed honestly": the thread.

We'll have to disagree. I don't think Jeff Epstein was a good guy, and bullying him, his friends, and their many many supporters is actually the right and moral thing a human being with a soul would do.

Fair enough, but I see a bigger picture.

Here's an extreme example. Monica Lewinsky still can't get a job. She absolutely did pursue an affair with a married man, but she was also thrown out of society for something that happens all the time. It wasn't even against the law. If not for her parents, I bet she would have ended up working retail.

Was that fair?

Should we be using the power of technology to compile a list of weaponised indiscretions for every human being on the planet?

It's a slippery slope. At some point, all you're getting is vigilante mob justice.

And, the need to soothe personal insecurities about your own exclusive relationship with your spouse (the real root of slut shaming and an instinct that has been with humans since before they were humans) might carry similar weight to your need to protect the young. All social instincts that came down from the trees with you before you were even human.

I'm personally not a huge fan of vigilante mob justice. You aren't Twitter Batman.

[Mischief Maker]

"This is my thread to undermine a problem I don't want to be addressed honestly": the thread.

We'll have to disagree. I don't think Jeff Epstein was a good guy, and bullying him, his friends, and their many many supporters is actually the right and moral thing a human being with a soul would do.

Fair enough, but I see a bigger picture.

Here's an extreme example. Monica Lewinsky still can't get a job. She absolutely did pursue an affair with a married man, but she was also thrown out of society for something that happens all the time. It wasn't even against the law. If not for her parents, I bet she would have ended up working retail.

Was that fair?

Should we be using the power of technology to compile a list of weaponised indiscretions for every human being on the planet?

It's a slippery slope. At some point, all you're getting is vigilante mob justice.

And, the need to soothe personal insecurities about your own exclusive relationship with your spouse (the real root of slut shaming and an instinct that has been with humans since before they were humans) might carry similar weight to your need to protect the young. All social instincts that came down from the trees with you before you were even human.

I'm personally not a huge fan of vigilante mob justice. You aren't Twitter Batman.

Again, orange808 with the bizarre mixed metaphors. Attacking the cancel culture that brought down Harvey Weinstein, but uses as an example Bill Clinton abusing his power against Lewinsky and ruining her career in the same way Weinstein did against his victims? Are you aware that twitter was not around at the time of the Lewinsky scandal? Are you unclear that the people smearing Lewinsky were not a spontaneous twitter mob but in fact professional PR firms with mass media connections being paid by Clinton?

The whole thing with #cancelrkelly and #metoo is it was people using the democratizing power of social media, even constrained within its monopolistic corporate context, to allow younger, poorer women to gain a measure of justice against the powerful men who abused them/ruined their careers through public exposure. Lewinsky did not have that option against Bill Clinton. Your analogy doesn't work.

[o.pwuaioc]

As much as I detest cancel culture, the "right" has been doing it much, much longer. What the heck are book burnings, the McCarthy blacklist, and the thousand year history of heretical burnings if not a form of cancel culture?

I only wish the "left" would adopt a longue durée approach to the struggle, because short-sightedness will keep the pendulum swinging back and forth forever.

As far as Weinstein and Cosby go, jail is about right. But then we have to acknowledge the hypocrisy of the left's opinion on prison reform. Is it punitive or rehabilitative? BryanM wants him bullied. That's a clear cut case of my-side/your-side retribution. Might as well call him a McCoy. Who's the Hatfield? Who gets a free pass to be awful? Even with Weinstein's absolute awfulness, dig more deeply and you'll see it break down along certain hot topic lines. I taught a class for a few years in which one of the assignments was to ban certain types of media as part of living in an ideal world. It's funny how my students were so eager to ban trending unpopular items. Whatever hit the news recently, that's the thing that should be banned. Fake news, thin model in magazines, Twitter - whatever was currently bad, that's what got the majority of class against it.

It's always that way, unfortunately.

[GaijinPunch]

I hope you flunked every last one of them.

[Blinge]

Let's ban all Latin based languages tomorrow!

So English is safe then..

[ED-057]

Cancel culture is a religion based on the ignorant making themselves feel important. That, and a shocking abandonment of the enlightenment principles of free and open discourse, at a time when technological change has already brought mass surveillance, censorship, and propaganda campaigns that rival any dystopian fiction.

Imagine if that kind of energy was devoted to reclaiming the trillions wasted on wars and bailouts _right now_. Instead, their plan to hold TPTB accountable is to knock down statues of people that died 200 years ago. YOU HEAR THAT DICK CHENEY!? YOUR TIME IS COMING! (in 2200AD (if humanity still exists by then))

[BIL]

I wouldn't file Bill Cosby and Harvey Weinstein (convicted rapists, in prison) with Roseanne Barr, Nick Cannon etc (convicted racists, off television). No amount of jeering at the latter's gangrenous micro-penis would've delivered him to the pokey. It might've landed him in the poorhouse, but who's to say? Roman Polanski's still good peeps to Meryl Streep et al, despite his conviction for drugging and ass-raping a 13y/o girl (perhaps sharing his attorney's admiration of his pedo-contraceptive nous, being "solicitous to avoid pregnancy").

Similar stink of politics over principle, for sure. Convenience culture, more like.

[FinalBaton]

While I err a bit more towards the side of pro-cancelling (I believe these superstars are not losing their lives but rather losing a privilege), I'm actually totally fine with having a discussion about cancel culture. But some people(including on here) flat out refuse to have a discussion and just sperg and Reeee.

There's also a bit of a case by case thing here with a bit of nuance, where some people's action are way less severe and it should be discussed wheter it's ok to cancel them for that. For example : there's a second (or third?) wave of calling out celebrities here, and while 98% of the actions called out are very wrong and harmful and reprehensible, and I do believe the victims everytime.. one case strikes me where what this women got accused of was to do dirty talk and bite the leg of another woman. and she lost her personal business over that. That one certainly seems discutable for example.

[orange808]

Again, orange808 with the bizarre mixed metaphors.

And, you again. Picking and choosing when it's convenient.

Attacking the cancel culture that brought down Harvey Weinstein,

Weinstein was arrested by the police.

but uses as an example Bill Clinton abusing his power against Lewinsky

She showed him her panties trying to get noticed and activately pursued an affair. Consenting adults. More picking and choosing? Yep.

She even tried to get him back afterwards. She was an adult.

What they did was reckless. That's it. Stop telling me she's a victim of Clinton. She's a victim of being black balled by a bunch of hypocrites in society--in general. Many of the same people that gladly shamed her back then are now conveniently pretending to sympathise. Boomers love to conveniently change their stories when it's time to pretend they are good people.

and ruining her career in the same way Weinstein did against his victims?

Nope. Pop culture sacrificed her for fun.

Are you aware that twitter was not around at the time of the Lewinsky scandal?

Are you aware how condecending that question is? Are you aware that human beings behave the same way all the time and Twitter is just a tool?

Are you unclear that the people smearing Lewinsky were not a spontaneous twitter mob but in fact professional PR firms with mass media connections being paid by Clinton?

Bullshit. She was roasted by everyday people.

The whole thing with #cancelrkelly and #metoo is it was people using the democratizing power of social media, even constrained within its monopolistic corporate context, to allow younger, poorer women to gain a measure of justice against the powerful men who abused them/ruined their careers through public exposure. Lewinsky did not have that option against Bill Clinton. Your analogy doesn't work.

It works perfectly. Let the law and justice system do it's job--and keep working to improve it. When people get done paying their debt to society, they need opportunities to move on. When they're in jail, rape isn't part of the punishment. Sorry for the tangent, but we need prison reform and better support for people after they get out.

Lewinsky had her career ruined when she became the public face of adultery after a politically motivated impeachment trial. The Republicans are responsible for keeping her in the news cycle for months.

Clinton hasn't accepted responsibility for his foolish decision. The chief executive can't afford to have skeletons in his closet. It opens the nation up to security risks.

Adultery is legal. There's some old laws on the books, but they aren't enforced and they don't matter. The problem was who and where it happened.

And, this isn't about Weinstein. It's about tossing people that aren't independently wealthy out of society for a sentence you didn't like. Stop pretending you don't know what this is about. This isn't about rich people.

[Vanguard]

Bullying the powerful is not allowed guys.

There wouldn't be a problem if the social justice warriors only went after the likes of war profiteers and pedophile rapists. In reality 99% of the time they target random, ordinary people who told a rude joke or said a swear word or committed some other form of wrongthink.

[Blinge]

The MikeZ cancellation over his slightly creepy messages stands out as a pretty egregious example.

jesus fucking christ

Creator of a videogame banned by the game's playerbase.

[Durandal]

The MikeZ cancellation over his slightly creepy messages stands out as a pretty egregious example.

jesus fucking christ

Creator of a videogame banned by the game's playerbase.

For clarification, the thing that did MikeZ in wasn't the inappropriate BLM joke or being cringy to a girl in DMs (said girl also admitted on her Twitter in the past to have a preference for little cartoon boys, so the Inquisition didn't feel like pushing this angle in particular would seem morally clean enough), but rather the claim of a former Lab Zero co-worker that MikeZ was being incredibly racially insensitive to her on multiple occasions. I suspect that the Skullgirls community's desire to not have their first-time spot in EVO taken away on account of Skullgirls' co-creator tarnishing the game's reputation by association also played a factor in how readily they were willing to throw him out, even if the entirety of EVO getting cancelled ended up throwing a wrench in that plan anyways.

[system11]

I think there's one obvious problem here - people arguing against the people against cancel culture, don't know (or refuse to accept) what the term is describing.

Most people complaining about cancel culture do NOT consider these types of example, being part of the problem:
#metoo (vast majority of instances)
Weinstein
Epstein (and his many clients)
(etc)

The above examples are instances of people who got away with actual crimes and justice demands something be done about it.

Cancel culture as understood by the people who can see what a problem it is, is shrinking the overton window to an extremely narrow (mostly) leftist view, and anything outside it being hit with scorched earth tactics like getting average working people fired, getting people who said something "offensive" banished simultaneously from multiple social media platforms at once, digging up ancient messages they've posted and applying this weeks latest moral code to them as evidence, and generally unpersoning them and attemping to prevent them from earning a living. Sometimes even their families. Sometimes even if it's ancient history they've already apologised and been forgiven for in the past. It's driven mainly by activists bolstered by useful idiots, and it's supported by social media companies run by people who share the same opinions and apply standards in a lopsided manner.

The kind of thing fascists / similar terrifying authoritarians might do, ultimately. It's wholly illiberal.

Of course the usual retort to the social media part of the problem is "build your own platform", but the same activists then go after that platform and destroy it.

[cave hermit]

Probably not very relevant to anyone who didn't grow up watching Spongebob but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUgTOfzKQaY

[Blinge]

said girl also admitted on her Twitter in the past to have a preference for little cartoon boys,

Was there any backlash against her for this? any consequences?

[BIL]

While we wait to hear back, let's all enjoy the best video of internet. Chaps, I think this is a gem of incidental cinema, PLS tell me it wasn't staged (｀ω´メ) As a connoisseur of burning garbage, its tragicomedy has the zeitgeist of this thread, and the Trump thread, and the Chinese Bat AIDS thread, and the best thread on the forum. "Side," he yelps

[Mischief Maker]

Ben Shapiro attempts to cancel Cardi B for her politically incorrect lyrics, but only succeeds in creating the dankest of memes.

Much like Tipper Gore freaking out over Prince lyrics back in the 80s, I don't know what about Cardi B's presentation made Shapiro think her music was going to be a "safe space" for him.