From Software 'n such

Anything from run & guns to modern RPGs, what else do you play?
User avatar
Immryr
Posts: 1422
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:17 pm

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Immryr »

moon president is a bit of a crappy boss. feels like they were definitely trying to go for an imposing, epic true last boss, as opposed to the "shell of its former self" gywn / demon's souls slug man, but the fight itself just seems to lack impact and imagination.

having said that, i really don't understand the complaint of "you just dodge his attacks then hit him", i mean......... ORLY? that's just how boss fights work. what would you want to happen other than you dodging his attacks then attacking when there's a gap?


blinge: i'm not sure why you seem to take it as a personal insult everytime someone finds something easy, or has some other problem with one of these games.

sumez: no, if you kill gherman then die to mp, you just have mp to kill when you respawn.
Last edited by Immryr on Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Blinge
Posts: 5369
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:05 pm
Location: Villa Straylight

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Blinge »

MP Has that bubble attack that might've been cool but I can't remember if it does much. It probably goes down before people see it.

Its AoE that wipes your health down to 1 or therabouts is really cool imo, I don't know if there's a limit to its range. It's cool because you're supposed to get back in and smack it to rally all/most of that health back. That's the 'easy if you know how' component to the boss I guess.
i'm not sure why you seem to take it as a personal insult everytime someone finds something easy, or has some other problem with one of these games.
et tu, immy?

Nah I've just heard the whole lmfao dank sulz isn't hard beat bed of chaos first try m8 too many times across the whole internet. It's often BS, or obnoxious bragging and i've committed the crime here of letting outside shmupsfarm annoyances inform my posting here.
That being said, as a screeching fanboy of the series I do get annoyed by some people's irreverence.

I feel the souls boss/area binary is thus: "2 easy fuck this" or "unfair, bullshit! artificial difficulty!"
It wears thin.

ps armored core sux
Image
1cc List - Youtube - You emptylock my heart
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Listen, my point wasn't to be condescending, "hurh hurh the game is easy I'm so good", which I tried to point out. My point was that, as proven by the video, I played horribly and stumbled through both fights (using the Bananamatic approved secret technique of spamming healing items), and still took them down in the first attempt in no time. I had to rewatch my video to even remember how the boss fights played out. If a game has a TLB, I kind of want it to be memorable.
Anyway, I'm not really complaining about the boss fight, I'm just pointing out that it's not really memorable, and it makes sense that you wouldn't realize it was meant to be a "TLB".
Immryr wrote:moon president is a bit of a crappy boss. feels like they were definitely trying to go for an imposing, epic true last boss, as opposed to the "shell of it's former self" gywn / demon's souls slug man, but the fight itself just seems to lack impact and imagination.
I absolutely loved demon's souls slug man!
Immryr wrote: having said that, i really don't understand the complaint of "you just dodge his attacks then hit him", i mean......... ORLY? that's just how boss fights work.
That really wasn't my complaint at all.

Btw, I just finished Nioh. And for all the things it does poorly compared to Souls/Borne (crazy repetition, few enemy types, padded missions, stupid loot system, etc), the boss fights here are definitely a highlight! There were only a couple I was able to take in one attempt, while most took me much much more than I'd care to count. But they were all designed in a way that I'd continue to get better at them, usually requiring very different tactics, and finally taking down each boss gives an incredible sense of accomplishment. The final boss here (last phase of a three part boss gauntlet) was definitely comparatively easy, but it was extremely memorable.
User avatar
Bananamatic
Posts: 3530
Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:21 pm

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Bananamatic »

rapoon wrote:that exacerbates their 'difficulty'; they just kill you in 1-2 hits.
to be honest that's 90% of the reason why these games are "hard"
Blinge wrote: I feel the souls boss/area binary is thus: "2 easy fuck this" or "unfair, bullshit! artificial difficulty!"
It wears thin.
because it is true
some random enemies aren't worth fighting at all because of how ridiculous they are (too much hp, infinite stamina, never staggering, killing you in 2 hits, being harder than bosses at times)
on the other you have the typical lazy bosses that do nothing, sit around half the time and have huge blind spots to hit them in
bloodborne dlc is a great example of the "too easy or too hard" thing
if you run from the enemies, it's piss easy
if you try to fight them, good luck

bloodborne did at least one thing right, making bosses drop less echoes so randoms are worth killing
except some very easy ones drop a ton of echoes (boars and shadows in the nightmare) and some are complete cancer and drop fuck all
if you make the random enemies so hard that running past them is the safest and easiest and most rewarding option by a massive margin, you fucked up somewhere

dks2 sotfs especially has ridiculous stuff going on
shrine of amana was fine in the original, was nerfed for no reason
iron keep is now so full of alonne knights that if you want to kill all of them before smelter demon, you need two weapons and a repair powder

here's a challenge for you: defend frigid outskirts design
you get ambushed in the middle of nowhere by 2 enemies that can 2 shot you, run all over the place so you can't keep them in sight at all times and can't run from them because they're too fast
I wouldn't call any boss in soulsborne unfair, but some random enemies are so bad that they are more of a parkour obstacle than something you are supposed to be fighting
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Nobody's defending any design in DS2.
Man I fret ever having to play that game again. Gotta try the scholar edition some time though.
User avatar
Immryr
Posts: 1422
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:17 pm

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Immryr »

Sumez wrote:
Immryr wrote:moon president is a bit of a crappy boss. feels like they were definitely trying to go for an imposing, epic true last boss, as opposed to the "shell of its former self" gywn / demon's souls slug man, but the fight itself just seems to lack impact and imagination.
I absolutely loved demon's souls slug man!
oh yeah, me too, my point was just that they clearly weren't going for that kind of lore/sad final boss fight here.
Sumez wrote:
Immryr wrote: having said that, i really don't understand the complaint of "you just dodge his attacks then hit him", i mean......... ORLY? that's just how boss fights work.
That really wasn't my complaint at all.
Sumez wrote: as the strategy, once again, was the same as pretty much any other boss in the game. Timed dodge and hit them from behind, rinse, repeat.
hmmm....
Last edited by Immryr on Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Immryr
Posts: 1422
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:17 pm

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Immryr »

Sumez wrote:Nobody's defending any design in DS2.
Man I fret ever having to play that game again. Gotta try the scholar edition some time though.
i'd say vanilla ds2 with the dlc is better than scholar.
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Yeah, but then I'd just have to play the same crap over again.
Immryr wrote: hmmm....
You're quoting me out of context man. I'm saying the Moon Presence really doesn't add anything memorable to the game, it's just there and similar to every other boss in how it fights. It even looks like 3 or 4 other bosses. I think most of the Souls games have perfect examples of other stuff you can do with boss fights in this format, but even within Bloodborne you have stuff like Rom, or The One Reborn.
User avatar
Immryr
Posts: 1422
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:17 pm

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Immryr »

Bananamatic wrote: bloodborne dlc is a great example of the "too easy or too hard" thing
if you run from the enemies, it's piss easy
if you try to fight them, good luck
this argument is pretty stupid if you ask me. firstly, in basically every action game ever, unless you are literally locked in a room until you kill the enemies, or it's a "kill x enemies to proceed" situation then running past all the enemies is easy.

if you want to just run past all the enemies, especially on a first playthrough, why even play the game. seems like you're more interested in just getting to the end of the game than actually playing it.
User avatar
Bananamatic
Posts: 3530
Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:21 pm

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Bananamatic »

Immryr wrote:
Bananamatic wrote: bloodborne dlc is a great example of the "too easy or too hard" thing
if you run from the enemies, it's piss easy
if you try to fight them, good luck
this argument is pretty stupid if you ask me. firstly, in basically every action game ever, unless you are literally locked in a room until you kill the enemies, or it's a "kill x enemies to proceed" situation then running past all the enemies is easy.

if you want to just run past all the enemies, especially on a first playthrough, why even play the game. seems like you're more interested in just getting to the end of the game than actually playing it.
why do dangerous stuff when the result isn't worth it and you don't have the time to spend a whole day trying to kill everything for no reward?
look at the unseen village in bloodborne, there's so much respawning crap to deal with (not to mention enemies with guns that do 75% of your health on NG) that "just run, don't try anything" is the first advice you get anywhere
and at the end you fight a boss that spends most of the time stunned on the ground rather than trying to kill you
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Maybe I just play too much like a pussy, but I enjoy that you can do both. The exploration aspect is a huge part of these games to me, and I like moving ahead one step at a time, checking out every nook and cranny, and trying to get a coherent overview of the world design. This requires me to take out every enemy on the way, which I think works well with how the game is designed (with enemies placed to ambush you, etc.).

However, once I know the area well, remember the enemy positions, and know where I'm going, I'm able to quickly rush past all of them, and fight only a few required ones, depending on what my current goal is. If I had to fight every enemy on my way as I'm making my way back to the boss fights, I'd very quickly be fatigued with the game (for the record, I actually did that when I first played both Demon's Souls and Dark Souls, I have no idea how I managed to carry on).
User avatar
Blinge
Posts: 5369
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:05 pm
Location: Villa Straylight

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Blinge »

Bananamatic wrote: why do dangerous stuff when the result isn't worth it and you don't have the time to spend a whole day trying to kill everything for no reward?
Gameplay itself is the reward.. but eh.
As you claim to be getting enjoyment from the game in your own way, I wouldn't say ur doin it wrong, especially as most of the game leaves you unchallenged.
But man, if someone said that to me out of context i would suggest playing something else.
It's not arcade game..

Well I'd say that's obvious Sumez, most people probably do 'the run' when they want to re-attempt a boss.
Personally I like to wipe an area out / kill everything at least once to feel like I've mastered it.
Not every playthrough, but certainly the first one and usually ng+

Edit: sorry I shat on Shadow Tower btw, Necron..
I did still enjoy the game more than not, and glad I got through it. Hopefully you have a better time. It has really cool atmosphere.
Image
1cc List - Youtube - You emptylock my heart
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Did we talk about Evergrace here, yet? It looks like a shitty cartoon Demon's Souls with robot boots. And the soundtrack is completely through the roof.

I want to play it.
User avatar
Necronopticous
Posts: 2121
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 8:50 pm
Location: Baltimore

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Necronopticous »

I bought Eternal Ring and Lost Kingdoms but I haven't picked up Evergrace yet.
User avatar
Blinge
Posts: 5369
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:05 pm
Location: Villa Straylight

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Blinge »

Haha man Evergrace has some of the worst voice acting I've ever heard, too.
And apparently attack strength based on the ps2's analog buttons EURGH!!

I've only given it a brief go myself, chose the girl but she doesn't even start with a weapon.

The question is, did bananamatic meet Ebrietas and Logarius? probably was super overlevelled for the latter.
that's quite fun to type actually. bananamatic bananamatic bananamatic
Image
1cc List - Youtube - You emptylock my heart
User avatar
Obscura
Posts: 1805
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:19 am

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Obscura »

Sumez wrote:And the soundtrack is completely through the roof.
That's one dank OST.
User avatar
Blinge
Posts: 5369
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:05 pm
Location: Villa Straylight

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Blinge »

BIL wrote:also ADVENTURE OF COOKIE N' CREAM.
...Need to get on this shit
Image
1cc List - Youtube - You emptylock my heart
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Waaaaait, why did no one tell me about Déraciné?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngQjvnqEOyA
User avatar
Marc
Posts: 3408
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:27 am
Location: Wigan, England.

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Marc »

Started Remastered. Swore I was done with From games, but received it as an early birthday gift.
For the first hour it was pretty much 'nope, had my fill, not doing this again'.
Then came a slowly dawning realisation of just how superior it is to the sequels (I'd argue they got worse as they went), realising I can tank properly again, and I'm back in it. Really wanted to try a magic build but that's just not where the fun is at for me. Played up the the gate for Capra, back at it later.
XBL & Switch: mjparker77 / PSN: BellyFullOfHell
User avatar
guigui
Posts: 2083
Joined: Mon May 26, 2008 1:02 pm
Location: France

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by guigui »

In BB again, just beat Margo's Wet Nurse, and the house is on fire. I did not submit to Gerhman, he attacked me, I boned out. Am I somehow really close to the end ?
Bravo jolie Ln, tu as trouvé : l'armée de l'air c'est là où on peut te tenir par la main.
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Pretty damn close yeah. If you have anything else you need to follow up on, go do it now. Lots of interesting and well hidden detours in this game.

If you haven't been to abandoned workshop, upper cathedral ward or the orphanage yet, you definitely need to go check them out (I think there's a path right from the lantern in catherdral ward)
User avatar
Immryr
Posts: 1422
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:17 pm

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Immryr »

or cainhurst, or the dlc, you might also want to do some chalice stuff, although they don't scale up in ng+ so it's fine to just continue that after beating new game.

yep go do all the other stuff before fighting gehrman.
User avatar
Necronopticous
Posts: 2121
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 8:50 pm
Location: Baltimore

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Necronopticous »

Going back a bit for some post King's Field III musings:

It's long! Considerably longer than the previous game. Much of the length is backtracking which can largely be avoided if you really know your way around the game, but hits you hard in a blind playthrough. As I mentioned before the triggers in the game are quite mysterious and arbitrary, so you're often not sure if you need to go around revisiting areas unless you start running out of obvious ways to proceed.

The new teleportation system was ultimately an aspect I ended up liking, but I still see it as more of a sidegrade to Melanat’s key & gate system simply because it exacerbates the backtracking problem even further when you're approaching the game for the first time. It's a great feeling to obtain the reconstructed Ichrius key later on, though--akin to the first time you beat Ornstein & Smough and retrieve the Lordvessel.

As for the individual areas, I actually don’t have a whole lot to say about most of them. I found them fairly basic. They were at least effective enough to each evoke a certain unique feel, but usually not quite large or interesting enough to do a whole lot beyond that.

Some highlights:

The EXP sword, Excellector, was a really interesting idea. Like most aspects of King's Field III I think they probably could have went a bit deeper with it. Playing blind I found it to be the best weapon at my disposal for the majority of the mid game once it reached level 2, and by quite a long shot later when it finally became fully powered. It wasn't until the very last stretch of the game that I switched over to Triple Fang & the Moonlight Sword. I didn't find any of the other unique weapons very useful at all which was disappointing, but I still somehow enjoyed collecting them all. As with the previous game, I think it has a lot to do with the fact that the item/equipment models are the best looking graphical assets in the game, and the way their existence is often weaved into various NPC dialogue.

Weirdly, I found the Ancient Battlefield/Training Area and Barracks to be the most well-designed levels in the entire game. They're the very first areas you go to after preparing around Quist. They are really the only content you get to do before getting your hands on the Pixy automap, so you have to internalize it as you go. The Silveria key mechanic is so well done. When you arrive at the entry gate in the Ancient Battlefield you will likely only have one key even though there are two to be found in Quist--one is guarded by a skeleton-in-a-box in a narrow room that is very tricky to snag before powering up a bit. If you played King's Field II you will automatically parse Silveria keys as surrogate rhombus keys because this first gate has a recess on both sides just like the rhombus doors in that game. It's not until the second gate that you'll notice that only one side has a recess, and placing a single Silveria key allows the door to open both ways, allowing you to backtrack & puzzle out how to take the key you used to open the entry gate along with you. If you find every key available to you in these two areas, including the aforementioned one in Quist, and puzzle out how to take them all with you, you will be rewarded with a powerful unique sword which, in turn, can be used in Quist to unlock yet another unique sword, both of which you've already learned lore about from NPC dialogue. Speaking of NPCs, I was pleasantly surprised to see what is essentially the first incarnation of the crestfallen knight in the Barracks. This guy ended up being my favorite character in the game. I liked all of his dialogue a lot, and thought it did a really good job of setting a dour tone early on. I liked the gravekeeper, too, and not just because he sells precious crystal flasks. If you pay close attention to when he repositions himself you can score a third unique sword. Just great stuff! I felt kind of spoiled by these zones right at the beginning of the game, and it made a lot of the following areas feel a little disappointing by comparison.

It took me a very long time to ever get a heal spell. I ended up doing the Cave of Shudom quite late since I couldn't figure out how to get over there. I kept thinking I was going to come out from behind somehow, and never imagined it would just be some second tier dialogue from a Ralugo NPC. This forced me to stick to consumables for quite some time. The fact that you get access to gold water so quickly in this game is a bit strange, but I guess it is counterbalanced somewhat by the fact that Crystal Flasks are much harder to come by early on. Still, it made the majority of the blue fountains feel worthless and uninteresting until they become telepoints with the Ichrius key.

More later!

Also: As with King's Field II, I decided to try to see what I could accomplish at level 1 in King's Field III shortly after finishing my initial playthrough. I had to abuse a few exploits, but I was actually able to explore most of the game at level 1. I obtained the power of all 4 elements, got most of the treasure keys, including the royal key, and thus the Triple Fang. I was able to obtain many powerful unique pieces of equipment, including two pieces of Promeus armor, and tons of other unique weapons. Unfortunately I could not complete the Ichrius Key since it requires a powered-up Excellector (which means gaining EXP/levels) but I was able to get the Ichrius Eye & Wings.
User avatar
Necronopticous
Posts: 2121
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 8:50 pm
Location: Baltimore

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Necronopticous »

Today my wife & I finished mapping & clearing out Fire World in Shadow Tower, and we've moved on to Water World. We haven't done too much there, yet, but we were able to take a plunge and do a quick shot down to the bottom reaches of the tower just for a peek at all of the remaining zones. This game is so fucking intriguing, you guys. It seems to be fairly divisive for fans of the King's Field series, but it's hitting all the right buttons for us. It's really a shame that the menus perform so poorly. If it were not for that cumbersome aspect, this would definitely approach perfection for me. We are going all out on these maps. Does anyone have any interest in me sharing these once we finish?
User avatar
Immryr
Posts: 1422
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:17 pm

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Immryr »

man, castle of regression from the evergrace ost is amazing. i'm gonna have to check this game out! i generally love the from soft games from that generation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUrP8_7bdVU
User avatar
Obiwanshinobi
Posts: 7463
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 1:14 am

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Obiwanshinobi »

BIL wrote:ADVENTURE OF COOKIE N' CREAM. I helped financed this gangsta shit. :wink:
AGETEC Cookie & Cream back text wrote:ANY MAN DIES WITH A CLEAN SWORD, I'LL RAPE HIS FUCKING CORPSE
One of the simply awesomest 2 player modes around as well.
The rear gate is closed down
The way out is cut off

Image
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Actual Cookie & Cream back text wrote:Love is optional
Immryr wrote:man, castle of regression from the evergrace ost is amazing. i'm gonna have to check this game out! i generally love the from soft games from that generation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUrP8_7bdVU
The soundtrack is incredible, and eccentric at a lack of better words. It was probably dumb of me to post the weirdest track on the entire OST, but I really do love it.
Check out this shit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7i7_LwrnDI4

Let's not forget the track that sounds like someone being raped though. I was expecting loud nigra at any moment.
User avatar
Squire Grooktook
Posts: 5969
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 2:39 am

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Squire Grooktook »

I've played through Bloodborne 3-4 times with 3-4 different builds, and the second half bosses still give me a hard time. I agree that it's not the hardest game in the series, but I think it finds a nice middle ground and might be the best balanced overall. It's also very, very fun to no-death run.

IMO, my ranking of the difficulty of the franchise would be:

Dark Souls 3 > Bloodborne == Dark Souls 1 > Demon's Souls

Haven't played Dark Souls 2.

All the games have a few rough spots, but Demon's Souls is the only game that I find comparatively easy. I think the meme bosses Flame Lurker and Man Eaters were the only major bosses I didn't beat blind / first try.
Bananamatic wrote: why do dangerous stuff when the result isn't worth it
Because this isn't a competitive shmup or fighter. Doing fun / silly shit like experimenting with off kilter builds for more challenge and replay value, or trying to speedkill bosses with tighter aggression for the fun of it is fine because it's not going to keep you off some leaderboard or lose you a tournament.

Every game in the series has an exploitative build or 3 that lets you take out all the bosses with 2 spells or a single combo, just watch speedruns. If you're going to take the ultra dogmatic competition mindset where you must seek out the most effective strategy at all times, then yes the whole series is trash. Just use magic or co op or one of the billion other exploits, or some shit.

-

I do agree though that I wish enemies were harder to run away from. Just putting in more ladders or doors (WITHOUT I-Frame opening sequences) to shank you on would probably fix that.

Generally when I no-death run the games, I impose a "kill everything from point a to point b" rule on myself. Again, not something that's "worth it". But it's fun and makes for a more exciting and more meaningful run.
Last edited by Squire Grooktook on Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
RegalSin wrote:Japan an almost perfect society always threatened by outsiders....................

Instead I am stuck in the America's where women rule with an iron crotch, and a man could get arrested for sitting behind a computer too long.
Aeon Zenith - My STG.
User avatar
Sumez
Posts: 8019
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Denmarku
Contact:

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Sumez »

Squire Grooktook wrote:I think the meme bosses Flame Lurker and Man Eaters were the only major bosses I didn't beat blind / first try.
Woot what the... first try, really? I mean, Demon's Souls doesn't have the hardest bosses aside from a few sticking out, but I recall having a lot of trouble with the game in general at the time. After all, nothing else like this existed at the time. Did you maybe play some of the Dark Souls games before starting Demon's?

I might need to get to replaying both Demon's and Souls in order to seriously compare, because the first games you play are always gonna feel harder, but in my memory, Dark Souls 3 is by far the easiest of the Souls series, though Bloodborne might be a tad easier. It just feels really hard when you first start out with it.

Dark Souls 2 is definitely the hardest game, but often not in a good way. Seriously, that ruin sentinels boss fight, what the hell?
User avatar
Squire Grooktook
Posts: 5969
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 2:39 am

Re: From Software 'n such

Post by Squire Grooktook »

Sumez wrote:
Squire Grooktook wrote:I think the meme bosses Flame Lurker and Man Eaters were the only major bosses I didn't beat blind / first try.
Woot what the... first try, really? I mean, Demon's Souls doesn't have the hardest bosses aside from a few sticking out, but I recall having a lot of trouble with the game in general at the time. After all, nothing else like this existed at the time. Did you maybe play some of the Dark Souls games before starting Demon's?

I might need to get to replaying both Demon's and Souls in order to seriously compare, because the first games you play are always gonna feel harder, but in my memory, Dark Souls 3 is by far the easiest of the Souls series, though Bloodborne might be a tad easier. It just feels really hard when you first start out with it.

Dark Souls 2 is definitely the hardest game, but often not in a good way. Seriously, that ruin sentinels boss fight, what the hell?
Yeah, my order for the series was:

Dark Souls 1 -> Bloodborne -> Demon's Souls -> Dark Souls 3

I do agree that experience with Souls playstyle helps a lot, and even then there's a lot of variance with difficulty that comes into play due to both the rpg elements and players general strengths and playstyles (every single person I've ever talked to has a different ranking for bosses and games difficulty wise). But that being said, I think Demon's Souls is objectively the easiest. It's almost shocking how much breathing room bosses give you in that game, if you come to it after Bloodborne or 3. Every time they knock you down or put some pressure on, they practically back off and wait for you to heal or get back into an advantageous position. Even Penetrator and False King feel laid-back in comparison to bosses later in the franchise.

Here's a more accurate list for how I did in Demon's Souls first playthrough:
Bosses I killed on the first try wrote: Phalanx
Tower Knight
Dragon God (I was warned about his gimmick beforehand)
Fool's Idol (was lucky to stumble onto the guy upstairs first while exploring, and killed him)
Old Monk (playing offline hue)
Dirty Colossus (Could count as cheese, I think I just ran away and threw fire bombs at him lol)
Maiden Astrea
Old Hero
Storm King
The Penetrator
False King Allant
True King Allant
Bosses that killed me wrote: Armored Spider (Didn't know how to deal with his flame breath attack at first)
Flame Lurker
Man Eater
Leachmonger
Adjudicator (walked into his room with 1 hp, died to tongue before I could even see him, wrecked him next encounter)
Anyway, having played it last, I think Dark Souls 3 is the hardest. It starts out as easy as Demon's Souls, but both normal enemies and bosses ramp up to be the most aggressive and least forgiving in the series by the end.

Dark Souls 1 is the opposite. Early game can be rough, especially if you're unfamilliar with the series, but even for a newcomer the second half can become unbalanced easily, and even beyond that some of the Lord Soul bosses are kind of poorly designed IMO (and I'm not just talking about everyone's favorite "puzzle" punching bag, Bed of Chaos). DLC is a great challenge though.

Bloodborne I think walks the best middleground of the series.
RegalSin wrote:Japan an almost perfect society always threatened by outsiders....................

Instead I am stuck in the America's where women rule with an iron crotch, and a man could get arrested for sitting behind a computer too long.
Aeon Zenith - My STG.
Post Reply