FALCOM Thread

[Pasokon Deacon]

I used a Joy2Key profile specifically to make it less stupidly impossible to play, but it was still not engaging. The dungeon crawling is really overly-simplistic, and the boss fights basically boil down to "kite it around and take a lot of pot-shots at it with Pipiro".

The boss fights aren't quite that dull, but they definitely don't vary like in the sequel and Falcom didn't use a retry system like the one they introduced in Ys Eternal. Bosses tend to get spongy anyway, so hoarding exchange food to level up harder can help. I like the dungeons despite their simplicity (each floor has some consistent and developed theme), and with better controls it'll be easier to combo and chain Arcanum supers.

It's obviously not a straight up Diablo clone, which is why I said only in a sense, but it's hard to deny that it plays and often looks like one. Saying it's not Falcom or less is a stretch, yeah, but when you look at their catalogue now it stands apart, because they haven't done anything similar since, or really before for that matter, with the closest thing being Brandish, but I'd say that gameplay stands on its own, and it still retains their kind of 'chibi' look, especially in the later PSP game. Dunno why you're not okay with that, but okay comparing it to Castlevania Unless it's just peeve, which then I get!

Well, notice how Castlevania's only one of the influences I brought up. I mainly react to anyone comparing this to Diablo because it's a peeve, but also because others have said it with more certainty, even when they don't know what Falcom developers actually played before making it. Key differences between the game comes from Xanadu Next's skillful combat and incentives to switch Guardians and passive items, as well as the unique weapon-skills system. The music and story tone diverge from expectations, and I'd more quickly compare this to Nox or Chinese/Korean ARPGs with multiple Western influences than just Diablo.

[Vanguard]

I love Xanadu Next myself. But yeah, it feels a bit removed from the rest of their catalog and more like a Diablo-clone in a sense, which is right up my alley. A lot more serious in both design and writing as well I'd say.

Is it a loot slot machine? Because that's a deal breaker.

[drauch]

I'd more quickly compare this to Nox or Chinese/Korean ARPGs with multiple Western influences than just Diablo.

I can see Nox, yeah, but I'm not too versed in anything out of China or Korea to be honest. What games did you have in mind? My interest is piqued.

I love Xanadu Next myself. But yeah, it feels a bit removed from the rest of their catalog and more like a Diablo-clone in a sense, which is right up my alley. A lot more serious in both design and writing as well I'd say.

Is it a loot slot machine? Because that's a deal breaker.

Nah nah, let's just forget I mentioned Diablo . It's very much its own game.

[WelshMegalodon]

While I'm always happy to see more Falcom localizations, the redone Zwei!! art is pretty lacking, at least in comparison to the original:

All these speed issues started when Falcom programmed Ys Eternal improperly, tying animation speeds to the CPU clock. That's why Dark Fact moves way too damn fast in Chronicles+ vs. Eternal on an old Pentium PC or in the PC-88 original.

If the original game was indeed paced with the read-write access speeds of the PC88's disc drives in mind, it seems appropriate for a remake to depend on the hardware in a similar manner. Not to mention that it was common practice at one time.

[Pasokon Deacon]

I'd be more willing to believe Falcom locked speed to the crystal for that reason if they hadn't hardcoded earlier and later games in that way or something similar. And read-write speeds have no analogue in games installed to a hard drive or SSD, which was more accessible to owners of Ys Eternal than players of the original Ys.

I can see Nox, yeah, but I'm not too versed in anything out of China or Korea to be honest. What games did you have in mind? My interest is piqued.

Admittedly I'm falling short on good examples I can name. The best place to start would be the Corum series, a trilogy of popular Korean ARPGs which might have circulated around enough for Falcom devs to notice while they were researching Korean games (like Rhapsody of Zephyr) to localize.

For a Japanese example, Falcom helped finished and release a real-time isometric CRPG started by a friendly company, Bothtec, called RINNE. Both RINNE and its Windows prequels (starting with Relics: Recur of Origin, a remake of a seminal 1986 PC-98 classic) have a bit of a Diablo influence, but they focus a lot more on your ability to possess other characters' bodies, role-play in those situations, and change the course of the story while exploring pre-designed dungeons. I forgot to mention how Xanadu Next's pre-made dungeons already make it a lot different from Diablo. The Relics games are still

[BulletMagnet]

Picked up Tokyo Xanadu EX yesterday and...at least in the early going I'm honestly pretty underwhelmed. Maybe the superficial similarities to Cold Steel are clouding my judgment to some degree, but it just feels clunky as all hell to me...I'm constantly wrestling with the camera, losing my lock-on seemingly at random, and getting caught in stalls galore. Is there some setting I ought to adjust, or does the thing get better "organically" as it goes on? I wasn't a huge fan of the combat in Zwei II either, but even that felt better than this, and at least that game has enough silly charm to take the edge off...if it hasn't clicked yet should I even bother?

[gameoverDude]

Trails of Cold Steel does start striking back hard when you're at the Old Schoolhouse's 5th floor boss,

Spoiler

Unsurtr. Be sure everyone has a freeze-resist accessory.

I had to rejig the quartz for this one. It took several tries, but I finally gave him a well-deserved good thrashing. When his HP hit 20,000 I had Rean, Laura, & Alisa throw down with S-Breaks. Crow took him out with a Grand Press. Beating this bastard was a joy.

Give Tokyo Xanadu a bit more of a chance. I've been impressed by it on Vita, and have preordered it on the PS4.

[Sumez]

Finally gotten started on Ys Origin, after waiting ten years for a console release! Damn, I'm glad to finally play this game, and it completely lives up to my expectations.

For some reason I had it lumped in with the "Seven" era of Ys games originally, but when my friend started playing the PC version some years back it dawned on my that this is a straight up follow-up to Felghana, the arguably best game of the series, and it really shows.

It's basically marrying Felghana with Ys 1 & 2, essentially my two (three) favourite titles of the series, and I'm loving all the nostalgic callbacks. I didn't recognise all of the bosses, but it's great to see new takes on them, most of them having really unique and creative designs, probably even better than Felghana's.
It has the awkward unique EXP and damage scaling of the two first games, reuses most of the same items, and ties directly into the story - crazy that it took them nearly 20 years to make a new game that is actually about Ys (and 10 more years for me to play it). Honestly, doing that feels way more canon than keeping Adol as the main character and changing everything else. I hope there will be more games doing the same in the future. Especially getting rid of a silent protagonist really helps with telling the story. You can tell this game was made around the same time as the first Trails game.

[Obscura]

Out of curiosity, which console version are you playing? Jenocres is apparently broken in some versions (he'll get stuck and decide to stop attacking).

[Sumez]

Yeah that happened to me, was kind of disappointed by that. Playing the PS4 version.

[KAI]

Sen no Kiseki IV ~The End of Saga~ has been announced

https://gematsu.com/2017/12/legend-hero ... 2018-japan (fucking spoiler images, beware)
Teaser Site
and I still haven't played the first game yet

In other news, Ao no Kiseki's fan translation is about to be finished! (currently at 95%)

[Sumez]

Still waiting for the bleedin' price drop on SC! Sony can't keep this up. I'm not gonna pay this much for a digital release

[Sumez]

Finished the third playthrough of Ys Origin. Glad to see an ending that ties more directly into the story of Ys 1 and 2, but the story wasn't really anywhere near as interesting as Hugo's and Yunica's. Gameplay wise, this playthrough doesn't offer a lot to separate it from Yunica's, so overall it's not as interesting.

Surprised that

Spoiler

Cain Fact is Darm, but then who the hell is Dark Fact? I was actually expecting to get that one cleared up, as it's probably the strangest thing about the original Ys.

In general though it feels nice to have some things cleared up about the obscure story points in the first two games which weren't really too bothered with actual plot.

[Mortificator]

The original Ys team left Falcom before the third game was released to form Quintet, and Ys sequels have been canabalizing the first duo's plot one way or another since. While I think Origin's story comes off well regardless, particularly Hugo's arc, there's clash with the original concept.

Spoiler

I can accept the insertion of Darklings, which were thought up for Ys IV. Writing Dalles as a Darkling who becomes a demon is iffier, considering he was immune to magic in Ys II due to being a pure-born demon, but OK. The twist at the end of Toal's route, however, is totally stupid. The tragedy of Ys was that its greatness and destruction had the same root, with the culture's decadence giving birth to the literal devil. That's ruined by having Darm really be this one old guy, and the whole thing being avoidable if he'd just died or been caught before carrying out his contrived scheme. No wonder you were surprised by that, since it was in no way evident in the original works.

As for Dark Fact, in Ys I he was largely a mystery, there to contrast Adol by showing the legend of Ys has motivated people to evil as well. Ys IV gave him a backstory where he was originally named Sieg Fact and has been around since the fall of Ys. The manual for the remake of Ys I gave him a different backstory tied to the ruined town at the mine's entrance; his parents knew enough about the "silver" there to try and stop the mining, and were killed by an angry mob, setting him off.

[Sumez]

Interesting points.

Despite being a huge fan of the Ys series, I don't really care enough about the plot to really take any stance on all of that. I thought Darm's identity worked pretty well, even if there wasn't any real reason for it. Honestly I don't really remember ANY story from any of the games aside from the original two. Even the ones I've played multiple times (such as 3, as well as Felghana) are a bit of a blur.

[Sumez]

So, right now I'm busy playing Ys VIII: Lacrimosa of Character who doesn't even show up until halfway through the game.

And coming straight off Origin (and with its partner in crime, Oath in Felghana, in mind), it feels like a huge disappointment. Not that it's particularly surprising, because basically it just follows the formular from Seven and Celceta, and does pretty much nothing to spruce it up, and I think it has basically all the same problems that I had with Celceta.

Extremely padded, full of pointless quests and collecting of resources, ridiculously simplistic party-based combat that apart from the fortunately included element of a few timed dodges, basically boils down to just spamming skills over and over again. Coming straight off the tight, well designed combat Origin that showcased all the best qualities of the series, it is baffling to me that Falcom insists on continuing with a formula that compromises all of those elements. Why does the series need to have multiple healing items, why do you need AI partners, and what happened to fun, creative and challenging boss fights?

My biggest issue, however, is the complete lack of a sense of adventure. Similarly to Celceta, every area I've been to so far boils down to some combination of forest, beach, plains and cave. Nothing fun and creative, hell, not even a traditional fire dungeon so far. All of Origin took place within the same tower and had way more variation, both in terms of level design and scenery. There seems to be a story brewing around the whole thing with Dana, so it might eventually redeem itself - but so far, several hours into the game, all that's been going on is scouring forests and beaches for shipwrecked survivors, to build a small community. It's charming, but do Falcom really think that's what people want from their highest budgeted Ys game so far?

I've seen several people claim this is the best game of the series. What gives?

[EmperorIng]

For what it's worth, I have heard exactly no one call Dana the best in the series!

[Strider77]

For what it's worth, I have heard exactly no one call Dana the best in the series!

I have... and from people who are not new to the series. It completely baffles me.

There seems to be a story brewing around the whole thing with Dana, so it might eventually redeem itself

It doesn't... it didn't to me anyway.

[Sumez]

Well, I knew it wouldn't be. But I've heard people raving about it, and I'm honestly and regrettably wondering why. I don't dislike the game, it just doesn't do a whole lot for me. If I weren't an Ys fan I probably wouldn't be playing it - but I've already seen a lot of people actually getting into the series because of the game.

There most be some strong draw that I'm missing. Should I have played on a higher difficulty? I started on Hard because I was hoping it would make the gameplay a bit more involving, but so far the game hasn't done anything to counteract my strategy of "mash skill attacks".

[soprano1]

I heard the same rave about Dana. Maybe you find it weak since, as you mentioned, it uses the same game mechanics as Seven and Celceta? I got tired of Seven after a while playing it, only the amazing music kept me going to at least see the story through.
To think this was the game that got me into Falcom games and the discovery of this forum back in 2012, ha ha ha.

[Mischief Maker]

Yeah, I got Ys Seven last September and kinda lost interest after the tree boss. Who's the moron who thought players should go through two regions of the game doubled-up on slash heroes before finally begrudgingly giving you a piercing hero at the start of the midgame? I found the music so-so compared to Felghana. I think I'll go back to Ys Origin and copy the music files from Felghana for the ultimate Ys experience.

I just wish there was a fix to Origin's crash before the final boss other than disabling movies. My playthrough I had finally beat the second-to-last boss which had been kicking my ass forever only to have the game crash before I had a chance to save. It enraged me so much I un-installed. But stepping back and comparing, Origin definitely is the best in the series for gameplay, with small but substantial improvements to Felghana while retaining its combination of simple controls with Devil May Cry difficulty.

[Sumez]

Maybe you find it weak since, as you mentioned, it uses the same game mechanics as Seven and Celceta?

Yes, but I also found that weak in Seven and Celceta. It's not fatigue, it's just uninspired from the get go.

[drunkninja24]

I loved Ys VIII personally, but at the same time, I also had no issue with Seven of Celceta. I liked the concept of being shipwrecked and simply trying to survive as opposed to being in a place specifically for some grand journey (though the grand journey does of course come to you lol) so the whole looking for survivors aspect of the early game didn't bother me. To me, it felt like a proper evolution of the series to more modern rpg standards, whether you view that as a positive or negative is I guess subjective and what you think the Ys series should be (though I actually started the series with Napishtim back in like 2008, have since played some version of most of the main series games). I enjoyed doing the various quests, and while its not an amazing story, I don't think the higher focus on narrative really hurt the game, and I still have no issue with seven-style combat or its derivatives.

I can understand why others may not like it, especially those who hold the Napishtim-Origin era in such high regard, and Felghana is still probably my favorite game in the series, but I had a great time my entire playthrough of VIII so *shrug*

[FinalBaton]

I loved Celceta.

I can't wait to try VIII. I have to first : get a PS4, so I can play the physical copy that's sitting on my shelf. lol

[Sumez]

I don't think the higher focus on narrative really hurt the game, and I still have no issue with seven-style combat or its derivatives.

Just to be clear, I don't mind that has a high focus on narrative. Even though it's not particularly good, I'll still swallow it all up, dig the characters, and find myself anxious to see what happens next.
However I don't see why you'd take the opportunity to make a grand RPG adventure, and squander it on several variations of nondescript caves in the same island. At least things got a little more interesting on the north side of the island which I just got to, but it still feels like a waste.

To me, it felt like a proper evolution of the series to more modern rpg standards, whether you view that as a positive or negative is I guess subjective and what you think the Ys series

I'm not sure what you mean. I'd like the series to be more modern, and I don't want to just play the same games over and over again. But I'm not sure what's "modern" about reducing combat to mindless mashing and completely removing memorable boss fights and locations.

[Strider77]

The combat system does blow.... so do the bosses. Spam over and over. Switching characters isn't even fun, it's more of a nuisance than anything else. While the music isn't bad, it doesn't hold a candle to past soundtracks from the series.

The visuals aren't bad though all things considered and I liked the fact the color contrast was so vivid.

[Sumez]

Yeah, wouldn't be Ys without it. If nothing else, I like the series for the consistent feel-good tone and fast pace.

I honestly think the soundtrack is a surprising highlight. It doesn't have amazing bangers like To Make The End of Battle or Valestein Castle, but it's much more varied than typical for the series. You wouldn't have found something like this in Ys 3:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfhpm9A7AoA

[Obscura]

I haven't played it yet, but "Deadly Temptation" is certainly up with the classics IMO: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h17_m1hJ2wg

[Sumez]

Gens D'armes also hits straight into that classic Ys vein of synth fueled not-quite-powermetal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDllGOPr-Vg
And this one sounds like it's taken directly from the PC Engine redbook audio version of Ys 1+2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6K4Ad5XCxlI

So the game definitely has those as well.

[Goompaolo9500]

Take me to the falcum!

Will this do?

This forum (like everything else) needs more Zappa fans.

FALCOM PUNCH!