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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 3:41 am 



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
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BryanM wrote:
You can't give Objective Points to Toshinden for being a product of its time, only Nostalgia Points. If we can write off large portions of the C64, 2600, Star Wars, etc, Battle Arena can't get a pass.


The thing about Toshinden is, it was absolute fucking trash in its time. I remember being so hyped thanks to GameFan's ridiculous fanboy slobbering, then getting my import system and.. what the FUCK is this? There was NO gameplay by any standard, pre- or post-3D.

Whatever credit you want to give based on the time, you have to remember that Virtua Fighter and Tekken both already existed - and Tek was right there on the same platform. Toshinden could never stand alongside either one. There was absolutely no excuse for the hyperbole spewed about that game pre-launch.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 4:21 am 


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This is pretty much what I always suspected, but I wanted to let somebody who's actually played the thing comment instead.

@ BryanM, I had the sinking feeling I was going to slip up on the rights issue. So OK, why didn't they put Crash on the thing? I don't think they'd lose any sales of the ported version, as I noted before. Lol Sony. They put their best foot forward this time - and up into their mouth. And their gun holster, where they shot it off. I don't know, the lineup just looks worse and worse.

But have you preordered yours for eBay flipping later?


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:34 am 


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Sony doesn't own Crash Bandicoot. The franchise is held hostage by the Activision demiurges. Naughty Dog wouldn't have had to transition to Jak & Daxter when the PS2 arrived if Sony had the rights to Crash. The same goes for another popular Playstation mascot of the era - Spyro the Dragon.

tnc wrote:
Where is LSD: Dream Emulator?

Playstation Classic Trip-on-Acid SKU featuring LSD: Dream Emulator, Planet Dob, Lattice: 200EC7, iS: Internal Section, Tokyo Wakusei Planetokio, Pu-Li-Ru-La and Segare Ijiri. What are the chances?

Also, this was a perfect opportunity to finally release the elusive PS1 version of Black & White and they totally blew it! Peter Molyneux be mad!


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 1:46 pm 


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There was a time when they retained the rights to the original Playstation games, but as of "Crash Bandicoot N. Sane Trilogy" I guess we can say they pawned those off long, long ago too.

Sony gonna Sony I suppose. Anyone excited for their hot new film franchise, Ghostbusters, but minus the dark humor?

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you have to remember that Virtua Fighter and Tekken both already existed - and Tek was right there on the same platform


Battle Arena got like a couple months head start and had weapons! It'd be like a year until Soul Edge was ported home.

Polygons were so new and exciting back then. But now like the "special effects" in movies... I wish they'd be used way less often than they are.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:12 pm 


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Jonathan Ingram wrote:
Sony doesn't own Crash Bandicoot. The franchise is held hostage by the Activision demiurges. Naughty Dog wouldn't have had to transition to Jak & Daxter when the PS2 arrived if Sony had the rights to Crash. The same goes for another popular Playstation mascot of the era - Spyro the Dragon.

tnc wrote:
Where is LSD: Dream Emulator?

Playstation Classic Trip-on-Acid SKU featuring LSD: Dream Emulator, Planet Dob, Lattice: 200EC7, iS: Internal Section, Tokyo Wakusei Planetokio, Pu-Li-Ru-La and Segare Ijiri. What are the chances?

Also, this was a perfect opportunity to finally release the elusive PS1 version of Black & White and they totally blew it! Peter Molyneux be mad!


No chance, but that would be AWESOME.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:24 pm 


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Just in case this thing wasn't a big enough fail already...
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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:29 pm 


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BulletMagnet wrote:
Just in case this thing wasn't a big enough fail already...


ugh. It's the C64 VC (and various C64 compilations) all over again (some of these even have NTSC games like Boulderdash running too fast). These games are readily available at the correct speeds and they STILL pull this crap.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:48 pm 


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what an unbelievable trainwreck...


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 4:59 am 



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It's clear they did this strictly to capitalize on the Classic craze and for none of the right reasons.

Reaction on all the boards I read is "preorder cancelled", "preorder cancelled", "preorder cancelled" straight across. I really hope this reflects what happens across the market in general, and Sony pay for this type of product development.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 6:29 am 


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Wait woah woah wait......

They... explored the possibility of porting Black and White to the Phantasy Station 1?

Black and White. The game that ran like a hog on cutting edge PC's. On the little toybox where they had to put fog 3 inches in front of your feet so as spare itself the exhaustion of rendering a few rectangles that passed as buildings at the time.

There's absolutely no way - it had to be an entirely new and different game. That they promptly gave up on five days into predesign at the latest, before spending the rest of the time just playing around in the office waiting for the contract to expire.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:26 am 


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I'm not really sure where all the recent anger is coming from. This is more or less the expected list since the thing was announced. Frustrating that Japan is getting a bunch of good things, but let's be real here: a PlayStation revival project really needs games that very few people have heard of, like Bealphareth or something. The PlayStation is absolutely stuffed with mysterious games like that.
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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:31 am 


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Quote:
Battle Arena got like a couple months head start


VF was out in arcades and on Saturn before Toe-shit-den.

On a different note.... it's dumb AF that this thing is loaded with the PAL versions of alot of these games (on the USA version even).
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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:11 pm 


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So what are chances someone will code a front end that will allow us to chuck a load of ROMs on it?

Also I would pay £10 more to NOT have Crash fucking Bandicoot preinstalled Jesus
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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:59 pm 


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I would toss out Toshinden in favor of Gradius Gaiden.
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 Post subject: you have once again entered the world of survival horror
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 9:54 am 


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Turrican wrote:

Except to be the good one it should be the European PAL D.C.


So this got real then.
Mayhap picked for the full color intro extravaganza. Ridiculous in itself, I think the b/w has more mood.
I don't mean to gloat, but I find it kind of funny. Late PAL comes back to remind the HD age that it's no fun to have a devalued game the rest of the territories wouldn't bother with. Outrageous! But...
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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 6:43 pm 


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Come to think of it, wasn't there some issue with re-releasing the PS1 port of Tekken 3 due to use of a licensed manga character (Gon).


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 8:19 pm 



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Stayed too close to the Nintendo mould of mini.

PS mini should have had PSN connectivity and some dual shocks. Obviously Sony Europe did the mini if it has PAL versions of games on it.

I bought the Nintendo mini consoles because it felt right being cartridge based games. Any disc based system running in mini form isn't going to feel right at all.

The biggest game not included is Ridge Racer for me. I bought a £700 import console on day 1 for Riiiiiidge Racer.. I think it was issue 11 or 12 of Edge magazine having the RR cover. Pure bliss. Those were the days when console launches were fucking exciting.
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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 10:24 pm 



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Where's Vagrant Story? Star Ocean 2? Resident Evil? Tenchu?


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 2:36 am 


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Resident Evil is there, in its Director's Cut variant. I just find myself wondering if they went for PAL versions because some licensors behind the former PAL Curtain gave them good deals on teh ROMz.

I ain't gonna give you crap about it because the badness of the list made my eyes gloss over and think something wasn't there that was, too.

I am not sure whether to put my bets on "smashing success" or "utter flop;" even back in the day Sony relied heavily on dumb consumer brand name recognition to move units - the obvious reason why the terribad Tom Clancy's game is on there instead of something interesting-but-unknown. To say nothing of the unpronounceable...Bealpareth? Good luck getting the average Amazon addict or Big Box Store shopper to show any interest in that. Consumer confidence is still near its unbelievable 18-year high; doubtless many people will still be willing to throw their money at stupid shit like this. nVidia did get punished this year for their latest graphics card releases being priced far too high, but I guess that's not a direct enough comparison.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 3:26 am 


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Yeah, it's a shitshow.
Man, I thought the 50hz issue was just in traditionally PAL regions, didn't realize that US models were getting PAL releases on the machine too.

Where's Gran Turismo? Is there a rights issue with that [music, cars]? Ace Combat 2? There's a new game coming out, why not use this for publicity? Where's Dino Crisis 2? Wipeout? I dunno about XL or 3, but I know Sony's been able to distribute the first game. Where's Armored Core in the west? Why the hell is it JP exclusive? I understand the lack of Crash and Spyro and THPS [lol, licensing], but the list is weirdly lacking.
Where's Street Fighter EX2+? Or any SF game? Rival Schools?
if Capcom hadn't just done a Mega Man X collection, we'd maybe could have seen X4 or something on the machine

Why is Persona 1 there? Or Rainbow Six [who wants to play the PS1 version of that]? I love Mr. Driller and I'm glad it's there... but it's kinda odd to see it. Why in fuck's name is Toshinden there? The PS1 was absolutely full of fun 3D fighters, why that one?
Jumping Flash is a fun game, but it's also really weird that it's there. 23 years after release, it feels super jank these days.

I'm also really confused as to why they didn't include DualShock controllers. Would have let them put Ape Escape on there.
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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 3:55 am 



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null1024 wrote:
I'm also really confused as to why they didn't include DualShock controllers.


This is the only clear answerable from your post. Cost. They obviously wanted to keep this at $99 and there's a hell of a lot more hardware inside this thing than the $79 SNES Classic. Adding all the extra analog and vibration hardware to the controllers vs. the basic digital shits was clearly a dealbreaker. Maybe they didn't want to bother re-engineering the vibration technology for USB vs. their original proprietary connection either.

Is it the right choise for what a PS Classic should be? Maybe not, but for an under-$100 PS Classic it was the only choice.

Personally, for PS1.. you can do very well limiting yourself to digital-only games. You just have to choose better than they did. I picked a very nice set for my SNES Classic, and ironically in the end the modded SNES even runs them better than this POS apparently does.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 5:07 am 


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A review is in!
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digi ... sic-review

...garbage.

For $99 though...hmm, it's an interesting thing for that little. The staff writer opines that perhaps 50Hz games were chosen to reduce demands on the chosen hardware, a possibility in the back of my mind behind the licensing woes. It seems like a poor stopgap given that the frame pacing is still all over the place, and forcing 50fps games to update on a 60fps device is causing problems anyway. Strangely enough, the PS Classic manages to run Ridge Racer Type 4 slightly faster than the more powerful Shield TV in their measured gameplay snippet. If that is the result of some tweaking done to the open sores emulator they used, they won't win many plaudits for the wins in software.

In conjunction with the powerless ARM platform, the digital-only controllers do seem like a needed cost-control measure.

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The performance on the Classic gives the impression that these games run a lot worse than you might remember when they most certainly did not, and this may negativity colour the opinions people hold on these games.

It wouldn't be too bad if the rest of the NTSC games ran properly but sadly, they do not.

Ouch.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 5:57 am 



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I don't think you guys remember just how mediocre every Street Fighter port was on the PS1. It'd be better to include the original Guilty Gear and call it a day for 2D fighters.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:05 am 


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BryanM wrote:
Wait woah woah wait......
They... explored the possibility of porting Black and White to the Phantasy Station 1?

Black and White. The game that ran like a hog on cutting edge PC's. On the little toybox where they had to put fog 3 inches in front of your feet so as spare itself the exhaustion of rendering a few rectangles that passed as buildings at the time.


They didn't just explore the possibility. It was actually in the process of being ported. A playable demo was demonstrated to the press and previews were published. The PS1 version even had its own stand at the European Computer Trade Show 2001 in London. After that event, months went by and no new information appeared. Then, at some point in 2002 news of the game's cancellation arrived with the publisher Midas Entertainment citing financial difficulties as the cause, and that was it.

Would've been an interesting curiosity, for sure. Almost on the level of Baldur's Gate PS1 (yes, such a thing does actually exist and can be played from start to finish, praise be to whomever leaked it back in 2009).


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:43 pm 


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quash wrote:
I don't think you guys remember just how mediocre every Street Fighter port was on the PS1. It'd be better to include the original Guilty Gear and call it a day for 2D fighters.


The PS1 port of Alpha 3 has some extra content over the CPS2 version (namely World Tour mode, the addition of all the missing fighters from the Super Turbo roster and proper story content from Balrog, Juni and Juli) that made it for the fact that it's not 100% accurate port.

Ed Oscuro wrote:
Resident Evil is there, in its Director's Cut variant..


Director's Cut is alright as long as it's not the DualShock variant (that's the one with the altered music).


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:43 pm 


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Yeah, I made the mistake of confusing the Director's Cut with the Funky Music Version, aka the Dual Shock version. The Director's Cut version has an arrange mode and sounds like the best version of the original release.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 1:31 am 



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Jonny2x4 wrote:
The PS1 port of Alpha 3 has some extra content over the CPS2 version (namely World Tour mode, the addition of all the missing fighters from the Super Turbo roster and proper story content from Balrog, Juni and Juli) that made it for the fact that it's not 100% accurate port.


Alpha 3 would be the best one to include, but even then, this genre was not exactly a strength of the console, so it doesn't make much sense to bring that back into public consciousness. If anything, it may create demand for a Saturn Classic. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 5:04 am 



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Alpha 2 Gold was also very strong, the SFII Collection was fine, and I believe the Super SF2 port was fine as well. PS got a lot of justified crap for early 2D ports vs. the Saturn, but Capcom learned to work with it a lot better in the second half of the gen. It's not correct to say the SF games on it were terrible across the board.


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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:00 am 


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Jonathan Ingram wrote:
They didn't just explore the possibility. It was actually in the process of being ported. A playable demo was demonstrated to the press and previews were published.


Looked up some screenshots and by god you're right, there was a rudimentary working prototype. It's about as horrific as I imagined - the large vibrant landscapes of that game were the only unequivocally good things about it.

In retrospect getting ripped off by this thing's hype probably has made me immune to its progeny - stuff like Spore and No Man's Sky. Sacrifice deserved to sell a million, more than any of these scams did.

Quote:
Why is Persona 1 there?


"Because capitalism" is the obvious reason for the Sony Conglomerate's lack of a first party library and the cheaping out on licenses to maximize profit by offering the bare minimum necessary for it to sell (it really could be so much worse. Tekken. Resident Evil. Metal Gear. Final Fantasy. That's something.).

Anyway, Persona 1 is infamous for the little plotline where the snotty rich kid's butler dies, but, because this is Persona, he's unable to escape his slavery through the sweet release of death and has to continue being the brat's servant for eternity. At least he gets a surfboard out of it.


Last edited by BryanM on Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: PlayStation Classic's full game list announced
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:09 am 



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No version of SFII was "fine", and especially not Super Turbo. This list of differences isn't even comprehensive, but it's enough to say with confidence that the PS1 port of the game is a mess. SFII ports in general are a shitshow due to how that game and its subsequent revisions were programmed.

Alpha 2 Gold was okay for its time, but still falls short of being arcade perfect in any sense. I just don't think it makes much sense to highlight the one genre that the console was decidedly inferior to its competition in.


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