Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari

[BIL]

(On that note, the guy got to Act 5 without dying... the fact that he was as adamant as he was about this game being unfair is puzzling.)

Act VI is the decisive test. Don't be lured into complacency.

Edmond's whole "unfair" shtick was a fig leaf for hurt feels. He felt the game owed him something for making it 95% of the way through. The game disagreed.

As said so many times here, NG1's Act VI stipulation is merciless, but it's not "unfair." It refuses to let players slum over the finish line. Is it morally right for a mere videogame to impose such a demand on its players, who have so generously decided to give it some of their precious time? Yeah I think so. Whiners fuck off.

FinalBaton's excellent no-death run has also proven an invaluable resource in this endeavor. I didn't even know it was possible to single wall jump in this game.

i would say BIL's run is probably the most informative because it contains quite a few mistakes and recoveries. it has the cadence of a good player taking a casual run through a favorite. this is by no means a stab at bil - he's said as much that it's a kusoplay, i believe - but rather a testament to its usefulness.

Actually, I've said it's not even worthy of the honorific kusoplay (ie, a lesser run by a skilled player). It's an aggressively unpolished, semi-cognisant run I banged out in literally twenty minutes, after several months away, in my drawers, with the sound off, while watching the news. I remember this specifically, because the point of the run wasn't to show dazzlingly refined play, or even put on an aesthetically pleasing performance, but to give a snapshot of the game's basic handling. Edmans' excuse of the day was "WAHHH, NG1 IS RELIANT ON BAD CONTROLS AND SHODDY COLLISION," and I knew one of my beloved rusty 1LCs would put paid to the scrubby libel. I 1LC this game to relax in my drawers at the end of long, boring days - I couldn't do that with something that handled anything less than marvelously! My feels are real!

(I also 1LC NG1, and CV1, to cleanse my hardcore sidescroller palate after extended exposure to bad/suspect controls! It took a solid week of both to bury Holy Diver from immediate memory! Ain't idle talk when I call these my gold standards )

Shockingly enough, Edmans instantly switched his tune from "CONTROLS BAD" to "BIL NOT GOOD AT GAME, MAKES MISTAKES, HAVE 2 ADMIT HE DIDN'T DIE THO" - neatly proving the point for me that there was no excuse for his failings, beyond his own bumbling, sloppy performance.

Spoiler

^ DAT GOTTA HOIT!

I've deliberately never updated the run for these reasons.

by the way, here's an interesting comment that was just linked to me, apparently translated straight from hideo yoshizawa, the director of the first ninja gaiden -

https://twitter.com/Zerochan/status/949396577491279872
he thinks the birds were unfair!

To be honest, I was expecting something about spawn points and was pleasantly surprised (having gone over the game with a fine-toothed comb in search of its mythical murderspawns).

I've often thought NG1 might be (possibly) improved if bird's third HP point was redistributed among the other enemies, to create a more even sense of tension. "Unfair" doesn't come anywhere near this, though... frankly if the birds were sprite-swapped with, I don't know, flying grim reapers that ate half your lifebar, I'd think it extreme but would just learn to be extra-careful while dispatching them or manipulating their familiar homing AI. (NB - I'm not saying this would be a good thing!)

[mycophobia]

putting some time into NG tonight. having some issues with doing that 5-2 jump with any kind of consistency but I managed so far to get to that point on one credit.

it really is a unique game with how it handles spawns and stuff. you can't really go super fast if you don't know what's coming up but any hesitation can be very deadly. I'm really enjoying it, stupid frustrating eagles and all.

e: btw are there any meaningful regional differences between Gaiden and Ryukenden on the first game?

[BIL]

e: btw are there any meaningful regional differences between Gaiden and Ryukenden on the first game?

Nope, none that I know of. Only differences are in the title screen, Act title cards and of course cutscene language.

[Durandal]

Uneven is the word that came to mind when I was thinking about the birds in NG1. Those damn birds primarily insta-kill me by knocking me into a pit, and then they also deal a great amount of damage on top of that compared to the miniscule damage output of most ground enemies I have an easier time avoiding? More like someone at Tecmo designed the birds with the idea of making an enemy players will remember for the rest of their (remaining) lives.

[kitten]

"Unfair" doesn't come anywhere near this, though...

the definition of "unfair" can range from as minor as "unkind" to as extreme as "unjust," and i'm definitely leaning on meaning much more the former. the game is a bit mean-spirited and uncompromising to learn with a few instances that will kill or compromise you without a little memorization & chipping.

hardly an issue after a certain amount of play, as those iron out and become things you can no longer complain about. can be a killer to the more casual players, though, and i don't think i necessarily fault them for it or the use of the term, given the context. there's a mountain of complaints against how the game plays that are certainly player soreness, though! i had some.

[BIL]

Uneven is the word that came to mind when I was thinking about the birds in NG1. Those damn birds primarily insta-kill me by knocking me into a pit, and then they also deal a great amount of damage on top of that compared to the miniscule damage output of most ground enemies I have an easier time avoiding? More like someone at Tecmo designed the birds with the idea of making an enemy players will remember for the rest of their (remaining) lives.

Birdy is probably my favourite NG1-2 enemy type, simply for regularly prompting the sort of "them or me" pointblank confrontations seen in the latter half of this gif...

Spoiler

...while at the same time having a ruthless but highly malleable AI/movement pattern. Sometimes I hop over him and jog on as he goes careening offscreen (adios birdy!) - other times I have an immediate further engagement and he steers his way back on-course with palpable murderous adrenaline (oh fuck, it's you again!). Still other times he ends up at 12/6o'clock and can't get his momentum going, flapping awkwardly while I get a few seconds to decide exactly what to do with him. Delightfully tactile dueling!

It's no coincidence my most beloved CV1 foe is his direct antecedent, the implacably homing Basement Ghost. Who technically isn't in CV1's basement, but gets reassigned there in Vampire Killer, and the name is catchy so I retroactively applied it.

NG3's helibots play a roughly similar role, but in the game's slower, heavier context it's not quite the same thing.

the definition of "unfair" can range from as minor as "unkind" to as extreme as "unjust," and i'm definitely leaning on meaning much more the former. the game is a bit mean-spirited and uncompromising to learn with a few instances that will kill or compromise you without a little memorization & chipping.

Aha - I lean hard towards the latter definition. Ninja Spirit's 7-2 ninja pit is something I consider categorically unfair - the player is forced into a binary guessing game they cannot hope to win on anything but blind luck (or painstaking rote playback). There's no flex or subtlety, in fact it's not even a contest - if you pressed left or right at the wrong invisible prompt, you're dead.

It's through this lens that I don't consider NG1's birds very notable. They're mean buggers, but they're never in a position to terminate your run pending the one true response. I would put Contra III (Hard)'s st3-1 snipers closer to unfairness - if you don't know they're there in advance, their brutal shot speed+frequency combined with the stage's awkward footing and the game's fixed jump height is going to kill you fast.

It comes down to wriggle room, imo. If a first-time player can at least stall or retreat, I'm generally okay with it (those snipers would be a lot less terminal if you could at least scroll them offscreen once they're revealed). If it's some unstoppable instakill steamroller / falling piano I'll be either perturbed or quickly turned off, depending on the frequency that it appears and the character of the surrounding game (it's a testament to Ninja Spirit's world-beating quality that it can survive such a brutal 11th-hour pratfall).

[kitten]

It's through this lens that I don't consider NG1's birds very notable. They're mean buggers, but they're never in a position to terminate your run pending the one true response. I would put Contra III (Hard)'s st3 snipers closer to unfairness - if you don't know they're there in advance, their brutal shot speed+frequency combined with the stage's awkward footing and the game's fixed jump height is going to kill you fast.

i did have one spawn out of the floor on my recent run, but even then, i don't think i'd consider this unfair by your definition. i had time to react and promptly took it. it's definitely mean as heck, though, haha.

i actually mostly like the birds as enemies, too! but i think their damage value is a bit high and that there are one or two whose position is too cruel for my taste.

[FinalBaton]

Good trick for birdies is that : if they arrive from slightly below you or even at the same height as you (but not above nor directly from under you), you can kneel down and they will always arrive at your feet and lineup neatly with your sword's hitbox. You'll notice that they automatically lower themselves right as you kneel down, and thus they'll never dive on your skull now. It's a surefire way to get them to lineup with your swordslash.

That's a 100% safe way to dispatch them.

You can also play with this : if they arrive full throttle from above, then duck down under it, face down the other way while still crouching and wait for the sucker to line up.



Even when they arrive from directly under you, you can dance around and make them arrive right where you want them to. Control the birdos. Don't let them control you.

RYU HAYABUSA : FALCONER BY TRADE!

Come to papa, you beautiful bird !


Also for a bit of exta fun(but requires quite precise timing) : for those which you know will come from above and that you've got no pit behind you : jump slash the shit out of them

POOR BIRDO NEVER SAW IT COMING

Spoiler

[BIL]

i did have one spawn out of the floor on my recent run, but even then, i don't think i'd consider this unfair by your definition. i had time to react and promptly took it. it's definitely mean as heck, though, haha.

That whole sequence is probably the game's most comically mean-spirited. The flappy is stuck at 6 o'clock, moving with uncharacteristic difficulty... but the dozy ledge guarder is inadvertently preventing a leisurely hop-over, and if you panic and bail for the safe ground to the right, hilarity ensues:

Spoiler

None of it is aimed to outright kill (WTF is the leftmost hunchback even doing?), but it certainly feels that way with the presence of a hellish yawning pit. I can give 'em a pass for it being an 11th-hour snare, and more importantly a decidedly farcical one. Like the designers are just out of frame, chucking popcorn at the screen.

[kitten]

if you panic and bail for the safe ground to the right, hilarity ensues:

i am well familiar with this T_T lol

- - - - - -

so, i suggested rock boshers dx to people in the thread a few days ago: limited run still has a few copies of their very small print run available for both ps4 and vita, but they'll probably be gone in less than 24 hours. fine time to pick up a copy! this is one of my favorite games and it's very hard to describe its appeal accurately - it's a series of single-screen, top-down shooter levels with different objectives that i found very addicting to shave seconds off of for better & better runs. it's very well-designed and i would genuinely go as far as to call it excellent. perhaps the most oddball and otherwise uncelebrated thing i'll vouch for being that good.

also! one of my anticipated b-day gifts later today is going to be data east arcade classics, so i'm looking forward to giving crude buster a shot sometime in the near future. will be a good indicator of how bad i want the console version, i presume. also going to be getting a few other fun things like mutant apocalypse!

also also! does anyone here have experience with dragon view? i picked this up, today, after an ebay seller immediately accepted my lowball offer and am really rather curious to sink my teeth in and find out if it's a satisfying beat 'em up underneath all the strange RPG stuff. i also grabbed the original drakkhen, too, though lord knows how quickly i might be repulsed (i'm sure there's a small chance of being mystified by its weirdness, too).

[BIL]

also! one of my anticipated b-day gifts later today is going to be data east arcade classics, so i'm looking forward to giving crude buster a shot sometime in the near future. will be a good indicator of how bad i want the console version, i presume.

It may not be - the MD version plays very differently from the AC one, to the point it's less of a straight port and more a FC Contra-style rebuild. Via Skye:

Interesting to hear a direct AC/MD comparison - the one thing I could've swore I remembered from my brief time with the former was the jumpkick not behaving the same (no multi-hit, IIRC). That and "WHATTA DAY," of course!

Spent a very brief time with it, but some things are immediately clear:

- Jump kick is non-controllable (ala Castlevania/Makaimura); This means no multi-hit, like you said. The jump itself will also make your character accelerate forward a bit, making it a bit awkward.
- Movement is slower, and most importantly, grabbing enemies is quite a bit slower as well, losing the more fluid "quick-grab-toss" aspect of the MD port.
- You can't throw the small stick (the one that can be used for beatings); both attack and grab buttons will swing it instead.
- The barrels will not go down the the ground plane, if thrown from the upper plane -- they will just roll along the ground.

That's what I can think of right now, but if you try it for a bit after being used to the MD port, then you'll immediately notice it's not nearly as good.

One thing I noticed with the AC version is that while it lacks the brief enemy invulnerability time of the MD version, it's also possible for the enemies to hit you multiple times.

Ah that's right, forgot that, good call.
Again, one of those cases where the port is better than the original.

[Vanguard]

Apologies for the giant multiquote post. Thread's been moving fast.

Maybe I'm playing it wrong, but to me Holy Diver has a constant stop-and-go design, mostly credited to evasive enemies taking multiple hits, putting it in a completely opposite end of the spectrum compared to Ninja Gaiden, with Castlevania being somewhere in the middle (but definitely closer to NG).

That aspect of the game is probably more off-putting to me than the control issues or the brutal difficulty.

Yeah, the game is full of strong enemies to duel rather than redshirts to plow through. Might be more of that Zelda 2 influence showing itself. It only really ever bothered me against the moshes in stage 3 and their metal blade counterparts in stage 4. The others are all varied, worthwhile, and generally they can be taken down quickly with aggressive play.

Yeah, still honestly don't even know what TAS entails usually, besides incompetent play that miraculously beats the game without taking damage. Like, doesn't having assistance via a tool kinda, uh... defeat the purpose? Never understood why so many goobs are all about it, especially with speedrunning.

Was watching some 1cc beat 'em up replays recently and kept noticing how cornball the playstyle was, and it was always the user SCHLAUCHI. Also the Dragon Blaze guy, it looks! Guess he's the king of WoL, according to my quick google search. No wonder he's everywhere! *swoon* What a hero!

A TAS is just a video where someone uses emulator features like save states, slowdown, etc. to enhance their gameplay. I think they can be pretty interesting and fun to watch, and making a quality TAS is a skill unto itself. As BIL said, TASers also tend to be quite good at unearthing fine details about how a game works.

To my knowledge, World of Longplays doesn't claim their TAS videos are genuine gameplay. I actually like them for when I want a quick look at what a game is about. Don't use them for strategy ideas though! It'd be nice if they made it more clear that their videos were tool assisted. More importantly, it'd be nice if the general gaming public knew that both the executions and the tactics in TAS videos are generally not viable for human players. We've all seen those comments - "That looks impossible!" "No human could do that!" You're right, no human could win with that strategy! There may well be people who saw that Dragon Blaze TAS mentioned earlier, saw the superhuman skill needed to pull off those dodges, and were turned off from ever trying the game. That, to me, is much worse than a bad player fraudulently claiming to be good.

I'm not super well-versed in CIII, but how often are extra lives granted?

ya that cut is definite evidence of cheating. if you beat a boss and get an extend b/c of its death you'll see it before the cut to the score tally. there's no magical 1ups in the twilight between the screen fade :B

god, it's so pathetic!!!

That's just how Contra 3 displays your lives. The stage display doesn't count your current life but the clear screen does.

Looks like we found out who the real frauds are.

But I record not so much to demonstrate any ability of my own, but to give a preview of the game; the sort I'll seek out when trying to determine if something is for me or not.

This is more or less my mindset. I won't lie and say I don't like to show off or be praised, but in the end someone for looking the most skillful videos possible could do a lot better than mine. Ideally I try to make something that's enjoyable to watch, looks enjoyable to play, and also looks achievable by an ordinary person with a bit of effort. That's why I haven't deleted that abysmal Ninja Gaiden 2 video yet. It shows part of the game's nature. You really can be that clumsy and still 1CC.

also also! does anyone here have experience with dragon view? i picked this up, today, after an ebay seller immediately accepted my lowball offer and am really rather curious to sink my teeth in and find out if it's a satisfying beat 'em up underneath all the strange RPG stuff. i also grabbed the original drakkhen, too, though lord knows how quickly i might be repulsed (i'm sure there's a small chance of being mystified by its weirdness, too).

I've played through that. It was more than a year ago, but the thing that I remember best is that I thought the first person 3d overworld felt cool and mysterious. The dungeons and combat are more than a little bit repetitive and had gotten pretty tedious by the end. I keep a list of games I clear each year along with a completely subjective grade. I gave Dragon View a C.

What I've seen of Drakkhen doesn't look terribly fun to play, but I like its overflowing strangeness. To anyone who doesn't know Drakkhen, look at these encounters! The visuals, audio, and concept there all combine to form something I find genuinely unsettling. There's other weirdness for the sake of weirdness like this. I don't know if I'd play Drakkhen even if it did look fun. It might spoil the mystery and make the weirdness mundane!

[Sumez]

I've often thought NG1 might be (possibly) improved if bird's third HP point was redistributed among the other enemies, to create a more even sense of tension. "Unfair" doesn't come anywhere near this, though... frankly if the birds were sprite-swapped with, I don't know, flying grim reapers that ate half your lifebar, I'd think it extreme but would just learn to be extra-careful while dispatching them or manipulating their familiar homing AI. (NB - I'm not saying this would be a good thing!)

I've always thought this - people "hate" the birds in NG not because they do a lot of damage, but because they don't expect birds to do that.
They did fix that in Ninja Gaiden 3.

[Sumez]

I was extremely intrigued by Drakkhen and picked it up some years ago on the same whim as you guys - but yeah, it's almost unplayable. I kind of want to see it through though.

[__SKYe]

also! one of my anticipated b-day gifts later today is going to be data east arcade classics, so i'm looking forward to giving crude buster a shot sometime in the near future. will be a good indicator of how bad i want the console version, i presume.

It may not be - the MD version plays very differently from the AC one, to the point it's less of a straight port and more a FC Contra-style rebuild. Via Skye:

I played the Arcade version a few more credits, and it is surpassed in every way by the MD port, except for in the audio department (those voice samples are positively awesome ).

Here are a few more differences:

- The jump kick actually hits multiple times, but only in the direction you jump; but since the knockback that even the weakest enemies receive is so small, you may just end up getting hurt as well.
- As BrianC posted before, you have no i-frames on knockdown. This means it is very possible that after getting knocked down close to either any of the bosses, or the stronger enemies (including the spandex bruisers, which pick you up and throw you) will result in you getting annihilated.
- I also said before that the grabs are noticeably slower than in the MD port, but there's more: you cannot grab an item on the upper plane (the up+jump & release jump and grab). You won't even jump higher like in the MD port. Definitely one of the worse differences, as the grabbing mechanic is essential for the fun of the game. The grabs also seems somewhat imprecise (ie. not like in the MD port, where they are spot on).
- Besides barrels thrown in the upper plane not falling to the lower one, some items are explosive and will hurt you too, should you be close when they get thrown (some barrels, burning cars, etc).
- The yellow spandex bruisers and the long-arm enemy will now switch planes to where you are (in the MD port they never jumped).
- No health-regaining Cola between or within stages (there is a cutscene here your character drinks one -- a Budweiser in the JP version).

The bosses (at least to where I played (ie. 3rd boss/Rhino) are also harder as a result, because approaching and grabbing them is much harder than it should. The Scythe guy will destroy you if you get close, as he has a massive close quarters range, and there's only half of the available upper plane compared to the MD port (which is imperative for a no-damage fight against him).
The Rhino is somewhat more stupid here, in that you can hit him out of his charge (whether he has the big horn or not) by crouch+sweeping (there a bit of timing involved, but still). Amusingly enough, if he throws you into the sky, and you fall on him on your way down, he'll take damage as well.

There are also differences in the enemy formation: you'll occasionally fight an helicopter that spits out enemies (similar to FC's Contra 2's 1st boss) and can be destroyed piece by piece, and a few hoverbike enemies as well.

Also uncool, is that you can no longer (or barely, I couldn't do it even once) grab the S&M dudes out of the air, as your air-grab sucks.
The only ones that still remain cool as ever, are the flamethrower dudes.

To sum it up, not really worth playing through, especially after you've tried the MD port. Or if you do play it through, please do give the MD port a go because it is much better executed.

[kitten]

Looks like we found out who the real frauds are.

fuck!!!!!!! *shrivels underneath this post and leaves nothing but my dumbass tennis shoes behind*

I've played through that. It was more than a year ago, but the thing that I remember best is that I thought the first person 3d overworld felt cool and mysterious. The dungeons and combat are more than a little bit repetitive and had gotten pretty tedious by the end. I keep a list of games I clear each year along with a completely subjective grade. I gave Dragon View a C.

yeah, i'm worried i'll end up considering it mediocre and the combat will eventually become a slog, too (rpg mechanics have a tendency to do this to most action). this was my realistic expectation upon buying it, but it's such a weird mash-up that i had to try it for myself.

been considering playing this once my copy of zoku gets here so i can get some back-to-back absurd genre mashup.

- - - - - - - - - -

also, thank you, bil and skye for the reminder and the information! i'll keep this in mind as i play it.

[drauch]

That Contra picture has successfully made me lose it three times now. Bravo!

[Stevens]

More Kunio.

Its grabbed me much like Alien Syndrome did - blazingly short, action filled stages on a timer. I'm enjoying my time with Kunio and want to see how far I can go - but does anyone have any suggestions for similar games? The bold, huge, (he he) words are important though. Something about being on the clock. And before anyone suggest it - not Ghosts or Ghouls. Love them, but have played a bunch of both, particularly Ghouls:D

Played a bit last night, take the last photo I posted and increase the score by about 2,000 points. I'll get to the fourth loop yet.

Some things I've noticed:

- After you down a boss the timer continues to run. If it hits zero before the stage end sequence kicks in you time out This happened to me right before I reached loop three for the first time.

- Addendum to the above - You can kill the boss and then still be downed yourself if one of the mooks has started his stabbing animation (I say they're stun guns). This has happened to me several times. This can probable happen on any stage, but will most likely only happen on the 4th due to the 1 hit kills.

- Accidental grabs on stage four can quickly cost you. Grabbing should be avoided at all costs unless the other enemies are off screen (not hard to do) and the boss is above/below you.

I find it funny that poor Hiroshi keeps getting beat up by, well everyone. He is either really unlucky or a giant dick.

[FinalBaton]

Speaking of the World of Longplays channel on Youtube :

I'd advise people to not watch uploads by player Valis77 (or sometimes known as ValisHD) so as to not put money in his pockets. He contributed to a good chunk of longplays on that channel. The guy is reportedly a pedo. Lots of dodgy stuff... that's too much to ignore at this point.

https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/ValisHD



On a lesser level : He also moderates Anita Sarkeesian chats and is a big supporter of that scammer and her Feminist Frequencies vehicle.


Let's steer away from this scum

[Stevens]

Played some Kung Fu Master today as I make my way through the onslaught of 80's arcade goodness. Was able to reach my best of 2-4, but not passed it.

[BIL]

It's a hell of a stretch, as the game itself is decidedly marmitey love/hate, but have you played Sanvein (PS1), Stevens? Despite its floaty controls and sometimes dodgy camera, it's a game I recall instantly when the subject of time-trialling action comes up. Basically a topdown shooter in a series of small, baddy-packed rooms. Time runs out, you dead. Get hit = less time = you dead. The only recourse is FUCKIN KILL EM ALL STAT. Advance across map to boss and, yes, kill him too.

The presentation's yet another layer of love/hate - it's deliberately, maniacally repetitive in a way that I can't get enough of, particularly combined with the eccentrically bangin' techno soundtrack. Others may simply find it annoying. Anyway, it's one I like recommending... seems to either delight or appall. With traditionally tight topdown 2D, I think it'd be a firm cult favourite - still worth a look imo.

To Escape From Our Utopia... (ENTERING OUTER WARDS)

There's undoubtedly better stuff I'm forgetting or just not aware of. >_< For now I'll also mention Final Fight CD, specifically its exclusive Time Attack mode - total arcade crack, both solo and in pairs (whether you're cooperating or being absolute pricks to one another)! It's not quite the same "under the gun" deal as Kunio's stages, but the simple compulsion of chasing your best score is undeniable.

[mycophobia]

One-lifed it to 5-1 just now, credit ended in 5-3 thanks to jetpack shuriken dudes. Game really stops fuckin around there; respawn hell is in full force

[BIL]

Try grabbing the Jumpslash from the end of 5-2's first floor, and holding onto it until the jetpackers - it'll hugely simplify things. Jumpslash isn't quite the panacea it may seem, but it's absolutely made for mowing through jetpackers and their loitering projectiles. (the game specifically provides you with one, for those enemies' final stand in the first of 6-2's many chokepoints)

[WelshMegalodon]

One-lifed it to 5-1 just now, credit ended in 5-3 thanks to jetpack shuriken dudes. Game really stops fuckin around there; respawn hell is in full force

Right now I can semi-regularly one-life to 4-3. Looking forward to it!

Skipping the firewheel in 2-2 is probably the most helpful thing I learned from FinalBaton's run.

[FinalBaton]

Right now I can semi-regularly one-life to 4-3. Looking forward to it!

Skipping the firewheel in 2-2 is probably the most helpful thing I learned from FinalBaton's run.

Good catch

It's much more handy to have the shuriken to dispatch the cross -throwing ghoul that's on the next screen!

[Mortificator]

More Kunio.

Its grabbed me much like Alien Syndrome did - blazingly short, action filled stages on a timer. I'm enjoying my time with Kunio and want to see how far I can go - but does anyone have any suggestions for similar games? The bold, huge, (he he) words are important though. Something about being on the clock. And before anyone suggest it - not Ghosts or Ghouls. Love them, but have played a bunch of both, particularly Ghouls:D

Played a bit last night, take the last photo I posted and increase the score by about 2,000 points. I'll get to the fourth loop yet.

Some things I've noticed:

- After you down a boss the timer continues to run. If it hits zero before the stage end sequence kicks in you time out This happened to me right before I reached loop three for the first time.

- Addendum to the above - You can kill the boss and then still be downed yourself if one of the mooks has started his stabbing animation (I say they're stun guns). This has happened to me several times. This can probable happen on any stage, but will most likely only happen on the 4th due to the 1 hit kills.

- Accidental grabs on stage four can quickly cost you. Grabbing should be avoided at all costs unless the other enemies are off screen (not hard to do) and the boss is above/below you.

I find it funny that poor Hiroshi keeps getting beat up by, well everyone. He is either really unlucky or a giant dick.

I really like this game too. It's tremendous that the start of the belt-scrolling brawler genre, while short and ugly, got the essence of one-against-many so well.

If you can tolerate control lag, you might like Venture. 12 short rooms you have to clear fast before an unkillable monster shows up.

Going back to Technos games, the sleeping dragon unexpectedly awoke in me and I replayed Return of Double Dragon, a game I didn't enjoy much the first time around. There's some interesting stuff there, but it's disappointing how incomplete even the Japanese version is. Enemies are passive enough that they can usually be avoided by simply moving up and down, giving you plenty of time to charge your devastating whirlwind kick. Block & parry just isn't worth it. The punch also outshines the almost-superfluous standing kick.

[BrianC]

Going back to Technos games, the sleeping dragon unexpectedly awoke in me and I replayed Return of Double Dragon, a game I didn't enjoy much the first time around. There's some interesting stuff there, but it's disappointing how incomplete even the Japanese version is. Enemies are passive enough that they can usually be avoided by simply moving up and down, giving you plenty of time to charge your devastating whirlwind kick. Block & parry just isn't worth it. The punch also outshines the almost-superfluous standing kick.

There's also the non working conveyors and the glass elevators that look like can be broken, but can't.

I should get the CV out and play some Venture. Fun game.

[mycophobia]

I reached Malth and uhhh. I'm dumbfounded. guess I'll have to watch a replay cuz I have absolutely no idea what to do

e: oh.

Spoiler

I guess I can just run up to him and slash him until he's dead. lol

[Sumez]

Just tank and mash. No one plays that fight seriously.

[mycophobia]

yeah just as you posted that I saw it on skye's no subweapon replay. I guess that's why they give you a full lifebar. what a weird boss