Little things that annoy the hell out of you

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Vanguard
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Vanguard »

orange808 wrote:"Rougelike" is the ultimate fucking hipster catch word. It's random. You die lots. You can keep some shit. Other shit you can't. I arbitrarily decided. It's "roguelike"! It's always innovative, because randomized maps weren't a thing in Castle Wolfenstein. Oh wait, they were.

Or that one guy that won't shut up about "permadeath". Claims he played Bioshock on the hardest difficulty and just started over an already painfully long and winding game every time he died. Fuck. Everyone knows you're lying. Who would do that to themselves? Show me a 1CC of Final Fight if you want to impress people.
You're supposed to keep little to nothing after your game ends in a true roguelike, but setting that aside, games like Spelunky, Slay the Spire, and FTL are innovative for reasons besides being Rogue's descendants. What came before any of those and plays much the same as any of them? So far as I am aware, the answer is "nothing." StS isn't just single player Magic the Gathering. Spelunky's not just randomized Mario on hardmode, and it certainly isn't Nethack. (Speaking of, now there's one of the most innovative games of all time! It's as indie as it gets, too!) Lastly, both I and MM brought up games that are neither roguelikes nor roguelites.
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BIL
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BIL »

Mischief Maker wrote:
BIL wrote:If that alleyway were a real location it'd have to be designated a treasure of world cinema Image
Someone hasn't seen Jacob's Ladder (1990):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrxkwIcLG8w
Someone hasn't searched my post history. :wink:

KCET's Silent Hill was always a happy accident of East meets West, producing something not quite either. The resulting work, while obvious in its debts, is nonetheless its own animal. As has been shown repeatedly since, with fifteen years of dishwater-dull outsourcings to the lowest bidders. It was never as simple as "Jacob's Ladder + Rosemary's Baby + Hellraiser = iconic horror, wow!"

When I revisit SH1 and the masterfully shapeshifting horror of its alleyway chase - the all-too-relatable panic of losing a wayward child, inexorably eclipsed by a stratum of terror still more primal, a "fear for the flesh" you might say - I'm not thinking "zomg its Jacobs Ladder vs Hellraiser!" Any more than I am "bruh, d00d, its Solaris x Lost Highway The Vidya!" at the lacrismosal disintegration of SH2's climax.

I bet the devs of those shitty outsourcings would, though. :cool:
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by neorichieb1971 »

What are we discussing re SH1? The dynamic camera? That opening does 2 things, it gets the player used to the controls and does a good job putting the player in an unsettling environment. Although the camera is dynamic its smooth. Its not like some guy holding an iphone with shakey hands.

2 more things that annoy me a little is the RE4 remake videos on youtube. Each one says "some unseen footage of the RE4 gameplay". Yet there are so many of them I wonder if there is anything left of the game to show. Youtube should have a policy that products that haven't been released yet should restrict to trailers. Imagine if a movie called RE4 had several hours of footage before it was released you could just piece them together and watch the whole thing :roll:

Another internet thing that gets up my nose is when you click on a link on social media and it takes you a page that has a pop up to accept all cookies, then splatter guns ads all over the page to the extent you can't even read the content without X'ing out of them. I have recently just backed out and not read the content. I haven't tried, but some games on social media have so many adverts there are more of them then actual gameplay time. Who thinks of these things?
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BIL
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BIL »

neorichieb1971 wrote:What are we discussing re SH1? The dynamic camera? That opening does 2 things, it gets the player used to the controls and does a good job putting the player in an unsettling environment. Although the camera is dynamic its smooth. Its not like some guy holding an iphone with shakey hands.
Discussing SH1 as an example of GOIN DUTCH (sounds like a bummin! :shock: wait that's going Greek nm) done right :wink:
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BareKnuckleRoo »

One of the best parts of SH1 is the unlockable first person camera which totally changes how the game feels. Both the third person and the first person modes are great horror experiences.
orange808 wrote:Or that one guy that won't shut up about "permadeath". Claims he played Bioshock on the hardest difficulty and just started over an already painfully long and winding game every time he died. Fuck. Everyone knows you're lying. Who would do that to themselves?
Why would someone need to lie about this? I've done no death runs of plenty of long games, from FPSes to RPGs. Plenty of people do this for the Souls games for instance. The length of the game doesn't necessarily mean the feat itself is overwhelmingly hard, and in many lengthier games it's usually down to learning the particular trouble spots in the game and how to avoid getting tripped up by those while playing consistently through the rest of the game (as opposed to an arcade game where a deathless run generally one minor mistake away).

For non arcade games I actually feel compelled to play it until I can learn to beat it start to finish without dying. It means it takes me a while to actually get through and play new games...
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BIL »

Hell yeah, Self View is amazing. Image Playing in that mode made me realise that while the PS2 trio benefited from a quantum hardware leap, and were no slouches at that, it was SH1 that set the bar. Painterly detail throughout.

I mostly use it to get a better look at the environments, but occasionally I'll enable the reverse camera toggle option, so the game is in Self View by default. :mrgreen: It's really better left for players who've cleared the game at least once, but if you know the ropes, it really puts you in Harry's shoes, in places like Midwich and Alchemilla where usually the camera pulls back. Creeping through the second floor library like that, demon children lurking somewhere nearby, brr. You can still escape to the relative safety of the default cam by hitting the toggle if it gets 2 XTREEM, ofc. :cool:
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by orange808 »

BareKnuckleRoo wrote:One of the best parts of SH1 is the unlockable first person camera which totally changes how the game feels. Both the third person and the first person modes are great horror experiences.
orange808 wrote:Or that one guy that won't shut up about "permadeath". Claims he played Bioshock on the hardest difficulty and just started over an already painfully long and winding game every time he died. Fuck. Everyone knows you're lying. Who would do that to themselves?
Why would someone need to lie about this? I've done no death runs of plenty of long games, from FPSes to RPGs. Plenty of people do this for the Souls games for instance. The length of the game doesn't necessarily mean the feat itself is overwhelmingly hard, and in many lengthier games it's usually down to learning the particular trouble spots in the game and how to avoid getting tripped up by those while playing consistently through the rest of the game (as opposed to an arcade game where a deathless run generally one minor mistake away.

For non arcade games I actually feel compelled to play it until I can learn to beat it start to finish without dying. It means it takes me a while to actually get through and play new games...
The nice thing about an "arcade" title is the pacing. Great ones have a satisfying pace and condensed experience that makes replay a joy--instead of a bloated slog.

I value my time. I assume other people do the same.

Shadow of the Colossus comes to mind as a game that boiled things down far enough to replay until I could master the game. Most games include too much bloat and grind to repeat. It's a long game, but not crushingly so.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Lander »

Hmm, I should watch Jacob's Ladder.

And Roguelike, arbitrary?

The genre may be a dumpster of poorly-cobbled-together level design and an irritating overreliance on being blessed by RNG, but the title is literal.
Rogue-like; like Rogue; deriving elements of design from seminal randomized ASCII dungeon crawler Rogue.
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BIL
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BIL »

Lander wrote:Hmm, I should watch Jacob's Ladder.
Great movie! On the off chance you don't know the plot, avoid all synopses like the plague and go in dry! Image (and for the love of God and all that is holy, it's the 1990 original you want, not the remake - which I've not seen, but I'm gonna bet a whole ham sammich it were shite m8! Image)
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Mischief Maker »

But immediately after watching Jacob's ladder, find and watch the deleted scenes, the ending makes no sense without them.

It's a goddamn crime they never released a director's cut of Jacob's Ladder

* * * * *

Back to indie games and innovation:

The roguelite RPG genre has been an absolute godsend for me. As an adult who no longer has hours and hours of free time to waste grinding my way through 20+ hour jRPGs, roguelites give me the experience of power leveling a party through a whole RPG in maybe 2 hours at most. I was never a fan of RPGs for the story.

Though my last epic RPG was definitely ending things on a high note: Lords of Xulima.
Two working class dudes, one black one white, just baked a tray of ten cookies together.

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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Vanguard »

While I'm glad they're carrying on the spirit of classic arcade games in their own way, I wish they weren't quite so in love with unlocks and randomness. The grind to max out your save file in The Binding of Isaac and Dead Cells feels as daunting to me as an MMO, and the former also makes me feel like I'm gambling to a degree that Nethack and Sil never did.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

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I'd be lying if I said I'd never had fun with the genre - I put many enjoyable hours into Gungeon after pushing past its initial Raizing-cab-on-a-bad-day difficulty ramp. But I know for sure that I'd enjoy it more if success didn't feel so contingent on luck-manipulating your way into a viable (read: busted) build.

Thinking about it, that might seem a little hypocritical given my gushing praise for Garegga's masterful randomness-over-randomness control, but we all kick the cab for good reason :)

I'm up and down on the unlock side of it - I'm more comfortable with progression if it's achievable without having to repeatedly roll new runs and hope a certain zone, mook or pickup happens to show up. Perhaps through a mercy system, or just good old fashioned resources.

On Jacob's Ladder, I must be lucky, since the extent of my knowledge is "something something Silent Hill?"; will give it a showing plus deleted scenes tonight, and no doubt report my horror in the film thread!
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Vanguard »

It would be way cooler if they were more like Rainbow Islands, where godlike power comes from good performance instead of dice rolls. Even when they try they don't do it as well, and they can't stop themselves from throwing in more RNG while they're at it. Like when I go for the no-damage rewards in Dead Cells it feels like the game is being way more anal than Rainbow Islands is when it asks me to collect the diamonds in order. And I know what I'm getting in Rainbow Islands and I know most of the rewards are awesome. In Dead Cells I know I probably won't get something that fits into my build, but if I don't have an endgame-ready set then I have to try anyway. Haven't played Gungeon but I'm given to understand it has a similar mechanic.

Spelunky felt like it was on the right track with difficult side areas that reward you with cool items like the plasma cannon in the mothership, though even in that game most of that stuff didn't help or even got in the way of going for the best ending.

The Binding of Isaac and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BareKnuckleRoo »

Vanguard wrote:The Binding of Isaac and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race.
I'm inclined to agree. What makes many roguelikes/games with roguelike elements fun is that player skill matters a great deal outside of the RNG elements, and player skill can allow you to manage even "bad" RNG to a large extent. Where the player is able to gain power regardless of what the RNG throws at you via skill based elements. Nethack is very much like this; you eventually discover you have so many options available at any given point in time that deaths are quite reliably avoidable.

The recent Monolith update felt like its changes were to make it more chaotic, much like Binding of Isaac, and in particular it removed a key function to how ammo works, removing a large element from player control. It is no longer possible to be rewarded with guaranteed ammo pickups for beating bosses at full health, and thus player control over what weapon you can use at a given time is lost (as your current weapon breaks if ammo hits 0).
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Vanguard »

BareKnuckleRoo wrote:I'm inclined to agree. What makes many roguelikes/games with roguelike elements fun is that player skill matters a great deal outside of the RNG elements, and player skill can allow you to manage even "bad" RNG to a large extent. Where the player is able to gain power regardless of what the RNG throws at you via skill based elements. Nethack is very much like this; you eventually discover you have so many options available at any given point in time that deaths are quite reliably avoidable.
Yeah, The Binding of Isaac is like if a roguelike only generated one or two items per floor, and the items could be anything ranging from Holy Longsword Ringil (4d5) to a cursed suit of leather armor of sickliness [-2], and the game doesn't give a shit either way. Also there's about a 10% chance per floor that you'll be inflicted with the curse of the blind, which means you'll have no way of knowing if your only item you get for the floor is the cursed armor until you've put it on. There are no safeguards in place to ensure the game generates anything analogous to a weapon or spellbook at any point in the run, so have fun if it decides you'll spend half the game with your miserable starting attack power. It's especially a shame because I think the underlying run and gun gameplay is pretty fun.
BareKnuckleRoo wrote:The recent Monolith update felt like its changes were to make it more chaotic, much like Binding of Isaac, and in particular it removed a key function to how ammo works, removing a large element from player control. It is no longer possible to be rewarded with guaranteed ammo pickups for beating bosses at full health, and thus player control over what weapon you can use at a given time is lost (as your current weapon breaks if ammo hits 0).
Bummer. I still need to play that one.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by orange808 »

Android and iOS could be reengineered to seriously discourage data harvesting. I love how stupid we are. We're thick.

Banning TikTok? Okay? Why? Data harvesting that any app can do? Why? Why can any app harvest so much data? What's going on with these operating systems? Google Play Services and "good" partners need to spy on us? Why?

We're stupid. We're so unbelievably stupid, we can't even follow the simplest path of logic or ask the very simplest of questions.

Unleashing more censorship? Why? To what end? Because, we want these mobile devices to provide all this data, but only to "good" people. And, it's always better when the government has more direct control over what applications you can (and cannot) use on your personal device. Let's roll out an even more established framework for that and trust the "good" people.

Cool plan. Don't close the dangerous data leak at the source like a smart person. Be a stupid pleb instead. Turkeys voting for Thanksgiving.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

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Exceedingly little annoyed hell: why's it so tricky to grab screencaps of PS4 games' bootup screens? I mean the artwork that pops up while the game's loading, like this:

Spoiler
Image


You'll get a reject message for 90% of the loadtime, unless you use 1337 HARD GAYMER timing to hit "share" just as the game finishes booting. Just as likely you'll get a black screen though, due to delay. Image

I wouldn't care normally, actually I don't care even now, I'm gonna OCD back to my usual wall of solid black soon enough, just seems odd given they're perfectly-cropped for wallpaper. Are you supposed to pay for them lmao :shock:

Both current Toaplan Arcade Garages are fuuuckin killer. Castlevania GBA Collection makes me burst out laughing every time, it's like they stole it off deviantart. Image Weird they didn't just use Ayami Kojima's gorgeous cover arts.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Udderdude »

I've been trying to find some manuals for older games lately, and I have to say .. the state of manual preservation is pretty awful right now. It feels like where software preservation was about 20 years ago. Tons of stuff is missing, it's fragmented all over the place, and what's there is often low quality and gummed up by doofuses who can't help but smear their greasy fingerprints all over everything. There are some good things happening, like Gaming Alexandria and Kirkland's Manual Labor, but by and large things are looking pretty grim. Such is life in the download zone.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BareKnuckleRoo »

And it's bad enough for the English manuals. It's basically hopeless if you're trying to find Japanese manual scans.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Lander »

BIL wrote:Exceedingly little annoyed hell: why's it so tricky to grab screencaps of PS4 games' bootup screens? I mean the artwork that pops up while the game's loading, like this:

Spoiler
Image


You'll get a reject message for 90% of the loadtime, unless you use 1337 HARD GAYMER timing to hit "share" just as the game finishes booting. Just as likely you'll get a black screen though, due to delay. Image

I wouldn't care normally, actually I don't care even now, I'm gonna OCD back to my usual wall of solid black soon enough, just seems odd given they're perfectly-cropped for wallpaper. Are you supposed to pay for them lmao :shock:
Brr, I don't much fancy playing chicken with the clunky PS4 UI to get my filthy, sticky, greasy little hands on a nice wallpaper that should come as a pack-in!

Since the web store hosts a bunch of image content, we can pull on our heavy-duty rubber medic gloves (complete with wince-inducing snap to put the patient in their place :shock:) and go in arm-deep for a good old fashioned rummage.
(...It's at this point I realise that my nerd browser is too 1337 to offer a right click -> copy image link for PSN backdrops, but it works in Chrome. I suppose we'll skip the dev tools dissection then...)

Anyway, snip the '&width=blah&thumb=false' off the end of the URL, and presto, gorgeous max-res art with no obscuring bollocks (warning, HUEG):
Spoiler
Image
Though in irksome fashion, it's slightly different from the load screen; left-panned a bit with no logo.

Bonus, big region-specific thumbnails:
Spoiler
Image
Spoiler
Image
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BIL
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BIL »

Lander wrote:Anyway, snip the '&width=blah&thumb=false' off the end of the URL, and presto, gorgeous max-res art with no obscuring bollocks (warning, HUEG):
Image

Thank you so, so much - I love that artwork, and it's even better now. Image Scaled down to 1080p perfectly:

Spoiler
Image


I'm normally a "wall of inscrutable grey/black, let the icons do the talking" sort, but GNGR proved to be truly emblematic of thoroughbred arcade gaming; right down to its flagship art keeping pace with the formidable OG/Dai/Chou/Goku and Makaimura Gaidens II & III (first Arremer solo gig is cool - dynamite logo - but kinda its own thing, imo. gotta love real model photography! mans was always Men's Health cover-buff, just needs the ol' Spinal Tap cucumber trick to give 'im a bulge Image Image).

It's like how I keep ACA stuff at the bottom of each respective folder. It ain't disrespect, that stuff is the foundation of a surprise arcade-in-a-suitcase platform. :mrgreen:

I never noticed the Berserk-styled "Hill of Swords" hiding behind the logo! Lookit that detailing :o The Warhammer's meat-tenderiser spikes, and the Iron Ball's caked-on, \m/etal af gore, and the Daggers being present in triplicate, for those iconic "stabbed three times in .3s" speedkills. And the road sign, which now I think about it, confirms my preference for the JP title Kaettekita / Return to. I initially wanted a traditionally escalating, ever more hyperbolic "TeiouMakaimura," etc; but ala the recent Twin Peaks triumph, "Return" arguably works even better. It has been a long time since an arcade-calibre project of this profile. The sign pointing left, I suppose could be either a "let's get back to the good stuff," or perhaps a Nihon chauvinist "read right to left, bitches!" - either is fine with me :cool:
Bullseye timestamping btw :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by emphatic »

Buying something at a higher price from a EU store than the US counterpart to avoid extra tax only to see the item shipping from the US and having to pay import tax on top. The customer service only response was "well, you've purchased it from our INTERNATIONAL store". I call bullshit. :evil:
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by neorichieb1971 »

emphatic wrote:Buying something at a higher price from a EU store than the US counterpart to avoid extra tax only to see the item shipping from the US and having to pay import tax on top. The customer service only response was "well, you've purchased it from our INTERNATIONAL store". I call bullshit. :evil:
I've been using a proxy buyer for over 10 years now. Not only do I get him to accumulate lots of items but I rarely get hit with customs fees. One of the things I miss living in the USA is chose cheap ass prices they get.
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For all you know, this too could be a joke.

Post by Lander »

Have a safe and happy Trust No One Day, friends.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by BIL »

When people get the story of King Canute and the tide backwards.

As the 12th-century original goes, Canute had his courtiers bring him to the beach, upon his throne, to face his one remaining challenger: the sea. He commanded the rising tide to halt, halt I say! So as not to dampen the royal person. Canute got wet socks. In front of his courtiers, he then professed his servitude to God, under whose authority all men dwell; even kings. This was an incredible gesture of humility for its time. A more popular 18th-century embellishment, the one I grew up with, has Canute setting out to make this point from the very start: that for all his worldly station, he was no closer to the authority of God than anyone else.

Whichever iteration you prefer, I always found the tale a hopeful one; suggesting that humans aren't necessarily doomed to myopia and hubris at the highest echelons of power. Even the original, more headstrong Canute swiftly acknowledges his common humanity; a controversial notion not just in 11th-century Britain, but in countless human societies around the world.

Since moving to England, I often hear Canute portrayed, sometimes via omission, but often directly - like the nattering twat DJing my lunchtime radio just did - as reacting not with humility and wisdom, but the impotent rage of a tyrant denied. There are a million and one cases of powerful rulers brought low thus. A later king (Richard, IIRC?) is said to have been literally fucked to death with a red-hot poker. It's a shame to see a moving exception mangled so, particularly in its country of origin. 3;
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by ChurchOfSolipsism »

when people are too fucking lazy to disable the "Sent from my tapatalk or whatever the shit I use to post is named" signature :lol:
n0rtygames wrote:[The wife] once asked me "whats a shoryuken?" so I gave her a real life demonstration. Except she was too close on the spin. So I actually SRK'd her. With full vocalisation too...
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by ChurchOfSolipsism »

when Windows for no fucking reason at all changes the file type associations. Case in point: on both my laptops Windows suddenly open stl-files (for 3D printing) with Paint. Fuck you.
n0rtygames wrote:[The wife] once asked me "whats a shoryuken?" so I gave her a real life demonstration. Except she was too close on the spin. So I actually SRK'd her. With full vocalisation too...
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by neorichieb1971 »

Zippers.

You get a nice piece of clothing, after 2 or 3 wears, the zip gets stuck, comes undone at the bottom, or you cannot get the slider to catch the latch. The worst one is when your fly zipper is so low its buried a hole into the denim like its dug into its final resting place.

Zippers, thats what annoys the hell out of me.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by Vanguard »

ChurchOfSolipsism wrote:when Windows for no fucking reason at all changes the file type associations. Case in point: on both my laptops Windows suddenly open stl-files (for 3D printing) with Paint. Fuck you.
And if you want a wrongly associated file type to be associated with nothing, they make it 100x harder than it ought to be to fix it.
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Re: Little things that annoy the hell out of you

Post by RGC »

Performance parenting. Jesus.

People so insecure about their ability to raise kids in socially accepted ways that every public interaction takes the form of a bloody pantomime. Trying to enjoy my coffee on the other side of the venue here. Kind of an extension to my gripe about indoor/outdoor voices. If you're speaking at full volume and we're sharing an enclosed space that means you're talking to me, whether you think you are or not.

Also, pussies who talk quietly all the time. :P
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