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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 8:11 pm 


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Ah okay I don't do that. You sure had loads of fun with Manus.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:25 pm 


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jesus, i wasn't expecting what happens when you
Spoiler: show
get the first death blow on guardian ape :shock:


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:41 pm 


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pretty sure DSP said something like
"where did he get the sword from!? "
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:08 pm 


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Game Over

Spoiler: show
I am so glad I learned to fight the bosses in this game on my own, especially Sword Saint. What a ridiculously fun fight with a little practice. I used my sword, ako's, parries, loaded umbrella, and mortal blade.

I posted about the Genichiro phase - double Ichi to cancel his mortal blade at the start. Be aggressive. He goes down fast.

Sword Saint 1 - Quick ako's at the start, rush him, trade, mikiri when he goes for the thrust. Charging? Get out of range or hide under the umbrella. Ichi? Count to two and side step. The Ashina Cross? He would sheathe and I would panic. And then I tried simply walking backwards. What a solution. Not only does he always miss you are at the perfect distance for max punish.

Stage 2 - I would stay just out of his initial swipe distance. Ako again and heal. And if time allowed I would run in and get one swipe with the MB. Rest of the fight is stay close and parry. Swiping at him only when your sure he doesn't have another follow up coming. Most notably it was after he would over extend himself on a strike with the spear. Mikiri counter his combo ender followed up with one swipe with the MB. Just one. Two results in pain for you but one if free.

Last phase is like the 2nd phase but honestly easier. Lightning is free posture damage and he gifted me three or four of them in a fairly quick succession. To be fair he killed me three or four times (including one cause I hit the home key on the 360 pad and it brought the menu up) as his final posture bar was almost full, but with each of those I knew I was close. In the end he probably took me close to 50 tries, so the bookend bosses killed me the most. The other being Lady Butterfly. Ape got me 20-30 times, and everyone else was less than that. Gyubou - that guy was free.

Watch ending. Profit.

Went back and killed Fountainhead Headless and moved on to NG+

At the start of NG+ I destroyed Genichiro:D Played a bit, not too bad. I have the charm right now, if it gets too easy I'll give it back. Not sure which ending I'm going to do just yet.

I haven't enjoyed a game this much in a long time, Bloodborne included and that isn't a knock on BB. The combat is just excellent, frantic, but not sloppy. It was also nice to not need a PHD to follow the story.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:05 am 


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Put about 10 - 15 hours into Demon's Souls over the weekend.

I did better than my first attempt a year ago, but I threw in the towel working on my fifth area (Valley of Defilement). I thought the level of BS couldn't get any worse after the first four areas, but nope. It did. Went about 30 minutes from the trek from the first boss archstone, through the swamp (what a tedious slog), dealt with some heavy hitting club dudes that for some reason by this point in the game still do half my health bar (and I do next to nothing to theirs), ran up some wooden planks only to be bombarded by multiple smaller club guys and mosquitoes that latched on to my neck, found a larger wooden structure with a fog door at the end, only to be noticed and chased by two or three big club dudes (plus smaller ones), and.. yeah. I died without reaching a checkpoint, said "fuck it", slowly opened up the PS3 Super Slim disc drawer, took out the disc, quietly snapped it in half and dumped it in the trash.

Dark Souls 1 and on aren't perfect by any means, but damn did they learn from many of Demon's Souls mistakes. Not to mention they respect the player's time at least a little bit more, making them infinitely more tolerable in solo play.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:43 am 


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I cried a single tear reading that.


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 6:55 am 


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Austin wrote:
dealt with some heavy hitting club dudes that for some reason by this point in the game still do half my health bar (and I do next to nothing to theirs), ran up some wooden planks only to be bombarded by multiple smaller club guys and mosquitoes that latched on to my neck,


Well there would've just been the one big club guy if you hadn't run up the wooden planks yet.

huh, what weapon were you using? How upgraded was it?

Rofl. can only laugh at this point.

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they respect the player's time at least a little bit more


blurgh
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:08 am 


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i don't get it. demon's souls is easier than any of the games which came after it, by far.


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:54 am 


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Blinge wrote:
Well there would've just been the one big club guy if you hadn't run up the wooden planks yet. huh, what weapon were you using? How upgraded was it? Rofl. can only laugh at this point.


I killed the first big guy before making my way up the higher planks. It was the structure at the end where multiples bombarded me. And just prior, up on the planks multiple smaller guys jumped down on me, so I said "screw it" and just went for a running strategy (which obviously backfired on me). Weapon was the basic longsword, +6. Treated me fine enough up through the previous four areas. I also upgraded a Uchigatana but wasn't using it because it weighed me down (no fast roll). No bow/arrows, no magic either, pretty basic play style (as I usually go for in these games).

Quote:
"they respect the player's time at least a little bit more"

blurgh


Hey, I said a little bit more. It's really not saying much as you all know and that doesn't go for every area in the other games either. That said, I am failing to think of many run-backs that are as annoying or tedious as many of them in DeS. Dark Souls non-Remastered's catacombs to the first bonfire in the Tomb of the Giants is one; Frigid Outskirts in DS2 is another.

Immryr wrote:
i don't get it. demon's souls is easier than any of the games which came after it, by far.


Perhaps when you really get to know every little detail about the game. On a first playthrough blind, it's nightmarish and punishing compared to the others.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 12:40 pm 


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i really don't think it is. i first played demon's souls after playing dark souls 1, 2 and bloodborne and found it considerably easier. especially the bosses. the run backs are a little longer, but it's not hard to just run past the enemies if that's what you want to do.

that whole shtick about 'respecting my time' is tedious too. it's like you're playing a video game and complaining about the game making you play it and interact with its systems. or like you think a games job is to allow you, the player, to pass from start to finish with as little friction as possible. i definitely second blinge's blurgh to this.


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:30 pm 


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I tried Demon's after finishing 1 and 2, poss before 3 and BB, and I definitely found it harder both to play, and easier to loose huge chunks of progress. I gave up, but it still niggles at me. I hadn't a clue what all the tendency stuff was about either.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:34 pm 


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frozen outskirts doesn't respect anything, the whole area is pure dogshit
summoned the max amount of npc phantoms and let them beat it for me including the boss, never again


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:54 pm 


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Necronopticous wrote:
I cried a single tear reading that.


RIP DISC (assuming that wasn't a joke).

Immryr wrote:
i don't get it. demon's souls is easier than any of the games which came after it, by far.


Exactly.

I've beat it 3 times, it's so good. Everyone has different standards but I finally got my buddy who I knew would love it to play the game and he had this to say: "I just spent 5 minutes killing a giant dude with arrows only to learn he wasn't a boss, just some giant dude. How can I say no to more of that?"

Which could read like sarcasm, but it's not. It's probably going to end up his favorite gen 7 game.

Blinge wrote:
Austin wrote:

Quote:
they respect the player's time at least a little bit more


blurgh


The classic From hater cry is something I didn't expect to read on shmups farm in 2020 that's for sure. :wink:

Immryr wrote:
that whole shtick about 'respecting my time' is tedious too. it's like you're playing a video game and complaining about the game making you play it and interact with its systems. or like you think a games job is to allow you, the player, to pass from start to finish with as little friction as possible. i definitely second blinge's blurgh to this.


There has been a discussion about this in the things that annoy you thread. But basically Randorama nailed the current attitude of many people (not saying Austin is this way) which is I paid for this, so I should be able to get exactly what I want out of it without expending any effort. Most video games these days barely have any way to lose real progress, so I barely feel like I did anything when I'm done. I enjoyed Uncharted 4, I really did, but it's like watching a movie. Good god, I'm having flashbacks to the Sekiro needs an easy mode articles.

Bananamatic wrote:
frozen outskirts doesn't respect anything, the whole area is pure dogshit
summoned the max amount of npc phantoms and let them beat it for me including the boss, never again


Wow the fucking bitch talk in this thread lately. :evil:
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:28 pm 


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Steamflogger Boss wrote:
Good god, I'm having flashbacks to the Sekiro needs an easy mode articles.


Haha. What a load of horse shit. Also I should read some of those for a good laugh. It takes two things to finish any game made by FS - time and effort.

NG+ run -

Spoiler: show
Started, went through and killed Gyubou (2 - 0 against him now:). Headed to Hirata. Killed Juzou 1 v 1 without a stealth DB, parries, and I think I used cross as my combat skill. Might have used the fire raven thing once for kicks. Lady Butterfly killed me once (I forgot about the homing butterfiles...again), but I got her the 2nd time.

Went to castle and beat the snot out of Genichiro. Headed down and fought Sashimi (this time in a fog wall) and then doubled back and killed Lone Shadow. Fought him head on, no plunging DB this time. I used the purple ninja in the Ashina dojo to learn these guys since he was right near an idol.

Headed to the depths and killed Snake Eyes. Stopped as I reached the valley. Going to play through the stages in a more sensible order this time rather then bounce back and forth. After I kill false monk I think I'll do Senpou and then Sunken Valley. Want to do purification this time.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:40 pm 


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I got mad at the gargoyles in DS and literally threw my disc in the trash. But then a few minutes later I got it out and tackled those bad boys. But to break it? For shame!


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 9:27 pm 


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i'm confused stevens. how do you
Spoiler: show
get to the shichimen warrior without killing the lone shadow?


as for my own lazy progress update:

Spoiler: show
i just killed o rin and found the phantom monk.


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 9:31 pm 


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Immryr wrote:
i'm confused stevens. how do you
Spoiler: show
get to the shichimen warrior without killing the lone shadow?

Spoiler: show
There is an easily-missable side path in the Abandoned Dungeon. In order to access the Ashina Depths you must either kill the Shichimen Warrior or the Lone Shadow.


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 9:46 pm 


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But
Spoiler: show
lone shadow blocks the way to the dungeon, no? there is a fog gate there. is there another way in that i've completely missed?


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:08 pm 


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What Necro said.

There is another way into the dungeon that you missed:D
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:10 pm 


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Steamflogger Boss wrote:

Wow the fucking bitch talk in this thread lately. :evil:


Yeah but the Frigid Outskirts bit is legit.

I've spent more time than anybody should in horsefuck valley, i should know..
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 1:48 am 


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It's some shit, but it's plenty doable on your own.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:20 am 


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just because you can doesn't mean you should


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:43 am 


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drauch wrote:
I got mad at the gargoyles in DS and literally threw my disc in the trash. But then a few minutes later I got it out and tackled those bad boys. But to break it? For shame!


That's similar the how DS1 made me feel when I first played it. I'd delete it off the hard drive and then start re-downloading it like an hour later. :lol: For all the salt it was generating that alone is proof it was doing something very right.

DeS is actually the first game I completed in the series and I found it to be the easiest of them. It's actually my favorite of all of them, tendency was a really interesting idea that made the world feel very mysterious. I really hope DeS remaster happens.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:09 am 


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drauch wrote:
I got mad at the gargoyles in DS and literally threw my disc in the trash. But then a few minutes later I got it out and tackled those bad boys. But to break it? For shame!


The sequel's version of that fight was the first time I realised they'd dialled up the bullshit quota just to be obnoxious. Still some outstanding areas though.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 4:14 pm 


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Marc wrote:
drauch wrote:
I got mad at the gargoyles in DS and literally threw my disc in the trash. But then a few minutes later I got it out and tackled those bad boys. But to break it? For shame!


The sequel's version of that fight was the first time I realised they'd dialled up the bullshit quota just to be obnoxious. Still some outstanding areas though.


Pfft, the OG Gargoyles, DeS' Maneaters were much worse.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:26 pm 


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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzBIOCOvlgM
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:42 am 


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Steamflogger Boss wrote:
RIP DISC (assuming that wasn't a joke).


Definitely not! Honestly, it felt a bit liberating. I went on to play some Ghosts 'n Demons on PC (also a very difficult game) along with some shmups and was much happier in the process. Really, that's what counts.

Also, it helped that the game was sub-$15 when I bought it. If it was pricier I would have stopped myself.

Steamflogger Boss wrote:
I've beat it 3 times, it's so good. Everyone has different standards but I finally got my buddy who I knew would love it to play the game and he had this to say: "I just spent 5 minutes killing a giant dude with arrows only to learn he wasn't a boss, just some giant dude. How can I say no to more of that?" Which could read like sarcasm, but it's not. It's probably going to end up his favorite gen 7 game.


I mean, that's cool and all, but I suppose he could get the same effect out of playing any of the other Souls games where he could very much do the same thing. Plus, shooting a giant dude with arrows is pretty different from, say, avoiding the silver dragon's fire while dealing with multiple enemies on the runback to the Old King Allant, or spending 30 minutes lost in the caves of Stonefang Tunnel, only to end up at the Flamelurker and die before knowing the short[er] way to the fight, or dealing with the absurdly lengthy run down to the Old Hero from the Adjudicator archstone in the Shrine of Storms, getting whacked by rolling skeletons at a mile a minute while also getting rammed from behind by stingray projectiles (before finding out on his tenth time through that the Thief ring really helps there), or getting one-shot by the Dragon God, even though the Dragon God didn't actually hit you.. etc., etc.

Either way, I'd be curious to hear his thoughts when he finishes the game (if he does or has already done).

Steamflogger Boss wrote:
Immryr wrote:
that whole shtick about 'respecting my time' is tedious too. it's like you're playing a video game and complaining about the game making you play it and interact with its systems. or like you think a games job is to allow you, the player, to pass from start to finish with as little friction as possible. i definitely second blinge's blurgh to this.


There has been a discussion about this in the things that annoy you thread. But basically Randorama nailed the current attitude of many people (not saying Austin is this way) which is I paid for this, so I should be able to get exactly what I want out of it without expending any effort. Most video games these days barely have any way to lose real progress, so I barely feel like I did anything when I'm done. I enjoyed Uncharted 4, I really did, but it's like watching a movie. Good god, I'm having flashbacks to the Sekiro needs an easy mode articles.


I am most certainly not that way and I too laugh at those "easy mode" articles.

I typically loathe modern action games that want to do everything for me, or pad out the experience with unnecessary dialogue, or force me through tutorials I don't really need, or involve heavy amounts of meaningless platforming that isn't really platforming, but a series of events where I simply have to press "A" a bunch of times to succeed (Castlevania Lords of Shadow, I'm looking at you). I am all about actually playing the games. That's why I play games. The actual playing part is what is enjoyable to me. It's also a reason I typically enjoy older game experiences more than newer ones, and it's a big reason why the Souls games appeal to me.

However, when I am spending what feels like five minutes running back to the Maneaters and literally doing nothing but holding a stick forward in the process (save for the shitty encounter with the Mind Flayer on the stairs), I am no longer playing the game. Every Souls game is guilty of this, but I find it to be the absolute worst in Demon's Souls. Everyone has their limits, and for me at this moment in time, the runbacks in Demon's Souls push past my limit.

Maybe I'll go back to it in the future and baby step my way through it, abuse magic and arrows like everyone I watch seems to do, but I'm OK with staying away from it for a while. I've got tons of other games to play. Maybe when I come back around a remaster will be out, or maybe I'll do what some people do and fire it up in a PS3 emulator that supposedly runs it at 60fps, making it infinitely more playable in certain instances (re: Maneaters).

Steamflogger Boss wrote:
Bananamatic wrote:
frozen outskirts doesn't respect anything, the whole area is pure dogshit
summoned the max amount of npc phantoms and let them beat it for me including the boss, never again


Wow the fucking bitch talk in this thread lately. :evil:


To be fair, half the conversing that happens in the off-topic section is bitch talk in one form or another. :evil:
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:22 am 


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Austin wrote:
However, when I am spending what feels like five minutes running back to the Maneaters and literally doing nothing but holding a stick forward in the process (save for the shitty encounter with the Mind Flayer on the stairs), I am no longer playing the game. Every Souls game is guilty of this, but I find it to be the absolute worst in Demon's Souls. Everyone has their limits, and for me at this moment in time, the runbacks in Demon's Souls push past my limit.

runbacks all suck, they are barely ever difficult and do nothing but waste your time, thank god From realized it too and Sekiro basically removed them
though not as much as "hardcore" gamers who think games are a competition in who can eat more shit instead of having fun, if I wanted to eat shit on purpose I'd play a kaizo hack and laugh at how ridiculous it gets

reminds me of the monhun veterans who complain that world is too casual because it displays how much damage you or that you don't need to spend hours pointlessly gathering supplies
there is nothing "hardcore" about wasting hours on mundane shit with zero difficulty


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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:58 am 


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Steamflogger Boss wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzBIOCOvlgM


WHY ARE THERE UNDEAD.

is this actually a thing? I can't tell how much of this is real and how much is pisstake aaa the new internet.
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 Post subject: Re: From Software 'n such
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:08 am 


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The Maneaters runback sucks? Ok.. like, yes?
You don't just hold forward, silly! You have to hold circle for a bit too!

Still some runbacks are in the series are ait, you get good at them. They become more efficient, you dodge enemies better, or kill them more and more efficiently.

I wouldn't complain about the Old Hero runback because that boss is piss easy.. I don't think i've had to do the runback like ever.
Infact when I did my NG+7 Pure Black WT run (flex) if i died on that stage I'd just play the whole thing again because trying to evade skellies etc in that claustrophobic AF stage was a bad idea.

who cheeses what with magic and arrows?
You don't have to.
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