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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:51 pm 


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nier automata still..... i'm just playing on hard now. not sure i'm exactly enjoying it.

is the counter system just broken in this game? several times now i've done a perfect evade and went to counter attack and been killed by the lingering hit box of the attack that i dodged.... you can also just completely miss the counter attacks too. is that working as intended or just completely busted?


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 9:53 am 


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^ this is the feel when I play any platinum game haha.
In my case with Bayo or MGR though, I probably just needed to git gud.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 2:35 pm 


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It took me a while to get the hang of it, but once I realized Ruiner controled like an isometric version of Zone of the Enders 2, I got it.

Is there any special thing the whole "waypointing" dashes system can do that regular dashes can't? I wish I could turn that mechanic off because I'd rather my dashes execute upon the button being pressed rather than released.

Loving the aesthetic. It's like "Ghost in the Shell" meets "Suspiria."
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 3:51 pm 


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Mischief Maker wrote:
It took me a while to get the hang of it, but once I realized Ruiner controled like an isometric version of Zone of the Enders 2, I got it.

Is there any special thing the whole "waypointing" dashes system can do that regular dashes can't? I wish I could turn that mechanic off because I'd rather my dashes execute upon the button being pressed rather than released.

Loving the aesthetic. It's like "Ghost in the Shell" meets "Suspiria."

You can use it to plan a longer multi-jointed dash around a piece of cover to get enemies from behind, and the potential length of a multi-dash with a single node is longer than that of a standard dash. There's also an upgrade which lets you scale melee attack damage with the total distance you travel in a multi-dash. I've found it can triple the damage for your melee attacks if you make a really long- dash.

It can also be used to effectively stunlock a boss by repeatedly long-dashing though him while hitting it with a pipe, a pretty nasty exploit which the developers only 'fixed' with the final boss in Arena Mode which performs an escape shockwave attack if you stick close to him longer than two seconds. You can also abuse the slow motion when preparing a waypoint dash to line up your shots or react faster to threats, not a whole lot of energy is drained in doing so.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 4:15 pm 


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Well this actually is a shmup, but not a good one. I went through Arrow Flash.

The final boss is a perfect encapsulation of Arrow Flash. Zero risk of dying (you can almost just stay in the middle of the screen the entire time) but takes a boringly long amount of time to kill. People ask what bad shmups are, and I think this is a good example. It's not challenging and just doesn't offer anything unique either.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 4:29 pm 


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Immryr wrote:
nier automata still..... i'm just playing on hard now. not sure i'm exactly enjoying it.

is the counter system just broken in this game? several times now i've done a perfect evade and went to counter attack and been killed by the lingering hit box of the attack that i dodged.... you can also just completely miss the counter attacks too. is that working as intended or just completely busted?


The counter attacks aren't that useful, you're often better off cancelling into a normal attack. IIRC if you hold evade again and attack you'll get normal attacks instead of running. Guessing you're using the light sword one which launches you into the air? They don't need a perfect evade, any kind of evade activates it.
The evade in Automata is pretty broken, you cant be hit while holding the button and if you mash it you're only vulnerable for 1 frame every time you release. While you can be 1-shot on >hard you can cancel any attacks into an unpunishable dodge. So you have really strong defense.

I need to give Automata another shot, it's been so long. Some of the DLC unlocks make it possible to restart the game at level 1 but with all abilities/weapons unlocked and also lock your level if needed. That should be fun to mess around with. I highly recommend picking up the DLC if only for the final combat arena which is the games equivalent of Bloody Palace.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:39 pm 


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Famicom Mini Series Vol. 23 - Metroid

Somehow it never dawned on me that this version was the original Famicom Disk System version with its save system, richer sound effects, and more varied enemy patterns. The lack of loading times does give this conversion (some of the graphics have been redrawn) an advantage over the original, but last time I checked the Internet at large considers the NES version the "better" one anyway.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 3:26 am 


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Just finished Ruiner.

Goddamn, I'm feeling as singed by over-stimulation as I did when watching the credits for Tetsuo: The Iron Man for the first time. Hats off for this game's music and visuals.

Dunno if I want to come back for more of the gameplay, I'm annoyed by the way dashing works. Also I think the game would have been a zillion times better by replacing the "switch weapon" button with dedicated buttons for melee and gun attacks.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:24 am 


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Blinge wrote:
^ this is the feel when I play any platinum game haha.
In my case with Bayo or MGR though, I probably just needed to git gud.



oh i definitely suck at the game, i don't really have much experience with platinum games, but this seems like a case of the evade counter either not working or just being a pointless sucky move.

as zaarock said though the evade window is really lenient, so if the follow up was powerful it would just make everything really easy. so far it seems to me like the balance of this game is just not that great or well thought through.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:49 am 


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Mischief Maker wrote:
Dunno if I want to come back for more of the gameplay, I'm annoyed by the way dashing works. Also I think the game would have been a zillion times better by replacing the "switch weapon" button with dedicated buttons for melee and gun attacks.

This is one of those games I'd absolutely dedicate myself to mod to death--scrapping the moronic unlock system in favor of streamlined linear progression, balancing the game around being able to clear encounters without taking damage, cut the padding, redesign the boss encounters entirely, redesign enemy variety and encounters to consist of more than "guy who shoots and dashes" and "guy who shoots and teleports twice", not tying Ruiner Kill opportunities to freaking RNG, full invincibility on dashing but more limited dashing, a ranking system worth a damn, if only there was a modding SDK of some kind. Everything in the past seems to have been moddable, but even though everything runs on Unity or Unreal Engine 4 nowadays there don't seem to be any universal modding tools.

The developers have released a Linux port, which indicates they're pretty much done with delivering any free content updates, on top of news showing they're hiring for some new kind of sci-fi FPS. I had hoped they'd put out some story DLC gauging by how unfinished the story felt (and how disappointing the climax was), but I guess we won't get even that. Maybe this new FPS they're making might turn out to be Ruiner 2, who knows.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 2:14 pm 


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I must be the only person on the internet who thought the ending to Ruiner wasn't a disappointment.

Spoiler: show
I think it was pretty clear from the start that "she" wasn't your friend and the closer you came to the end, the more the "help me" messages from your brother became as intrusive as Wizard's "KILL BOSS." Everything story-wise was leading up to this, the relationships in town were falling apart, your loyal gang of creeps was being slaughtered by Heaven security, and the tone of the story went all the way from cyberpunk to outright horror. It made perfect sense to me that in the end "she" would leave you for dead in the exact same position as Wizard. Cyberpunk stories rarely have happy endings anyway, and I've long since learned to expect open endings in video games.


Gameplay-wise, the final battle emphasized all the combat system's strengths, much more than the sick sisters and MUCH more than Trafficking.

But yeah, how frustrating that it's such a beautiful game with a combat system just at the edge of greatness but still falling short.

But on the upside I discovered the smash attack button in Overload today. Was this in previous Descent games and I just never realized it? This move makes an already great game even more fun!
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 2:20 pm 


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Still playing lots of OutRun. Happy to say I am not complete shit at it anymore. Most of my play has been in time trials and I am making consistent improvements.

The 360 version controls wonderfully with the thumb sticks. Acceleration and braking is mapped to the triggers and gearshift to the right thumb stick. Brilliant scheme (only recently started playing manual) and it makes shifting a joy. 360 version is also beautiful to look at in motion. The downside is it is missing half the tracks of the PS 2 version. Been playing this version on and off since its release.

My current opinion of the PS 2 version may change after I get my hands on an official Sony controller (not cause of the graphics). The controller (it's shit) I'm using has a rather large dead zone for the thumb sticks which makes steering gradually (long gradual turns) impossible with them. In order the make the game playable I have to use the d pad and I use the thumb stick only for drifting. It is still enjoyable, but it would be more so with a better left stick (provided the Sony controller doesn't have the same dead zone). The content of this version is insane though - having the original and SP course on one disc is awesome (times in time trial are better than the 360 version too).

I know the PC version is the best - I may have discovered it somehow and it is sitting in my Google Drive waiting for me to have a better laptop. Soon..

I love OutRun, and so should you. In fact everyone should. If you don't love OutRun you are probably dead inside.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 2:39 pm 


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Stevens wrote:
The downside is it is missing half the tracks of the PS 2 version. Been playing this version on and off since its release.


Don't forget that Outrun 2 for the original Xbox is playable on the 360 and has two lengthy bonus tracks featuring the courses from Daytona as well as Scud Race.

The PC version of Outrun 2006 is nearly flawless, except it has a really, really large deadzone when playing with a steering wheel for some reason. However, there is a fan patch called "Outrun 2 FXT" which addresses this on top of tweaking the Outrun 2 SP port slightly: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.p ... c=147131.0

If you use a steering wheel with the PC version of Outrun 2006 it is highly recommended you setup Outrun 2 FXT for the reduced deadzone.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 3:02 pm 


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Stevens wrote:
The 360 version controls wonderfully with the thumb sticks. Acceleration and braking is mapped to the triggers and gearshift to the right thumb stick.


I play my Outruns with upshift and downshift mapped to A and B respectively, on a 360 controller. That way it's super fast to initiate a drift and minimize the loss of speed. I guess it could be pretty fast with a quick flick on the thumbstick as well, with some practice.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 3:42 pm 


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I will give that a try.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:29 pm 


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Ghegs wrote:
I play my Outruns with upshift and downshift mapped to A and B respectively, on a 360 controller. That way it's super fast to initiate a drift and minimize the loss of speed. I guess it could be pretty fast with a quick flick on the thumbstick as well, with some practice.


This is how I like it too on PC. RT for accel, Y for brake, A for higher gear, X for lower gear.

Y is brake because on the PC port, the RT and LT are seen as one axis (so if you try to use LT to brake while holding RT, it doesn't correctly apply the brake).
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 7:01 pm 


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BareKnuckleRoo wrote:
Ghegs wrote:
I play my Outruns with upshift and downshift mapped to A and B respectively, on a 360 controller. That way it's super fast to initiate a drift and minimize the loss of speed. I guess it could be pretty fast with a quick flick on the thumbstick as well, with some practice.


This is how I like it too on PC. RT for accel, Y for brake, A for higher gear, X for lower gear.

Y is brake because on the PC port, the RT and LT are seen as one axis (so if you try to use LT to brake while holding RT, it doesn't correctly apply the brake).


You can configure acceleration and brake to be in the same axis, it works just fine on the PC port. Options / Control / Configuration, it's the fourth one from the top.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 7:15 pm 


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Re Outrun PC;
Sun/lens flare fix. https://steamcommunity.com/app/4730/dis ... 384292066/
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:15 pm 


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That was short lived. Back to thumb stick shifting.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:40 pm 


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Mischief Maker wrote:
I must be the only person on the internet who thought the ending to Ruiner wasn't a disappointment.

Spoiler: show
Not like I didn't predict something was up, it's not like the player can suddenly be expected to care for some alleged brother as his main motivation. To me it just never felt like it went anywhere. I never quite felt like everything was falling apart, probably because I didn't pay too much attention to what was happening in town. As far as the main storyline thread was concerned, to me it felt like I was just going around killing things with a flimsy-ass excuse which clearly was a lie, but I don't even see in Ruiner what I was even supposed to care about. Things just happen.


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Gameplay-wise, the final battle emphasized all the combat system's strengths, much more than the sick sisters and MUCH more than Trafficking.

Yea, it's a common mistake for combat designed around fighting crowds to have you fight only one dude as a boss whose fight comes down to being a puzzle, much like how any good beat 'em up boss always has grunts spawning in. I'm glad they listened to my suggestion of spawning in additional grunts during boss fights for NG+, it's what the Matayama boss did right before the NG+ update. I did love seeing most enemy types again in the final fight, even though the composition could have been more varied in my opinion.


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But on the upside I discovered the smash attack button in Overload today. Was this in previous Descent games and I just never realized it? This move makes an already great game even more fun!

It's a new addition to Overload. It even restores a little bit of health upon doing so, so it never hurts to open up with a smash attack on an unaware enemy. It deals even more damage when the Invulnerability power-up is active, which makes ramming into everything while you're fucking invincible even more exhilarating.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:16 pm 


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Zen wrote:


Is there anywhere this folder is uploaded for those of us who don't have the XB Online Arcade version to do this with?
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:38 pm 


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:43 pm 


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Comet Strike
Very recent indie arcade-style game, launched 8/jun/2018, looks like it is the second work of the guys. I was just watching a guy playing this on Twitch and I happened to won the game in a raffle by the end of the stream. Also, IcedLizardGames himself was there on the chat answering some questions regarding the gameplay. Although there are some shmup elements, I thought it was better suited for this thread. I am playing on the hard difficult with a arcade stick; the game moves pretty good and I felt that my deaths were fair. Hopefully, I'll soon improve to get a 1cc. There is some unlockable stuff, but thankfully all the difficulties are there by default. The game also have a interesting scoring system for competition; looks like it was done by real players. I'm not fan of the NES indie style in general, but it was well done here. The music is great and I really like this game's bosses.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 12:36 am 


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Few more thoughts on Ys 8 as I get closer to the end...

- It was already pretty silly, but as the game goes on the story progression just gets even stupider; almost every single plot development is boiled down to "this happened and everyone was instantly totally okay with it because that's convenient". It's not game-killing, especially since Ys has never needed much more of an excuse to eradicate ecosystems than "I'm an adventurer and everything is overly territorial", but when you see it so many times over the course of such a lengthy game (which, to be fair, would probably drag if it attempted to go much deeper) it's hard not to roll your eyes.

- On a related note, I've also seemingly wandered into not one, but two blockbuster summer movie franchises over the course of the adventure so far; just waiting for the space aliens to show up to complete the trifecta, and hell, by the look of things they just might! :lol:

- Not Ys-specific, but while I'm here why why whyyyyy do developers of modern 3D action games insist on including at least one or two cramped-in zones that their camera simply isn't equipped to handle? It's nowhere near as fatal here as it was in Gravity Rush 2, but devs, listen and listen good; I really, really don't care how much loving polygonal detail was put into my character's ass to begin with, but especially when half the time all I can see is the edge of a wall and an enemy pinning me to death, and double especially when all the fancy tech makes the framerate chug on top of that. Give yourselves plenty of room to 1) Keep the action smooth, and 2) Zoom that damn camera out.

- I've been pretty thorough (finally added some more "boss" fish and a lone "S" grade to my tally, too), but according the encyclopedia have still managed to miss a few time-sensitive things, as I'm fated to do in every game like this...ah well, trophies, schmophies. :P

- One small QOL item from Ys Seven (did Celceta have it too?) that I find myself missing is the ability to turn only Adol's voice off, to keep him a true "silent protagonist"; it's a small thing, but it just feels a bit weird to hear him yelling "hah!" "something's there!" "you okay?" alongside everyone else, it sort of intrudes on his timelessness, if you'll pardon the overly dramatic turn of phrase.

- I'm equal parts annoyed and amused that Falcom didn't bother to indicate on the map screen which adjacent area any exit leads to, but did make sure to map nipple bumps onto Dana's outfit. :P Speaking of outfits, nearly all the non-DLC "costumes" you can acquire in-game are just palette swaps, though I'll concede that in a few cases the color palette is an improvement over the default IMO.

Still enjoying myself despite all the snarkiness, but I dunno, Ys has always struck me as too "straightforward" or "to the point" to be able to cast itself as "epic" in the way a lot of other series do; I certainly can't fault having more stuff in one game, but a series like this, for all its strengths, doesn't and frankly can't have the necessary and copious glops of non-gameplay glue to hold the whole mass together in coherent fashion.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 4:24 am 


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I happened to play The Ark of Napishtim yesterday and this time its abundant story background exposition early on hit alarmingly close to home (all the ethnic - or you might say cultural - friction). Almost like the Vanquish story viewed lately (there's conveniently an internet movie made of its cutscenes mixed with gameplay footage out there, so you can easily revisit just the story).

I don't think the makers of either aimed to sound as serious as my current readings of their stories are, but is it, eventually, even possible not to get serious about it?

BulletMagnet wrote:
- One small QOL item from Ys Seven (did Celceta have it too?) that I find myself missing is the ability to turn only Adol's voice off, to keep him a true "silent protagonist"; it's a small thing, but it just feels a bit weird to hear him yelling "hah!" "something's there!" "you okay?" alongside everyone else, it sort of intrudes on his timelessness, if you'll pardon the overly dramatic turn of phrase.

I can't believe nobody else than I had the same problem with 3D Mario.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 4:30 am 


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nothing but mecha games

Sega Ages Virtual On [PS2].
Is it just me, or do attacks home in more on the Saturn version? A bunch of shit that flat out hits moving opponents on the Saturn just barely misses before hitting here. I'm pretty sure if I got in as close as I was doing here on the Saturn version, I'd just be eating shit because things don't veer off so hard when near.
Instead of engaging in far-range firing from cover affairs like I'll do on the Saturn [nailing anything dumb enough to get out from cover with Viper II's crouching center weapon, which hits fucking everything on Saturn], now I'm having to go way in and aggressively use the fact that Virtuaroids have awful enemy tracking at anything but medium range [Viper II's CCW is a hell of a lot more situational now, forward dash CW seems better, or just holding RW].
Was getting fucking murdered by Jaguarandi in single player because matches took so long trying the same technique I used on Saturn.
Also, playing this in beautiful 480p is a treat. Shame about the small window size.

wish my DC worked properly [laser issues], I want to play VOOT right now
could probably fiddle around with running it in nullDC, I remember having decent success with that [edit] okay, it works like a charm, it's a shame I'm literally sitting next to my friends playing Under Night instead, fucking fuck ass damn :lol:
need to wrangle my IRL friends to fucking play some VO, all they want to do is play Under Night or BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle :roll:

Virtual On Marz [PS2].
I still don't know why I subject myself to this garbage.

like, playing as Fei-Yen is almost fun, she's actually fast as shit and the game almost reaches VOOM speed
but there's still the gigantic delay after everything and the painfully slow attacks and it's just entirely nasty
Was playing through Challenge Mode, and I'm still entirely not sure how you're supposed to reasonably dodge the Ajim twins' attacks when they're low on health.
Or really, in general. The most effective method involves having no idea where they are relative to you, and just dashing around them [which admittedly is also an issue with VOOM's Z-Gradt, turning to look at him will just get you killed]. It's also better if you're really fucking close. Would be really nice if I didn't keep accidentally running into my dead partner and losing an asston of health because I'm sharing it with the braindead AI and then getting clipped by something and then being slowed down [because that seemed like a good mechanic, fuck] and now it's actually just literally impossible for me to dodge.
It wouldn't be so awful if mobility in the game was on VOOM levels, but it's not.

At least I kinda have an actual idea of how VO's melee attacks work now.
It always used to feel so fucking jank, but no, it's a decent system.
kinda helps that the sheer lack of speed in this game makes them much more readable, trying to get a feel for using CC attacks by playing VOOT is just asking for trouble

Ended up downloading an all-clear save because FUCK Dramatic Mode, the story is garbage [at least Hatter's fucking hilarious], the missions are garbage, and unlocking the VRs you'd actually want to play as is the biggest slog in the world [you have to kill a bunch of 'em, and all the ones you actually want and aren't just another Tenjin alt are rare as shit]. Challenge Mode is almost fun [it's literally just VO Force's single-player mode with Marz's altered mechanics and VO selection, and the Ajim twins aren't the final boss anymore [still feels like they are, fuck] because there's a bunch more fights after, and now you have to fight two fucking Z-Gradts at the same time at the end -- which is easier, but certainly dumber].
emphasis on almost, it's still not actually that fun

entirely inconsequential things: Guarayakha can't transform into Jaguarandi in this game [so she's a lot worse now, but at least she's here]
you're never going to play as her anyway since you need to subject yourself to Dramatic Mode on Hard, which is again, just a slog

I've also been playing Gundam Vs. Zeta Gundam [PS2], which is a lot of fun, and I like the relatively "grounded" feeling it has compared to say, a more recent Gundam Vs. game. There are also some really cool stages.
and the incoming enemy noise is amazing

I also considered popping in Armored Core 3, but I'm too tired to play anything else now.
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Last edited by null1024 on Tue Jun 12, 2018 1:02 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 4:47 am 


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Obiwanshinobi wrote:
I can't believe nobody else than I had the same problem with 3D Mario.


I have seen a ton of complaints about Mario's goofy voice and the voice clips added to the GBA ports of the SNES Mario games.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:39 am 


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finally got a ps4 and persona 5
got past the 2nd major boss fight on hard, the story bosses at least seem way harder than in P3 and P4
probably because they refuse to stay debuffed and the second one was a multi target one, so the single target debuffs kind of suck there (and single target buffs are a waste of time)
I expect it to only get easier as I get better healing/full party buffs
game is pretty damn great so far though, 10/10 easily


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 11:16 am 


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BrianC wrote:
Obiwanshinobi wrote:
I can't believe nobody else than I had the same problem with 3D Mario.


I have seen a ton of complaints about Mario's goofy voice and the voice clips added to the GBA ports of the SNES Mario games.


SMB Advance + good set of speakers = thrown in jail for running an unlicensed special needs school out of your house. Image
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 11:33 am 


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I've been playing (and am still playing) Elite: Dangerous since June 2017. In VR and with a HOTAS, this game is just something else. I'm flying my frickin's Spaceship, and can't get enough of it. 680 Hrs in and raising...

Somebody stop me, please. Or not, don't. :mrgreen:
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