shmups.system11.org

Shmups Forum
 
* FAQ    * Search
 * Register  * Login 
It is currently Thu Sep 20, 2018 10:17 am View unanswered posts
View active topics



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 176 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Shmups: PCB vs PC port vs Emulation?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:05 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 25 Jun 2010
Posts: 3413
Xyga wrote:
The 'entire' is exaggerated but that's in line with your opinion of people who buy pcbs despite you complaining about shitty ports ad nauseam, right, (though you might be right about a majority of pcb hoarders and potential EXA customers today, but it wasn't always like that)

futari and M2 garegga straight up demolished the arcade pcbs in terms of quality, options and accessibility yet you don't see prices going down
you can't even pause to take a piss on a pcb, even shitty ports like sdoj give you basic extras like pausing, practice, replays and scoreboards (not to mention no need to do maintenance and other stuff required for arcade games)

the potential revenue loss I can think of is people using ports to practice instead of throwing in credit after credit (the first guy to clear futari ultra spent a ton on it that way, probably more than the pcb costs)
if you have to do that in order to keep the arcade business alive then let it die

qmish wrote:
Too bad ng:dev team disagrees and acts like neogeo collectors will stop buy their products if they'll port them to psn or else

the real reason is that no one would buy the ports because the games themselves suck, it's much easier to attach something with pretty retro graphics to something arcade with an insane price tag and wait for the suckers to open their wallets


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:36 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 6242
Location: Craig's
Bananamatic wrote:
futari and M2 garegga straight up demolished the arcade pcbs in terms of quality, options and accessibility yet you don't see prices going down
you can't even pause to take a piss on a pcb, even shitty ports like sdoj give you basic extras like pausing, practice, replays and scoreboards (not to mention no need to do maintenance and other stuff required for arcade games)

Yeah right-away you take two of the best examples but again it wasn't always like that.
Dunno when you got into shmups in particular but when I got the fever pcbs didn't cost nearly as much as they do today (save for the new kits for some time of course)
For instance buying Mushi or Ibara made sense VS the PS2 ports, Toaplan games didn't have sound in MAME etc plus all the stuff that wasn't emulated at all.
Even 15kHz emu setups weren't nearly as easy to make as today, and we weren't as well equipped and educated when it came to scalers and shit.
So yeah buying pcbs, with a supergun or a cab (also much cheaper at the time) wasn't a stupid collectors-only thing, it was by far the best option if you wanted to play the shit out a good number of arcades games in ideal conditions period.

Bananamatic wrote:
the potential revenue loss I can think of is people using ports to practice instead of throwing in credit after credit (the first guy to clear futari ultra spent a ton on it that way, probably more than the pcb costs)
if you have to do that in order to keep the arcade business alive then let it die

Maybe that will depend on the difficulty of the available games. Maybe EXA and partners are aware that it's not the 20th century anymore, not even the early 2000's, and there won't be as many people to drop bags of coins into their favourite arcade joint, not even a handful of coins if we're talking casuals (well there aren't even arcades over here so they can't lol)
(edit: meaning anyway that for Japan and AP in general they must be targeting both actual arcades and collectors, and for the west obviously it has to be individual sales/collectors in priority)

But you will say if the games are too easy they won't be worth playing either, so I don't think you would be satisfied either way.

I wouldn't mind a consoles-only revival of the genre but looking at the recent past years it looks like that won't happen without the arcades side of things being alive/active anyway.
So in a way I don't care about whatever comes out on the EXA, as long as it motivates devs to make new titles for other platforms that is.
_________________
mycophobia wrote:
have tyou ever played dodponpatchi


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:26 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 26 Dec 2008
Posts: 602
Location: Sweden
Shou wrote:
clippa wrote:
Shou wrote:
Type-R will never be ported - arcade only to maximize operator income


Aw! A version of aka to blue without the exa-arcade exclusive content could still come to pc though, right?
Type-(another letter)?

I really want to play this game and I'm not too keen on the idea of dropping a grand on a locked down pc when I have an open one sat right in front of me.
I'm happy to make the sacrifice if it means that arcades get a shot in the arm and people start making more games though.

In the g.rev thread you said "To clarify, any choice would be for arcade first then PC/console later. That's how the economics of this work out."
Is that just for the g.rev game?
Have they decided to just add some more content to strania instead of making another game or are they just doing that first to take a run up?


Aka & Blue will not have a PC port.

Any console port will be a significantly different game like the mobile version vs the arcade version.

G. Rev announcementS will be made in the near future.


Aw, I can see why, just a shame that I will prob never be able to play the game then :(
_________________
Image


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:38 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 26 Oct 2014
Posts: 1202
z0mbie90 wrote:

Aw, I can see why, just a shame that I will prob never be able to play the game then :(


1) nobody from your family/friends has ios/android tablet to play original Aka to Blue?
2) maybe one day you'll have a voyage to Japan or somewhere else with exA-Arcadia cabinets

:idea:
_________________
Kill the Past / Suda 51 fansite and more | Favorite artwork selection from manuals | My music


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:06 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 896
Shou wrote:

Aka & Blue will not have a PC port.

Any console port will be a significantly different game like the mobile version vs the arcade version.

G. Rev announcementS will be made in the near future.


What makes you so sure that it won't come to Steam someday?
And what about all the talk about console ports being different...have you already played the switch port?

Btw, no "official" PC port doesn't actually mean that it won't be playable on regular Windows PCs...considering Exa will be cracked sooner or later. Remember Type-X? :lol:


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:21 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 25 Jun 2010
Posts: 3413
Xyga wrote:
but again it wasn't always like that.
Dunno when you got into shmups in particular but when I got the fever pcbs didn't cost nearly as much as they do today (save for the new kits for some time of course)
For instance buying Mushi or Ibara made sense VS the PS2 ports, Toaplan games didn't have sound in MAME etc plus all the stuff that wasn't emulated at all.
Even 15kHz emu setups weren't nearly as easy to make as today, and we weren't as well equipped and educated when it came to scalers and shit.

I started in 2009, I still don't know what 15 khz or scaler even means or why should I need it to play
just launch ddp in mame, turn off vsync and bilinear filter and play with whatever controller you like
easy and it works perfectly (if you enjoy shmups for the gameplay and not for being a hardware snob)
or play touhou or whatever there was on pc
also it's not early 2000s anymore, most games are either well emulated or have at least an acceptable port
weren't pcbs actually way cheaper back in the day when the games were less accessible then they are now?

Quote:
But you will say if the games are too easy they won't be worth playing either, so I don't think you would be satisfied either way.

beginner mode
original mode
expert mode
doujin devs understand this and everyone is happy
in fact, doujin devs understand how to make a good shmup better than the big name devs do these days


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:06 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 26 Dec 2008
Posts: 602
Location: Sweden
qmish wrote:
z0mbie90 wrote:

Aw, I can see why, just a shame that I will prob never be able to play the game then :(


1) nobody from your family/friends has ios/android tablet to play original Aka to Blue?
2) maybe one day you'll have a voyage to Japan or somewhere else with exA-Arcadia cabinets

:idea:


True, never say never, but the chances are slim. Sure I know people with ios/android, but I don't enjoy playing on a phone/pad.
_________________
Image


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:35 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 6242
Location: Craig's
Bananamatic wrote:
I started in 2009, I still don't know what 15 khz or scaler even means or why should I need it to play
just launch ddp in mame, turn off vsync and bilinear filter and play with whatever controller you like
easy and it works perfectly (if you enjoy shmups for the gameplay and not for being a hardware snob)

So you've missed a better era and yes things were cheaper, and no caring about hardware and configuration isn't snob, overdoing it is, but completely ignoring it stubbornly is just being stupid.

Bananamatic wrote:
or play touhou or whatever there was on pc

yeah right everyone was too that's only natural

Bananamatic wrote:
also it's not early 2000s anymore, most games are either well emulated or have at least an acceptable port

Your point? the past never happened and doesn't count in any argumentation? You always criticize people who buy pcbs so I answered telling you I understand if you only look at the present or recent years, that it's not always been like that, but it seems every time anything before your time - you the slightly younger generation that came into the hobby a bit later when the industry was dying and prices rising like hell - you get offended.

You sound like Shepardus, you guys give the feeling that nothing but what you've known your time when you got into the hobby, your way, makes sense.
Jealousy? Poorfags? if so that's nonsense.
Even for people like me who were earlier into it the problems are the same, I don't shit on entire portions of the genre's history and community for such, you're not talking exclusively to a bunch of old bourgeois snobs if that's what you believe. Yeah, what am I thinking knowing you; seems you do.

Bananamatic wrote:
beginner mode
original mode
expert mode
doujin devs understand this and everyone is happy
in fact, doujin devs understand how to make a good shmup better than the big name devs do these days

Yeah okay, industry-oriented devs who made arcade and console games never thought of it, and no doujin dev ever has had any relationship to the industry either.
In fact we're talking about different races, and obviously people who dev and play doujins are superior while the old arcade bourgeois are degenerates.
We must eliminate them and create the doujin reich of shmups.
Right? RIGHT!!? :D

Nah just the doujin/indie scene alone won't do it, not enough, will forever remain too niche. Shmups need arcades, consoles and doujins, splitting and politicizing the genre is stupid and will go nowhere.
_________________
mycophobia wrote:
have tyou ever played dodponpatchi


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 7:17 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 25 Jun 2010
Posts: 3413
Xyga wrote:
So you've missed a better era and yes things were cheaper, and no caring about hardware and configuration isn't snob, overdoing it is, but completely ignoring it stubbornly is just being stupid.

it's an old ass game from 90s and its selling point is 100% the gameplay, what else is there to want if it plays and runs well? what's the point of 15hz or downscaling or whatever? does it make it control better or is it just for "authenticity" and worth spending thousands of dollars on?

Xyga wrote:
Your point? the past never happened and doesn't count in any argumentation? You always criticize people who buy pcbs so I answered telling you I understand if you only look at the present or recent years, that it's not always been like that, but it seems every time anything before your time - you the slightly younger generation that came into the hobby a bit later when the industry was dying and prices rising like hell - you get offended.

the past doesn't matter anymore, the present does
the games are more available than ever yet the prices went up several times so it's pretty safe to assume the price has nothing to do with gameplay but with the whole "arcade" and "retro" fetishism

Quote:
You sound like Shepardus, you guys give the feeling that nothing but what you've known your time when you got into the hobby, your way, makes sense.
Jealousy? Poorfags? if so that's nonsense.
Even for people like me who were earlier into it the problems are the same, I don't shit on entire portions of the genre's history and community for such, you're not talking exclusively to a bunch of old bourgeois snobs if that's what you believe. Yeah, what am I thinking knowing you; seems you do.

and you "good old days" people barely play the games, just jerk over back when where nothing was available (except there were plenty of good games if you stopped blindly shitting on touhou which was actually pretty damn good back then) and insist on keeping it that way
people don't like to play the games? here's an idea, make them more exclusive and increase the price 50 times because it's "arcade"

Quote:
Nah just the doujin/indie scene alone won't do it, not enough, will forever remain too niche. Shmups need arcades, consoles and doujins, splitting and politicizing the genre is stupid and will go nowhere.

while cave was busy rotting, we got crimzon clover, astebreed, blue revolver, battle traverse and soon rolling gunner (and danmaku unlimited 2/3 to some extent), doujin shmups are doing better than ever with arcades dying
face it, arcades are irrelevant, old, overpriced, inaccessible and busted, fighters long left arcades behind, street fighter V is doing just fine without arcades
even rhythm games mostly moved on and are about the gameplay despite staying mostly in arcade

only this irrelevant genre is still all about the 15hz (the fuck does this even mean?), scanlines, "true low res" (it's 2018), pcbs, downscaling (why?), paying ridiculous prices for a single game and wanting this to continue, if you want to complain about elitism in the genre, you have it right here
no mainstream gamers give a shit about all this, they like to play games, not wank to them (unless it's anime waifu stuff)
do you honestly think shmups will become less niche with another worthless japan only arcade platform that is basically a pc artificially creating exclusive games by refusing to port it to sane platforms and encouraging people to spend thousands on it?

this shit will bomb hard, if anything it will become popular for fighters if it really has less delay


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 7:41 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 26 Mar 2008
Posts: 1288
Location: philly suburbs
Bananamatic wrote:
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE


Why does every thread that mentions pcb devolve into you whining about how pcbs killed your family and raped your dog? Give it a rest, no one gives a shit.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 8:13 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 18 Feb 2011
Posts: 4315
Location: Denmarku
I'm surprised Xyga even bothers :)


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 8:16 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 26 Oct 2014
Posts: 1202
Quote:
street fighter V is doing just fine


those sf5 apologists...
everywhere, son.
_________________
Kill the Past / Suda 51 fansite and more | Favorite artwork selection from manuals | My music


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 8:50 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 6242
Location: Craig's
Bananamatic wrote:
it's an old ass game from 90s and its selling point is 100% the gameplay, what else is there to want if it plays and runs well? what's the point of 15hz or downscaling or whatever? does it make it control better or is it just for "authenticity" and worth spending thousands of dollars on?

Sorry for liking excellent pixel art and know it looks its best on a low res crt, you may not know what it's like, well too bad for you, probably influenced your shit taste.
You're the type of sperg who only cares about score, right, good for you, but you're not the only player in this world (thankfully).
Lag is also annoying though not with every emulated game but still important. Go try and say you don't care.

Bananamatic wrote:
the past doesn't matter anymore, the present does

Ignoring it and making stupid statements against things you deliberately choose to ignore don't make you sound smart, just ignorant.

Bananamatic wrote:
the games are more available than ever yet the prices went up several times so it's pretty safe to assume the price has nothing to do with gameplay but with the whole "arcade" and "retro" fetishism.

Today yes. But your idiotic insistance on ignoring what I've told you about how it was before you came into the hobby apparently disables your capacity to understand that it's wasn't always the case. And many of us were there at that time, for you it didn't happen? We're all rich fetishists because today is today period? Duh.

Bananamatic wrote:
and you "good old days" people barely play the games

Yeah right maybe we got enough of most of those before you because of that thing called 'time' you don't know about. I've played shmups like any other game since I was a kid in the 80's, really got bit by the bug after the 32bit era and increasingly from I think about 99 to 2010 or so I think where I had much less time for it, not the only one here. just life. Got my fill even though I still enjoy playing more casually and tinker with hardware. So what? Do we all have to be sportsmen like you and forever if we dare still thouch shmups? you too will get older and more casual, sooner than you expect.

Bananamatic wrote:
just jerk over back when where nothing was available

Are you doing this on purpose or you really can't read? It was, just not as well on pc-only, so we still bought pcbs and so but that didn't mean spending nearly as much money as today.

Bananamatic wrote:
(except there were plenty of good games if you stopped blindly shitting on touhou which was actually pretty damn good back then)

Bitch what are you on I freaking never shat on Touhou games, don't know anyone here who actually did, and I've played them before you fucking dumbass, especially enjoyed Scarlet Devil and PCB.
Most of us just just hate how fucking anal and obnoxious Touhou fans are, that's all. Surprise! they happen to be among the youngest. Time is unfair to the young in its own way.

Bananamatic wrote:
and insist on keeping it that way
people don't like to play the games? here's an idea, make them more exclusive and increase the price 50 times because it's "arcade"

WFT?
Just because there'll be a number of games we may not play in the arcades again doesn't meant that at all, those who got the cash will buy them now but again the arcades side will stimulate consoles+pc and necessarily doujin makers too.
And the arcade originals will obviously come to be ported and/or emulated one day, you know it, maybe it'll be in many years, so what? do you have no patience at all?
And is there anything you would like to own now anyway? No, not yet, so why do you complain?
You haven't experienced the time when there was an alchemy between all mediums of production, obviously you don't realize that, and yes even the doujin scene was more active and heavily inspired by the arcades too but you don't fucking realize that either.

Bananamatic wrote:
while cave was busy rotting, we got crimzon clover, astebreed, blue revolver, battle traverse and soon rolling gunner (and danmaku unlimited 2/3 to some extent), doujin shmups are doing better than ever with arcades dying

Lol that's all you know about? because you were there at that time to see it? I mean the doujin scene literally waited for your generation to be discovered! yeah really! And that's the highest and best production output ever! bwahahah. :lol:

Bananamatic wrote:
face it, arcades are irrelevant, old, overpriced, inaccessible and busted, fighters long left arcades behind, street fighter V is doing just fine without arcades
even rhythm games mostly moved on and are about the gameplay despite staying mostly in arcade

Right, in terms of business model it's really hard to believe it'll work anew. There's only a hope for new little development impulse with the rules of making arcade products that might happen.
the arcade model influences the design decisions of the devs who design them, that's what makes the touch and history of it all where it started.
the problem of the exclusively amateur and independent scene is that it sure experiments on its own and that's very good, but some of the basics and spirit are gone, or forgotten little by little. if production on EXA gets real with new and high-value production stuff going back to some basics won't hurt the genre.

Bananamatic wrote:
only this irrelevant genre is still all about the 15hz (the fuck does this even mean?), scanlines, "true low res" (it's 2018), pcbs, downscaling (why?)

Because you don't pay attention and don't read why you think you have a point?
Again you may haven't know how good-looking many old games look displayd in their true nature, that's your problem being ignorant, not ours.
using a 15khz setup is for that purpose.
For newer games that are high-res some people want to downscale to use in their cabs because they don't have a 31khz compatible or LCD in it, that's all, you're the only idiot seeing fetishism. Most will likely play on a HDTV or monitor and have no problem with it.

Bananamatic wrote:
paying ridiculous prices for a single game and wanting this to continue

Again no, we want shmups to continue being produced, including some coming from the arcades, even if that means using some patience like before or just going for different versions on other platforms.

Bananamatic wrote:
if you want to complain about elitism in the genre, you have it right here
no mainstream gamers give a shit about all this, they like to play games, not wank to them (unless it's anime waifu stuff)

You're among those I've seen shit the most on what other shmuppers play or not, like or not, do or not, etc. who's an elitist?
You can't be this dumb.

Bananamatic wrote:
do you honestly think shmups will become less niche with another worthless japan only arcade platform that is basically a pc artificially creating exclusive games by refusing to port it to sane platforms and encouraging people to spend thousands on it?

Shou is trying to start a business, no even revive a market, because he knows and and remembers its specifics and strenghts and uniqueness, you know; those things you don't know and shit on. the selection looks poor now but as he says let's be patient, I fully support his venture as I would support all people who try to do things for the game genre I've liked the most in my life.

Bananamatic wrote:
this shit will bomb hard

Says the guy who plays the shit of arcade games again, but contradiction is part of your trade, and many of your generation apparently, you're just an ignorant sperg behaving like a know-it-all teenager with too much misplaced pride.
You can boast about your level with the select games you play very well, and that's good congratulations, but about the rest you should really shut your stupid-ass trap, serioulsy you only sound like a douchebag, nothing else, not someone who actually ever had a passion for the genre or cared about it much.
I think your thing is to score score score whatever the game genre and have people watch you replay and retweet your performance, alright everyone enjoys stuff his own way, but why the fuck would everyone need to be as limited in scope, interest, knowledge, taste etc as you?
_________________
mycophobia wrote:
have tyou ever played dodponpatchi


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:41 pm 



Joined: 01 Aug 2009
Posts: 132
Location: The Netherlands
clippa wrote:

This exa thing, could I plug in a usb arcade stick and plug it into a monitor or would I have to buy a cabinet for it?


That would be pretty cool. One side of me says hey for authenticity you'd want a cab for this and this is the first reason i've ever seen to get a non-dedicated lcd cab. The other side of me says i've got way better panels here than whatever years old crap they put in the lcd cabs so just use it on that.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:51 pm 



Joined: 24 Mar 2005
Posts: 605
Power to the Exa!


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 1:29 am 



Joined: 29 Jan 2013
Posts: 608
Necronom wrote:
Shou wrote:

Aka & Blue will not have a PC port.

Any console port will be a significantly different game like the mobile version vs the arcade version.

G. Rev announcementS will be made in the near future.


What makes you so sure that it won't come to Steam someday?
And what about all the talk about console ports being different...have you already played the switch port?

Btw, no "official" PC port doesn't actually mean that it won't be playable on regular Windows PCs...considering Exa will be cracked sooner or later. Remember Type-X? :lol:


He's saying EXA-exclusive content is a stipulation of the dev contract, and any future console version will have to be different to the arcade version because of that.

The developers already said they intend for the console port to be 4:3.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 1:36 am 


User avatar

Joined: 13 Dec 2014
Posts: 3173
Location: Ringing the bells of fortune
I think Exa's doing a lot more for arcades than it's doing for shmups. Choices like the decision not to port Aka & Blue Type-R to consoles or PC are clearly made with arcade operators in mind first - Shou even said as much himself:
Shou wrote:
Type-R will never be ported - arcade only to maximize operator income

The obvious reasoning being that if a port were available people would just play the port and not bother with the arcade. There's a tension between operators and players here - players would rather not spend more money if they didn't have to, and would prefer having more choices on where and how they can play the game, while operators would rather have players spend more money and have more of that income going to the arcades. This isn't far removed from the competing interests that exist in free-to-play games and web services that rely on advertising - who are you really selling to?

Making games exclusive to arcades effectively means you'll extract more money from the hardcore players who have access to those arcades (and are willing to keep dropping in credits to play the game instead of simply playing something else). This could be a sensible business decision (just how sensible it is depends on how little income developers make from their ports), but does nothing to expand the genre's reach and player interest in the genre, which is what I and perhaps others here are more interested in. At least in the F2P model the whales subsidize the game's existence for a larger audience that the game wouldn't otherwise reach.

The only way I can see this being a benefit to shmup players in that regard (more games, easier access to those games, and more people playing them) is if the games make enough money in the arcade that developers can afford to make more games and make them more widely available, and are feeling generous enough to do that rather than keep going for the arcade-exclusivity that got them there in the first place.
_________________
Image
NTSC-J: You know STGs are in trouble when you have threads on how to introduce them to a wider audience and get more people playing followed by threads on how to get its hardcore fan base to play them, too.
1CCs | Twitch | YouTube


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:59 am 


User avatar

Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Posts: 435
Location: Central Tokyo, Japan, Asia, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way
Necronom wrote:
Shou wrote:

Aka & Blue will not have a PC port.

Any console port will be a significantly different game like the mobile version vs the arcade version.

G. Rev announcementS will be made in the near future.


What makes you so sure that it won't come to Steam someday?
And what about all the talk about console ports being different...have you already played the switch port?

Btw, no "official" PC port doesn't actually mean that it won't be playable on regular Windows PCs...considering Exa will be cracked sooner or later. Remember Type-X? :lol:


1. There is an agreement on this.
2. Anything can be cracked but your desire to see it so will just destroy this endeavor and any future for Japanese arcade games.
The Nesica leak cost Taito a ton of money and now that platform is dead. Sega and namco have already exited normal arcade games.
_________________
become history


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:41 am 


User avatar

Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 1501
Location: borders
shooter fans are sad because this game will be limited to japanese arcades (maybe some euro/us ones too) and rich collectors its pretty simple to understand.. :lol:
and i used to buy pcbs such as muchi prork etc when they were not available to play on home console. i always sold em for a new one once i had scrub cleared the game tho :twisted:
_________________
SLAG OFF KETSUI I SLAG OFF YOR MUM
https://soundcloud.com/vapor-teh-apparition
https://soundcloud.com/don-pachi-aka-bling-laden


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:43 am 


User avatar

Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 1501
Location: borders
still if the makers want to limit who play the game that is a decision they are free to make.. i just don't personally agree with it.
at least super pang will get to play it even if the rest of the forum cant :roll:
_________________
SLAG OFF KETSUI I SLAG OFF YOR MUM
https://soundcloud.com/vapor-teh-apparition
https://soundcloud.com/don-pachi-aka-bling-laden


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:45 am 


User avatar

Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 1501
Location: borders
but he'll have to credit feed it just to scrub clear it :P
one solution is just to boycott any inferior ports/versions till they give us the real one.if the company goes tits up it will be from their own bad decisions and they will only have themselves to blame. i personally don't think a game can turn a profit arcade only nowadays especially in the shoot em up niche
_________________
SLAG OFF KETSUI I SLAG OFF YOR MUM
https://soundcloud.com/vapor-teh-apparition
https://soundcloud.com/don-pachi-aka-bling-laden


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:51 am 



Joined: 01 Jan 2016
Posts: 39
Shepardus wrote:
I think Exa's doing a lot more for arcades than it's doing for shmups. [...]


Approximately how I feel. I've seen a lot of people hype it up, and I am definitely interested in buying it -- especially if the most exciting options are in fact not yet even revealed -- but I still feel like it will not do much for the shmup community in the west, since the only people who'd be able to play those games are either rich, friends with people who are rich, or live in big cities with arcades that are still alive (like all 10 of them).


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:02 am 


User avatar

Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 1501
Location: borders
bananamatic has a right to voice his opinion . a modern shooter doesn't last him very long compared to other players .eventually he is going to have no games to play :cry:
_________________
SLAG OFF KETSUI I SLAG OFF YOR MUM
https://soundcloud.com/vapor-teh-apparition
https://soundcloud.com/don-pachi-aka-bling-laden


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:13 am 


User avatar

Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Posts: 435
Location: Central Tokyo, Japan, Asia, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way
vvv_stg wrote:
Shepardus wrote:
I think Exa's doing a lot more for arcades than it's doing for shmups. [...]


Approximately how I feel. I've seen a lot of people hype it up, and I am definitely interested in buying it -- especially if the most exciting options are in fact not yet even revealed -- but I still feel like it will not do much for the shmup community in the west, since the only people who'd be able to play those games are either rich, friends with people who are rich, or live in big cities with arcades that are still alive (like all 10 of them).



For those in the US, Round 1 plans to have 200 locations there. D&B is opening 1 new location a month and currently has 110 locations. Other states like Texas have an increasing amount of arcades.
_________________
become history


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:51 am 


User avatar

Joined: 26 Oct 2014
Posts: 1202
Quote:
post you're scores:
in fact, doujin devs understand how to make a good shmup better than the big name devs do these days


do you remember that "big name devs" related to shmups are still nearly same 2-10 people in team, not very far away from doujin, lol

and how 90% non-shmuppers never heard about them (or, they could heard about doujins much more than about "arcade/console shmup devs" due to viral communities like Touhou or Undertale)

Quote:
Shou:
For those in the US


Any Europe-related news?
_________________
Kill the Past / Suda 51 fansite and more | Favorite artwork selection from manuals | My music


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:17 am 


User avatar

Joined: 13 Dec 2014
Posts: 3173
Location: Ringing the bells of fortune
We could debate the line between indie/doujin and "commercial" endlessly but I don't think it has much, if anything, to do with the size of the dev team or how popular it is. To me a game like Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup with dozens (if not hundreds) of contributors is more "indie" in spirit than any of CAVE's output. That's in large part because people contribute to DC:SS on a voluntary basis rather than for a living (as far as I know, anyway), but even so there are indie devs nowadays who quit their jobs to develop full-time. Anyway, the small size of most shmup dev teams should indicate that there's little they can do that doujin devs can't. And let's not forget that Infinos and Hydorah are by doujin and indie devs respectively - the news there is that they're coming to arcades, not that "big name"/"commercial" developers are getting into the shmups game.
_________________
Image
NTSC-J: You know STGs are in trouble when you have threads on how to introduce them to a wider audience and get more people playing followed by threads on how to get its hardcore fan base to play them, too.
1CCs | Twitch | YouTube


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:01 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 6242
Location: Craig's
Shepardus wrote:
The only way I can see this being a benefit to shmup players in that regard (more games, easier access to those games, and more people playing them) is if the games make enough money in the arcade that developers can afford to make more games and make them more widely available, and are feeling generous enough to do that rather than keep going for the arcade-exclusivity that got them there in the first place.

Shepardus wrote:
We could debate the line between indie/doujin and "commercial" endlessly but I don't think it has much, if anything, to do with the size of the dev team or how popular it is. To me a game like Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup with dozens (if not hundreds) of contributors is more "indie" in spirit than any of CAVE's output. That's in large part because people contribute to DC:SS on a voluntary basis rather than for a living (as far as I know, anyway), but even so there are indie devs nowadays who quit their jobs to develop full-time. Anyway, the small size of most shmup dev teams should indicate that there's little they can do that doujin devs can't. And let's not forget that Infinos and Hydorah are by doujin and indie devs respectively - the news there is that they're coming to arcades, not that "big name"/"commercial" developers are getting into the shmups game.

Glad to see you're starting to realize my point.

This is how it worked in the past and from as far as I can remember, you just weren't aware and can't gut that someone like me told you about a status of things you probably haven't experienced yourself if you only got into it around the same time as Bananamatic.
Like I said in the voting discussion thread there was an exchange of knowledge, capital, people etc, an alchemy, when arcades were still alive that was beneficiary to the genre, both in terms of output and quality. It was a market, multi-segmented but a market yes.
A single side of creation and production practically autarkic and ignoring the massive importance of arcades in shmups would only keep the genre straying further and further away from its roots and fundamentals. You may deny and not care about those but the history of shmups and players didn't start with you guys, disregard when it's not flat out disdain for arcades is laughable; after all you guys are essentially playing great games that came out of that past alchemy and market I'm talking about.
"the past doesn't matter anymore, the present does" quoting Banana is the stupidiest thing a shmups lover and player could say, it's a genre from the past, from the origins of video games, impossible to ignore it.
Those dividing the the genre and players into antagonist parties aren't me or alike, it's you guys, by ignoring stuff of before and building up prejudice over nothing solid.

It's like the complaints about the price of things, for fuck's sake which age demographics has been complaining the most about how ridiculous prices have become? and which has been paying whatever crazy prices and contributed the most to that speculative insanity?
All those years I've closely followed the evolution of the stores and forums market of used games and that includes pcbs, and it wasn't the same before the turn of the 2010's, in every community I visited at the time the stupid collectors with mad money were massively newcomers, younger in age and discovering 'retrogaming' on the late and being entranced with it and posession no matter the cost, they were the primary demographics to play the game of sharks and flippers promoting them to the the price-makers and adopting the same mentality.
I don't want to hear ridiculous statements about old timers being the artisans of exclusivity and elitism, and that goes for actual gaming too.

Seriously, practically the same time the maket changed at the turn of the 2010's the demographics, approach and daily practice and relationship to the internet changed too.
The years I was shmupping the most there were no fucktons of channels websites and social media, almost no streaming, no massive and almost exclusively competition with people gathering around individuals.
Buying games console arcade and pc that were still affordable, discussing, playing for ourselves 1cc'ing, scoring or just playing for pleasure period without punks putting pressure and commanding around communities on what games are worth playing and who deserves recognition and reputation. Superplaying was not a stage thing nor even considered the only thing to chase after either, it wasn't so much a popularity contest or a sport.
Fuck even the Touhou madness wasn't even nearly as big, the games were appreciated, the young idiot fans were still few, 2hu were just good doujins among tons of others, not like 80% of the doujin market and noise like today, and Comiket didn't just appear in 2009. There were tons of other good games we in particular did not ignore (I miss the times of shootthecore, what a fantastic portal to the world of doujin shmups it was, when places like doujinstyle and 2hu communities took over they basically crushed tons of doujin in their path, sending them to oblivion).

The whining of some about EXA having exclusive titles they can't play at home because of the cost is, because what actually? because that means they can't have sheep watch and follow on their twitch/twatter/yt whatever right-away? can't be the fastest to publish score and videos and opinion nor be the focus of attention for the novelty?
Assuming things go well - the money and work put into the arcades again WILL end up benefiting ALL of the shmups market including consoles and doujin/indie makers by reopening a segment. The dynamic will restart little by little on all platforms and so in fine everyone including you guys will benefit from it even if you can't buy EXA.
Personally I don't have the cash available for an EXA either, too many other priorities, but that doesn't make me stupidly jealous or angry because I know of the importance of arcades in the past, I know it's a good thing happening anyway.

Don't be so dense and self-centered guys, what happens with EXA is a plus, a welcome fresh opportunity to bring back a part of the lost vitality of the genre we like, not a plot by rich old elistist assholes who don't want you to have nice things.
_________________
mycophobia wrote:
have tyou ever played dodponpatchi


Last edited by Xyga on Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:13 pm 



Joined: 24 Mar 2005
Posts: 605
If there any curious Londoners who want to try the Exa, I am more than happy to have you come over and play on it when the system is set up at home.

FYI, I'm not a rich arse hole elitist, just passionate about shmups ;) and happy to share what I have.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:15 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 6242
Location: Craig's
That's the spirit! 8)
_________________
mycophobia wrote:
have tyou ever played dodponpatchi


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aka & Blue Type-R (Exa Arcade 2018)
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:27 pm 


User avatar

Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Posts: 435
Location: Central Tokyo, Japan, Asia, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way
qmish wrote:
Quote:

Quote:
Shou:
For those in the US


Any Europe-related news?


We've received over 20 requests from EU arcades. Happy to work with any size arcade there - big or small.
_________________
become history


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 176 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], vector7 and 4 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Space Pilot 3K template by Jakob Persson
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group