Whiskey: The Awesome Thread

[jepjepjep]

I just started to play Yakuza 0 and that inspired me to try my first Japanese whisky, the Hakushu 12. It's really excellent; sweet, complex, a little spicy and slightly smokey. I'm really enjoying it!

[Randorama]

GP: After 5 years of Sweden, GZ (near HK) is a dramatic change. Actually, it is not that warm (5 C at night and no heating, during the short winter), but my last year in SVE (GB, specifically) featured snow in May and a few -10 to -15 C days during the winter. The problem is that I grew to love those days ("grew back": I remain a redneck from the mountains).

The good thing is that here there are whisky-only, very luxurious shops: one is two minutes from here, by walking. They are aimed at the noveaux riches who need to display their wealth as arrogantly as possible, but have decent prices.

I am probably going this afternoon or tomorrow to have a look, and possibly buy some Talisker, which remains a favourite of mine. If I could find some Venchi (Italian, very bitter brand) chocolate, it would also be great (well, and a decent import shop for chocolate).

[GaijinPunch]

GP: After 5 years of Sweden, GZ (near HK) is a dramatic change. Actually, it is not that warm (5 C at night and no heating, during the short winter), but my last year in SVE (GB, specifically) featured snow in May and a few -10 to -15 C days during the winter. The problem is that I grew to love those days ("grew back": I remain a redneck from the mountains).

The good thing is that here there are whisky-only, very luxurious shops: one is two minutes from here, by walking. They are aimed at the noveaux riches who need to display their wealth as arrogantly as possible, but have decent prices.

That sounds pretty dope! I work w/ a few people from there, actually. Never been to China. Perhaps one day.

I am probably going this afternoon or tomorrow to have a look, and possibly buy some Talisker, which remains a favourite of mine. If I could find some Venchi (Italian, very bitter brand) chocolate, it would also be great (well, and a decent import shop for chocolate).

Oh, you'd hate my house this week. Due to the weather the delivery is delayed, but I have 6 bottles incoming. If I order them from the UK, delivered to my door, they wind up about $25 a bottle cheaper than if I walked to the discount mart here in Chicago. That one is marketed at about 2x the cost here in the US than it is in Asia or Europe.

[GaijinPunch]

I just started to play Yakuza 0 and that inspired me to try my first Japanese whisky, the Hakushu 12. It's really excellent; sweet, complex, a little spicy and slightly smokey. I'm really enjoying it!

Don't get too attached (or go buy a lot). It's out of production.

[jepjepjep]

Thanks for the tip GP. I'm still able to find it locally for now. It seems to be marked up only a little ($85). Yamazaki on the other hand seems to be only available at extortion prices (~$200 ).

Part of the reason I've been reluctant to branch out into Japanese whisky is that they seem to be pretty high priced and hard to find. I'd love to stock up on the Hakushu, but it's tough to justify the cost when there are some nice scotches available for less. The Dalwhinnie 15 is one of my favorites and it can be found at $50, same for Macallan 12 or Glendronach 12.

I've yet to try the Laga16 that you guys talk so highly about, maybe that's the next one for me. How would you describe it compared to the Laphroig 10?

[GaijinPunch]

Thanks for the tip GP. I'm still able to find it locally for now. It seems to be marked up only a little ($85). Yamazaki on the other hand seems to be only available at extortion prices (~$200 ).

Which state might you be in? You may be able to do mail order. $200 is too much for Yamazaki 12... $85 is fair for Hakushu 12 I feel. I get it in Illinois for $80 which is baffling. I have seen one place with it in Cali for $63, but they have tons of shit on the cheap.

Part of the reason I've been reluctant to branch out into Japanese whisky is that they seem to be pretty high priced and hard to find. I'd love to stock up on the Hakushu, but it's tough to justify the cost when there are some nice scotches available for less. The Dalwhinnie 15 is one of my favorites and it can be found at $50, same for Macallan 12 or Glendronach 12.

This is a very valid argument. Ironically, the same holds true in Japan! Before the single malts halted, in Japan, I felt the J-whiskies were priced properly. If you went to a discount shop, Yamazaki 12 / Hakushu 12 were 6000 yen. Yoichi 15 was, I want to say, 12,000 (but available for 5500 duty free). Yamazaki 18 I believe a bit more. Their costs in the states went way up once people realized the quality and the distributors added in the exotic factor (Taketsuru for $60? It's 2000 yen in Japan). At that point, it was hard to justify regularly drinking them as you could get equivalent scotch a tad cheaper. Now the disparity is even higher.

Also, now that the single malts are done, we have cheaper whiskies (Toki, Iwai, Akashi) that are of course, about half the price in Japan as they are here. They're fine at their Japanese price point, but Akashi for $40 versus Laphroaig for $45? Easy call. It's definitely hard to justify most J-whiskey at this point.

Now, the weird part - Scotch is dirt cheap in Japan, so even there, why buy no age statement Yoichi/Miyagiko/Yamazaki/Hakushu for 4500 yen when you can get any number of superior scotch's for less?

I've yet to try the Laga16 that you guys talk so highly about, maybe that's the next one for me. How would you describe it compared to the Laphroig 10?

Smoother. Definitely not as in your face. Maybe slightly smokier but less peat. I'm really not articulate w/ this shit... but if it's good enough for Ron Swanson, it's good enough for you.
Maybe not good enough for pussies that drink gin & tonic. It's also not for people who like blends. God damn that show was amazing.

[jepjepjep]

I'm in the Los Angeles area. Which place in Cali are you thinking of? It's a shame that Japan is moving away from age-statement whisky.

Smoother. Definitely not as in your face. Maybe slightly smokier but less peat. I'm really not articulate w/ this shit... but if it's good enough for Ron Swanson, it's good enough for you.
Maybe not good enough for pussies that drink gin & tonic. It's also not for people who like blends. God damn that show was amazing.

I haven't seen the show, but that Ron Swanson character is hilarious. I think Laga16 might be pushed to the top of the list.

[Randorama]

That sounds pretty dope! I work w/ a few people from there, actually. Never been to China. Perhaps one day.

There...GZ? Or CHN? It is an interesting change, and a welcome one career-wise (100% research with teaching as a paid extra). I will need to be very careful (...because Academia: everywhere is the same crap), but all I can say is that BJ (...the capital) is far away, so the atmosphere is different (political and environmental: air is relatively clean). The great thing is that there is a simple way for me to move any taxes I pay here towards my EU retirement fund.

Oh, you'd hate my house this week. Due to the weather the delivery is delayed, but I have 6 bottles incoming. If I order them from the UK, delivered to my door, they wind up about $25 a bottle cheaper than if I walked to the discount mart here in Chicago. That one is marketed at about 2x the cost here in the US than it is in Asia or Europe.

I believe that someone is not doing their homework when it comes to marketing/pricing, in IL: 25$ per bottle is out of whack, but I guess that people prefer going out and buying it locally (bah!). I definitely hate you, but I defended myself by studying the prices at the aforementioned whiskey shop. They have a massive offer and really cute girls who speak English and are well-prepared in offering an overview of the whiskeys

[GaijinPunch]

I'm in the Los Angeles area. Which place in Cali are you thinking of? It's a shame that Japan is moving away from age-statement whisky.

Their site is down now but K&L Wines can be your new go-to. They have great prices, and deliver if you can't make it to West Hollywood. Bigger presence in the Bay Area, but delivery on a few bottles is basically the same as 1, and still leaps and bounds cheaper than Illinois.

I haven't seen the show, but that Ron Swanson character is hilarious. I think Laga16 might be pushed to the top of the list.

He's a fucking scream... he's as picky about everything as he is his whiskey. The bowling statement is a favorite of mine.

There...GZ? Or CHN?

Both, actually.

It is an interesting change, and a welcome one career-wise (100% research with teaching as a paid extra). I will need to be very careful (...because Academia: everywhere is the same crap),

I met someone here in Academia, and her stories made me realize it is something I would never, ever do. Jesus christ... sounds like a few of her colleagues didn't graduate high school. I recall something about someone she had a relationship with (like 5 years prior) being on her tenure review board.

I believe that someone is not doing their homework when it comes to marketing/pricing, in IL: 25$ per bottle is out of whack,

It's worse than that. Basically it's just American marketing, and then some Illinois over taxation on top. Even in other states, Talisker is usually $70 a bottle, and here it's often $80. (The link I told jepjepjep about is about as cheap as it gets in the US, ad $50 a bottle). In Japan or Europe, it can go between $30-$35 USD. So, if I get 6 from Master of Malt for like $32 USD each (no VAT) and then shipping is like $21 a bottle, it's actually the cheapest. Still a far cry rom walking into Seijo Ishi and paying 3500 yen, but I'll live.

really cute girls who speak English and are well-prepared in offering an overview of the whiskey

Worth the dough.

In all seriousness, most places I've found in the states, will have one or two things priced better than anyone, and the rest sucks. K&L is about the only exception, where I can pretty much assume I don't have to research the prices. In Illinois we have a shop called Binny's which is a chain, and usually when stuff goes on sale I can get it for the California standard price. They're definitely the best game in town, but I always check to see and if the price disparage is more than like 15% of California, I just wait for my next trip.

[GaijinPunch]

Okay, so back on direct topic, I came across a great deal on Caol Ila 18... what I thought was their standard 18 year peated whiskey. When I got my hands on it, it was the unpeated which is actually a good 10GBP more usually. I figured why the fuck not, and kept the two bottles. The lady and I had a tickle last night, with a 1/2 oz pour each. Holy shit... very impressed. No peat, slightly salty... a tinge of smoke but it's the smoothness it has going for it. Superb. I'd have a hard time buying it at it's usual price, but I got this south of a hundred each after tax/shipping/all that shit. I'm chalking it up to a nice mistake, as I'm not sure I'd have knowingly splurged on an unpeated version of something that is "comparable to Lagavulin & Ardbeg".

For the record, I got this:


But thought I was getting this:


So one day I'll need to find the 18 year old regular release, but I can probably wait until I find a good deal.

[jepjepjep]

K&L has been on my radar. I've not been in person yet but they do seem to be cheaper than everyone else and have a great selection. So far, I've been paying a few bucks extra to avoid driving to Hollywood.

That Caol Ila looks awesome man, enjoy!

[GaijinPunch]

If you can stomach a few bottles at a time shipping is not that bad. Probably $20 for 6. I also think they have Hakushu for $63 if you become a member.

[jepjepjep]

I was actually planning on heading down there to buy the Hakushu on Friday. I had been eying it earlier in the week and it was $70 there at the time , but unfortunately they sold out. I wonder if they’ll get a restock or if it’s gone for good?

[GaijinPunch]

I was actually planning on heading down there to buy the Hakushu on Friday. I had been eying it earlier in the week and it was $70 there at the time , but unfortunately they sold out. I wonder if they’ll get a restock or if it’s gone for good?

Ouch, that sucks. (Yeah, $68.99, and it's indeed out of stock). I would give them a call and see. At this point though, it really is just a matter of time before the stock is gone, and then it's non-aged, which I feel are vastly over priced in the states. If you look at the Yoichi non-aged on Amazon Japan, a lot of the recent reviews say "too expensive" (in light of their line up and price changes), giving it 2 and 3 star reviews. Note that it's like 4000 yen there. Not looked at Yamazaki or Hakushu yet but I suspect something similar.

[jepjepjep]

Haha, yeah life is cruel isn't it? It's too bad that the quality has dropped in recent years moving to the non-aged. I can't imagine the popularity keeping up if this is the direction they're taking. Buying Japanese whisky seems like buying shmup PCBs, if only we could go back in time...

Speaking of non-scotch, before picking up the Hakashu, I was curious about Irish whiskey so I've been enjoying this bottle of Redbreast. It has a little different flavor to any scotch that I've tried, but it's very good too. Any of you guys enjoy good Irish whiskey?

[GaijinPunch]

Haha, yeah life is cruel isn't it? It's too bad that the quality has dropped in recent years moving to the non-aged. I can't imagine the popularity keeping up if this is the direction they're taking. Buying Japanese whisky seems like buying shmup PCBs, if only we could go back in time...

Yeah, but the difference being there are cheaper and equally as good alternatives. I agree with you... they will lose their luster if they don't re-introduce their aged line, me thinks. Who knows though.

Any of you guys enjoy good Irish whiskey?

At this point I am avoiding Irish mainly out of spite. Not sure where he got his data from, but a very dear friend told me in a text, "Good thing you're into Irish whiskey and not that Scottish crap"... and I think he got that after I said something about a Scotch. Confused... so, gonna be stubborn and not even bother.

[jepjepjep]

a very dear friend told me in a text, "Good thing you're into Irish whiskey and not that Scottish crap"

[Randorama]

I met someone here in Academia, and her stories made me realize it is something I would never, ever do.

All rumours are true (omni rumores sunt veritates), as the saying goes. After this cycle (up to 3 years) I could qualify for a professorship, and then jump ship to corporate research (google, microsoft, anyone interested in computational applications), or corporate teaching (Education First, for instance). What I know is that as long as I work in EU or in countries with the opportune agreements, I can get a pension. Italy is excellent for retired people with decent money, so I could even go back by 67 or so. Only 30 years to go...

It's worse than that. Basically it's just American marketing, and then some Illinois over taxation on top.

Yes, I was imagining this...I definitely would import.

Re: Caol Ila. I agree that this one can compare to Lagavulin and Ardberg, though I am wondering if I would like the no peat version. I have really become partial to peatiness and more than a tinge of smoke, while getting old.

Re: shop. Their prices are not too cheap but not too steep: they must import, and their typical clients clearly earn a lot. They have English-speaking staff trained appropriately, and mentioned that they wanted to start a weekly tasting session. The main owner/investor fell in love with whiskey while studying in Edinburgh, so he is committed to promoting the culture behind it, and not just the booze. Also, he likes pure chocolate. There is hope, I guess?

In the meanwhile, I bought a bottle of Talisker Storm, which must be a new name for the traditional recipe or something. I feel safer, now

[GaijinPunch]

Italy is excellent for retired people with decent money, so I could even go back by 67 or so. Only 30 years to go...

Save me a spot. I'm pretty sure I wont' retire in the US... and we may have to get married so I can get a visa.

Re: Caol Ila. I agree that this one can compare to Lagavulin and Ardberg, though I am wondering if I would like the no peat version. I have really become partial to peatiness and more than a tinge of smoke, while getting old.

Definitely with you on this... but this was pretty amazing. And now the GF is developing a taste for the expensive stuff... (damn).

[Randorama]

re: retirement. Oh dear, we have plenty of time, so we can plan when when the time is due. The waifu and I also married only because it makes getting VISAs simple

re: business. I have a simple question about ice. I generally dislike ice in drinks, and especially in spirits. Still, I am wondering if I could try using some when drinking (I Have a Yamazaki and a Talisker bottle). Should I educate myself on how to prepare ice, before doing so?

Speaking of education...I have a colleague working in Ireland who always forced me to try Irish whiskeys when visiting, usually tasting some rather obscure brands. I never disliked them, but what should I know, to understand them better? I know that I tend to like smoky, rich whiskeys (and peatiness, eh!).

By the way:

Three years ago (time flies!) I went to the Ardberg restaurant in Gamla Stan, Stockholm. Picture Stockholm's old town during the long dark night of winter, with snow-laden alleys and a biting cold...

I enjoyed choice of Ardberg's best choices at a special price, plus dinner based on game meat and berry sauces. It was irrationally expensive even on discount (1500 SEK per person), but the quality was simply astounding. I would say that anyone who has time and money should visit the place.

A bit off-topic, but on the same winter I also visited Yasuragi, possibly the only Japanese onsen outside Japan (near Stockholm), and had a chance to enjoy sake and Mackmyra after dinner. For a whiskey that was basically invented yesterday, it is quite nice and strong (I tried a very smoky version). Their story is also amusing

[Stevens]

re: business. I have a simple question about ice. I generally dislike ice in drinks, and especially in spirits. Still, I am wondering if I could try using some when drinking (I Have a Yamazaki and a Talisker bottle). Should I educate myself on how to prepare ice, before doing so?

I don't boil the water or anything but I do have one of those giant cube trays. If I want it cold but neat whiskey stones do the trick.

[GaijinPunch]

re: retirement. Oh dear, we have plenty of time, so we can plan when when the time is due. The waifu and I also married only because it makes getting VISAs simple

Only reason to do it these days.

re: business. I have a simple question about ice. I generally dislike ice in drinks, and especially in spirits. Still, I am wondering if I could try using some when drinking (I Have a Yamazaki and a Talisker bottle). Should I educate myself on how to prepare ice, before doing so?

I go both ways on this (badump tsssh). Lately I've gotten the spherical ice ball maker, but then again, I'm usually drinking with mates, or while watching some television. So, I'm sure I'm "not doing it right". But, just like w/ everything, it's your preference. Honestly I don't mind doing a "small rock" every now and again which I'm sure is WAY wrong. If I'm at home enjoying a dram while doing something else, I may not get to it in time, and w/ a single cube or two, I feel it's not ruined. For the record I have Yamazaki and Talisker both this way. As the price approaches $100USD for a bottle I tend to think I should go straight.

Three years ago (time flies!) I went to the Ardberg restaurant in Gamla Stan, Stockholm. Picture Stockholm's old town during the long dark night of winter, with snow-laden alleys and a biting cold...

I enjoyed choice of Ardberg's best choices at a special price, plus dinner based on game meat and berry sauces. It was irrationally expensive even on discount (1500 SEK per person), but the quality was simply astounding. I would say that anyone who has time and money should visit the place.

This sounds worthwhile. Still never been to Sweden, or anywhere even remotely Nordic for that matter. One day, for sure... just waiting for Sven666 to kick his kids out of their room for a week to make it more affordable. If you and the waifu ever make it to Tokyo, definitely try The Helmsdale. No brand loyalty, so no well thought out layout, but I dare say they're gonna have a ton of shit you won't find elsewhere.

[jepjepjep]

Regarding ice:

I don’t pretend to be an expert, but I have done a lot of reading and watching youtube videos on whisky in order to educate myself. According to two of the largest YouTube whisky reviewers, shame on you for using ice in a single malt scotch!

Actually, the reason to avoid ice is twofold, first it dilutes the whisky as the ice melts, secondly some of the complex flavors are subdued when the temperature is too low.

Best practice is to drink out of a tulip-type glass or glencairn so that the aromas are focused on your nose, avoid ice but add a few drops of water. One or two drops of water is supposed to chemically release some of the complex aromas. If it is high APV, then more water is suggested to taste. Essentially a higher APV provides stronger, richer flavors, at the expense of higher alcohol smells, and drying effects (the hydrophilic nature of alcohol essentially strips the water/saliva on your tongue and mouth), so it’s a very personal thing.

Having said that, the most important caveat is that as long as you’re enjoying yourself, you’re doing it the right way!

[Stevens]

Best practice is to drink out of a tulip-type glass or glencairn so that the aromas are focused on your nose, avoid ice but add a few drops of water. One or two drops of water is supposed to chemically release some of the complex aromas.

I have a few tulip glasses from several whiskey tastings I have gone to, but didn't know the water thing. Going to try it next time. Thanks.

[jepjepjep]

I have a few tulip glasses from several whiskey tastings I have gone to, but didn't know the water thing. Going to try it next time. Thanks.

Cheers, Stevens! Here’s a cool video on the subject that’s worth a watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajqd62fE73E

Speaking of education...I have a colleague working in Ireland who always forced me to try Irish whiskeys when visiting, usually tasting some rather obscure brands. I never disliked them, but what should I know, to understand them better? I know that I tend to like smoky, rich whiskeys (and peatiness, eh!).

Aside from common, cheap stuff like Jameson’s, there seems to be far fewer high quality Irish whiskeys than Scotch. I’ve tried two, personally that have been very good. The above mentioned Redbreast 12 cask strength is delicious. It has a very rich flavor, but it is more fruity and nutty, and a little spicy from the oak. There is little to no peat in it, so it’s very different from the smokey Islay-style scotches. I’ve also tried a Teelings brothers in arms single malt: it’s a combination of a 14 year bourbon matured and a 21 year Sherry matured single malt. Also a very good whiskey with a unique sweet, fruity, nutty flavor. They’re both worth a try if you have an opportunity.

[Stevens]

Cheers, Stevens! Here’s a cool video on the subject that’s worth a watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajqd62fE73E

Likewise sir.

It was a very informative watch. I subscribed to his channel.

Also, 'presuming bourbon speak is allowed here as well, I'm opening the bottle of double oaked woodford the Mrs. got me tonight. I am greatly looking forward to it.

[rtw]

Cheers, Stevens! Here’s a cool video on the subject that’s worth a watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajqd62fE73E

Thank you very much. Fun fact, I actually studied in Glasgow back in the day and walked past that area nearly every day

[jepjepjep]

That’s very cool, rtw . I’d love the opportunity to visit Scotland someday.

[rtw]

That’s very cool, rtw . I’d love the opportunity to visit Scotland someday.

I studied there for 4 years, brilliant experience.

When we were going out we'd go to the Maltman where our barkeep John would serve us this weeks selection of malts.

He would never serve us more than 3-4 different single malts before he said that our senses were so dulled that he could just serve us Bell's

[jepjepjep]

That sounds like an amazing experience, rtw! During my college years, it was Corona with lime and Newcastle. I've only recently been introduced to scotch and nice whisky.

Speaking of which, I was able to taste some Yamazaki 12. Truly excellent stuff! It seems more similar to traditional scotch than say, the Hakashu, which seems very unique. The Yamazaki reminds me quite a bit of Dalwhinnie 15, which is one of my favorites.

Also, 'presuming bourbon speak is allowed here as well, I'm opening the bottle of double oaked woodford the Mrs. got me tonight. I am greatly looking forward to it.

How was the double oaked woodford?