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 Post subject: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 11:02 am 



Joined: 04 Jul 2010
Posts: 228
I've always thought these things were the best you could get with analog and on some brands you could even achieve beyond 2k without the need of digital processing. It sucks they can't accept 240p or interlace, but with an ossc or earlier equipment you can still get a picture that is as pristine as any HD set out there.

Of course nobody has manufactured crt's for the past few years and I fear that like consumer crt's they're going to become real hard to find. I still consider them the best displays for 6th generation consoles and the ultimate competitor to the pvm/bvm line.
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:44 pm 


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No but I miss mine and I think I'll get one again soon.

I think what I'll do for my setup, is have an AV cart or some sort of furniture I can roll around, and have both a standard def CRT and a PC crt on it. In addition to my consoles and a retro PC or two. 240p and 480i games are gonna be played on the SD crt, and Dreamcast and oldschool PC games are gonna be played on the PC crt.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 1:09 am 



Joined: 04 Jul 2010
Posts: 228
I've always felt that for 480p having a pc monitor is an absolute must as these displays were designed to specifically support that resolution natively. You could try 480p on a panel, but then scaling kicks in and muddles the image, then you try 960p and while sharp it's just too much for some people due to how blocky this makes the image (Dreamcast vga is just as blocky btw). You'd need scanlines to even it out and any set that is 1080p without a good interger mode will smear moir all over it. Any computer monitor will just take 480p and still give you the natural scanlines needed to make it look crisp and just perfect.

Now one thing I'd like to point out is while most people would keep one for playing their Dreamcast games on, having an ossc pretty much changed the notion that 480p component can look just as good (Gamecube for example) and opens the door for these consoles to be preferred for playing games on. I'm even finding it amusing that a PS3 with 4:3 mode looks natural on these and is the main reason I don't just trade my games out on newer ones. AVP 2012, TOMB RAIDER, etc all look amazing. We likely have some shooters that are exclusive to these consoles, so it boggles my mind that we don't see these displays ever brought up and focused on.

oh and they make the best alternative to purchasing a pricy BVM in most cases. Those scanlines when trying 240p in 480p are just "THICC AS ****!!" I'm surprised Phonedork never bothered to tackle the subject. :)
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:39 pm 


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Joined: 23 Dec 2005
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Location: Ontario, Canada
Yes, I still use a CRT monitor for PC. Samsung SyncMaster 955DF. Its ok but even bought new, it seems to have worn out and become blurry. I plan to switch over to a LaCie Electron Blue IV 19" in the near future as that is far, far better for clarity and colour.
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 5:41 am 


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I did until about a year ago, and boy did it last a while. Eventually it just became impractical to keep around.
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2018 7:52 pm 



Joined: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 416
While I still like my CPD-G420 hooked to a PC, I've always found the phosphor persistence too short for 60Hz. A flashy, flickery mess. The rez it's fed makes no difference. Scanlines are pretty though. Interlacing works too, btw. Just has to be within spec.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:30 am 


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Joined: 18 Nov 2007
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Location: Planet Dust Asia
I use a flatscreen PC CRT as my primary gaming TV at the moment.
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 6:16 pm 


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Joined: 13 Jun 2006
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Location: Murda Mitten, USA
I modded one into my arcade cab. Anticipating the rarity, I keep spares in storage in case it breaks.
I keep an IFTTT thing pointed to craigslist keywording 20" and 19" CRT to take advantage of graphic artist people offloading bulky things when they change apartments. I've scored three off that. Three is enough backup displays for a lifetime, yeah?
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 7:21 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
I use my Tri-sync CRT arcade monitors for everything since the dawn of gaming up to and including my PS3.

I find that most games look better on a CRT display. Flatscreen displays only surpassed the image quality of CRTs with OLED tech. Image quality is largely based on a display's contrast ratio. It is more important than any other factors such as resolution or framerate. A great CRT is capable of contrast ratios of 50,000:1. The first OLED display from measured at 357,000:1.

Still, CRTs have advantages for gaming that can not be matched by any other display tech. I.e. The ability to switch res instead of scaling and no input lag. And... the ability to use light guns which are a million times better than an Aimtrak or Wii remote.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 7:23 pm 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014
Posts: 565
I know it's hard to tell from photos but check out how great Sega Ralley on the PS3 looks in 480p on a 25" crt monitor:

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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:25 pm 


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Joined: 17 Sep 2007
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Location: Brazil RJ
Got two SyncMaster 1100pplus today.
Very happy!
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:15 pm 


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headlesshobbs wrote:
It sucks they can't accept 240p or interlace, but with an ossc or earlier equipment you can still get a picture that is as pristine as any HD set out there.

Each line is doubled at 240p, but they do, technically, accept it (it's no software scaling from what I understand, but the tube's "native" way of handling 240p signal, that's the idea I got anyway).

I for one am jolly fond of refresh rates up to 120 Hz (on mine). I do not claim to SEE much difference between higher than middle-forties* framerates, but when the PC can muster much more, why not actually display as many as technically possible? Obviously, not every software will benefit from, or even support such high screen refresh rates. Even emulators, however, should get less delay from v-sync when running at 120 Hz than they would at 60 or so (don't quote me on that, though; I know there's more than one v-sync method).

*) Unless game frameskips like OutRun 2006, but it's hardly on-topic here.
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:33 pm 



Joined: 02 Mar 2017
Posts: 857
The only nicer-spec'd PC CRT monitor I've been able to find is a 20" Sony CPD-520GS (like 1 level down from their best model line I think). The guy said it basically wasn't ever used being hooked up to his server (so only for routine maintenance every couple weeks), but I'm still not too happy with how it looks - it's simply not as bright and vibrant as my 480p Sony PVM and BVM's (even with the brightness/contrast jacked-up). Still on the lookout for something else in 20-22" size to test to see if I got a dud or what.

I do know however that my PVM/BVM's are absolutely beautiful with 480p content from consoles like the OG Xbox - LOVE it. Still can't get my flatscreens to be as nice at all when running 480p content no matter how I upscale it (but I'm working on that project as we speak).


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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:28 am 


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Obiwanshinobi wrote:
headlesshobbs wrote:
It sucks they can't accept 240p or interlace, but with an ossc or earlier equipment you can still get a picture that is as pristine as any HD set out there.

Each line is doubled at 240p, but they do, technically, accept it (it's no software scaling from what I understand, but the tube's "native" way of handling 240p signal, that's the idea I got anyway).

I for one am jolly fond of refresh rates up to 120 Hz (on mine). I do not claim to SEE much difference between higher than middle-forties* framerates, but when the PC can muster much more, why not actually display as many as technically possible? Obviously, not every software will benefit from, or even support such high screen refresh rates. Even emulators, however, should get less delay from v-sync when running at 120 Hz than they would at 60 or so (don't quote me on that, though; I know there's more than one v-sync method).

*) Unless game frameskips like OutRun 2006, but it's hardly on-topic here.


You're creating persistence blur (doing that with "60Hz" source material that just repeats identical frames). Also, your emulator won't poll any faster running at a higher video refresh rate, so it's not helpful.

For desktop use, higher refresh is wonderful. It will reduce flicker and eye strain.
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:15 am 


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Well, said blur does make the motion appear more fluid, so it contributes to the old tech's charm (one of reasons why SD console games looked so good to me back when most most PAL TVs would already support RGB and the standard PC resolution was 1024x768).

What I did mean is - input delay, inevitably increased by v-sync on the picture's upper area, should be shorter at higher refresh rates even though you won't get any more frames per second.

As for emulators, I read (back when SotC's framerates on PS2 bothered some) that some of them employ framerate hacks (or just ROMs hacked somehow), making for higher framerates without speeding the pace up. "Read" as I've yet to get myself a PC where PS2 emulation would be of any use.

Last but not least, this could be a placebo effect, but when playing a game without v-sync at any framerate, screen tearing bothers me less at 120 Hz, as if the screen tore "faster" so to speak, not as perceptibly as in 60 Hz (that being said, I'm usually quite tolerant of screen tearing in general when playing the sort of games where I want possibly shortest response times).

That out of the way, something like reading manga scans in tate on a CRT is most obviously easier on the eye at rates higher than 60 Hz (120 would be excess, though, 85 is just enough for me).
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:45 pm 


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FWIW, I was pointing out that doubling the refresh takes away an advantage of a CRT: motion resolution.

Although, some people may prefer the blur and the reduced flicker. It's not for me.
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:16 am 


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Location: Fairfax, VA
I do not have one any longer but I want another. I have built various older Windows rigs over the last couple of months (separate Win 95, 98, and XP systems respectively) and I'd like to have a VGA CRT display to use them with.
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 Post subject: Re: Do you still have a pc crt?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:32 pm 


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I hoarded about 9 PC monitors in the past two years lol. That's not including all my Sony WEGA CRTs either :?

I still use PC monitors for retro gaming including hooking up current gen consoles to play arcade ports for example Ketsui on PS4 on PC monitor.

The big gripe I have with PC monitors is that most of them are quit dim. I find I'm better off just hooking up my retro console to a consumer TV because the brightness and clarity pops out more. On PC monitor it's far too dark for my liking.

The only console from my experience that doesn't have a problem with the brightness is Dreamcast via VGA.

The way I get around the brightness issues with PC Monitors is to use a monitor that can brighten the image. My favorite monitors Philips 107T6 Lightframe 3 and Samsung SynMaster 955DF both these monitors have an enhanced brightness button/option that brightens the image.

The only con about this option is that you lose a subtle slight bit of detail compared to the regular settings. But in my opinion it's worth it considering you can actually see a whole lot better.

I do have other monitors that output the image with an acceptable brightness as well.

My opinion CRT Monitors have over LCD panels is the refresh rate. Hands down when you play an extremely fast game for example sonic you can see the game clear from beginning to start. For LCD Panels even with the fastest 1ms response time you'll get blur. I use a BENQ esports monitor with 1ms response time.

LCD beats out CRT monitors in Crystal Clear image, geometry and brightness for gaming. I also have a Consumer Sony WEGA HD TV and that beast as much a I love it just doesn't cut it for HD images compared to an LCD Panel.



Limbrooke wrote:
Yes, I still use a CRT monitor for PC. Samsung SyncMaster 955DF. Its ok but even bought new, it seems to have worn out and become blurry. I plan to switch over to a LaCie Electron Blue IV 19" in the near future as that is far, far better for clarity and colour.


I have the exact monitor I use for TATE for my shmups via OSSC and HDMI VGA converter. Or direct XBox 360 via VGA cable. Or PS4 HDMI to VGA converter.

To be honest it's one of my best CRT Monitors I own considering that there is a highlight zone feature that brightens the entire image. Not only that but it's also a flat screen monitor too!

Most PC CRT monitors these days are very dim when using them for retro gaming.

I also have the Syncmaster 950b that isn't a flat screen but the colors are slightly better in my opinion. It does lag compared to all my other CRT monitors.


FinalBaton wrote:
No but I miss mine and I think I'll get one again soon.

I think what I'll do for my setup, is have an AV cart or some sort of furniture I can roll around, and have both a standard def CRT and a PC crt on it. In addition to my consoles and a retro PC or two. 240p and 480i games are gonna be played on the SD crt, and Dreamcast and oldschool PC games are gonna be played on the PC crt.


I have a set up where I have my OSSC, power supplies for consoles, video cables for consoles and PC Monitor in a moveable TV stand.

I have a few consoles inside the stand but not enough room for the bigger consoles like a Xbox 360 or PS4.

It's quit convenient and has actually gotten me to play a few games here and there. I usually am lazy and if my consoles aren't hooked up I might not boot it up for months. With the convenience I just push the power and start gaming with little hassle :)


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