The Shin Megami Everything Thread

[cj iwakura]

For all of 5's stylistic changes and big city atmosphere(which I love), it basically boils down to being the same damn game as 3 & 4, just with a fresh shade of paint.

So if you like 5, you'll also enjoy 3 & 4. Honestly I still think 3 is the best of the new Persona games.

2 remains my favorite, though.

[Zaarock]

Picked up Persona 5 because of all the praise, playthrough took 105h on hard (didnt skip days, tried to raise links as much as possible). I wasn't a fan of P3 but liked 2. Both combat and social mechanics in 5 seemed like a step up. There's tons of convenience features to make things faster & new stuff. Non-random dungeons had some fun design and I enjoyed them more than the previous games. A lot of boss fights get rid of the new combat mechanics & end up being the same as other SMT games.

The story didnt grab me but I really liked the presentation and music at parts. Social scenes between major events can drag on forever but I guess that's to be expected.. I felt like the story doesn't expect any attention by the player as the characters discuss everything non-stop so I felt like I was proceeding through the dialogue rather than thinking for most of the game. The dungeons were the high point for me but with how the game is structured it seemed 3/4 of playtime is dialogue/cutscenes/social links. Pleasantly surprised with the game as someone who isnt a fan of the series in general.

Really should give Strange Journey a try sometime soon

[ZellSF]

Finished Persona 5 and well. It's a slightly inferior version of Persona 3 and 4. Still good, but you know, it just met my expectations. I wasn't really pleasantly surprised by anything.

[Squire Grooktook]

For all of 5's stylistic changes and big city atmosphere(which I love), it basically boils down to being the same damn game as 3 & 4, just with a fresh shade of paint.

I went ahead and watched the tlb fight and it legitimately made me angry.

Spoiler

It's literally fucking Izanami again. The stupidest part of Persona 4.

8 fucking years and you couldn't come up with a better final boss than that. Aaaaarrrrgggh.

Fuck.

Putting this one on the backburner. If I eventually get around to it, I'm probably going to just disregard any pretentions of there being a half-decent narrative in there and treat it as a 'turn off your brain' style over substance dating sim with some fun rpg combat.

To that end, I guess I'm glad they made some of the girls costumes more revealing. Might as well revel in the guilty pleasure nature of the thing while I'm at it.

[ZellSF]

Story is mildly interesting. Nothing more than that. Unless you like the gameplay systems, presentation values and character interaction to some degree you won't like it.

On character interaction, the amount of interactions that takes place in text messages is awful. Should just have the characters meet up more often. Or maybe just remove most of them, very few had anything interesting.

Also on the subject of gameplay systems... how the hell do you know which items aren't usable in combat? I really couldn't find a way to tell, did I miss something?

[qmish]

inferior in gameplay?

because presentation-wise it's huge step above, really next gen dash from p3/4.
Also very heartwarming humour and many references.

[ZellSF]

inferior in gameplay?

because presentation-wise it's huge step above, really next gen dash from p3/4.
Also very heartwarming humour and many references.

When I said inferior I really meant in all aspects, including its presentation.

[cj iwakura]

The avalanche of crazy plot twists in November/December gave me a change of heart. It made the game really strong, but boy does it draaaag before you get there.

The final final boss was kind of underwhelming, too. It's a great game, just flawed.

[M.Knight]

Really should give Strange Journey a try sometime soon

I really liked SJ's sci-fi atmosphere and its difficult bosses. The battle system itself is more favorable towards the player than Press Turn because enemies can't gain bonus attacks, but it's not unbalanced either.

If you don't already have the game and own a 3DS, you could also wait a bit to see if the recently announced port (Deep Strange Journey) is localized. While the trailers mentioned a new character that I feel doesn't mesh well with the story and atmosphere, it could be SJ's definite version

[soprano1]

Almost done with the Neutral Route in SMT4A, nice plot device there Danu

Spoiler

Just give birth to another Dagda that isn't an asshole, then kill the original one.

Now for the final dungeon to fight (scrambled tape sounds).

[BulletMagnet]

Thanks to the encouragement from this thread I just finished Persona 5 myself, and generally had a good time. Moreover, I figured I might as well keep the vibe going, and dusted off the PSP for a shot at 3. Only a little ways in, overall going fine, but there are definitely some conveniences I'm missing...seriously, where the heck is the Compendium? (EDIT: Ah, there it is. Dangit Atlus. )

While I'm on the topic, I started up a NG+ on 5 just to get a quick look at how it goes, and switched the language over to Japanese, to get a sample of how it compared to the localized acting; weirdly, the music and SFX were both completely borked throughout the intro sequence. Anyone else experienced this?

[cj iwakura]

I've heard the JP voice was implemented pretty rough, a lot of stuff isn't subtitled for instance. I'm holding off on NG+(on which I'll use JP voice) until I'm ready for a go at the optional boss.

[soprano1]

Guys, how's Soul Hackers for the 3DS?

[MX7]

Guys, how's Soul Hackers for the 3DS?

Awesome. Feels like the Super Famicom SMT games with a cyberpunk swagger. Amazing music and stylistically very confident. Very cheap download, so just go for it.

[soprano1]

Guys, how's Soul Hackers for the 3DS?

Awesome. Feels like the Super Famicom SMT games with a cyberpunk swagger. Amazing music and stylistically very confident. Very cheap download, so just go for it.

Sounds nice. It was originally released on Saturn in Japan, if i'm not mistaken?

[MX7]

Guys, how's Soul Hackers for the 3DS?

Awesome. Feels like the Super Famicom SMT games with a cyberpunk swagger. Amazing music and stylistically very confident. Very cheap download, so just go for it.

Sounds nice. It was originally released on Saturn in Japan, if i'm not mistaken?

Yep. Lots of lovely jagged 32 bit polys. So pretty much heaven.

[soprano1]

Yep. Lots of lovely jagged 32 bit polys. So pretty much heaven.

Ha ha, sounds interesting. I might go for it, then. Thanks.

[cj iwakura]

Yep. Lots of lovely jagged 32 bit polys. So pretty much heaven.

Ha ha, sounds interesting. I might go for it, then. Thanks.

It's one of my favorite SMTs. Amazing music, too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBuc-cw3Gv0

[soprano1]

http://www.siliconera.com/2017/07/04/sh ... ctober-26/
October 26 in Japan. Late date for a remixed port.

[soprano1]

http://www.siliconera.com/2017/07/06/sh ... ion-japan/
Nice limited edition for Redux. Gore's new design looks weird, looks like they went for a Sengoku warlord style. The Chaos and Order avatars have a more anime look.

[cj iwakura]

Pretty much everyone looks worse.

[BryanM]

The gameplay footage on the youtoob says they're going with that simplified shading aesthetic.

... can anyone come up with a theory as to why? Besides "this is Megami Tensei - don't you know that God hates us?"

[soprano1]

http://www.siliconera.com/2017/07/10/sh ... ry-demons/
https://youtu.be/IvLc8kXrz1g
New PV, shows more anime scenes and VAs.

[trap15]

Pretty much everyone looks worse.

Are you saying After looks worse than Before? Because the only part I can maybe agree on that is with Edgy McEdgelord at the bottom there.

[cj iwakura]

Pretty much everyone looks worse.

Are you saying After looks worse than Before? Because the only part I can maybe agree on that is with Edgy McEdgelord at the bottom there.

Yes, they made everyone into generic anime city.

[BrianC]

Yes, they made everyone into generic anime city.

At least Zelenin can attack people with her hair now and Commander Gore has a shinier head.

Spoiler

Joking aside, I like the original DS art style better.

[soprano1]

http://www.siliconera.com/2017/07/12/sh ... -graphics/
New video, comparing the original and the new version. Gore is voiced by Prof. Oak.

[M.Knight]

The new graphics don't seem that much better compared to the DS version, and the draw distance -which was the number one thing the transition to the 3DS should have improved- is just as low.
So far, nothing really makes me regret sticking to my DS copy.

Pretty much everyone looks worse.

Yeah, definitely. Kaneko's style worked so much better with SJ's atmosphere than the new artwork. Gore isn't too bad, but Jimenez lost all of his smugness and Zelenin no longer has her serious/mature look which is a damn shame.

[BulletMagnet]

I'm sure everyone here is thrilled to hear that I just finished P3P, and thus Phase 2 of Operation Binge My Dread is complete! A couple of (hopefully non-spoilery) thoughts on my slightly late introduction to the series via 3 and 5:

- Obviously 5 wins in the presentation department (though at times I found its style a bit overbearing, I'd rather take that over something bland), especially since I played 3 on the PSP, though for the most part I found P3P more than serviceable graphically, thanks in part to the "install" option; I do wonder how certain story scenes might have registered differently if not played out in "visual novel mode" though.

- While I generally prefer the advancements made to 5's combat system (not to mention not having to deal with the inherited skill wheel o' fortune), I did kind of like the ability to attack a weakness twice in a row to make an enemy lose a turn in 3; when fighting a nasty critter who could withstand an all-out attack and immediately hit you back, keeping them down so you could chip away at them was a safe but resource-heavy option to be used sparingly. Something tells me someone figured out a way to exploit it or something though, and it was ditched in favor of "knock everything down at once all the time". I do hope the series keeps the way you earn more than just better fusion results from social links though, that definitely made that whole part of the game more engaging for me.

- I have mixed feelings about battling "shadows" as opposed to SMT's iconic demon roster directly; the former gives the game more visual variety and a bit of extra separation from the "mainline" SMT titles, but the latter allows for more personality-filled adversaries, especially via negotiation (which supposedly does have a "trick" to it, and I could guess at what it is, but unfortunately there's absolutely no hint in-game to tip players off that it exists, at least that I noticed), which doubles as a handy "get out of battle quickly" option when you need to conserve resources, not to mention a way to seek out specific personas without hoping for a random post-battle drop (though you do still need to semi-randomly encounter them, of course).

- Perhaps the biggest thing I thought 3 did unquestionably better than 5 was coming across as less "cartoony" - to be clear, I don't hold it against the Persona games for having a less stiflingly oppressive air than the "main" SMTs, and would readily submit that there's only so "grounded" any game about super-powered teenagers is going to be, but especially in the Social Link department 5 felt a good deal more juvenile and formulaic to me. In 3 not every link got a "happy" ending, or was even truly a "good" person, but in 5 every "confidant's" problems were mainly someone else's fault, and said someone always got their comeuppance; moreover, the (often overbaked) villains state much the same case for themselves, but are invariably rebuffed. It just always seemed to boil down to "we're good, you're bad, that's that", which is a real shame because the game does nibble at the edges of some legitimately thorny real-world issues, far moreso than 3 ever does. A truly regrettable missed opportunity.

- Playing on "Normal" difficulty for both (scrub alert, I know ), I found 5 a bit more challenging overall, mainly because dungeon diving takes up more time and you're encouraged to take as few trips in as possible; in 3, especially once I'd maxed my social stats and the couple of night-only links there was little incentive not to head to Tartarus and grind for a bit almost every night, even if I quit long before getting tired (and if I stayed too long a "yawn-be-gone" fixed me right up; that said, I recall that earlier versions of 3 were stricter when it came to fatigue, so I probably got a bit of a handicap there). On the flipside, I did enjoy the hand-designed dungeons (with a random one off to the side to scratch that itch), though I suppose they necessitate the "don't go in too often" approach, since "eh, why not" repeated trips would get dull real fast. Oh, and as for how the "extra" boss battle was set up in 3...screw you too, Atlus.

- I'm still not entirely on board with the way the series does things overall - there's often no way to know what to prioritize at a given time for best results unless you cheat - but I found myself able to see a pretty good amount of stuff even going in blind and screwing up/wasting time on occasion, so I suppose I can consider my Dread more or less Binged. Chances are I'll leave 4 for another time, and the same goes for a female playthrough of 3, though I'm tempted to give the "afterword" from FES a go before bidding farewell to 3 completely...not looking forward to this, though, SMT is more than enough of an RNG-dependent nail-biter as it is.

I think that's most of my "main" thoughts on the games; thanks to those who encouraged me to try them, I've had a pretty good time all told.

[BryanM]

The Marin Karin thing is overblown. She only uses it like 5 times in an entire game, and it even works one of those times. You'd be using a heal skill (with #1 priority) if it ever came down to critical health, anyway. The bigger issue is you don't get to kill zombie robot Hitler in any of these later games. Also: very few aliens.

The battle system is really weird, giving you the overwhelming advantage of first move on every turn. Eh, it's a game with an accessory with +30% Max HP, balance was never really one of its goals.