What [not shmup] game are you playing now?

[BrianC]

So even the JP version lists both Bloodlines and New Generations under the same selection, despite only having Bloodines (IIRC, the US version didn't add New Generation, but still mentioned it in the description of Bloodlines, even after the update)? No interest in playing that version seriously due to 50Hz and censorship, but it's curious how they included a description of it without including that version of the game.

[BIL]

Yeah, I thought that was odd too... I once played New Generation, and I swear the clash of 60hz muscle memory and 50hz sludge made me ill. Or maybe it was the green zombies? Not missed, at any rate. It's clear these sets aren't comprehensive chronologies ala M2's later AGES 2500 discs, though they get my priority titles (CVIII, VK, AC Super, Spirits), and the emulation is superb, so I'm more than happy.

What I'm more miffed about is both sets lacking button configs for the MD games, and only them. While the defaults aren't offensive, they're sub-optimal for PS1 controller layout. If I'm not playing VK on a six-button MD pad, I'm gonna want [subweapon] on R1. Same for Hard Corps and [switch weapon]. And [shoot/jump] on [square/X], respectively.

PS4 lets you remap the DS4's buttons and save per-game profiles, ofc, but it's a silly oversight.

[BrianC]

Yeah, I thought that was odd too... I once played New Generation, and I swear the clash of 60hz muscle memory and 50hz sludge made me ill. Or maybe it was the green zombies? Not missed, at any rate. It's clear these sets aren't comprehensive chronologies ala M2's later AGES 2500 discs, though they get my priority titles (CVIII, VK, AC Super, Spirits), and the emulation is superb, so I'm more than happy.

What I'm more miffed about is both sets lacking button configs for the MD games, and only them. While the defaults aren't offensive, they're sub-optimal for PS1 controller layout. If I'm not playing VK on a six-button MD pad, I'm gonna want [subweapon] on R1. Same for Hard Corps and [switch weapon]. And [shoot/jump] on [square/X], respectively.

PS4 lets you remap the DS4's buttons and save per-game profiles, ofc, but it's a silly oversight.

I should check the switch version with the M30 or retro bit controllers. I remember not being able to set a Genesis style button scheme, but I'm not sure if the Konami collections are one of them.

Edit: Checked Bloodlines. I'm stuck using the Genesis style controller's X or Y button to attack.

[Sumez]

Yeah, I thought that was odd too... I once played New Generation, and I swear the clash of 60hz muscle memory and 50hz sludge made me ill.

It plays fine in 60hz fortunately

[Steamflogger Boss]

I hit disc 3 of FFIX last night. I can't imagine disc 4 has much on it? At least based on completion times I saw online vs where I'm at.

Also, I intend to give Secret of Mana an actual fair shake after this. Can't remember who all here was part of the Secret of Mana roooolz gang other than Xyga, who this is a shameless attempt to summon.

[Sumez]

I always loved Secret of Mana, but I can easily see its shortcomings that people tend to bring up a lot nowadays.
Did you ever play its immediate sequel?

[Steamflogger Boss]

I always loved Secret of Mana, but I can easily see its shortcomings that people tend to bring up a lot nowadays.
Did you ever play its immediate sequel?

Trials of Mana? I have not.

I've played some of Legends but it's a completely different game. Never played any of Dawn of Mana either but reception on that one seems middling.

[vol.2]

Also, I intend to give Secret of Mana an actual fair shake after this.

I remember my first play of SOM to be engaging enough that I pretty much did nothing but play it all the way through. I was a big fan of the first game though (Final Fantasy Adventure) as well. Don't think I actually ever played the sequels, probably because they weren't released in the US and I forgot it existed.

[Sumez]

Trials of Mana? I have not.

I've played some of Legends but it's a completely different game. Never played any of Dawn of Mana either but reception on that one seems middling.

Yeah, I heard a lot of good things about Legend, but it's very different. All the subsequent ones are kinda odd, and yeah they didn't get a nice reception.

Seiken Densetsu 3, or Trials of Mana as I guess it's called now is very much like Secret of Mana though, but it improves it in pretty much every possible way that it can. It's just a magical game.
So I guess if you feel like there's something to like in SoM but it comes short of being great, definitely check out the sequel.

[Steamflogger Boss]

Trials of Mana? I have not.

I've played some of Legends but it's a completely different game. Never played any of Dawn of Mana either but reception on that one seems middling.

Yeah, I heard a lot of good things about Legend, but it's very different. All the subsequent ones are kinda odd, and yeah they didn't get a nice reception.

Seiken Densetsu 3, or Trials of Mana as I guess it's called now is very much like Secret of Mana though, but it improves it in pretty much every possible way that it can. It's just a magical game.
So I guess if you feel like there's something to like in SoM but it comes short of being great, definitely check out the sequel.

I will keep that in mind. I am thinking I would want to play the original, and not the remake.

[Sumez]

Yeah. The remake did feel surprisingly good from what I played in the demo - but it does look cheap. Not because it feels lazy, I think they did well with what they had, it's just a low budget product. The original game still looks like a million in my opinion.

[Steamflogger Boss]

Mmm. Love good SNES graphics.

While I had not looked into this particular remake, my own experience with the Grandia and Langrisser games vs the "HD" remakes leads me to believe I will always just prefer the originals for older stuff. I feel like it's different once you hit more modern games. At that point sure just upres everything or w/e. These old games have like...I dunno it's hard to explain.

But like...

This

or



or even




Grandia is closer stylistically but I'd still rather just put the game in my PS1.

[Blinge]

Aw man that's gorgeous.

...aaand I just shat my dick AGAIN thinking about the abomination that is FF6 on steam.

[Sumez]

I dunno it's hard to explain.

Did you read this article? I think I've linked it before
https://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/BlakeRe ... el_Art.php

It's very good at explaining why good pixel art is a lot more than just nostalgic retro charm or making the best out of technical limitations.

Either way if that's how you feel, definitely play the original. It's even been translated officially now.

[ED-057]

Uh oh, those lancers are toast!

[Steamflogger Boss]

I dunno it's hard to explain.

Did you read this article? I think I've linked it before
https://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/BlakeRe ... el_Art.php

It's very good at explaining why good pixel art is a lot more than just nostalgic retro charm or making the best out of technical limitations.

Either way if that's how you feel, definitely play the original. It's even been translated officially now.

Yep I've read this before, surely from you linking it. It is a good article that I remember sharing after reading it.

[CStarFlare]

How does the Trials of Mana remake/port run? I remember trying to play it on my SD2SNES and it lagged horribly - it looks great but seemed to be straining the hardware quite a lot. I put it down before finishing one character's questline, which was disappointing but I just didn't enjoy the overall experience. (It could have also been a consequence of running a ROM instead of a real cart, but I'd never run into that with other games on the flashcart)

[bottino]

Langrisser 2? It's the Mega Drive version or bust.

[Blinge]

Did you read this article? I think I've linked it before
https://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/BlakeRe ... el_Art.php

It's very good at explaining why good pixel art is a lot more than just nostalgic retro charm or making the best out of technical limitations.

Heh, I linked that to a friend recently because he's usually interested in visual art etc.
Possibly the rudest most toxic response was thrown back at me.

'you have chosen the most unnecessary opinion piece ever to send to me
" Good art is good art, and nothing beats the real deal. "
this is the most redundant statement i've ever read, an someone was paid to write it
'
sadblinge

[Steamflogger Boss]

Langrisser 2? It's the Mega Drive version or bust.

I played on Saturn but it has been many years. I like Growlanser a fair bit more but it's still a solid series.

[Leandro]

Just finished Monster Boy and the Cursed Kingdom.

What a fantastic game. One of the best 2d titles I've played in years. Highly recommended

[Sumez]

'you have chosen the most unnecessary opinion piece ever to send to me
" Good art is good art, and nothing beats the real deal. "
this is the most redundant statement i've ever read, an someone was paid to write it
'

Lol, your friend obviously didn't read the whole article! I've never read a better piece on pixel art honestly.

[FinalBaton]

FF 1 remake on PS1 (FF Origins) has been on my shelf for 5 years without me ever playing it through, and last night I finally gave it a whirl. So far I'm really enjoying it I gotta say, to my surprise. I'm not far atm(elven city, grinding it out)

I find the game quite tougher, which is a good thing for a 50th playthrough of the game honestly

You seem to be dealt more damage and cure spell/potion in proportion doesn't heal as much. at level 4 I had to make the trek to Pravoka in 4 goes, retreating the first 3 times. Around Matoya's cave surprised me too, tougher than OG. A group of 2/3 ogres can still do damage to you even at level 7. A couple ghast can wreck you at said level too. Bumped into scorpions around elven city and they're absolute units in this game. Currently back at Pravoka grinding on the eastern peninsula, and I'm on the edge of my seat, saving my game after each battle pretty much. Can't wait for that cure 2 spell!

The additions are nice : being able to flush spells and equip other ones, weapon elemental damage finally working + other stats bug fixes, spells fixes. Curiously they have not changed the bug of the peninsula east of Pravoka, which makes me think that maybe it wasn't a bug... or that maybe they wanted to honour such a beloved bug?

The graphics are growing on me. I quite like the backgrounds now. Character sprites a bit less so, but they're okay-ish. I'm so attached to the OG sprites (as my ava and username might tell you), that it's hard to accept anything else Was playing on the PVM-2950 and the colours really were nice I though, good mix of contrasty stuff and more earthy tones.

I just threw it on there to see how the game would look on my monitor and I ended up playing 3 hours

[Blinge]

Lol, your friend obviously didn't read the whole article! I've never read a better piece on pixel art honestly.

It is an uphill struggle to get him to check something out, even if he is interested in it. Attention span of a gnat. fml.


Oh snap Baton I didn't know your name was from FF aswell, what is it, a late game staff?

Well I just finished Metal Max Returns

Interesting game in that it has even less plot than FF1 or DQ1.
Its just got little stories you encounter here and there.
Progression is from hunting down bounties, but the final one isn't even wanted in any towns. he's basically passed from memory, a random dude in a bar mentions him, and you might've got his old wanted poster after defeating his younger brother earlier.

The actual final boss and saving the world (technically).... You're not pointed there at all. You either find that section, that building.. or you don't. Granted, it's one of the last places you can explore on the map, but still.. I kinda love that, nothing really points you there.

[Sumez]

Ok that sounds pretty awesome actually

[Blinge]

The original famicom game was much harder, I understand.
And you know what.. I kind of prefer the soundtrack when listening to it now..

One problem you can have with Returns and its rebalanced difficulty is that for a whole area, especially the earlygame, the random encounters are an utter sleepwalk. Then suddenly you hit a bounty target who wipes you out in two turns.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

FF 1 remake on PS1

The only thing I'm not fond of is that in all versions after the NES/MSX ones is

Spoiler

the remodeling of the "Sky Castle". Originally, you're told that you have to find the Fiend of Wind there, but the only hints you get that the "Sky Castle" is actually more of a futuristic spaceship is the presence of the robots you meet prior, both in the teleporter room of the Mirage Tower and the robot who gives you the Cube needed to activate said teleporter.

In all remakes of FF1 it's no longer themed to be a dead spaceship of metal, where you find what looks like computer equipment in the later floors, but is instead remodeled to be just a literal castle in the clouds, and looks far more bland and uninteresting.

I didn't even realize the area near the Marsh Cave on the world map had Scorpions, apparently it's the rarest encounter there. I'm only used to seeing them in the cave itself and around some later areas.

FF Origins is indeed harder than FF1 NES is. Monsters that were supposed to regenerate HP each turn now correctly do so, potions don't heal quite as much reliably, and bosses have double the health. However, this is balanced by having several now functional (and exceptionally powerful) spells in the form of Temper and Saber.

What party are you using? Some of the stuff you've described sounds normal even for the NES version though; Ogre groups can be a real threat unless prepared properly, and Ghasts (GEISTs in the NES) are a massive danger in the areas west of Elfland and far east of Pravoka since they're a Stun-inflicting undead that hits fairly hard and has a 3-hit attack that has a high chance of inflicting its status ailment. Each hit gets a chance to inflict which is also why Crawls found in the Marsh Cave are basically guaranteed to Stun you with their 8 hit (!!) attack.

The peninsula thing far East may or may not have been intentional, but my guess is it was intentional. It's too conveniently designed. If it was unintentional, it's very odd that that land mass just happens to be long enough to reach the next encounter area and have a 2-tile wide space to walk back and forth on it! The only other such space you can find that has higher than normal level enemies is a single tile on the Western edge of Elfland's continent (by the Western castle at 6-3 on this enemy chart map), and those enemies aren't that much more powerful (Melmond-area difficulty).

Another unusual map oddity is this region, the only spot in the Northern regions where you have nothing but Imp encounters on 2 tile-wide section of land where immediately to the East is a forest containing some very tough fights! That one was unintentional I'm pretty sure, as it uses the same encounter table default for the areas with absolutely no land whatsoever and only ocean, so it was assumed you'd never meet any enemies in that table.

[FinalBaton]

@Roo that sucks about sky castle. it is indeed way cooler in OG game, the atmosphere in that part is so dope

monsters just do more damage on average I find, while you don't. Which means I gotta be more careful than usual. I played the OG game so much that I can just feel right away that this is a good cut tougher.

I seldom made a semi-shit party. With thief in second slot (rest is Fighter, Black Mage, White Mage). I know he's weak but sometimes I like to have him on there to play with Ninja (even tho Ninja is not that amazing either, and is shit for half the game). But the thing is : I've played the OG game with same party countless times (probably to increase difficulty too) and in Origins there is a good cut more danger in encounters at same level. I do use Temper and the defense spells, and it helps a bit.

[Sumez]

The peninsula thing far East may or may not have been intentional, but my guess is it was intentional. It's too conveniently designed. If it was unintentional, it's very odd that that land mass just happens to be long enough to reach the next encounter area and have a 2-tile wide space to walk back and forth on it!

Maybe the devs intentionally added in that peninsula for testing purposes, and decided they liked it enough to keep it in, even in the original game?

[Blinge]

Couldn't agree more on Sky Castle.