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Iran War. When.
2021 17%  17%  [ 2 ]
2022-2025 25%  25%  [ 3 ]
2026-2030 8%  8%  [ 1 ]
2031-2040 8%  8%  [ 1 ]
2041-2050 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Never 42%  42%  [ 5 ]
Total votes : 12
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 3:53 pm 


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They'll never run on Medicare for All, ending corruption, etc until a massive bottom-up enema is done replacing their entire roster of representatives. Democrats exist to lose elections.

Biden told hispanics bringing up concern over the Obama-era deportations to "vote for Trump". They gave millions of dollars to the Lincoln Project... I guess to advertise how close they are with Kasich and company, and are gung-ho for a repeat of more W. era war crimes?

I would be hard pressed to call their platform something that would have even flew 30 years ago. We ask for the smallest, most incremental of change actually measurable, they reach down and break the neck of our vessel to do that and put a girl molester as their champion. Dracula won't stake himself, Roo.

And you can't vote for someone you don't know - even that page you linked admitted "yeah the bog standard democrat would have won because of name recognition even in this different election system." They would still decide who has fame and who doesn't.


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 4:09 pm 


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BryanM wrote:
And you can't vote for someone you don't know


Ah, but an election system that actually gives everyone, even smaller candidates, an equal shot at the election without stuff like "spoiler candidates" would motivate people to actually learn more about all the candidates on the ballot. They'd actually have a reason to care about more than just the Democrat and Republican candidates, and many of the actually good and useful election systems (score, approval) have good resistance against fame-based pathologies. I realize that's making the major assumption that the current election system does get reformed (I sincerely hope both parties at least reform how they do their primary elections for their own sake).

The only way to reform the system it seems is to do what more hardcore progressives such as Sanders or Ocasio-Cortez have done is to run under the Democratic flag (or even the Republican flag) and then to campaign hard for election reform. Basically, fill the government with people willing and actively all discussing how much the current election sucks, the math behind it, and so on. I'm well aware this is the sort of thing that unfortunately would take decades, if not centuries.

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Democrats exist to lose elections.


Agreed. None of them wanted to take a potential Trump election seriously, and despite being badly humbled in 2016 this election demonstrates that their experience appears to have taught them little, if anything.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 4:28 pm 


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The turnout was the highest in our lifetimes. You can't possibly expect more. This was the ceiling for engagement.

If you're imagining a solution with more people coming around or more engagement, you're not being serious.

I keep hearing about people that are already in office. AOC, you say. Neato! Got anything new?

Who did you add to that list this time? Because, this magic change isn't happening if you didn't make gains.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 5:54 pm 


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Food for thought.
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Then he says to the white dude "Watch out for that black dude, he wants a piece of your cookie!"


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:06 pm 


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Quote:
Ah, but an election system that actually gives everyone, even smaller candidates, an equal shot at the election without stuff like "spoiler candidates" would motivate people to actually learn more about all the candidates on the ballot.


That's just expecting way too much of the average person. Such a motivated person would already be checking open secrets to see who those $200+ donors are. In reality, osmosis is the amount of effort they're willing to apply. For older people, that's TV. For younger people, it's social media.

It's not like there's any secret platform that would come out of nowhere, there's no shoe-on-head "unicorn in every garage" policy that'd catch on fire. Reality just isn't that interesting, we know what the platform is - Medicare for All, increase the minimum wage, legalize marijuana... stuff like this passes ballot initiatives by massive margins in the exact same state elections Trump wins or loses by a coin flip.

Democratic congress critters are opposed to this stuff down the board - except they'll increase the minimum wage slightly if and only if they're on the brink of being relegated to a permanent minority party.

Eh, and of course I do agree with you that in the abstract that elections can be improved, but again that'll only happen in a beautiful world where we have the chance of an actual future. Not the one where collapse is inevitable and, now, unmitigated.

BareKnuckleRoo wrote:
Agreed. None of them wanted to take a potential Trump election seriously, and despite being badly humbled in 2016 this election demonstrates that their experience appears to have taught them little, if anything.


Hah, they literally used the 'ole piped piper strategy to help him win the primary. Galaxy-brain smarty men.


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:21 pm 


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This was a bill that would have made it so that people making about 270k a year and up would have to pay more taxes in Illinois.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:58 pm 


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Mississippi decided to replace its confederate flag with a nice flower instead.

Only 30% of the state wanted to keep the klan flag.


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 7:21 pm 


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BryanM wrote:
Mississippi decided to replace its confederate flag with a nice flower instead.

Only 30% of the state wanted to keep the klan flag.


Sounds like big improvement for Mississippi.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 7:44 pm 


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Shedding a tear while thinking about what could have been...

Spoiler: show
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Two working class dudes, one black one white, just baked a tray of ten cookies together.

An oligarch walks in and grabs nine cookies for himself.

Then he says to the white dude "Watch out for that black dude, he wants a piece of your cookie!"


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 9:08 pm 


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Everyone knew what Prop 22 was, turnout was huge, and it still passed.

You're out of excuses.

"I want those things for them, but not enough to actually pay them."

Love you, love you, love you! You're a liberal! :)

Want to talk about "bad" voters stabbing everyone in the back? Okay! Let's do that.

~8% of "Democrats" voted for Prop 22. If you need shame some assholes, you should start there. Inconvenient, isn't it? :)

P.S.
You were saying something about a different set of colors in a different pattern on a flag? Oh goodie! A winner is you! (Because, that changes a whole big bunch of nada.)
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:56 pm 


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I bet Biden is gonna win. Too much pressure on the shoulders of the media hype, they've been promising a great Biden's victory for months, now he must win at all costs, no matter how long the counting takes ! :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:16 pm 


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lmao
Fox News called Arizona for Trump. They also offered too much confidence about Wisconsin.

It was ridiculous. FiveThirtyEight immediately disagreed on their live feed the moment Fox News announced it. It wasn't a "hindsight" thing. It was a "I'm ignoring facts and good sense" kinda thing.

Fox News is huge. Will all this "pressure" matter? Is there a conspiracy? :)

The president put yuuge pressure on everyone after he claimed victory. Is there a conspiracy there? He threatened to take it to his stuffed court--no matter how long it takes. Is that a conspiracy?

Nevada and Arizona will put this to bed tomorrow. Enjoy your shit sandwich, Republicans. You created the largest turnout in our lifetimes. What did you expect?
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:30 pm 


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:56 pm 


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orange808 wrote:
lmao

Nevada and Arizona will put this to bed tomorrow. Enjoy your shit sandwich, Republicans. You created the largest turnout in our lifetimes. What did you expect?

LOL I don't know if you're talking to me, I don't care if it's Trump or Biden, I'm not american. Nevada is the key for Biden's victory, he just needs 6 more electors and it's a win. Biden is about to be the new president, but it will be quite difficult for him to govern in such a political context with senators etc... :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 12:13 am 


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How are we ever going to replace this guy?

Spoiler: show
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Two working class dudes, one black one white, just baked a tray of ten cookies together.

An oligarch walks in and grabs nine cookies for himself.

Then he says to the white dude "Watch out for that black dude, he wants a piece of your cookie!"


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 1:06 am 


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https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2020/11 ... 2016-2020/

Inconvenient, isn't it?

You didn't drown Trump in a sea of ovaries and melanin. In fact, those demographics supported him MORE--as turnout increased!

Who kicked him out? Well... I can't say. It's inconvenient.

I'm sure there will be fresh talking points to explain it all away by morning. This is inconvenient.

By the way, this shift was predicted. I'm not surprised. If you are, you're not actually "engaged".
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:07 am 


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The Dems wouldn't want to be too unfair, so some House seats flipped.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:55 am 


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Steamflogger Boss wrote:
The Dems wouldn't want to be too unfair, so some House seats flipped.


With record breaking turnout? Say it ain't so!

The great sea of ovaries and melanin didn't bring a blue wave. I would say it's time for introspection, but we all know that isn't happening... :(
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 5:51 am 


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trump still "wins" this election and democracy across the globe loses as the ostensible world leader - the USA - gets embroiled in the murk of a legal battle amid record turnout. bolsonaro and other despotic world leaders are going to be emboldened by this, belief in democracy across the globe is going to continue to dwindle, and it's going to come down to trump vs utter decrepitude in 2024 as we watch whatever progressive candidate people are rallying for get shot down by biden going for another term (perhaps this is too optimistic, who am i kidding, we'll not even get a chance to rally for one before they're shot down). democrats are going to continue to curtail the expectations of a left that demands a better progressive candidate and cultivate further doomerism while young people continue to get indoctrinated into thinking trump - who isn't truly "going anywhere," even after he's out of his office - is rebellion against a greater power.

do we get cucked by a geriatric tool of the establishment whose entire campaign is just saying "hey, you get trump's campaign if you don't vote for us?" or do we get cucked by the failure of a businessman and myopic egotist who people are voting for sheerly because his impudence is seen as more desirable than the quietly smug arrogance of a do-nothing? nobody is even voting for their party, anymore, they're just voting because they've bought into the illusion the other is worse. the democrats' campaign is no-joke just trump's campaign, only as a threat rather than a promise. if there's any hope for the world in the coming years, it is in other countries' leftist movements become more of a stage for global attention than the dying united states'. we are living in a very dire time and in a very evil country.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:59 am 


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The interesting aspect about this election is how the final result is so far from the promises of the media world and polls. They announced a Dems landslide, but in the end, Biden is going to beat his opponent with just 2 to 10 electors ahead... This reveals how the country is quite divided, and tomorrow will be harder than today I'm afraid... Also keep in mind Joe Biden will be 78 years old in a couple of weeks..


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 12:48 pm 


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The thing that liberals say that infuriates me more than anything is when they do the "hur hur this wasn't about policy, it was about racism derp derp durdle" thing. Yeah, our country is just so fuckin' racistly garbage we elected Obama in massive landslides twice. Over a decade ago, when the electorate was more racist.

What is the rational, sane response to that, that doesn't involve telling them to shut up and go fuck themselves? It's the same transparent trick conservatives do, where they support something like genocide and then act like Jesus on his cross when people get mad at them. It demeans and dehumanizes us all.

cvaniafan wrote:
The interesting aspect about this election is how the final result is so far from the promises of the media world and polls.


Just another 2016. The polls said it was a coin flip again. They lied about what they said, again.

One or two faithless electors could change the outcome of the election, which I find hilarious. System working as intended.

Quote:
That’s the real issue this time,” he said. “Beating Nixon. It’s hard to even guess how much damage those bastards will do if they get in for another four years.”

The argument was familiar, I had even made it myself, here and there, but I was beginning to sense something very depressing about it. How many more of these goddamn elections are we going to have to write off as lame, but “regrettably necessary” holding actions? And how many more of these stinking double-downer sideshows will we have to go through before we can get ourselves straight enough to put together some kind of national election that will give me and the at least 20 million people I tend to agree with a chance to vote for something, instead of always being faced with that old familiar choice between the lesser of two evils?

Now with another one of these big bogus showdowns looming down on us, I can already pick up the stench of another bummer. I understand, along with a lot of other people, that the big thing this year is Beating Nixon. But that was also the big thing, as I recall, twelve years ago in 1960 – and as far as I can tell, we’ve gone from bad to worse to rotten since then, and the outlook is for more of the same.


I watched Back to the Future again recently, and you know how it makes the 50's look shiny and new and wonderful, and the 80's a decaying shithole? When he gets back to the 80's and the little shot of the movie theater advertising pornos appeared, with Orgy American Style being the flick on offer, I was like "WOW! They still had movie theaters back then."

Just think how awesome today will seem 30 years from now when we're in the apocalypse, proper.


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:05 pm 


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cvaniafan wrote:
The interesting aspect about this election is how the final result is so far from the promises of the media world and polls. They announced a Dems landslide, but in the end, Biden is going to beat his opponent with just 2 to 10 electors ahead...


The reliable poll/data outlets were much more humble this time and they presented the data better. Biden's lead wasn't larger than the margin of error. This time, people actually admitted a margin of error exists. Of course, the MSM didn't report it, but those people aren't particularly bright.

cvaniafan wrote:
This reveals how the country is quite divided, and tomorrow will be harder than today I'm afraid... Also keep in mind Joe Biden will be 78 years old in a couple of weeks..

All I see is the disconnect between the wealthy (mostly white) professional class and the majority of the plebs.

It's not more divided, but we have the full picture of what it is. Will we learn anything this time?

1. This finally proves that turnout is not a sleeping giant of lazy Democrats. That was a lazy assumption. The reality: lots of real people don't vote. More turnout won't change a thing, Dems. We already had a good sample of the population at large.

Data scientists have been poking at this for some time. Of course, us smarty-pants internet types always knew better than experts. (Except, we didn't.)

2. Women and minorities gave Trump more support than last time and white males in the rustbelt abandoned him. (Of course, Trump pulled a bait and switch on them last time. They made him pay.) Bryan already hit the race and gender memes associated with this. It's absolutely delicious to see so much melanin and so many ovaries vote for Trump. So delicious! Identity politics is bullshit.

Gasp! There is no sisterhood of the traveling justice pants? Goodness gracious, my stars, and sakes alive! That's so (not) shocking!

3. People still vote against their own best interests. Permanent reclassification of workers as "contractors" in California is a de facto nationwide blow to labor. ~8% of the "Democrats" in California voted for it, because they don't want to pay other people. They only care about shit that doesn't affect them or cost them. They also don't know how the multiplier (or economics) works. Idiots. They have degrees? Well, they might need to get another one. Of course, they aren't Sanders supporters, so their backstabbing shenanigans will go unpunished.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:36 pm 


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What a delicious meltdown.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:41 pm 


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Remember when we couldn't risk Bernie because Trump would call him a socialist?
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Two working class dudes, one black one white, just baked a tray of ten cookies together.

An oligarch walks in and grabs nine cookies for himself.

Then he says to the white dude "Watch out for that black dude, he wants a piece of your cookie!"


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 5:08 pm 


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Bernie Sanders's failure to be elected is truly a tragedy that will be examined and lamented by future generations. The best presidential candidate in decades who has consistently been on the right side of history fighting for a progressive push away from the status quo, and America tosses him aside twice due to political interference from parties putting forth some of the most uninspiring candidates with questionable historical legacies. When was the last time America had a presidential candidate who'd been seen fighting for civil rights and willing to be arrested over it? Sanders will be able to tell people he was right all along about a wide variety of issues such as how Trump would act after the election but it'll be little comfort to him saying that as he watches what's left of his country burns to ashes.

kitten wrote:
trump still "wins" this election


Yep, even if he officially loses, he will have won in the sense that he has created a massive cult of personality around himself that will forever be able to use his name to politically influence the nation thanks to a gullible and devoted Republican base that sees him as the second coming of Christ to fight the wicked, sinful "libs". Trump may well forever have their ears even if he is officially forced to slink out of politics. And he's forever a winner in the eyes of those who see Trump's only purpose as being to generate chaos and fuck things up for their amusement, to see "triggered libs" or whatever. Hardcore right wing anarchists, basically.
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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 5:33 pm 


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Steamflogger Boss wrote:
What a delicious meltdown.


The best advocates for democrats: republicans. The best advocates for republicans: democrats.

These are the kinds of people enthusiastic enough to participate in the primaries. When I went to vote for a gentler, managed apocalypse it was a ghost town at the station, just two old people ahead of me who felt it necessary to confirm their love of Trump in an uncontested primary.

Same kind of uncontested primary we will have for the ~16 or so years of Kamala Harris we're looking forward to, it doesn't really matter that they'll lose a general election once or twice in that timeframe she'll be the de-facto boot on the neck of humanity during this era.

"Don't get angry, VOTE!"


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 5:37 pm 


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BryanM wrote:
"Don't get angry, VOTE!"


General Strike.
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Two working class dudes, one black one white, just baked a tray of ten cookies together.

An oligarch walks in and grabs nine cookies for himself.

Then he says to the white dude "Watch out for that black dude, he wants a piece of your cookie!"


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 5:44 pm 


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No that would cost rich people money and you need to make rent or you'll die. Just vote for what condiments you'd like on your shit sandwich.

A lot of people think stuff like this is an expansion in who gets to be considered "white" for our national chauvinism demographic, but I personally think it's mostly just people giving the fuck up if not outright dying.

I was shocked to hear a few years ago from my ex that her brother and brother-in-law killed themselves. (Her father had given into meth addiction years before that.)

..The mass shootings and riots are only going to accelerate from here.


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 7:35 pm 


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Cultists are demanding access to ballots. Imagine volunteering your time as a counter and having a dozen lunatics screaming "STOP THE VOTE!" in your ears.

And Georgia judge throws out trump campaigns lawsuit: "no evidence"


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 Post subject: Re: Prelude to the Apocalypse
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2020 7:37 pm 


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